Conference napalm::guitar

    re: .0
    
    I think that Mesa is still selling tubes.  My friend needed some
    6L6s and Mesa didn't have them in stock awhile back.  They just
    called him last week to let him know that they'd received a fresh
    supply if he wanted to buy some.
    
    Greg

    Mesa is getting tubes (6L6) from China. Until that supply dries
    up I would imagine we're all set. Their previous supplier was Sylvania.
    Sylvania is getting out of the tube biz.
    
    Mesa stopped letting their dealers buy wholesale tubes for retail
    sale for a while. I believe the reason (I called Mesa) was that
    the China shipment was late. I think it's fixed now.
    
    I will say that I am a bit worried about the prices going up and/or
    the quality of tubes going down, but in the great tube debate a
    few notes back, I began to wonder myself if paying Mesa $18.50 for
    a 6L6 is worth it - especially since they used to brag about how
    
    high quality they were as a result of working with Sylvania and
    modifying them. Now they are coming from China and are the same
    price. Same quality? Who knows - but more important - does it really
    matter? 
    
    It could come down to simply a matter of your ears making the decision.

    
	Interesting subject,as I seem to be heading in a solid state direction
these day's to save on maintenance cost's from power tubes. This does not mean
I don't/wouldn't have a tube amp around to use. But I believe that a lot of 
hype has X% of truth to it. Solid state amp's are pretty unforgiving when they
blow up and I'm not so sure that there is an awful lot of preventive main-
tenance that can be done to avoid this situation. Whereas with tubes I've been
able to troubleshoot on the spot and be back up in 15 minutes. 
	I do believe there will always be someone who will have a set of tubes
around,however parts places have mumbled to me that they are getting out of 
the tube buisness. 
	This will make it even harder and 10 years from now at a retail level 
they will command a high price and unless some manufacturer takes the time to 
mature a process and test procedure we are at present going to see poor prod-
uction yields I would predic at first. We may find our far east friends will
control tubed futures. 
	Tube amp's will go up in price as I'm sure everyone know's,however 
amp manufacturers will be more likely not to sell tubes as they will want 
them to sell amp's.
	Plus I would expect more solid state amp designers working harder
to provide a "tube sound"
	Reliability? Cost's and Maintenance? I have a better track record 
with tubes,and a little experiance with solid state which was not bad. But
I would prefer to minimalize all the above.

	I have not found the sonic changes too painful to handle. :^)


							

    Some friends of mine have the same problem with an old hybrid (tubes
    + solid state) console TV.  Nobody will touch it for repairs because
    the tubes aren't available.
    
    Mike

    	Well, the tube shortage dilemma seems to be consistent with
    other "mature" industries in America.  The technology has been moving
    toward better transistorized products and away from tubes.  At the
    same time other nations have been improving upon tube technology.
    (From what I've heard, the USSR is making great inroads in the tube
    world).  Typically, these things come full circle (like DRAM's)
    and once the supply tapers off and the demand picks up here in the
    U.S. manufacturers re-start their tube production again.
    
    Is there anyone left who makes tubes in America?
    
    joe.

    This is oneof the reasons I wanted an MP-1, it only has two tubes
    (12AX7's ???) and I figured I'd just buy a hundred or so...:-)
    
    
    dbii

    A satisfied GP-8 owner says, "Tubes ?  Why they don't even put 'em
    in tires anymore ...."
    
    Something I wondered anyway ... if you have a tube amp or pre-amp,
    BUT you have a wad of digital rack effects going into it, how much
    of you "tube" tone actually makes it out of a speaker ?
    
    
    				Scary .... !

    I think the desire for tubes in that tube distortion sounds better
    to many of us than any other approach...so I really only need a
    tube preamp....
    
    dbii

    A satisfied GP-8 owner says, "Tubes ?  Why they don't even put 'em
    in tires anymore ...."

******* Sure they do! What about bikes?  :^)
    
    Something I wondered anyway ... if you have a tube amp or pre-amp,
    BUT you have a wad of digital rack effects going into it, how much
    of you "tube" tone actually makes it out of a speaker ?
    

******* A good question,digital effects add to the sound or waveform,(or
changes phase?) however it's popular music production(regardless of idiom) 
that dictates effects used. These effects which seem to be fads like flange,
chorus,or delay and I use them sparingly or when called for. I also believe
you can play your effects as much as you play your instrument.The basis of 
the sound or tone is still tubed.   
	However if you consider distortion and overdrive an effect it has 
been the most popular and probably has the most variations. Some unusable,
some very unique. 
	 I just prefer a guitar and a tube amp....

    re: .7-.9
    
    Well I own both a GP-8 and a tube amp (the "B" brand) and while I
    might no longer take the tube amp out on run-of-the-mill gigs
    (the GP-8 is good enough and I already have to lug both a full
    keyboard setup and a guitar setup), it's not a replacement for
    a tube amp.
    
    The GP-8 still sounds very "processed" to me, where as the B_____
    has that tube amp warmth and dynamics.
    
    	db

      I also have a GP-8, but hardly use the overdrive (#3) or distortion
    (#4) sections as I have it set up to switch channels in both my
    Kitty Hawk Quattro tube pre-amp and the Kitty Hawk M1 head. I have
    a bank in the GP-8 set up for non-switching amps but the results
    are nowhere near as good. 
      As far as tubes go, I wouldn't worry too much about 12AX7A's ,
    they are common enough to stay in production and I haven't had any
    problems with them in the past. I wouldn't hesitate to buy any of the
    rack mount tube pre-amps out there if it gives you the sound you're
    after. There's quite a selection: Boogie, Metaltronix, Kitty Hawk,
    and probably some othes.
      Some of the same holds true for entire tube amps. 6L6's and EL34's
    are out there enough to warrant a suppliers interest. The big factor
    here is going to be qualility and price. 
      Anyway , this topic has given me more incentive to send away for
    the Audio-Glassic brochure and see what they are all about. 

    
    Groove Tubes has just come out with a series of socket adapters
    to allow using common preamp tubes like 12AX7s in amps that use
    less easily found tubes like the 6CA7.
    
    Only catch....$40 each.

    
    
    
    	WOW, 40 bucks for a gizmo that remaps a tube socket... we're in the
    wrong business!!!  Gotta be all of $2 cost.
    
    Steve
    
    I'll look for 6ca7's at my next hamfest?

It may not be a simple remap. The first digit of a tube number usually
is the voltage that the heater element runs at. 6L6CG's for instance run
at 6 volts, or you can put 2 heaters in series & run them at 12 volts
(using 2 tubes). 12AX7's run thier heaters at 12 volts. I'd suspect that
6AC7's run at 6 volts, so using a 12AX7 will not be that simple. It's
possible that they also supply an additional on board power supply, or
wall bug to give it the 12 volts it will need.

NOTE: The 1st digit rule does not always apply. I don't recall the logic
      behind the other numbering schemes (probably has to do with Mil-Spec
      differentation).

								Jens

    
    
    
    
    	Ummmm... oh <blush>... more complicated, huh.  Seems like I'm
    always trying to make things to simple!  
    
    
    Steve

    For those of us who have TUBE amps & want to pick up some spares...

    PROSOUND in Colorado Springs (Boulder & Denver also) has 6L6GC's
    and 12AX7's for $6.99 this week only (it's thier 15th aniversary &
    part of the celebration). My wife just picked up 4 6L6GC's for me
    this morning (at that price, I'd have to be crazy not to get some
    spares). As for the brand, I don't know who made the tubes. I happen
    to have quite a few spare 12AX7's so, I only went for the 6L6GC's

    If you want to follow up on this offer, the phone # here in 
    Colorado Springs is: (719)597-9962    

re: .14

    6CA7's do use  6.3  volts  on  the  heaters,  and whereas the
    12AX7's have "12.6 volt" heaters, they are center-tapped, so
    that both "halves" of the heater can be run in parallel at
    6.3 volts.   So  no  extra  power should be required.  At $40
    apiece for these adapters, I say go buy a tube spec book and
    make your own; it should just be a re-map as another reply
    stated.
    


                                Kent - using an SVT with
                                       zillions of tubes...

    
    
    7 years later, tubes and tube amps still easily available and
    rackmount stuff less prevalent.  It's a miracle. 8-)
    
    Kevin
    

    kinda like the oil crisis of the '70s.