Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    ST251 = RD32 right? more  or less anyways...  Did you check the
    cables from the disk to the controller.  I got bit by that and
    took the system apart twice before I checked that.  Make sure that
    the cables are lined up correctly (they mention this in the 2090
    book.)  I did the install by hand rather than executing their
    script.  Though I do look at it to make sure I was doing it right.
    
    brad
    
        
    Attached is the mountlist for my system  (B2000,2090,ST251). 
    
devs/mountlist
    
RES0:     Device = hddisk.device
          Unit   = 1
          Flags = 0
          Surfaces = 6
          BlocksPerTrack = 17
          Reserved = 2
          Interleave = 0
          LowCyl = 0  ; HighCyl = 1
          Buffers = 1
          BufMemType = 0
#

DH0:      Device = hddisk.device
          Unit   = 1
          Flags  = 0
          Surfaces = 6
          BlocksPerTrack = 17
          Reserved = 2
          Interleave = 0
          LowCyl = 2  ; HighCyl = 27
          Buffers = 5
          BufMemType = 0
#

DH0P1:     Device = hddisk.device
           Unit   = 1
           Flags  = 0
           Surfaces  = 6
           BlocksPerTrack = 17
           Reserved = 2
           Interleave = 0
           LowCyl = 28  ;  HighCyl = 424
           Buffers = 20
           BufMemType = 0
#

DH0P2:     Device = hddisk.device
           Unit   = 1
           Flags  = 0
           Surfaces = 6
           BlocksPerTrack = 17
           Reserved = 2
           Interleave = 0
           LowCyl = 425  ;  HighCyl = 819
           Buffers = 20
           BufMemType = 0
#

    

Re -1

Thanks for the mountlist, it does prove to me that that isn't the problem
( been out of town all week so didn't get to try it till today ). 

In looking more closely, I find that it is hanging on BINDDRIVERS. The 
drive light comes on and that is the last thing that happens.  If I disconnect
the cables or take out the drive select jumper on the back of the drive,
then I can get through install and into prep to a point just after I have
to enter the error map.  I have never heard any hard disk activity.

      My cabling is as follows in case somebody sees something wrong.

2090 board      ::::::::   ::::::::   ::::::::::::::::::
                                  ^                    ^
                                  red line             red line

back of drive   --------   ::::::::   ------------------
                       ^   ^                           ^
                red line   jumper                      red line

Running 1.2 or 1.3 Kickstart makes no difference.
Running 1.2 or 1.3 Workbench makes no difference.
My Hard Disk Software for the 2090 is labeled V1.8 6/22/88
The behavior is the same whether I have the Starboard 2 meg in place or not.

Anybody got a feeling if this kind of behavior is pointing at my drive or 
the controller?

	Dick

    
    Well, when I had the problem with the swapped cables, I was also
    hanging on binddrivers.  Even though it seems that you have the
    drive cabled correctly did you try reversing the cables?  NB.  
    my cables were reveresed and I didn't hurt my drive, *HOWEVER*
    please only do this at your own risk.  Also, try replacing the
    cables.  It could be that you have a bad cable or two.
    
    brad
    

Ok, as long as there is a history ( of 1 ) of not blowing up the drives or 
controller by having the cables backwards and the symptoms around hanging on
binddrivers is the same, I'll give it a try.

Does anybody remember an article on USENET about this documentation on the 
cables being wrong ( dim memory from the past )?

If I have them backwards now and it does cause damage, I have to take it in
for repair. If they are right now, it still doesn't work and I have to take it
in for repair anyway.

Thanks,
	Dick

    
>>    Ok, as long as there is a history ( of 1 ) of not blowing up the drives or 
>>controller by having the cables backwards and the symptoms around hanging on

    	I didn't blow my controller or drives up.
    
    	Before you try "putting a twist in the cables" try a NEW set
    of cables or a set that you know works.  These cables are the same
    that DEC uses for all of their RD drives (ST506 type drives).  Then
    if the problem still persists put the twist in the cable.  If it
    still doesn't work, then I will open up my box and check it out
    for you.  I'd hate to see you pay money for a repair that you didn't
    necessarily need.
    
    brad
    

I checked the continuity of my cables - no problem.
Tried all the permutations of cable twisting - different symptoms but no
   success. Restoring the original configuration restored the original
   symptoms.
When the drive gets power on starting up, I can hear a click inside.

Is it possible that the drive is parked and these utilities won't clear the
parked situation?  ( this was a new drive fresh out of the antistatic wrapper)

Under what conditions should the drive start spinning?  Prep, mount, powerup,
binddrivers? If this is anything like the drive in my vaxmate, I should go
deaf from it. So far, only the click when it gets power ( even checked that 
out ( good clean 4.9 and 12.0 volts )

I'll drag home a drive I've used before and try that next as I know when I
put a new drive in a vaxmate I get some serious teeth nashing sounds before 
it figures out where it is and is able to be formatted.

	Dick

    
    
    Your description of the problem and the sound you hear I get the
    impression that the drive never actually spins up.
    
    The distinctive 'click' is normal but this should be followed by
    the sound of the drive spinning up. This sound should be obvious
    although I suspect not deafening :-) 
    
    After the drive comes up to speed the heads should recalibrate
    resulting in another distinctive sound. I can't describe it any
    better than the sound that you would normally hear from a seeking
    drive.
    
    Take a look at your power supply. I understand that a solid 2 amps
    of 5V and slightly less at 12V is required. This varies somewhat
    from drive to drive but the actual amount of current required may be 
    greater during the initial spin-up period due to inertia etc.
    
    If your voltage starts out at 5V or greater with no load (or just
    logic power requirements) but drops when you apply power to the
    drive motor I'd start looking for a beefier supply.
    
    Hope it helps and good luck
    -bw
    

    
    re -1
    
    agreed!  The drive should should click when power is first applied
    and then it should spin up.  If you close your eyes, it sounds like
    a plane preparing to take off.  If the drive never spins up, then
    binddrivers will fail.
    
    hope this helps,
    
    brad
    

I don't have an RD32 spec handy so I can't give you exact numbers.

Like .-? said, check the power *while* the drive is plugged in and trying to
spin. The 12V is of most interest since it takes the biggest surge (3-4 amps?).
What you describe is characteristic of not enough power on the 12 volts.

The click is a solonoid that locks the heads in the parked position. Once it
releases, the drive should spin up.


John

Many thanks to all, I had a bad disk that wasn't recognized by my VaxMate
either.  Another disk and no problems as advertized. This is being typed
from VT100 running off my ( long term loan ) RD32.  What a treat to have
all my tools on one disk and not have to swap every few minutes ;^)