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Conference napalm::guitar

Title:GUITARnotes - Where Every Note has Emotion
Notice:Discussion of the finer stringed instruments
Moderator:KDX200::COOPER
Created:Thu Aug 14 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:3280
Total number of notes:61432

1541.0. "Yamaha FX500 multieffect" by COPCLU::SANDGREN (Walking Tall) Fri Oct 27 1989 07:10

Has anybody tried the new Yamaha FX500 multieffect processor yet? I had
half an hour checking it out, and it really impressed me, although I
don't know that much about it. How is it compared with other units from
today's standard? It is about $700 in Denmark (everything is expensive
here).
How do you like the distortion effect? How is it, compared with, f.ex.
the Chandler Tube Distortion (which I think must be one of the best)?
It is able to get something which is much better, by paying a little
bit more?

Come on, give your opinions!

Poul
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
1541.1Related Info in #500AQUA::ROSTChickens don't take the day offFri Oct 27 1989 11:403
    
    Take a quick look through note #500 on the related Yamaha REX-50, SPX-50
    effects.
1541.2Yamaha FX-500 + questionKBOMFG::MACKINNONWed Apr 11 1990 12:0933
11-APR-1990

I hate to ask another 'has anyone checked out this effect" question but oh
well here goes.  Anyone have any experience (yet) with the Yamaha FX-500? I
looked through the GUITAR and COMMUSIC notes files and there's not too much
reference to it - most of the information is about the SPX-90 and 50. The
November 1989 Guitar Player magazine gave it a great review.

I checked it out briefly last weekend for about an hour and thought it was a
pretty decent unit (outside of the distortion sounds which I don't really need
anyway).  Other than wanting the basic effects that most of these boxes in
general offer (and in this price range), I specifically wanted to make sure it
had compression, and the ability to store the loudness  of an effect - which I
need for playing live, both of which it has.  What surprised me was that the
salesman also claimed, with a midi pedal connected, one can also control the
reverb/distortion of the amp.  He claimed you could have for instance, say
reverb + delay (from the FX-500) + the amps distortion set to one pedal, and
then on another pedal say, flange + turn off the amp distortion.  I kind of
doubt this is true, and unfortunately the store was closing up before we had a
chance to try it out.  I won't have a chance to get back there for another
week or two.  I'de be interested to know if anyone has checked this out -
particulary this feature.   Even without this option I still think its a 
decent box for the price (here in W.Germany about $560-which I think is like
list price in the US.)

A side question would be how do you guys deal with this problem - of wanting
to switch with one pedal the distortion of the amp on/off in conjunction 
with effects in the effects box?  I've heard Scholz makes some sort of midi
switch box that makes this possible but I haven't seen it here.

thanks --
Roy

1541.3Uh, Yes And NoAQUA::ROSTBass is the placeWed Apr 11 1990 12:4437
    
    What you *can* do with a MIDI pedal and the FX-500 is set up different
    "patches", say one with reverb and distortion, one with reverb only,
    and switch between them while playing (thereby letting you turn the
    distortion on and off).  On the SPX-50 (so probably the FX-500) there
    is a second mode where you set up a chain of effects and instead of
    using a MIDI footswitch, you can use a simple on/off switch (like most
    amps use for reverb) to move through the chain.  Unless you also have a
    MIDI *amplifier*, you're not going to be able to kick the amp
    distortion in and out with the same footswitch that controls the
    FX-500.  
    
    What's the difference?  With the MIDI switch you can instantly go from
    any one preset to any other.  With the "chain" you have to go through
    them in order...meaning you have to arrange the chain to meet your
    needs.  Not as flexible, but lots cheaper.  A simple on/off switch is
    about $10 US, a MIDI footswitch over $100 US.
    
    A simple chain example:
    
    Reverb --> Reverb plus distortion  --> Reverb  --> Reverb plus
    distortion and chorus  --> Reverb --> Reverb plus chorus --> Back to
    top of chain
    
    So you start out with just reverb, and with every click of the on/off
    switch, you advance to the next effect in the chain.  If you need to go
    from reverb plus distortion to reverb plus chorus suddenly, you need to
    click the switch four times.  The next click would then take you back
    to the reverb preset at the top of the chain.  Notice how reverb keeps
    appearing in the chain.  That's so at every click, you are either
    turning on or off an extra effect, but you *always* get the reverb.
    
    Also, unlike "stomp box" effects, when you go from one preset to
    another, there is a brief (1/2 second, maybe) dropout of the effect as
    it goes to the new preset.  Such is life with digital effects.
    
    							Brian
1541.4Similar to the GP8MILKWY::JACQUESWed Apr 11 1990 12:5721
    
    The Roland GP8 has two control outputs, which can switch non-midi
    effects on and off, channel switch an amp, or turn an amp's internal
    reverb on and off. These control outputs work just like a latching-
    type footswitch. Each patch has two parameters that you set in the
    on or off position to select the state of the control outputs. This
    enables you to control everything from the midi pedal. One patch may
    use the distortion in your amp, with the reverb off. Another patch may
    use your amps' clean channel with the reverb on. 
    
	It sounds like Yamaha has incorporated this same feature into their
    new unit. I guess they would pretty much have to if they want to be
    competitive. One other thing to keep in mind is the polarity of your
    amps footswitch jacks. Some ground out the footswitch output and others
    work differantly. I believe the Roland GP8 has polarity selection for
    their control outputs.
    
    	Perhaps someone who has more experience with the GP8 can elaborate.
    
    	Mark Jacques
    
1541.5could be like GP-8 in this respectKBOMFG::MACKINNONWed Apr 11 1990 13:2512
    Hey thanks for the quick replies.  I called this guy up again and he
    told me it was just like the GP-8 in this respect.  He said there is an
    option w/every patch that says "external control 1,and external ctrl 2"- and
    he said there are regular guitar jacks on the back of the box that plug
    right into the reverb,distortion of your amp - thus enabling or 
    disabling the reverb/distortion of your amp.  I still want to see him
    demo this, but it sounds like its there.  This would make this box
    pretty good for the price.  I don't know what a GP-8 goes for.
    Now the problem is that he just sold his last unit yesterday and won't
    have any more in for 7 weeks!!
    
    Roy  
1541.6TCC::COOPERMIDI-Kitty-ADA-Metaltronix rack pukeWed Apr 11 1990 13:3317
Yepper, like .2 said, you probably CAN switch your amps channels and
reverb.  Even if you can't with this effect unit, there are a few patch bays
that allow you to do this....

Sholz MIDI Octopus 
Kittyhawk MIDI Patchbayette II
others...

I use the Bayette II to do this with mine.

Kitty Hawk also has a Bayette I which has loops in it where you could
chain all your stomp boxes and stuff...And just turn the loop on or off
with a MIDI preset.  Nifty.  Especially for you in KBO since Kittyhawk
is made by Roy in Germany...You might be able to get this stuff right
in yur home town !

jc (Who sez:  Isn't MIDI cool ??)
1541.7GP8 pricing/competitionMILKWY::JACQUESWed Apr 11 1990 14:1921
    Roland GP8's were selling for ~$899 when they were at the peak of 
    their popularity. FC100 foot controllers sell for an additional
    $200.00.    Since Roland has introduced the GP16, the GP8 sales
    have understandably fallen off, and many stores are blowing them 
    out.  Other manufacturers have introduced competing units, which
    have also pushed the GP8 closer to obsolescence.  Sales of the
    FC100 foot controllers remain healthy, because this unit is compatable
    with the GP16, as well as Roland guitar synths. 
    
	I have demoed the GP8's and came fairly close to buying one. 
    I am glad I waited, because there is now a larger selection of
    similar units, and prices are more attractive on many of them.
    
    One thing to keep in mind is that the GP8 is not just an effects
    box, it is a full-blown preamp, cabable of providing enough gain
    to boost a guitar signal up to line levels, and drive a power amp
    directly. Units like the ART SGE are really just effects boxes, and
    you pretty much need to use a separate preamp with them.
    
    Mark
    
1541.8FREEBE::REAUMEone Jalapeno milkshake pleaseWed Apr 11 1990 14:2512
  ditto on that Roy! If you're close to the Kitty Hawk factory, go over
there, slap 'em in the head, and tell them to answer Boom's letter!
I used to have a GP-8, I used the ext control jacks to switch channels
in my old KMD amp and my Kitty Hawk M3, but when I tried to use it
on my KH M1 but there was a technical problem related to the way Roland
rigged the GP-8. The sleeve of the control outputs were common with
the sleeve of the audio output and the M1 didn't like it. It just killed
the guitar signal!
  So I use the Kitty Hawk patch bayettes to change channels and everything
works just fine! But if the FX-500 will "do it all" then that's probably
the most cost effective!   
    					-BoOm-
1541.9any ideas ??MILKWY::JACQUESWed Apr 11 1990 15:4833
    While we are on the subject, I have something in mind, which I have
    tried, unsuccessfully.
    
    I have a new Fender "The Twin" amp. It comes with a footswitch, which
    controls the channel switching and the reverb on/off. The footswitch
    plugs into a single stereo 1/4" phone plug on the back of the amp.
    I would like to retire the chrome-plated foot switch that comes with
    the amp, and replace it with a couple of Boss FS5L (latching-type) foot 
    switches. I have tried doing this, and got the channel switching to work, 
    but I can't get the reverb to switch. First of all, I plugged an adaptor
    cable into the footswitch jack on the amp. This cable brings the two
    channels of the stereo jack out to separate 1/4" plugs. I then connect
    these to separate FS5L foot switches. The channel switching works no
    problem, after finding the correct polarity setting. I have tried
    both polarity positions and the reverb still does not work properly.
    It remains in the off state regardless of switch settings.
    
    You may ask, why would I want to retire the stock footswitch and
    spend $50.00 on Boss FS5L switches. There are several reasons for
    doing this. I am currently using 2 of these to control other efx, 
    and one FS5U (non-latching momentary switch) for a punch-in pedal.
    These units slide into each other to form a nice organized pedal 
    board. They also look much cooler than a clutter of odd pedals on 
    the floor. The other reason I want to do this, is because I am a 
    musician, and we are supposed to be allowed to do things that makes 
    little or no sense to anyone but ourselves. Call it creative 
    stubborness.
    
    If anyone has any ideas, I am all ears. I suppose it would help if I 
    had a schematic for this amp. 
    
	Mark Jacques
    
1541.10slight diversionUPWARD::HEISERfrom the trendoid vortex of AmericaWed Apr 11 1990 16:063
    I saw a GP8 in the local want ads last week for $450!
    
    Mike
1541.11say what????ROYALT::BUSENBARKThu Apr 12 1990 15:5310
    re..7
    
    	Mark,compare your fender footswitch stereo plug to a typical 
    stereo plug make sure the dimension's of the tip,ring and gnd sleeves
    are the same. I'd also look at the insides of the pedal too make
    sure you only got 3 wires(and not 4)
    	I'll dig up my copy of "the twin"schem's if you need them.....
    
    							Rick
    
1541.12re .9MILKWY::JACQUESThu Apr 12 1990 19:1116
    Rick,
    
    	I called Fender yesterday, and they are sending me a schematic.
    Actually, I think the plug on the back of the amp is a mono 1/4" plug, 
    as well as the plug on the end of the footswitch cable. I guess they 
    bring the channel switching line out the tip, and the reverb line out 
    the ring (or visa versa). I'm not sure what they are doing inside the 
    switch. The footswitch has an led to indicate the status of each function, 
    yet it does not need a battery. Obviously, the leds are getting power 
    from the amp.
    
	I guess I have some more investigation to do.
    
    	Thanks,
    	Mark
    
1541.13GLOWS::COCCOLIIs everybody happy?Thu Apr 12 1990 22:1714
    
    
      I tried the fx-500 and found it lacking. 
    I didn't like the distortion (a matter of taste).
    It ain't rack mount( it's half size). You can get an adapter kit,
    but it would mess up the aesthetic look of my rack.
    The price I was quoted was $360.
    The prices of used Gp-8's and Gsp-5's are very competetive.
    New Gsp-5's can be had for $309 at Sam Ash.
    
    
    Rich
         
    
1541.14more on The Twin footswitch.MILKWY::JACQUESWed Apr 18 1990 15:0430
    
    I recieved a (barely legible) schematic for my Fender "The Twin" in 
    the mail the other day. The foot-switch circuit on this amp is set 
    up very unique to say the least. They are taking 30vac off the power 
    supply transformer and bringing it to the tip of the foot-switch jack. 
    The channel switch has a forward biased diode tied to ground, and the 
    reverb switch has a reversed bias diode tied to ground. They tie the 
    same 30vac line to 2 comparators which sense the voltage drops and make 
    the appropriate switch. While this circuit works good, it makes this 
    amp uncompatable with standard foot-switches, and also prevents you 
    from using control outputs (on a GP8, midi patch bay, or other similar 
    devices) to do the switching. I spoke with someone at EU Wurly the
    other day, and they were just as surprised to learn this as I am.
    Apparently, they have never tried it, but assumed it would work like
    any other amp.
    
    I can think of one way around this problem. I am considering buying
    an extra Fender foot-switch, replace the stomp switches with 1/4" jacks, 
    and mount the switch inside the amp cabinet. I could then plug standard 
    1/4" cables into the Fender foot-switch and run them out to whatever
    I want. This would allow me to use a midi-patchbay or any other type
    of control device I want.
    
    Why do manufacturers do strange things like this ? Is it just to
    mess up the small minds of musicians like myself, or do they have
    some legitimate reason for being differant. In this day and age
    of MIDI, and compatability, why can't all manufacturers follow
    the same standard ? 
    
	Mark
1541.15IOSG::CREASYQuiet in the cheap seats!!Wed Apr 18 1990 17:1116
>    Why do manufacturers do strange things like this ? Is it just to
>    mess up the small minds of musicians like myself, or do they have
>    some legitimate reason for being differant.
    
    Mark,
    
    While I can understand your bewilderment, I have to say I applaud
    Fender for doing this - by using an ordinary jack-to-jack, an ordinary
    joe like me can replace the cable at a moment's notice if it goes down
    at a gig.
    
    BTW, thanks for doing all this research - I *thought* it was an
    ordinary lead connecting the footswitch on my Twin, now I'm sure!
    
    Nick
    
1541.16There are two differant versions of thisMILKWY::JACQUESWed Apr 18 1990 17:2511
    By the way, when "The Twin" was first introduced, Fender supplied them
    with a round, chrome-plated footswitch, with a hard-wired cord. This 
    switch looks almost identical to the switch that came with my mid-70's
    silver face Twin, except for the addition of LED's.
    
    They have since replaced this design with a rectangular box, which
    is black and brushed silver in color. I believe the guts of the two
    differant switches are identical. 
    
    Mark
    
1541.17FX cant switch amps dist or reverbKBOMFG::MACKINNONWed Jun 20 1990 08:2215
    I'm putting this note in here now just in case someone else is looking
    for information on the FX-500.  I found out that the FX-500 DOES NOT
    perform external control on an amp - ie. you cannot control the amps
    distortion, reverb etc with the FX-500.  I do know that the Roland GP-8
    and GP-16 CAN do this.  Maybe some other effects boxes can as well, but
    these are the only ones I know of.  It is possible to achieve the above
    effect with certain midi controllable switch-boxes on the market - I 
    believe Meico and Scholz make some.  These would work in either in 
    conjunction  with an effects box or alone (if alone you could only
    change the amps distortion or reverb - not too useful because those 
    are usually switchable with the amps switchpedal's).  Anyways, I still
    bought the Yamaha and am pretty happy with it.  Even with the price of
    the switchbox the price is still a lot cheaper than buying the GP-8 or
    GP-16 (unless of course you buy a used GP-8 now!)  Outside of
    distortion the sounds are all pretty nice. 
1541.18WEFXEM::COTEAs seen on TV!Wed Jun 20 1990 10:257
    Correct me if I'm wrong (ha, like someone won't...), but I've never 
    seen an FX box that performed external control on an amp, or any other
    device for that matter.
    
    ???
    
    Edd
1541.19Mark Jacques has ESPAQUA::ROSTI'll do anything for moneyWed Jun 20 1990 12:254
    
    Yo, Edd go see .2.
    
    
1541.20Yep ... 8^)RAVEN1::JERRYWHITEJoke 'em if they can't take a ...Wed Jun 20 1990 13:554
    The GP-8 will switch 2 external devices (like reverb and channel/dist).
    I'm pretty sure the GP-16 does too.
    
    Scary
1541.21{blush}DCSVAX::COTEAs seen on TV!Wed Jun 20 1990 15:283
    Well, slap me silly!!! That sure is a nice touch...
    
    Edd
1541.22FREEBE::REAUMEWEEKENDworkweekWEEKENDworkweek...Thu Jun 28 1990 19:1114
      I used my GP-8 as a channel and reverb switcher and it worked
    fine, then I sold it and needed something else to do the same job
    (MIDI controlled switching). The Rockman MIDI Octopus seems well
    suited for this, but I got a DEAL on my Kitty Hawk MIDI Patch Bayettes
    and they do the same thing (and then some). Search through 1103.*
    and use tte" for a keyword if you want more info. The nice thing
    about the KH and the Rockman is that it's totally independant from
    your effects, so if you upgrade/replace your effects you still retain
    the MIDI switching capability.
      BTW - you're right about GP-8's selling chea. I let mine go with
    the foot controller for $450. It was hard to get more than that
    with all the new gear that's out.
    							-boom- 

1541.23Yamaha FX500 Effects ProcessorSMURF::BENNETTBe Bi BoMon Aug 20 1990 17:578
	I saw a couple of you talking about this beastie in 1717.

	Could one of you FX500 owners be so generous as to give us a
	rundown of capabilities, applications, nits, doc quality, price,
	etc?

	Thanks
1541.24Some Other Notes AlreadyAQUA::ROSTBad imitation of Rick CalcagniMon Aug 20 1990 18:233
    See notes 1541 and 1775.  Cheez, doesn't anybody ever type dir/title=?
    
    							Brian
1541.25info on FX-500 from a real ownerKBOMFG::MACKINNONTue Aug 28 1990 11:11156
I've owned an FX-500 a couple of months now and can probably answer a 
few of your questions.  For other information though you can check out
note 1775 (which I initiated) and the November 1989 issue of Guitar Player
magazine where they review it (quite favorably).

Okay:
price:  I bought it here in Germany where things like this are a lot
        more expensive than in the states - but I got it for about 
        $530 which is very good for here.  I actually saw a very un-used
        used one this summer while I was on vacation in the US for $250.
        At any rate its in a fairly reasonable price range for these
        gadgets for what you get.  I'm willing to bet you can find it
        for maybe $400-$450/

Documentation:  I found the documentation to be very good. After spending
                two evenings going slowly through it all + messing with
                the guitar and amps I felt pretty comfortable using it.

Capabilities:

The unit is pretty easy to use.  Its set up like this:

compression - distortion - EQ -->  Modulation   -   Reverb/Delay
                                   - chorus         - Reverb(various combinat
                                   - flange                  ations of hall,
                                   - "symphonic"             plate etc. reverb
                                     (a sort of              there are 8 I think
                                      lush chorus)  - Delay (can be set to diff
                                   - tremelo                 values for left/
                                                             right side when
                                                             used in stereo)
						    - Echo  (real echo)

There are of course many various parameters you can adjust in each of these 
effects and rather than going into the detail here the best thing to do would 
be to look through the user manual. If you can sit with one for an hour or so
you'll get the idea of what it can do.

The compression-distortion-EQ chain are fixed in order - although you can turn
any effect on or off.The order of Modulation (any of the 4 effects listed)
and Reverb/Delay can be switched.  That is you can run for example:
chorus --> delay or Echo-->flange etc.  This is a really nice feature because
the difference in sounds you can get between these two configurations is pretty
wide.  While programming you can use any 1 effect alone or use them all or
any number of them you want.   A nice feature is that you can easily turn 
on/off an effect (ex. compression) within the sound your programming (patch)
to see what  difference it makes.

There are 60 pre-set effects programs which contain any combination of the 
above effects.  There are 30 free spots for your own programs. This is one
of its "drawbacks" because most other units offer a 100 or so spots. I guess
this would be a problem if you use the unit a lot for the studio and wish to
store lots of different sounds for a library sort of thing.  I personally
only use about 5 different sounds when playing live (and some of these do
not differ from each other much). I only have about another 10 "sounds"
stored that I use for messing around with.  I don't use any of the 60
pre-set sounds but I find them good for getting ideas as to how to get
certain sounds I'de like.   Depending on the music you're into some are 
more useful than others.  There's a title edit feature that lets you store
a name for the patches you've created.

I find all of the effects to be pretty fine except for the distortion.
I guess its a matter of opinion on digital distortion but I don't find
ANY box that sounds good with this.  However when using it in stereo
you can coax some okay sort of warm sounding distortion out of it. The
distortion wants to sound heavy-metalish - and for this its pretty good.

The EQ is only 3 band - fairly limiting, but I have to admit for a 3 band
EQ its got good effect.

The Modulation and Delay/Reverb stuff is all excellent.  Another big
advantage of the Delay/Reverb section is that not only can you play it
before or after modulation, but you can set it up the following way:
Reverb (alone)
Delay  (alone)
Reverb-->Delay
Delay-->Reverb
   Reverb
-->  +   -->
   Delay

The reverb time can go up to 40 seconds which gives some really cool spacey
synthesiser sorts of sounds. So this set up gives you a pretty wide range of
sounds.

What else:

One of the best features for the box (and in this price range) for me, is
that VOLUME can be stored as part of the effect.  For playing live this
has been a life saver.  It means you can control for example the volume of 
sounds you wish to use for say a rhythm part of a tune and for a lead part
(usually louder than your rhythm part).  When you can't do this you either
have to dick with your guitar volume or the amp volume, and when you're playing
live this can be a pain in the ass.  I should note that there is no "overall"
volume control for a complete patch but rather a "level" control for each
individual effect (ie. comp,eq,dist,mod,rev/del etc) WITHIN the patch.  But
with use you find that this lets you control and store the volume setting
of the patch quite well.

Control wise you can control the calling up of patches by the following ways:
 o Midi pedal - best way (and most expensive of course)
 o You can program it to loop through any range of sounds ("patches") - ie.
   you could have it set up to go from 1-4 as 1-2-3-4 - that means to get
   from 1-3 for example you'de have to press the pedal 2 times.  This can
   be done with a regular old foot switch.  I lived with this for a while
   but have recently ordered a midi-pedal.  Its mostly a problem playing
   live to have to hit the pedal a few times to go to where you want. And
   its distracting keeping track of where you were so that you know how
   *many* times you have to push your foot down to go to where you wanna go.
   But its a good feature to have until you can save the bucks for a foot
   pedal cause it works with an ordinary foot pedal.
 o There is also a jack where you can bypass the sound programmed - that
   makes it basically a switch between what your playing and the natural
   sound of the amp. Also can be done with a regular footswitch.

It is also possible with a special foot pedal to control in real-time certain
parameters of different sounds in the box - for example, reverb,delay time ,
or volume.  This is supposed to be a big addition but I find it overkill
and too hard to get to used to using.

Drawbacks:
----------

o No pitch shifting
o No harmonizing
o Distortion aint too hot
o Its half rack size (you can get a rack mounting kit - but it may screw up
                      your set up if you have other rack stuff. - Also, some
                      people are kind of bent on the fact that "full" rack
                      size looks "cooler" than half - whatever.
o No external control.  The Roland GP-8 and 16 have this.  It allows you to
  turn on/off your amps distortion/reverb etc in addition to or without
  any effects.  ie. it would be nice to have a feature whereby you could
  have something like the amps distortion turned on in conjunction with  
  say delay from the FX box (assuming you prefer your amps distortion to the
  FX-500's.  You'de need to do this separately with a midi switch box.
  The GP-16 is in a much higher price class than the FX.
o Uses an AC adaptor instead of having power supply inside box.  For me this
  was good because I want to be able to use it in the US or here and it
  simply means owning two adaptors - but in general I think its better
  when the box just has a regular plug and not a bulky AC adaptor thing.
  The jack on this and wire are flimsy and I can foresee them breaking or
  getting frayed especially when you lug it around a lot for practices,gigs etc.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Anyways, I'm sure there are other good points and probably more of bad ones
I've either left out or don't know about, but this should help you a bit.  The
only other box I considered in the same price range was the SGE (ART) box
which does have some of the other options I mentioned above.  But you 
couldn't store the volume as part of the patch and this was a big point with 
me cause I need it for playing live, so I got the yamaha. I also found
the yamaha to be cleaner sounding - which is nice when recording. Check around.
The GP-8 I've heard is going for cheap now and has this external control which
I find really useful, but I *think* it has only one of reverb or delay, and
if it has both I don't think they can be played in the combinations that
the FX can - and I find this a big selling point of this box.
1541.26CHEFS::DALLISONLiquor and PokerTue Aug 28 1990 11:4914
    
    re:-1
    
    >> I should note that there is no "overall" volume control for a 
    >> complete patch but rather a "level" control for each individual 
    >> effect 
    
      Yes there is! The 'level' (LVL) parameter on the EQ effect actually
      lowers and raises the volume of all the patch effects and parameters,
      without losing any clarity of sound. So, if you have a very crunchy
      rock sound, and you lower the volume via the EQ level paremeter,
      you don't lose a thing - it still sounds hot when its very quiet. 
    
    -Tony ( who loves the distortion on his FX500 ).
1541.27I like my FX500!COPCLU::SANDGRENWalking TallTue Aug 28 1990 13:4226
I've used this box for quite a while now, and I'm very happy about it. I use
it for band rehearsel and for home recording. This little box enables you to
make quite an impressing sound quality when just connected to a tape recor-
der in your living room. With headphones plugged in, you can record your
Hendrix imitations, without your wife notice at all (if you have one). At
home, I use it together with my Roland D20 synth and a 4 channel taperecor-
der, and the final result when played on my stereo, is an impressing live
band sound quality (if you don't listen to all my goofing :>)...

One drawback is you can choose to have your footswitch step through a num-
ber of patches (as described in .2), OR you can have it controlling the
Delay/Echo as tap-tempo-delay, not both. I find the tap-tempo-delay function 
quite useful; you trigger the footswitch twice in the same rhythm as the 
music you play, and BINGO the echo speed follows you...
Useful when doing the trick where your playing sounds double as fast as
you actually play...

When using it with my Fender The Twin, I connect it in the effect loop, but
I normally use the build-in reverb in the Fender, which I find very good,
and I also better like the distortion in the Fender than in the FX500. The
Chorus, Symphonic and Echo are very good when used with the Fender, and
when playing with a clean sound I also use the Compressor.

Poul

1541.28LVL on EQKBOMFG::MACKINNONTue Aug 28 1990 14:5512
    re .3
    
    thanks - I'll have to check that out. I haven't really tried just doing
    that and listening to the effect and I don't think its in the
    directions - but that's good to know.
    
    By the way - the distortion on the FX500 IS pretty good as far as 
    these boxes go and especially compared to others in this price
    range - but I still like the distortion on cranked up Fender,Boogie,
    or Marshall a lot better.
    
    Roy
1541.29CHEFS::DALLISONLiquor and PokerTue Aug 28 1990 14:5823
    
    Thinking about it, for the money, the only critism of the FX500 I have
    is as follows :-
    
    The unit has an adjustable input level on the front, in the form
    of a dial. Adjusting this allows you to trim off unwanted noise and
    hiss from your sound, to ensure that you get the best possible sound
    quality from you rig.
    
    BUT - the problem is, that as the input level is adjusted by a dial,
    and is a 'global' setting - if you get a nice 'noisless' level on one
    patch, as soon as you kick in another patch with maybe a bit more
    compression or EQ on, its likley to alter the input signal and
    therefore alter the sound. The only way you can compensate for this is
    by fiddling with the dial on the fron of your rig - not the sort of
    thing you wanna do whilst playing a gig huh ?
    
    I wish Yamaha had put an input level on each patch, like the EQ level
    mentioned a couple replies back. 
    
    Other than that, its cool.
    
    -Tony
1541.30CHEFS::DALLISONLiquor and PokerTue Aug 28 1990 15:0417
    
    re.5
    
    Hi Roy,
    
    Well, I guess the sort of distortion I'm after is a very metal sound, 
    and if you crank the FX500's distortion, with a little compression, eq 
    and a hint of chorus - it screams like a pig 8^). If I'm after a blues 
    type sound I just blug into my little combo which has a built in overdrive, 
    and whack it on the neck pick up - instant Clapton !
    
    I found that the factory presets aren't particually good, and are a very
    poor representation of the units capabilities. Once you get
    experimenting its great 8^).
    
    Cheers,
    -Tony
1541.3142443::DALLISONChange my lifeTue Oct 16 1990 15:5812
                
        I have a question.
        
        On my FX500 unit, whenever I program in a clean patch, it always 
        sounds very, very slightly distorted, even when there is no 
        distortion or overdrive effect in the patch. What could be doing 
        this ? Compression ? EQ ? I've experimented with this two, but with
        no luck - I've made sure its not the input level dirtying the signal
        too . Anybody out there had a similar problem please let me know.
        
        Cheers, 
        -Tony
1541.32A --> D --> AAQUA::ROSTShe moves me, manTue Oct 16 1990 16:2412
    Re: .8
    
    Digital FX aren't perfect, and the conversion from analog to digital to
    analog can introduce distortion.  Also, make sure you aren't
    overdriving the unit.  Other Yamaha FX have LEDs showing input level, I
    assume this one does, too.  Levels above "0" will cause a weird
    metallic distortion since digital circuits don't tolerate overloads
    well at all.
    
    						Brian
    
    					
1541.33CHEFS::DALLISONChange my lifeTue Oct 16 1990 16:519
    
    Yup, it has an adjustable input level, and I've experimented with that
    but with no luck.
    
    Is it possible thats it something to do with how I'm setting the
    EQ/Compression ?
    
    Thanks,
    -Tony
1541.34Hmm...GOES11::G_HOUSEShread melodicTue Oct 16 1990 21:4813
    Tony,
    
    Is it possible you're overdriving the amp with the output level of the
    FX?  This could easily happen if you're using a tube amp.  
    
    Does it happen when you select just certain effects?
    
    I often intentionally do this using the clean channel of my Kitty Hawk,
    set so that it's clean if I play light and just a tiny bit of grunge if
    I play heavier, and then use an EQ stomp to boost the signal a little
    more for an intermediate level distortion. 
    
    Greg
1541.35BTOVT::BAGDY_MI'm the Lord of the WastelandsWed Oct 17 1990 10:3019
        Tony,
        
        Just a  thought  that  I  noticed from using my Roland SP1000
        digital delay.  Is there a `Phase Shift' setting that you can
        turn on or off  on  this  ?  I'm not familiar with the FX500,
        although my brother owns a GPE50 effects.  (Plus I know these
        are two totally different animals. (FX vs. Delay))
        
        When I used the `Phase Shift'  switch, it seemed to muddy the
        lower frequencies and cause a slight distortion in the higher
        hz.  Not much, but enough to be noticed.  
        
        Also, does  this  unit  have  adjustable  parameters for each
        effect ?  
        
        Just an idea. . .
        
        Matt
1541.36CHEFS::DALLISONChange my lifeWed Oct 17 1990 11:2310
    
    Re: .11 - Greg, it is possible that the output level is overdriving the
    singal - I'm using Laney heads, which are all tube. is there any way to 
    prevent this or even test this ?
    
    Re: .12 - Unfortunatlrey Matt there isn't a phase shift setting on the 
              unit 8^(
    
    Thanks,
    -Tony
1541.37AQUA::ROSTShe moves me, manWed Oct 17 1990 12:0610
>    Re: .11 - Greg, it is possible that the output level is overdriving the
>    singal - I'm using Laney heads, which are all tube. is there any way to 
>    prevent this or even test this ?
    
    Easy, go into your FX patch and set the output level down from 100% to
    maybe 75%, 50%, 30%, etc. and see if the sound cleans up.  Also check
    to see if the unit has any controls to adjust the send level from -20db
    (guitar level) to -10 or even +4 db (common pro audio levels).
    
    							Brian
1541.38Maybe the pickup...GSRC::COOPERMIDI rack pukeWed Oct 17 1990 21:316
    Could be your guitars pickup too mate.
    
    I know my charvel bridge pickup isn't the cleanest in the world.
    Try backing off on your guitars volume level a bit.
    
    jc
1541.39WHAT? CAN'T HEAR YOU!COPCLU::SANDGRENFast FredThu Oct 18 1990 08:2511
Tony,

did you use headphones when noticing the distortion? In that case, you
might have overdriven the output stage of the headphone circuit (I tried
that myself). Take care when using headphones, you start on reasonable
level, but turn it up once in a while to make it 'sing', and you end up
with a level that makes your ears cutoff at 800 Hz :-)

Poul

1541.40CHEFS::DALLISONChange my lifeThu Oct 18 1990 11:2615
    
    
    Well JC, I tried it on four guitars-
    
    Charvel (now got Charvel pickups), Vantage (EMG 85's), Aria Pro 
    (Aria pu's) and even on my electro acoustic (with those dinky little
    pick ups in the bridge). The signal is slightly dirty on all of them.
    
    I was running the unit through a cab.
    
    I'll try and modify the output level. Many thanks for he advice folks!
    
    Cheers,
    -Tony