| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 3064.1 | | ICS::BEAN | Attila the Hun was a LIBERAL! | Wed May 11 1994 20:52 | 14 |
| re: .0
at the risk of being jumped on:
isn't
> If you CAN help me, please contact me a 223-2619 or
> via E-mail at CONSLT::CHAMBERLAIN
a direct "solicitation"... which seems verbotten in this conference!
tony
(who is only partially kidding!)
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| 3064.2 | ? | ANGLIN::ROGERS | Sometimes you just gotta play hurt | Wed May 11 1994 23:45 | 6 |
| Tony,
Not to jump on you at all, but what's the problem? The base noter just
seemed to be looking for a pointer to some help.
Larry
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| 3064.3 | no harm intended | ICS::BEAN | Attila the Hun was a LIBERAL! | Thu May 12 1994 15:40 | 10 |
| In a moment of relative weakness, amid all the hoopla with edp's saga,
I facetiously pointed out the apparent inconsistency with which this
conference is being moderated: one solicitation (for help) is allowed
while one solicitation (for agreement) is disallowed... for *being* a
solicitation.
In no way was I trying to stifle any response to the basenoter's
request.
tony
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| 3064.4 | Benefits to packaging strategy | CONSLT::CHAMBERLAIN | | Fri May 13 1994 16:14 | 82 |
|
NT Pilot Summary
What Do I Get For My $6K Investment?
- packaging graphic design
- CD-ROM label graphic
- documentation cover graphic
- diskette label
- product warranty card
benefits:
- know your customer by collecting names
- merchandise complimentary NT products
- after market sales potential
- captive audience for product upgrades/sales
- back ad sheet
benefits:
- product specific
- increase product exposure
- z-fold
benefits:
- cross sell complimentary products
- increase product exposure to potential
customer
- include in hardware and software packaging
(ex; Alpha, NT OS)
Old Process New Process
TOTAL COST: $40K TOTAL COST: $6K (<85%)
- long lead time, 14 weeks - short lead time, 6
weeks (<57%)
- point product "look & feel" - consistent line "look &
feel"
- fragmented - streamlined processes
- channel ready
- cross sell products
package design/engineering: $29K package design: $1.5K
lead time: 12-14 wks lead time: 4 wks
CD-ROM graphic: $4K CD-ROM label graphic: $1K
lead time: 6 wks lead time: 4 wks
documentation cover graphic: $5K document. cover graphic: $.5K
lead time: 6 wks lead time: 4 wks
warranty card: $1K warranty card: $0K
lead time: 6 wks lead time: 0
diskette label: $1K diskette label: $0K
lead time: 2 wks lead time: 0 wks
back ad sheet: $2K
lead time: 6 wks
z-fold: $1K
Lead time: 6 wks
Additionally, when NT was first announced, there were 40 software products.
Based on those 40 products, here are some financial's:
DESIGN ENGINEERING FINANCIALS:
For 40 products utilizing strategy:
Old Model - Functional style 40 x $40,000 = $1.6M
New Model - Collaborative strategy 40 x $6,000 = $240,000
NT Pilot Cost Reduction Opportunity $1.3M
SOFTWARE MANUFACTURING FINANCIALS:
PROJECTED COST SAVINGS
- Eliminate WW material and labor costs $700K
- Reduce obsolete inventory write=offs $100K
- Three year SW product cost savings $2.4M
- Improves SW competive cost and margins
|
| 3064.5 | wrong emphasis | CARAFE::GOLDSTEIN | Global Village Idiot | Sat May 14 1994 04:19 | 16 |
| This is being discussed more appropriately in MARKETING.
But the point is that to the Product Manager, this is probably NOT a
win. They didn't ask for it and probably don't want it.
Having consistent packaging for NT software is, IMHO, silly. Better to
have consistent packaging for a multi-OS product, REGARDLESS of waht OS
it's on. So if we sold eXcursion for Windows 3.1, eXcursion for
Windows NT and eXcursion for Mac and eXcursion for anything else, the
box should look like eXcursion's box, not a generic-Mac box, a generic
Win3.1 box, a generic NT box, etc. Users care about the application
first, not the OS! Only OS-specific products (say, NT utilities) need
to go into an NT-consistent package.
I suspect Word Perfect, Microsoft, Novell and other successful software
houses would not do it the way .0 proposes.
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| 3064.6 | reply to .5 | CONSLT::CHAMBERLAIN | | Mon May 16 1994 16:34 | 23 |
| I guess if anyone could confess to being marketing and call me,
I could work WITH them and have them decide what is best.
BTW: Product managers seem to like the concept and are using and/or
planning on using it.
What you are exampling regarding eXcursion (In reply .5) maybe so,
I would like to know for sure if I could find MARKETING support
somewhere. They would/should know best. For now, spending $40k
for a package design, for a software, that may not be
advertised/marketed and/or may not sell, and is also not market
tested (most our software designs I don't believe (I could be
wrong) are not market researched/tested). We design them (or
a Product Manager has a CAD operator or external Designer) design
it, then they print, pack and sell.
Our design is not market tested either, and that is another reason
that I am searching for market support.
Lis
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| 3064.7 | Signing off | CONSLT::CHAMBERLAIN | | Mon May 16 1994 16:37 | 17 |
|
Thank you everyone!
I appreciate all points of view, comment, concerns and support.
I am leaving this note for now. When/if I get results from it,
I'll update status.
For now, I want the note to work for me, to find me a CONTACT.
Please don't be offended if I dont' reply.. I have other projects
to attend to and this one needs to take the back burner until
I can find support.
Thanx
Lisa
|
| 3064.8 | I'm all confused | KLAP::porter | save the ales | Mon May 16 1994 17:12 | 3 |
| I don't understand this note. Did "The Design Group" do
thw work without first finding out whether anyone wanted
it done?
|
| 3064.9 | | FORTY2::SHIPMAN | MOG | Tue May 17 1994 10:56 | 44 |
| Since it looks like this conversation is closing, I will summarise my
reactions.
Most importantly:
If you are a product manager, and you are thinking
of buying into this scheme, please get cross-quotes!
Because I was so shocked by the figures presented, I did this. I
found that it does NOT cost $40,000 to get your own packaging design,
it costs less than $1,000.
It also does not take fourteen weeks to get the results, it takes
three weeks, with twelve hours of work from a production controller
(the person who runs the project), from briefing the designer to
taking delivery of a run of 5000 packages.
I tried to make sure there were no differences between the $40000
deliverable and the one I got a quote for. Even if there are, it
can't matter: the purpose of both is to package a kit.
If you want to cross-quote, and you don't know where to start, call a
local small publishing company and ask to speak to the production
manager. Offer them lunch in return for picking their brains about
how to make packages to hold software kits. They'll tell you the
things you need to know and put you in touch with designers. When you
call a designer, don't say you work for Digital or the price will
double. But even if it does, I don't think you can do worse than
going with this proposal.
I can forward to interested parties the names and numbers of two or
three good designers in the Reading, UK area who do this kind of work.
But I suggest you use local designers; it's important to meet
face-to-face.
I've cross-posted this reply because it seems relevant to the forum
(given that the base note exists). The remainder of my comments are
in MR4SRV::MARKETING note 212.*. Finally, if anyone can see any
problems with my argument, please post or mail a response - I'm not
pursuing this for fun, it's relevant to my current project.
Nick
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| 3064.10 | | ELWOOD::LANE | | Tue May 17 1994 12:05 | 9 |
| re: Did "The Design Group" do thw work without first finding out whether
anyone wanted it done?
It wouldn't surprise me one bit. There are a lot of support groups around who
feel a need to migrate into something more layoff-proof by inventing something
that everyone needs. The best way of convincing people that they need this
new widget is to promote it as a new "standard." Since rumor has it that
standards must be adhered to, no matter what the cost, the group that manages
to pull off this stunt has a new funding source.
|
| 3064.11 | I'm back! ;') | CONSLT::CHAMBERLAIN | | Tue May 17 1994 15:21 | 72 |
| Well, looks like I can't stop replying after all.... ;')
I discussed these comments with my Product Manager, who agrees they are
all valid points.
A few notes to make, though...
The $40k quoted for the NT packaging process is estimated for the Win NT
software products. NOT all products cost that in packaging design.
For the Win NT packaging, the $40K would of covered, if each product
went with a Product specific design:
Package engineering - spec'ing out a box for the product, part
number, engineering drawing, etc.
Graphic Designing - for the box, back ad sheet, CD graphics
and Z-fold ... also Photography, if/when needed
Documentation covers and text
diskette label is generic
This was also based on a 4 color process, for:
Films for the printer(s)
Fuji's/cromolin for the printers (an addition to utilizing these is
also a cost avoidance having
someone at a press run)
part numbers
Design time
Comprehensives for approvals (includes color mock ups)
Our responsibility is to package a product as efficiently
as possible. Meaning: the way to package EACH product as sensible
and cost efficient as possible for the product, channels, PRODUCT
bottom line cost and Digital; ensuring cost avoidances. We also
ensure brand identity, which is currently very important to Digital..
We also offer alternatives, depending on what channels a product will
take. Using software, for example... if it will be shipping with hardware,
could it be shipped in a bag with graphic design on the just the cd and
documentation, and the documentation cover will be placed on top so the
graphics are visable.. therefore avoiding a box? Will it be bought
through retail or VAR's or Catalogues? We are not doing the work just
for the sake of work..
We work with the Product Managers to meet their needs and costs, as well
as keep brand identity amongst our products. We do NOT have a
set price for any job, they are all priced per their needs and product
bottoms line cost.
The purpose for the Win NT packaging strategy, (my base note), was so that Win
NT products would not all be spending a lot of money. They could piggy back
off one design, saving time and money, show consistency but yet have the ability
to have their own "personality" via the back ad sheet. The Win NT
Product Manager was involved with the idea and pilot.
Please do NOT think that $40K is the average/minimum/maximum
price range for a product pkg design. That was the
estimate for the Win NT product. This new
process is now only $6K and Win NT software product managers LIKE it and
are using it. The Product managers who do not apply to using it, we are
working a different theme for them, with a TOUCH of the Win NT design tied in
to show a relationship.
In conclusion, before this pilot ran, there was an open house. We invited ALL
those PM's who would be interested, and it was a VERY POSITIVE feedback,
therefore encouraging us to go forth with this, which we did and everyone
seems to agree to the simplicity and low cost. The only problem which arises,
is the MARKETING issues which was the purpose of this base note.
Have a good day,
Lisa
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