Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    Even if you don't ever want Prodigy (I don't), call 1-800-822-6922
    ext. 333 and tell them you want Prodigy to be ported over to the Amiga.
    
    To get Prodigy on the Amiga would help make the Amiga a 'legitimate'
    computer in the eyes of all the ibm/mac folks.
    
    I have a letter I wrote (in document format) to Prodigy that I'd be glad 
    to send to anyone who wants it.
    
    Steve
    

    I used to subscribe to Prodigy and don't think very much of it.
    The only ability I found myself using was the airline reservation
    system. All the news, stock info, etc are available in clarinet.
    
    Censorship of bulletin boards is a very common occurance in Prodigy.
    Just mention an IBM or Sears competitor, or something against prodigy,
    or something promoting a non-IBM computer club and it'll will get
    deleted. There is no download/upload facility, and email is limited
    to the prodigy system. The system news and bulletin boards are VERY
    IBM related. You also start to get all sorts of junk mail and email.
    
    Prodigy can be used on an Amiga with either Bridgeboard and 10meg of
    harddisk space. This was how I used it, and I would just say I was
    running on an XT clone. I was aware of one humorous effort on the
    part of Prodigy Support in Connecticut to get it to run on the
    Transformer - needless to say that was abandoned quickly.
    
    Keith

re: .1

I called the 800-number and got an person who was only (IMHO) a dull drone.

The person was clearly following a script. When I mentioned Amiga there was
a quick "you need an IBM compatible or MacIntosh computer to run Prodogy.
Can I direct you to a dealer in your area?"

I was insulted by this and let the person know that if Prodogy ran on a
Commodore Amiga I would subscribe. I think it went as far as his ear.

	Thanks,
		-SES

I called and got Herb Hack (didn't tease him about his name :-)

he read the script and asked which computer I had. I loudly and proudly said 
Amiga. "We don't currently suppot..."

I said, I'm one of a barrage of calls you'll soon get complaining about this.
It's well worth your effort to support Amiga etc etc.

he thanks me for my interest.

john

     I just extracted the 800 number in .1 and by accident named
     it porigy_number.txt... ;-) Is it as slow as mush?
     
     Maybe you had to be there.
     Dave

    I admire all your efforts to carry the amiga Banner. My thought when I
    recieved a offer for a free intro kit was "trash". Thats what I did. 
    	I realize that this is a self defeating act(should complain,and be
    heard) but I don't use a modem today,and would join Plink,or Bix if I
    did. I also realize the IBM,MAC vs Amiga holy war will go on forever.
    In this instance IBM,SEARS has invested very heavy in prodigy,and I
    think they feel they are going to storm the world,and set another
    standard. Of course in both those worlds the standards arn't that great
    so they may do it.(read "they didn't but will think they did"). Let
    them have prodigy,it will lesson the congestion on the important
    services, most of who support the Amiga. If someone refuses to
    recognize the Amiga today,it has to be a deliberate attempt to do so.
    I would not even flatter them with a phone call. 
    							bill

    
    I think the Prodigy bashers are missing the point... Prodigy
    absolutely, positively, without argument, is the poorest excuse for an
    online service to come along in decades.  
    
    It sucks dead gerbils through a garden hose.
    
    It is a complete and absolute waste of time and money.
    
    No one with even an ounce of good taste would ever mess around there.
    
    However, many potential buyers of home or personal computers know as
    much about online services as I know about electron spin.  They think
    that Prodigy is the telecommunications equivalent of teleportation. 
    They will not consider a computer that is not Prodigy compatible.
    
    So, we get Prodigy running on the Amiga, all these simpletons will buy
    Amigas, and THEN we let them in on the joke.  By this time, they have
    matured to sophisticated Amiga power users, and will chuckle at their
    earlier folly.
    
    By the way, I too called Prodigy, and got the 'IBM or Macintosh
    version'.  I responded with 'Believe it or not, there is this entire
    third computer in the world, called the Commodore Amiga.'  The drone
    responded that they would send me a literature package.  I started to
    get a little mad and told her that if I received even one more IBM/MAC
    brochure that there would be major loss of life.
    
    At this she laughed, took my name and number, and promised to have a
    real person call me.
    
    Ed.
    

	While this is an IBM/SEARS venture, they also support Macintrashes.
Sears does sell the Amiga through its business centers, at least for one
government contract.  Also,  sears may be selling the 500C.


	Sears could realize more money from hardware they are selling by
supporting the Amiga on prodigy.

	I would probably never subscribe to Prodigy.  I have most of the
stuff necessary through work, and the only service that holds additional
value to me is BIX for the support that SAS, Commodore and others give
for Amiga users.

-----Robert

I had the interesting experience of getting an outside viewpoint on Prodigy
(who caught the previous intentional misspelling I used!).

What I saw was a person who was as fanatic as any amiga user, but in favor of
prodigy. I think it has a lot to do with what a person knows or has learned.
This person was not a computer person, but owned a computer and did some very
basic applications on it (spread sheet, word processing, etc). Not a clue
about cga/ega/vga or why they were important. They were not to him. Prodigy
was the first and only on-line service he had ever used. Hence, it was also
the best. It also fed his ego by being associated with "big name" folks in
"the industry" like IBM and Sears.

Remember, lots of folks liked RSX11/M for years, even after much better
and easier to use systems were available. It was what they knew. I am sure 
there are still folks who adore RSX11/M and see great beauty in it. I think
this has great parallel with prodigy and its long term potential success.

	Thanks,
		-SES

    As long as the world remains ignorant to the shortcomings of Msdos,and
    believe in the hype they hear from the big blue,and fruit makers there 
    will be users for this service. I have to admit that prodigy is mailing
    to everyone,and as they say "theres one born every minute". The person
    discribed in the previous note is the prefect example of prodigy's
    marketing success. At times I see IBM users at the amiga dealers,and
    often I take time to talk to them,and show the Amiga. I was asked why I
    bother. I replied"because when that person sits down at his system
    tonight I want him to have a pain in the belly". I really feel that
    once these people play with the Amiga if they don't feel they are
    missing something then they should be given a free membership to 
    prodigy.
    								bill

    Re: .8
>                      -< Doesn't Sears handle Amigas... >-

>	While this is an IBM/SEARS venture, they also support Macintrashes.
>Sears does sell the Amiga through its business centers, at least for one
>government contract.  Also,  sears may be selling the 500C.

    Yes, and Sears is also now carrying that wonderful, overpriced piece
    of IBM hardware called the PS/1 (and bundling Prodigy with it). I thought
    the New England area wasn't supposed to see PS/1's for some time, but
    I happened to stumble across one the other nite at the Pheasant Lane
    Mall. What a poor excuse for a computer. $1999! Yikes, gimme a break.
    Seeing what clones cost these days, I can't see how IBM thinks
    they'll fool anyone this time.

    -Dom

    re .11
    
    I don't know about that... IBM (Incredibly Boring Machines) has been
    fooling people for years with their whole PC series, and now prodigy,
    and PS/1.
    
    The only thing Pee-Cee's have up on the Amiga is software.  There isn't
    a thing that an IBM can do that an Amiga can't... it's just no one has
    written the software.
    
    Steve
    

Excuse my ignorance of Prodigy, but why does Amiga support require the help
of the Prodigy staff?  Must things be changed at their end?  (E.g. if they
downline load executable code into your machine.)  Or, is it that the
protocol is secret?  (Is reverse engineering that difficult?)  Or is it
just that a bootleg port would not be useful without advertising by
Prodigy?

	Paul

I got a mailing today from Prodigy.

HERE WHAT I DID!

I write across the form: If you supported AMIGA I would subscribe to
Prodigy!

That's all. Says it all! I suggest that all reading this notes file
do the same.

Afterall, if we all return the envelopes, THEY  have to pay the
postage to get OUR message delivered to THEM.

I like it. Of course, I taped a brick to the envelope, but I would
not recommend that to others....

	-SES

    
    I got a letter from them yesterday in response to a letter I sent them
    about a week and a half ago.
    
    Basicly it said "We don't support the Amiga and probably never will
    support the Amiga, and if you want to use Prodigy on your Amiga, get a
    bridgeboard."
    
    What a bunch of scum sucking boneheads. (sorry, the tone of thier
    letter irked me)
    
    Steve
    

    re: .15
    
    At least they now know about the bridgeboard, they could have told you
    to just buy a supported system :-)
    
    Hmmm.... that means they do support Amiga bridgeboard systems.  So why
    don't their ads mention that?  Yet another thing to hassle them about :-)
    
    I wonder if they have heard of the A500 ibmpc board that fits in the
    memory expansion slot.  Didn't see any mention of it in their ad.
    
    Dave

    re .17
    
    Yes, they support the bridgeboard, and I read that they even went out
    of their way to fix a bug so that it would work with Amax, the mac
    emulator.
    
    It really makes me wonder why they are so afraid of the Amiga.
    
    I suspect it's because it'll make the IBM and Mac look like 2nd rate
    computers and they simply can't afford that.
    
    Steve
    

     Just wondering if Quantum-Link will ever include an Amiga-Format.
      Seems like they would have done this a long time ago seeing thier a 
     Commodore specific online service...
      But then again, they could get pretty expensive in my old 8-bit days.
       Some time, I'll have to try PLink.
     From the sound of Prodigy, even if I get one of the pulsar boards for 
    my 500, I doubt I'd want thier service. 
      Although everyones point on exposure for the Amiga is well taken.
    
    								Ed
           
                         

Article          719
From: newsbytes@clarinet.com
Subject: Prodigy Users Organize Protest Against E-Mail Charge
Date: 20 Sep 90 05:01:01 GMT
 
NEW YORK NEW YORK, U.S.A., 1990 SEP 17 (NB) -- A group of 
Prodigy subscribers have organized a  planned boycott of 
Prodigy advertisers to protest Prodigy's planned imposition 
of a surcharge on electronic mail.
 
The surcharge, to become effective on January 1, 1991, will 
add a charge of 25 cents to e-mail messages posted. This charge 
will not apply to the first 30 messages posted by a household 
in any calendar month but will take effect on their 31st message 
of any month. Dawna Rowland, founder of the Cooperative Defense 
Campaign which is organizing the campaign, told Newsbytes: "We 
are not anti-Prodigy in any manner. We are extremely 
happy with the Prodigy service and many of us have become 
dependent on it. We are, however, extremely disturbed by this 
proposed increase and plan to do everything to roll it back. We 
are contacting Prodigy advertisers and explaining to them our 
plans to boycott their products as a method of protesting 
the increase. A number of these advertisers, when made aware 
of the problem,  have pledged support and told told us that they 
will write to Prodigy to support our position."
 
Rowland added: "We have not complained about the Prodigy flat-fee 
increase of 30 percent from $9.95 per month to $12.95, which is 
also to take effect on January 1. We understand that costs go up. 
The charge on the e-mail service will, however, cause people who 
have come to depend on the service to have to do without it. There 
are dozens of support groups that have set up communications 
through this service and most of these groups will not be able 
to afford such charges. These groups include mothers of 
disabled children, AIDS support groups, groups of the terminally 
ill and AA groups. These people cannot afford such an increase and 
their ability to communicate will effectively be cut off."
 
Rowland also charged that Prodigy had introduced the price change 
in an underhanded manner. "The flat rate increase was publicized 
through statements in the press. The e-mail charge was buried in 
a section of Prodigy called 'About Prodigy.' It was only through 
a few of us finding it there and publicizing it that the word 
has gotten out. Thousands of negative responses have come in since 
it became common knowledge."
 
Peter Stephenson, an electronic journalist who has assumed the 
responsibility of media relations for the protest group, told 
Newsbytes: "This group is extremely serious about pursuing 
these actions. We see areas of protest -- against Prodigy directly, 
against Sears and IBM, the Prodigy partners, and against the 
Prodigy advertisers. This charge will squash e-mail for thousands 
and this should not be allowed to happen. There are handicapped 
and environmental groups dependent on the service. Most of 
these persons are computer neophytes and know only Prodigy. They 
would have no way of even considering alternative e-mail services. 
It's very troubling."
 
Stephenson questioned statistics that Prodigy had used to come up 
with a 30 message base. "They talk about average client usage and 
base their client figures on the number of kits they have sold or 
given away. Many of these people never have used Prodigy at all 
and certainly should not be included in any statistics. Many 
others may use the service for specific things like 
weather, airline schedules or the new encyclopedia and never 
use e-mail. They should also not be included. Prodigy is getting 
a bad name for this whole thing. The kits they give out mention 
only a flat fee. There is no indication of additional charges 
for e-mail. It's reminiscent of a 'bait and switch' operation."
 
Brian Eck, Prodigy spokesperson, told Newsbytes: "We have gotten 
complaints on this increase from a very small percent of our 
472,00 members. The large majority of members are using less 
than 30 messages per month. We did find that a small group of 
users are using a large amount of the capacity. Approximately 
1,000 customers are sending 2,000 or more messages a month, 
a few dozen are sending in excess of 13,000 per month 
and one person, during August, sent over 20,000 messages. Some 
people have set up businesses on the service. We have to recover 
costs in some manner and we were faced with 2 choices -- to spread 
the cost among the entire base or to have the heavy users pay 
for the use. It seems much fairer to us to choose the latter. All 
we are asking is that people pay their fair share. The 25 cent 
charge for heavier users is still the cheapest form of instant 
communications that we are aware of. It is no more than the 
cost of a postage stamp."
 
(Barbara E. McMullen & John F. McMullen/19900917)

Wow! Now let me see if I get this right:

1) Prodigy is implementing a 30%+ increase on their flat rate, effective Jan 1.
2) Prodigy is implementing a $0.25 charge for each mail message beyond the
   first 30 in a given month.

a) Prodigy says they do not want to charge the general user base for the 
   excesses of a few.
b) Prodigy is implementing a 30%+ increase on their flat rate, effective Jan 1.

c) Many users are *dependent* on Prodigy

Hummmmm... now, what is wrong with this picture?

Maybe it's time for a little big government regulation to step into the
over censored cash cow of sears and ibm... 

Just one guy's opinion.

	-SES

    re: .19  Quantum-Link for Amiga
    
    Q-Link has an Amiga section, but it's quite pathetic compared to others
    like People-Link, Genie, etc.  For a very long time they promised to
    make an Amiga native interface available, but then decided to shelve it
    at the last minute.  For a while there was some hope that one of the
    C64 emulators would allow standard Q-Link to run on the Amiga, but that
    never worked out either.  So, the only way to access Amiga stuff on
    Q-Link is still through a C64.
    
    I've always thought it might be fun to reverse engineer a Q-Link front
    end for Amiga...

.20>It's reminiscent of a 'bait and switch' operation.
FWIW. Sears has been brought to court many times for bait and switch tactics.

I also read recently that the Prodigy project has cost quite a bit more
than originally expected. This would explain reluctance to fund more 
development as well as plans to raise prices.

Dave

    
    
    
    
    
    After getting Yet Another Mailing From Prodigy (YAMFP), I fired off
    this letter in response...
    
    
       							September 25, 1990



       Prodigy Interactive Personal Service
       PO Box 8667
       Gray, TN 37615

       Sirs:

       Enclosed please find one Prodigy Free Gift Certificate.  I have
       clearly marked the certificate to indicate that I am interested in
       the Prodigy service for the Commodore Amiga line of personal
       computers.

       As you may be aware, the Commodore Amiga personal computer is not
       compatible with personal computers made by IBM or Apple.  I do not
       now own, nor do I intend to purchase, an IBM compatible or Macintosh
       computer.

       I have spoken with Prodigy sales personnel over the telephone, and
       have received more promotional mail than I care to remember.  In
       each case, I have made it clear that I would be delighted to
       subscribe to Prodigy if an Amiga compatible version were available.

       Please do not advise me to purchase an IBM compatible BridgeBoard or
       the AMAX Macintosh emulator, as I do not intend to use either of
       these products.  I purchased an Amiga computer because I prefer the
       Amiga to the IBM and Macintosh.

       If you do not intend to produce an Amiga compatible version of the
       Prodigy software, please take me off your mailing lists immediately
       and kiss my subscription fees (and possible those of hundreds of
       thousands of other Amiga users) goodbye.

       Sincerely,



       Edward G. Acciardi
    
    
    Feel free to plagiarise any or all of the above the next time Prodigy
    comes 'a calling.
    
    Ed.

Article 65013 of comp.sys.amiga:
From: papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga
Subject: Re: PRODIGY HATES AMIGA -- Says wont do port!

In article <c56mo1w162w@valnet> Joseph P. Hillenburg (joseph@valnet.UUCP) writes:
>dannie@coplex.UUCP (Dannie Gregoire) writes:
>> The person I spoke with gave me some bunk reasons about it being near
>> impossible to port the software to the Amiga due to its difficult 
>> programming environment, and the "hellatious memory requirements that it
>> would require for the graphics" (over the IBM and MAC).  If they port their
>> cheesy IBM-ish graphics (as seen in their Information Guide)  it should be
>> no problem at all.

This is all a bunch of B.S.

>> The person I spoke with at Prodigy knew absolutely NOTHING of the AMIGA,
>> eventhough he seemed to think otherwise.  I think that the Programming
>> staff at Prodigy must be a group of ex-UNIVAC programmers from the 40's,
>> or a near equivalent. ;-)
>> PLEASE stand up for YOUR computer.  Call Prodigy TODAY and complain about
>> this lack of intelligence and information on their part.  Enough inquiries
>> might change their mind.

I doubt this (see my story later).

>Why? Who needs Prodigy? People/Link beats it easily for it's files base 
>(for any computer) and BIX beats it for information. If we want graphics, 
>why not use SpyPix? (On JR-Comm, not SkyTerm, which is BLAH!) SkyPix is 
>so much better and faster. About a month ago, a Prodigy saleswoman calles 
>my house wanting me to sign uo for it. I said I mighr get a subscription 
>if they made an Amiga version, then I saw it ona friend's Mac...too many 
>ads, too slow, (The one thing a TRS-80/300bps modem can beat) and not 
>worth be bucks. Heck, BIX'es rate is extremely worth it, especially 
>considering you get access to CATS as well...

The point is not what is good or bad, but the fact that Prodigy already has 
a vary large installed base, the backing of IBM and Sears and a VERY large
advertising budget.  Simply put, having the Amiga support Prodigy will make it
a more "mainstream" computer than it is now.

And now my story.  I evaluated Prodigy back in 1987. Did a little of
reverse-engineering on the IBM CGA/EGA version and came to the conclusion that
an Amiga version would be fairly easy to do and MUCH faster than the CGA/EGA
version that are the "norm" for Prodigy. Prodigy uses very few things for
its screen: fonts, line drawing and filling reagions with hatch styles.
that's it.  When this is done on an EGA/CGA it is abismally slow, since
neither card has these features in firmware: it is all done in software.
On the Amiga, all of this is done by the custom chips, and therefore can
be done at a speed to blow away such IBM implementations.

We went all the way to contact Prodigy Marketing Development at Prodigy
headquarters back in 1988.  We proposed to do the port for them back then.
We also indicated that the Amiga 500 was being sold in the same outlets
(Software Etc.) that sell Prodigy to the consumer market.

Their response was that they "had no money left from their budget, since
they were funding a Mac and an Apple II version of Prodigy".  We never 
heard from them again. I think the Mac version did come out eventually.
I don't know about the Apple II version.  Subsequently we received
word from a reliable source that one of the reasons NOT to do the Amiga
version was that it would have been so fast that it would have blown away
the versions running on IBM hardware.  I have no hard proof that this is
true, and so I offer it just as a rumor.

Another rumor at last DevCon was that CBM itself was going to be involved in
a Prodigy port, but again I have no real hard facts on this.  IMHO, it would
be GOOD for the Amiga to have a version of the Prodigy software running on
Ami.

-- Marco
-- 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"Xerox sues somebody for copying?" -- David Letterman
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=


Article 65081 of comp.sys.amiga:
From: hb136@leah.Albany.Edu (Herb Brown)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga,sci.math
Subject: Two announcements

The Amiga is now a fully supported platform on the campus of The Univ
at Albany and has become quite prominent in the capital district area
of New York. I would like to tell you about two future Amiga-related
events that may be of interest to you.
The University's Mathematics Department will have a classroom equipped
with Amiga computers for instructional purposes in the upcoming fall
semester. Other institutions have experimented with computer labs as
an aid to mathematics instruction, but this may very well be the first
university to attempt to teach mathematics using computers in the
classroom. The department plans to offer three sections of calculus,
one section of Basic Analysis, one in Classical Algebra, one in Linear
Programming & Game Theory, one in Numerical Analysis, and one is Stats.
It is anticipated that students will learn to use computer technology
as a tool to help them understand the fundamental concepts of the
discipline and to explore as many applications of those fundamental
concepts as possible. The computer will allow them access to both
numerical computations and graphical representations that has been
unattainable until now.
The second upcoming Amiga-related event has been designated as Amiga
Day. This is a joint venture sponsored by CBM and the area's two Amiga
user groups: The Capital District AMIGA User Group (cdAug) and The Latham
Amiga User Group (LAUG). The event is scheduled for Saturday, Oct 20, from
10:00 am to 4:00 pm at a centrally located site, The Town of Colonie 
Public Library. Admission is free and information regarding the exhibits
is being sent to the area's primary and secondary schools, colleges, and
universities. The theme is the Amiga's role in multimedia and its impact
in education.
........................................................................
Herb Brown  Math Dept  The Univ at Albany  Albany NY 12222  (518) 442-4640
hb136@leah.albany.edu

I lost the posting, but someone on Usenet claims to have talked to a friend who
works for "prodigy" writing software and that they *are* planning on doing an 
Amiga version sometime in the future...


Did we make a difference?


john

	Last October we got some information that Prodigy was being ported to
the Amiga. Has anyone heard anything recently? It seems like this is the
cheapest alternative if all  you want is EMAIL.