Conference azur::mcc

353.0. "INFO: "User" feedback on Sept FT Iconic PM" by COOKIE::KITTELL (Richard - Architected Info Mgmt) Wed Sep 26 1990 17:10

        My proto/demo is working to the point where I've run it in a
        few "field test cubicles." The audience was engineers
        generally familiar with EMA concepts and DECmcc, but without a
        DECmcc Use manual open on their laps. All were experienced
        with workstations and windowing applications. So not exactly
        "users", but at least non-MM-developers.

        Overall, the initial impression was "neat". Specific comments
        about DECmcc, mostly the iconic_pm, in no particular order,
        follow. I got lots of good "feedback" on my management model
        as well, which is, after all, what I cobbled up the proto for.
        This is based on the Sept FT kit.

=== 1
        After selecting Open Domain and being presented with the Open
        Domain box asking for a domain name, the question was asked,
        "How do I figure out the list of known domains?"

        I know I could get out and do it from FCL, but can it be done
        from Iconic?

=== 2

        Given an attribute defined with Units, the units don't show up
        on the field in the Create box, but do show up in the Set and
        Show boxes.

=== 3

        For attributes that are enumerations, will a future version
        provide context-sensitive help to list of legal values?

=== 4

        In the Create and Show boxes, the attributes are listed in the
        same order, with required fields first. The Set box lists the
        fields in a different order. The comment was made that one got
        used to a given attribute showing up in a certain place, and
        it was confusing to have it in another place for Set.

=== 5

        The "Send" label over the toggle buttons in the Set window
        resulted in a "huh?" from everyone. When I explained what the
        pushbuttons indicated the response was, "Then why doesn't it
        say Set or Change? The fact that the operation results in
        sending a message somewhere is an accident of implementation."

=== 6

        The feeling was that the Send pushbuttons should default to
        off or at least have a pushbutton to turn them all off.

=== 7

        The operation icons in the toolbox were another "huh?"
        generator. This won't be as much of a problem once help is
        available, but labeling the operation icons as the entity
        icons are labeled would be a big help.

=== 8

        When creating an entity, and the message "Move the pointer to
        a Map window and Click MB1", elicited the response "But I don't
        have any map windows. I have a window that has the name of my
        domain in the title bar, and a toolbox, and a bunch that say
        DECmcc Management in the title bar, but nothing that says
        Map."

        I asked what it should say, some liked "Click in the Domain
        Window at the position you want the icon to appear", some
        preferred "Icon Window".

=== 9

        "We'll be able to use icons on child entities, won't we?"

        I said yes, that is why you are asked to click in the icon window
        for children, even though the position of the click is
        irrelevant for the baselevel we're running.

=== 10 

       "I've got an image in {one-of-a-zillion} image format, can I
       put it in the icon window and lay icons on it?"

       I said that support for other image formats is planned for
       future versions.

    
    While we're on the subject, I have a nit, also.
    
    Why is it that in alsmost all applications, a single-click is for
    selection, and double-click is for action, yet in the toolbox, a
    single-click is action (i.e. create and object of this class)?
    
    Marc
    

    
    
    Another comment, I'd like to reinforce the desire to have the SET and
    SHOW directives present the attributes in the same order.  I have
    already used the two simultaneously, and it is helpful to not have to
    hunt around for comparing values.
    
    
    Marc
    

Good input, Rich!  Thanks.

Fred

Thanks for all the feedback.  In answer to some of the points in 353.0

#2 - I was not aware of this. What do you mean by the create box?

#3 - In V1.1 EFT, if you press MB2 over an enumerated field and select Expand
     Field, a box with a list of the values is displayed.  Select an item from
     the list, press OK, and it is transferred to your form.

#4 - The reason that the order of fields in Set and Show operations is different
     is that currently we create a SET form by getting all the information from
     the dictionary, so it always appears in the same order.  In the case of a
     SHOW form, we create the form by decoding p_out, since different fields 
     can be returned each time the same directive is issued.  I do hear the
     comment that the same order would be helpful, though.

     The required fields (for action directives) are NOT forced to the top
     of the form; it may simply happen that they appear that way, but again
     the form is ordered as arguments are fetched from the dictionary.

#5 - Worth thinking about.  

#6 - All pushbuttons may be toggled to either on or off state by selecting
     Edit Menu Toggle All to Do Not Send or Toggle All to Send. 


Keep those comments coming.
Verna 
	

1.

In a SHOW or a SET window, you provide an "Change Entity..." option under the 
operations menu. Could you also provide a "Change partition  [->" option where
[-> will show all the partitions for a SHOW of the entity and set and reference
partitions for the SET ?

This way, we don't have to go back to the domain window (and possibly close
this window) to issue another show/set of a different partition.

2.
What about show ....all attributes. Is it a coming attraction? 

3. 
You have Close window defined as Alt/C. Both DECwindows mail and DECwindows 
notes have it defined as Alt/Q. From our customers point of view, we should be 
as consistent as possible  across our products.

That is it for now,
phil

Re #2 of 353.0

=== 2

	Given an attribute defined with Units, the units don't show up
	on the field in the Create box, but do show up in the Set and 
	Show boxes.


If an attribute/argument has Units defined in its MS, then the presentation
name for units should be displayed in any form.

I suspect that the arguments for the Create box probably do not have Units
defined.  The same routines are called to set up the form irrespective of the
Directive.  

If you find a situation where the MS specifies a Units field and it is not
displayed, please let us know.

Thanks,
Verna

RE: .4, .6

re: Units in the fields on Create.

Verna,

Yep, I only have units defined for the attribute MSL, didn't put it on
the arguments.

Thanks.