Conference 7.286::digital

    The rumor I heard is that it will be the same as the current one.  Can
    anyone verify?

    The rumor I heard (from a personal person in a plant which will be
    closing during FY94) is that it will be 7 wks + 1 wk for each year
    worked.

Don't forget that BP has said our package won't support you longer than
IBM's so our new package will max out at 26 weeks.

    
    
    	I also heard a crazy rumor that the 26 weeks will include
    	acrude vacation time...
    
    	It it legally posible???

    I was told today by personnel that it was 7 weeks severance plus 1 week
    for each year you've been with digital, plus any vacation which
    includes any vacation you accrue during the 7 weeks severance.
    

    
    Re: .5
    
    Your total severance pay will include unused vacation time, but
    that is not part of the "package" that you have to sign for
    saying that you won't sue Digital.  Vacation pay is compensation
    that you have already earned, but hasn't been paid to you yet.
    Whether you sign or not, you get paid for accrued vacation time
    just as if you had voluntarily resigned.
    
    Steve
    

    
    re: -.1
    
    what's this about "package that you have to sign for saying
    that you won't sue Digital."????
    
    sue about what?

    Re:
    
    	It is a legal C.Y.A. that Digital includes as part of the
        termination documentation.   
    
    	>>>>> Sue about what:
    
    		Among others:
    
    		   1) Discrimination (sex, age, race, ethnic, etc.)
                   2) Unjustified Release
    		   3) Coercion
    		   4) Coaxion
    		   

>    		   4) Coaxion
   OK, I'll bite. What is coaxion? 

    
    re: .9
    
    it's where they threaten to stretch you into a cable if you don't
    take the package          8^)
    

    
    What a great reply.... 
    
    Pretty soon we'll have to pay to leave this club..
    

    >>    		   4) Coaxion
>   OK, I'll bite. What is coaxion? 

    My Digital issued dictionary doesn't have coaxion but it does have
    coax.

    It's defined as "1. To persuade by pleading or flattery. 2. To obtain by
    persistent persuasion. [Obs. cokes, to fool]"

    			Alfred

    re .8
    
    It also is unenforceable.
    
    Unless, of course, you are a lawyer or have your lawyer sign it.
    
    But it usually effective as a threat.
    
    Of couse, JUST my opinion.........

    I have been hearing that court cases have been won, despite this form
    having been signed...

    Reason for the rulings have been due to "signing under duress",
    "bribery", "signing under coercion"..., etc.....
    
    I haven't had to personally experience this, so this is just from
    information from friends/family....
    
    Would be interesting to see court docettes to see the real story!
    
    Later!
    
    Bob G.
    

    seems like a good place to say that I have accepted the current package
    - met with my mgr this morning.
    
    aq
    

    I'll find out in about a half hour whether I'm "under stress"
    when I sign the TFSO form....
    
    
    Rick

    
    Just curious....
    
    IN what you have to sign for TFSO, do you have to sign
    away your life as far as WHO you can go to work for after
    Digital, and the timeframe (like a competitor, or a strategic
    partner, etc?)
    
    Scott

    Re; .17
    
    		From the ones I've seen from fellow ex-colleagues, no.
    The ONLY restriction is if you are going to get re-hire (not probably,
    right !!!!!!).   Restriction reads something like: You can not/will not
    be re-hired for the amount of weeks that totalized your TFSO package.
    Example:
    
    		If you get 26 weeks of TFSO package.
                You can be re-hired in week 27, not before that.
    
    

    Having just gone through this - last Monday - the TSFO acceptance form
    is not presented until AFTER one is "outta here" - it arrives at your
    home by carrier & you can go over it w/ lawyer, etc. & it MUST be back
    in DEC's hands by August 13 - if you are going to accept it's terms.
    
    Speaking of suits, I have heard that some folks are bringing them to
    try to get original terms (3 weeks per ea. year was'nt it?) and making
    the point that it isn't legal to change the terms all the time.  

    RE:.19
    
    >Speaking of suits, I have heard that some folks are bringing them to
    >try to get original terms (3 weeks per ea. year was'nt it?) and making
    >the point that it isn't legal to change the terms all the time.  
    
    	Please keep us posted if you hear anymore on this.
    
    Joe

        Has anyone tried to "organize" the ex-Digital products of
        TFSO?  At a minimum, it would make a darn interesting social
        club!

        Bob

    RE: .21 I don't know about the TFSO people but there is a SERP
    support group in NIO for retired Digits.
    
    			Alfred

   Re. 21 -  A couple of former employees are producing a newsletter 
   called "The Digital Alumni".  The newsletter includes information
   on former DECies, classified ads to help people network, social get
   togethers, etc.  They also produce an alumni directory twice a year.
   Subscription cost is $15 per year.  

   For more information contact:
 
     		Jan Bunker
		P.O. Box 789
		Amherst, NH  03031
		(603)673-6248

    Many ExDeccies (both TFSO'd and Retired) are returning to Parker Street
    (PKO3) as "contracted" instructors... some of them returned the very next 
    week!  I say, more power to them.
    
    But, an intersting thing:  None of these folks are allowed to form
    their own company and bid to come in as "private" consultants, for a 
    specified
    period of time... as much as a year, I'm told.  The ONLY way they can
    return is to sign on with one of several "recoginzed" consultant
    companies for which DEC has contracted these services FOR AS MUCH AS
    1/3 to 1/2 THE STANDARD CONTRACTOR'S RATES!.
    
    

    re: .-1

    Are you speculating on a matter of legal liability of Digital and its
    contractors?  I have no comment in that regard.

    Or are you referring to "what's fair" from the perspective of the
    former employee?

    The former employee is free to work anywhere, and Digital is free not
    to offer a contract to them.  It's "fair" that Digital can find cheap
    contractors.

>    But, an intersting thing:  None of these folks are allowed to form
>    their own company and bid to come in as "private" consultants, for a 
>    specified
>    period of time... as much as a year, I'm told.  The ONLY way they can
>    return is to sign on with one of several "recoginzed" consultant
>    companies for which DEC has contracted these services......

This is not uncommon and pre-dates the layoffs by some time.
There are two major reasons:
  1) Digital prefers to deal with recognized vendors.  Getting onto 
     the approved vendors list is time consuming for both parties.
  2) IRS rulings over the past several decade have made it more important
     to be able to define employee vs. independent contractor status.
     By bringing in contractors only from an agency, there is less
     ambiguity about the relationship between Digital and the contractor.
     His relationship with the agency may still be in question, but that's
     not Digital's responsibility.  (Analogy: Is the painter of your new house
     a subcontractor of the builder or his employee?  You probably don't care.
     If there's a problem, you will hold the contractor/builder responsible
     first.  It's his problem to resolve it with the painter.)

- tom]

Looks like 4 weeks + 1 week/year (0-15) +2 weeks/year(15-n)


A little smaller but not the doomsday stuff we've heard about.

    
    Source?
    
    cbc

    U.S. News                                                  LIVE WIRE
    
    Resumption of U.S. Transition Program (19-Jul)       Date:19-Jul-1993
    
    
    0-15 years of service             Four weeks of continuous pay,
                                            plus a lump sum payment of one
                                            week of pay for every year of
                                            service up to 15 years,
                                            minimum of four weeks' lump sum
                                            (i.e., 4-week lump sum payment
                                            for employees with 0-4 years
                                            of service).
    
    16 or more years of service       Four weeks of continuous pay,
                                            plus a lump sum of 15 weeks of
                                            pay, plus two weeks of pay for
                                            every year of service between
                                            16 and 32 years of service, up
                                            to a maximum of 52 weeks.
          
    
    cbc

    re: 4 weeks continuous pay ...
    
    Maybe this is a stupid question, but doesn't the 4 week package part
    fall under the minimum "plant closing" 60-day notice requirement? Has
    Digital found some way around providing laid off workers with 60 days
    notice (or pay in lieu of notice)?
    
    Geoff

RE:         <<< Note 2546.31 by AUSTIN::UNLAND "Digitus Impudicus" >>>
                  -< What happened to the 60-day notice law? >-
    
>>    Maybe this is a stupid question, but doesn't the 4 week package part
>>    fall under the minimum "plant closing" 60-day notice requirement? Has
>>    Digital found some way around providing laid off workers with 60 days
>>    notice (or pay in lieu of notice)?
  
      If the whole plant isn't closing, they don't have to give 60 days
      notice, do they?

                                      Greg

>               -< 4 wks + 4 wks (the minimum) is about 60 days. >-

But the second 4 weeks is optional (you are signing away your 'rights' to sue
Digital for whatever).  I do not see how that qualifies as 'notice'; it
certainly is NOT payment.  

>   <<< Note 2546.35 by SWAM2::MCCARTHY_LA "Texas Supply Chainsaw Massacre" >>>
>             -< If you don't sign, the whole package is optional >-

The first 4 weeks are supposedly NOT optional.  The 'years of service' is
the optional part.  Your (legal) mileage may vary.

Point of fact....

This is more than they are required to give by any law.

John I

    Any rumors as to what the TFSO package may look like for Q3/Q4 or if
    there is likely to even be one?
    
    Heard 2 wks notice, no package.

    There was a LiveWire notice about the latest package some weeks ago.

    	I believe the Q2 package is 4 weeks + 1 week for each year of
    service (regardless of how many years). I don't remember if there was a
    max number of weeks they would pay out. I don't believe any Q3 package
    has been announced yet. You'll have to wait until Jan. 3rd for that!

I've seen a memo that says effective immediately that if an employee finds an
internal job while the clock is ticking, it will require the signature of a
member of the SLT or his designee of the hiring organization.

Bob

    
    I doubt that this will put and end to the "Good Old Boy" network.  
    
    I can tell you right now that if there is a good match for a job
    posted in VTX and the person applying for it "falls off" for the want
    of a signature, A wrongful termination suit would be justified.
    
    If the purpose of the memo is to eliminate the creation of last minute
    job reqs, I'm all for it.  Even then, those whose careers depend upon
    their political connections will have their new positions secured before
    the TFSO clock starts ticking.
    
    -Ed 

    RE: -1 "GOB": I think you're right about that.

RE:  Note 2546.40 by STAR::DIPIRRO
     Only Q2

>     	I believe the Q2 package is 4 weeks + 1 week for each year of
>     service (regardless of how many years). I don't remember if there was a
>     max number of weeks they would pay out. I don't believe any Q3 package
>     has been announced yet. You'll have to wait until Jan. 3rd for that!

Has the Q3 package been announced yet?

- Jim

    	I haven't heard anything yet. You'll have to wait until the day
    after the Q2 earnings are announced. That's when the good news came out
    last quarter.