Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    naw, come on.  I find it extremely hard to even imagine that CBM
    would or even could kill the Amiga by neglect...
    
    brian

    A USENET note recently paraphased a quote from LOTUS magazine about
    AMIGA. [June Issue I think]
    
    It seems the C128 will be getting more of the advertizing pie at
    the expense of the AMIGA.  It seems that all machines today will
    be publicly bashed due to impending IBM winter announcements.
    
    All vendors (even Digitals VAXMATE) offerings are being delayed
    awaiting details of the IBM $600-$1000 PC compatible machines slated
    to arrive. [my opinion]
    
    There is no need to flame-on.  Any viable machine below $1000 will
    hold its' own.  I've finally given-up on the sidecar since a low-cost
    IBM could replace what I need it for.

    Not flaming on, but just curious. 
        
    Given that I do own an AMIGA, I can't see the rational for attaining
    IBM compatibility in any other way than with the SIDECAR - assuming
    that it functions as advertised. 
        
    The last thing I need, regardless of the price range, would be another
    system box, monitor, keyboard, associated cables, etc.  I have neither
    the space (nor do I think the power into my house) to accomodate so
    much hardware!  Perhaps it just a matter of personal preference, but
    seems a bit redundant. 
    
    I guess time will tell what one will get from IBM for the $600-$1000
    versus what the SIDECAR, inconjunction with the AMIGA, yeilds. 
    
        
    Art Gosling - Kanata 

    
    	Hi Amigaheads!
    
    	I'm new to this file and I like to read all the old notes in a
    conference rather than doing a set seen so that I know what's already
    been discussed.  I'm sorry if this is redundant due to a future posting,
    but:
    
    	What's happening now?  Is the CBM's supporting the Amiga in
    a satisfactory way or have they (and if so, to what degree) dumped
    it for something else?  This is of major concern to me, 'cause I
    bought a TI99/4A which, soon after, was discontinued by TI.  I was
    16 at the time and bought thier computer & periph's instead of a
    car.  It was my first computer so I didn't have much of an idea
    about what to get and as soon as I did, it was no longer available
    in stores.  Needless to say I was very angry with TI.
    
    	Now I'm close to buying an Amiga, but upon reading this note
    all those bad memories re-surfaced.
    
    	The machine seems to do everything I'd like it to, but if CBM
    is gonna blow it off then I'll take my bussiness elsewhere.
    
    	Thanks in advance,
    	Derek Davies
    
    

Hi Derek,  I don't know much except what I read in an announcement from
Commodore where they stated that the Amiga 2000 was "the Amiga" and it
would continue to be supported forever (or something like that :-))

Don't know about the 500 and the 1000, as you probably know, was discontinued
last year.

							...richard

    Just to bring you up to date...
    
    CBM has sold over 600,000 Amigas worldwide.  Not too bad, considering
    that the Mac just passed the 1,000,000 mark last year.  The A500
    probably comprises the bulk of that total; somewhere around 150K
    A1000s were sold (all that were made) and around 75,000 A2000s.
    
    Max Toy, current President of CBM, recently appeared on the Computer
    Show proclaiming that there were over 1,000 titles now available,
    in every category.
    
    Peripherals abound, especially for the slotted A2000.  68020/68881
    boards, genlocks, hard drives, memory boards, frame grabbers,
    digitizers, MIDI, etc.
    
    Version 1.3 of the system software is close to release and promises
    to be a major enhancement.  V1.4 is due later in the year and should
    be a real killer.  The OS is fairly stable now; developers are learning
    to write well behaved programs.  System crashes are now the exception
    rather than the rule.
    
    Do I sound optimistic?  You bet I am.  I doubt if the Amiga will
    ever catch up with the Mac, but it's establishing it's own loyal
    following.
    
    

    Read note #1395 and 1399;  I think you'll have a more current idea
    where CBM and the Amiga community are today.

    The new issue of Computer Shopper has an article on their Classic
    Computers section.  The TI part mentions something like a million
    TI 99/4As were sold (probably a lot of them after the price drop
    when TI abandoned them).  So numbers help keep a computer alive,
    but commitment from the manufacturer is much more important.
    Commodore's future was the C64/C128 computers.  Now it's the 
    Amiga.  
    
    -dave

    re: .7
    
    > I doubt if the Amiga will ever catch up to the MAC.
    
    By "catch up" you're talking about number of sales.
    
    The Amiga has surpassed the MAC in HW/OS technology.
    
    The software is catching up fast.  In some cases Amiga software
    can already do things the MAC can't.
    
    

Re: .7

>    Do I sound optimistic?  You bet I am.  I doubt if the Amiga will
>    ever catch up with the Mac, but it's establishing it's own loyal
>    following.

If you are talking about the size of the user base, I expect the Amiga
to surpass the Mac in installed base sometime in 1989.

In 1987, there were 7 Macs for every Amiga.
In 1988, there are 2 Macs for every Amiga.

The 1988 figures are based on the 600,000 Amiga figure from Commodore,
and the "best guess" of Mac sells from investment firms that watch
Apple (the figure was 1,400,000 Macs).

    Re: previous few...
    
    By catch up, I did mean in installed base.  The Mac is really coming
    on strong.  I hope Randy is correct in projecting the rate of increase
    in Amiga sales, but I'm skeptical.  We can only hope...
    
    Anyway, the issue isn't really the size of the installed base, but
    rather the quality and quantity of the software and hardware available.
    After all, there are 10x as many C'64s as Macs, right?
    
    One big advantage the Amiga has is a well honed multitasking OS. Apple
    and IBM seem to be having lots of trouble getting anything worthwhile
    shipping.  (Multifinder is a rather bad joke.  It's so bad that we
    de-installed it from our department's SE).  The Amiga's OS is so many
    light years ahead that it's almost unfair to even compare them. 
    
    I personally don't wish Apple a lot of success.  I used to think
    that they were a pretty good company that was sincerely trying to
    make the world a slightly nicer place, even though their products
    have always been overpriced.  Now I think the place is run by ruthless
    Yuppies, lawyers, and marketing types.  (No offense meant towards
    any Ruthless Yuppies, Lawyers or Marketing Types in the audience).
    
    In fact, I kinda hope that the current hostility towards Apple regarding
    them suing the rest of the human race (you did know that the lawsuits
    have pissed off a lot of people, didn't you?) will result in more
    people looking at the Amiga.
    
    Ed.
    

    Upon re-reading my reply .12, I think it may come across as being
    excessively hostile towards Apple and their products.  I want to
    apologize in advance to anyone who may be offended by my statement
    regarding the relative merits of the Amiga versus the Mac OS.
    
    So don't come over and beat me up, since I said I'm sorry.
    
    Actually, anyone who has been following these notes for a while
    knows that I've always held the Mac in pretty high regard.  It would
    be non self-serving to not wish that more Amigas had been sold,
    but it's pointless to be bitter over the success of a competitive
    product.  I only wish that the Amiga might see a measure of the
    success that the Mac has justifyably won.
    
    Maybe CBM needs some of those Ruthless Yuppies, Lawyers, and Marketing
    Types.
    
    Ed.

    
    two comments:
    
    1. re: .12's "our department's SE"  ... how many "department" Amigas
       are used at DEC?  The business market is now a good portion of the MAC
       market.  How many of those 600,000+ Amigas are home computers?

       Remember that famous question from Victoria Smith on the Computer
       Show? "600,000? but where are they?"  My personal opinion is
       that the Amiga found a previously untapped high end home computer
       market.  The stuff Trip Hawkins of Electronic Arts was raving
       about long ago.  It just took longer than expected for CBM to
       have the right configurations/price to sell into that market.
    
    2. The MAC market isn't static, just as CBM is improving the Amiga,
       Apple is improving the MAC.  Both are very concerned about the
       PC clones & IBM.  I suspect the Amiga growth will slow as it
       saturates it's current market niche.  The trick is to keep finding new
       niches.  The "desktop presentation" niche is the next big battle.
    
    -dave