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Conference hydra::amiga_v1

Title:AMIGA NOTES
Notice:Join us in the *NEW* conference - HYDRA::AMIGA_V2
Moderator:HYDRA::MOORE
Created:Sat Apr 26 1986
Last Modified:Wed Feb 05 1992
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:5378
Total number of notes:38326

233.0. "Pros & Cons about AMIGA???" by IMBACQ::PANEK () Wed Dec 24 1986 13:58

	I'm thinking of buying an AMIGA. Does anyone have any pros

	or cons about the AMIGA's versus other PC's, like, Radio Shack,

	or Apple, McIntosh, etc.

			Thanks, Ted Panek
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233.1First opinionHYSTER::DEARBORNTrouvez MieuxWed Dec 24 1986 17:2519
    If you look carefully at each one, and not get sucked in by sales
    hype...you will probably choose the Amiga.  Second choice, the MAC.
    Of course, this all depends upon what applications you have in mind.
     I shopped around, and decided on the Amiga.  I have never regreted
    the choice, the machine is fantastic.  Don't let people snow you
    into thinking there is no software for it either.  There is a lot
    of GREAT software for it NOW.  You may save a few bucks buying an
    ST from Atari, but you are also giving up a lot.  IBM clones...with
    the Amiga, you can have full IBM compatibility, monochrome and
    color...even at the same time!
    
    If you live in the Boston area, take a drive to the Memory Location
    on route 16 in Wellesley.  You will be amazed by all the Amiga stuff
    they have.  And you can see all of it in action.
    
    My opinion, buy an Amiga.
    
    Randy
    
233.2This is a long reply...CHEF::ACCIARDIWed Dec 24 1986 17:5496
    Boy, you came to the right place to ask about Amigas.  I have had
    mine for a year now, and I have just bought a 1 meg memory board.
    I can tell you that the Amiga's potential is only beginning to be
    tapped.
    
    After all the competitors have taken their best shot, the Amiga
    still has more features, right out of the box, than any other machine
    that I know of.  
    
    I hope I am not boring you with this, but in case you don't know, the 
    Amiga has a REAL multitasking OS, (The Mac, Apple][GS, and AtariST do not).
    
    Right out of the box, the Amiga has multiple graphics modes, but
    a quick summary follows:
    
    	320 x 200 interlaced     w/32 colors from a palette of 4096
    	320 x 200 non-interlaced  "	"	"	"	"
    	320 x 400 interlaced 	  "	"	"	"	"
    	640 x 200 interlaced     w/16  	"	"	"	"
    	640 x 200 non-interlaced w/16 	"	"	"	"
    	640 x 400 interlaced     w/16   "	"	"	"
    
    The Amiga also has an exclusive 'Hold-and-Modify' mode which
    allows all 4096 colors to appear on the screen in any of the
    above color/resolution combinations.  Screens in this mode are
    breathtakingly beautiful, and exceed the capabilities of any PC,
    including the IBM with the Professional Graphics Board.
    
    The Amiga has real stereo output, and an excellent sound chip, with
    sound sampling capabilities.  The Apple][GS has a more advanced sound
    chip, made by Ensonique, but they did some very silly things regarding
    the memory that the chip can access.  The ][GS also can't hold a
    candle to the Amiga for screen resolution, animation (it can't even
    page flip quickly), has no blitter chip, and is way overpriced.
    
    The most direct competitor to the Amiga is the Atari 1040ST, which
    has a megabyte of memory right out of the box, but once again, the
    ST is way outclassed in the sound and animation areas, and has no
    640 x 400 color mode available.  It does have a lovely 640 x 400
    non-interlaced mono display, which requires a special monitor, but
    one must swap monitors to go from color to mono, and most software
    is written for color or mono only, so to cover all bases, one needs
    both monitors.  The ST does have a built-in MIDI port, but it is
    not a great MIDI port.  Atari has been anouncing their own blitter
    chip for over a year now, but it is questionable whether or not
    it will speed up current software.  Just this week I played with
    an ST, and was amused at how program execution would grind to a
    halt just by moving the mouse.  The Amiga uses hardware sprites
    and the blitter chip to move large areas of screen at lightning
    speed.
    
    In terms of memory, the 1040 ST is a steal at $999.00 for a 1 meg
    computer, but so what?  Today you can buy 2 megabytes of Amiga memory
    for $500, whereas Atari seems to introduce a new, larger memory
    computer every year.
    
    In terms of software, the Mac is the clear winner for consistent,
    high quality stuff....but it has had a three year head start.  Now
    that the Amiga IFF standard has been adopted by all software writers,
    the Amiga can do anything the Mac can do, and tons of things it
    can't do...
    
    The ST and Amiga seem about equal in software volume, with the ST
    leading in the areas of Word-processing and business-type stuff,
    but the Amiga the clear winner in the graphics, animation and sound
    areas.  Entertainment software on the Amiga will absolutely run
    rings around the ST, thankss to the larger number of colors, stereo
    sound, and fast graphics.  Multitasking helps too, since a game
    can be fetching disk data, animating the screen, and playing a
    four-voice score, all without ever missing a single step.
    
    Anyway, I could go on forever, but your choice should be dictated
    by what you want your computer to do.  If costs are critical, it
    is hard to beat the ST.  If you need a ton of proven software, go
    with the Mac.  But the Amiga can do anything that the others can
    do, and lots that they cant, all at avery reasonable price.  Currently,
    you can get a 512K Amiga with 2 drives, and RGB monitor for around
    $1350.  And AmigaDOS is set up to work with a 68010, or 68020
    uProcessor.  I think it is going to be the computer to beat for
    quite some time.	
                         
    Low cost hard drives are (gulp) shipping in January, look for a
    20 meg Supra for $799.  Memory boards are available from a dozen
    or so vendors, and you can by a full-blown 68020/68881 for about
    $1500.
    
    The Side car is shipping in Europe and Canada, and should be available
    any minute now in the US.  It is a PC-in-a-box, for around $700.00
    AmigaDOS treats the Sidecar as a peripheral, and MS-Dos runs in
    it's own little window or screen.
    
    Well, I am getting tired.  Please ask the same question on the other
    conferences to get the opposing viewpoint.  But I will add that
    everyone that has gotten an in-depth Amiga demo from me has bought
    one after checking out the competition.
    
233.3More...HYSTER::DEARBORNTrouvez MieuxThu Dec 25 1986 21:3029
    I just spent most of Christmas day playing around with
    my brother's Mac Plus.  I gave him a copy of}i flight simulator
    for Christmas.  Al I can say is that now, I really don't like the
    Mac.  Like the ST, things slow down when you move the mouse.  I
    am used to the large screen on the Amiga.  Making the switch to
    the Mac felt like going from 70mm dolby stereo to black and white
    TV.  Everything is SO TINY!  (Yes, you can't see the scan lines,
    but you shouldn't have to use a magnifying glass to see a requestor.
    
    The CPU was always getting bogged down by mouse requests.  The thing
    couldn't decide whether to refresh the screen or ask for input...very
    disconcerting (my brother kept asking ME what was going on, why
    was the thing hanging up, etc.  Funny, I seldom have that happen
    with the Amiga)
    
    As slick as the Mac is, now I find it to be more 'toy like' than
    ever.  It spends so much time doing cute things, like the little
    animated boxes you get when you open something.  Now, more than
    ever, I really prefer the Amiga.  After all, what other computer,
    in this price range, give you so much, and multi-tasking too?
    
    I would not pooh-pooh multi-tasking (the way the competition does.)
    Once you've worked with it, you will really wonder how you ever
    got along without it.
    
    Good luck with you choice.
    
    Randy
    
233.4Amiga as a game systemGOLEM::GUAYSun Dec 28 1986 02:4519
    
    
    Hi,
    
    I currently own an Atari 800 XL and am thinking of moving up to
    the Amiga as my next system.  The only thing I would want to use
    it for is games.  I took a trip to the Wizz in Westboro and I noticed
    that they had some Amiga software, but when I asked them if they
    sold the machine I got a very firm NO.  It seems to be the best
    game system around from what I've seen so far, so I can't understand
    the reaction I got from them.  I've gotten a similar reaction from
    a couple of other places that sell computers around here 
    ( Shrewsbury ).  
    
    I have also heard rumors that a new better Amiga is going to be
    available soon.  Is this correct?  If so, and it is soon, it might
    be better for me to wait for it to come out...
    
    todd
233.5Skip the Whiz...CHEF::ACCIARDISun Dec 28 1986 03:4314
    The Whiz is owned by a friend of mine.  His primary interest is
    in selling 'The WHIZ PC'.  Seriously.  And a couple of reconditioned
    Apple ]['s.  His software selection is dismal, and way overpriced.
    
    The Whiz is an OK hobby shop, but if you buy software there, you're
    paying 20% too much.  Go to a real store, like the Memory Location
    in Wellesley, or the Bit Bucket in Sudbury or Newton.  I am a firm
    believer in supporting the stores that are supporting the Amiga. You
    can get a demo of what you want at any of the Amiga stores.  At
    the Whiz, you're on your own....
    
    By the way, the Amiga is the reigning world champion game machine,
    although it has been occasionally used for other purposes.
    
233.6Shortcomings...CHEF::ACCIARDISun Dec 28 1986 10:2651
    This seemed like a good place to list some of the shortcomings of
    the Amiga, as well as it's strong points.  I started thinking about
    this after seeing the 'Juggler' ray-tracing animation.  
    
    The Amiga custom chips are presently restricted to using the lower
    512K of memory.  Yes, you can expand an Amiga to 9.5 megabytes today,
    but the data for the graphics and sound chips must reside in the
    lower 512K.  I don't know why CBM did this.
    
    It may not seem like much of a problem, since 512K is a pretty big
    chunk of memory, but consider how the 'Juggler' demo works...a bunch
    of HAM ray-tracings are store in memory, and some little pointer
    somewhere jumps from frame to frame, causing pseudo-animation. 
    Actually, it is real animation.  Real good animation.  But if I
    wanted to make a similar animation with, say 500 frames, I would
    have to store the extra frames in external memory, then tramsfer
    them to the lower 512K, (Chip memory) to display them.  I don't
    know how fast the Amiga can do this.  Anyone know?
    
    Anyway, one of the things that I perceive to be a plus on the Atari
    ST is that there are no restrictions on where video data must reside.
    There are some very nice ray-tracings for the ST that are pretty
    impressive, athough limited to 16 colors.  With a megabyte of memory,
    a 1040 ST can store a truckload of frames without resorting to any
    memory shuffling.  Feel free to correct me if I am wrong about this.
    Anyhow, I hope CBM can come up with an upgrade or motherboard fix
    to correct this deficiency in the future.
    
    Another real flaw on the Amiga is the standard monitor.  It just
    is not a very good monitor.  For most work it is adequate, but the
    real problem is in the 640 x 400 color interlaced mode.  The 1080
    monitor has such short phosphor persistance that the screen flickers
    like crazy when in this mode.  The problem can be minimized by careful
    selection of low-contrast colors, but the only real fix is to buy
    a long-persistance monitor, which is a pretty expensive fix.  The
    bearable part is that very few commercial programs force you use
    that mode, but it is available if you decide to take advantage of
    it.  No other machine in the Amiga price range even offers the mode.
    
    Some medium-priced monitors, like the Sony, do a pretty good job
    in 640 x 400 interlaced, but it has always rubbed me that CBM would
    sell a monitor that simply cannot handle one of the Amiga's most
    powerful features.  640 x 400 with 16 colors is essential for CAD
    work.  I know, I know, a long-persistance monitor would have brought
    the system price up to unacceptable levels to support a mode that
    most people don't use, but I am one of the few who DO use it, and
    I resented having to buy a special monitor.
    
    Anyway, those are my gripes about the Amiga.  I still love it dearly,
    but it does have a few minor warts.  The plusses far outweigh the
    minuses in my opinion.
233.7A FEW wishesHYSTER::DEARBORNTrouvez MieuxMon Dec 29 1986 11:5618
    Here are a few more Cons:
    
    I wish there were more ports on the back of the machine.  One serial
    and one parallel makes things a little tight when you start adding
    on a lot a peripherals.  I know that I could always buy a "printer
    switch."  (Has anyone looked at the prices for these things in
    DECdirect lately?  They are asking between $160-300 for them...no
    wonder Digital is doing so well...)
    
    And what to do with that external drive?  Wouldn't it be nice if
    there was enough room in the system box to allow you to put it behind
    the left end of the front panel?
    
    Last of all, I'd like to have a numeric keypad like the one on the
    ST with a + key to use with the calculator.
    
    Gee, I can't think of anything else I would like...
    
233.8I want to buy an AMIGAPUERTO::ALVAREZMiguel,from sunny Puerto RicoMon Dec 29 1986 12:4929
    Hello !
    
    	After reading these notes for a few weeks, you guys have convinced
    me that what I want is an AMIGA. I don't want to add another note
    on something that has been talked about a lot, so I think this is
    a good opportunity to ask a few questions. 
    	
    	Here in Puerto Rico, I found one place that sells AMIGA's, but
    reading these notes I'm sure I can get a better deal in the states.
    So, I will be on a business trip to Tewksbury on the week of Jan
    12. Unfortunately, I will be only two days and very busy, so I won't
    have much time to shop around. My questions are:
    
    	1. What's the best place to buy an AMIGA ? I have seen mentioned
    	here The Memory Location, Bit Bucket, ComputerMart and Electronics
    	Boutique. Could you please specify the address ? Does it takes
    	American Express (if not, I will have to carry enough cash).
    
    	2. Does it sounds possible, even though difficult, to carry
    	and AMIGA, monitor and external drive as carry-on luggage on
    	plane. (I'm thinking in terms of volume and weight)
    
    	3. Is there any other music software you would recommend ? Assume
    	only an amplifier and speakers as additional equipment. I have
    	seen the bad reviews on MUSIC STUDIO. Any other you'd recommend?
    
    Thanks for the information. Happy Holidays.
    
    Miguel A. Alvarez
233.9Success!HYSTER::DEARBORNTrouvez MieuxMon Dec 29 1986 13:4914
    The Memory Location will ship it to you.  You will not have to pay
    the Massachusetts sales tax if you have it shipped.
    
    Deluxe Music seems to be the package to have.  Copies are pretty
    rare, perhaps mail order is the way to go.
    
    As mentioned in other notes, GOAMIGA (1-800-BEAMIGA) is a great
    place for mail ordering.  They have great prices, and are very
    responsive. 
    
    As for size, "carrying on" everything might be difficult, as the
    system box and monitor boxes are rather bulky.  Consider having
    the system shipped to you instead.
    
233.10...CHEF::ACCIARDITue Dec 30 1986 10:4915
    Re: .8
    
    Miguel...
    
    The phone number of the Memory Location is 617-237-6846.  They are
    on Route 16 in Wellesley, MA, which is right off of Route 9 heading
    east towards Boston.
    
    The Bit Bucket has a new Sudbury MA store.  Their address is 627
    Post Road.  They have been advertising a system price of around
    $1450 for an Amiga w/512K, Monitor, and external drive.
    
    Good luck with your purchase.
    
    Ed Acciardi