Conference bulova::decw_jan-89_to_nov-90

I'm currently running this on V5.1 SDC and X5.2-405 systems...


Directory MPGS::SYS$KITS:<DECW.UTIL>

BANNER000.A;4          1386/1386    22-NOV-1988 16:45  (RWE,RWE,RE,RE)

Total of 1 file, 1386/1386 blocks.

/Harley

    I finally got v5.1 running, and have almost everything running again,
    except Banner. I installed the kit, but it won't run. I get the
    following error:

    $ SPAWN/NOWAIT/Process=DECW$BANNER RUN SYS$SYSTEM:DECW$BANNER.EXE
    Process DECW$BANNER spawned
    Failed to open Application Xdefault database SYS$SHARE:BANNER.DAT

    The file didn't exist, so I copied my previous version from SYS$LOGIN:
    to there. No good. Ideas?
    
              

Make sure there aren't any old DECW$BANNER.DAT or DECW$BANNER.UID files
in SYS$SPECIFIC:[SYSLIB], and delete any DECW$BANNER.DAT files you might
have in SYS$LOGIN.  The message apparantly hasn't been updated to reflect
the new names of the files.  (It wasn't when I last looked at the code...)

I was unable to get banner to run properly as a detached job.  I could spawn it
or submit it, but when I did s RUN/DET SYS$SYSTEM:LOGINOUT.EXE/INP=com file name
It would run, but would not read or write the customization stuff.

The .com file I used set the display to my workstation screen, since I was trying
to run it on our 8550.


							-Jeff

Re .2

	The message is definatly wrong, the file it looking for is 
SYS$SHARE:DECW$BANNER.DAT.

Re .4 

	The most likely problem, is that SYS$LOGIN: is not defined. I have
frequently seen when running detached jobs, that SYS$LOGIN: does not get
defined. Since DECW$USER_DEFAULTS is mapped to SYS$LOGIN:, Banner cannot
find your personal settings. As well as defining DECW$DISPLAY, you should
define SYS$LOGIN or DECW$USER_DEFAULTS to where your banner defaults file
resides. I think you will find that Banner will then work correctly.

A reminder to everybody that uses the message window.

	The Message window can only be used, if you run Banner as a subprocess
of the session manager, or a DECterm process. If you run banner from VUE, or as 
a Detached process, you will not be able to use the message window!

Jim

< Note 80.5 by FIZBUZ::SAUNDERS "A WINDOW in any Language" >
                         -< SYS$LOGIN is the culprit >-
>	The message is definatly wrong, the file it looking for is 
>SYS$SHARE:DECW$BANNER.DAT.

Well, i tried that. The error message said that it's looking for banner.dat, so
i put both DECW$BANNER.DAT and BANNER.DAT in both places (see below) just in
case, but it didn't help. Why can't it run without the file, and just create it
if there's nothing there?

$ run sys$system:decw$banner
Failed to open Application Xdefault database SYS$SHARE:BANNER.DAT
$ rec dir
$ dir/own/prot sys$share:*banner.dat

$ dir/own/prot sys$share:*banner.dat

Directory SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSLIB]

BANNER.DAT;1              [SYSTEM]              (RE,RWED,RE,RWED)
DECW$BANNER.DAT;35        [SYSTEM]              (RE,RWED,RE,RWED)
DECW$BANNER.DAT;34        [SYSTEM]              (RE,RWED,RE,RE)

Total of 3 files.

Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]

BANNER.DAT;1              [SYSTEM]              (RE,RWED,RE,RWED)
DECW$BANNER.DAT;1         [SYSTEM]              (RWED,RWED,RE,RWED)

I suspect the versions in SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSLIB] are very old, since the Banner
installation places thngs in SYS$COMMON. If there contents are out of date,
then banner will infact give this error as well! I suggest you delete the 
versions in SYS$SPECIFIC and try again.

Jim

    I cleaned up as you suggested, and it works like a charm! Nice
    improvements over the last version.

    					-- hs 

    I am having a problem running Banner. When I execute decw$login I get
    the following:
    
    %DCL-S-SPAWNED, process DECW$BANNER spawned 
    
    Then a bunch of windows pop up on the screen, then I get an access
    violation as follows:
    %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation, reason mask=00, virtual
    address=00000000, PC=0001D32F, PSL=03C00004
    
       Improperly handled condition, image exit forced
    
    	Signal arguments	Stack contents
    
    	Number = 00000005	  20503214
    	Name   = 0000000C	  20202020
    		 00000000	  20202020
    		 00000000	  20202020
    		 0001D32F	  00202020
    		 03C00004	  7FF30454
    				  00000000
    				  27FC0000
    				  0014801C
    				  77F30478
    
    	Register dump
    
    	R0 = 00000000	R1 = 00002857	R2 = 80004F64	R3 = 7FF30434
    	R4 = 0000000C	R5 = 00000053	R6 = 0000FFC8	R7 = 0000F59C
    	R8 = 00002724	R9 = 000101C8	R10= 00000077	R11= 0000FEFC
    	AP = 7FF303E4	FP = 7FF303A4	SP = 7FF30420	PC = 0001D32F
    	PSL= 03C00004
    
    I've tried running it interactively and get the same dump. I've also
    copied decw$banner*.* to my sys$login area with the same results. I
    have all privs. so I don't think that's the problem.
    
    Any help would be appreciated.
    
    /Cowboy\

Check the SYS$SPECIFIC directories of SYS$SHARE: to see if there are Banner files
in it. You should look for DECW$BANNER.DAT and DECW$BANNER.UID. I suspect you
have a bad version of DECW$BANNER.UID in the the specific directory of 
SYS$SHARE:. This will certainly cause an ACCVIO when Banner tries to generate
is Widget list from the .UID file!

Jim

I have the banner up fine under V5.1 except the message window doesn't
work when a message is received.  It is being spawned from DECW$LOGIN.
I even do a set broadcast=all all over the place before I spawn it.

Any hints on where to look?

Thanks

CHad

    I had the same problem.  DECwindows V5.1 but message window don't work. 
    Check the log file.  I'll bet that Banner tried to allocate the session
    manager's mailbox, but failed.  Try spawning banner as the last thing
    in your DECW$LOGIN.COM.  That worked for me.  I'd guess that Banner
    gives up after a while, if it can't allocate the mailbox.
    
    Wook

how about getting banner to trap OPCOM messages as well? 

John

Re .11

	There is indead a problem when running from DECW$LOGIN.COM. It would
seem that the Session manager doesn't create the Session Terminal Device 
until after DECW$LOGIN.COM completes. Banner has a 10 Second delay while
it looks for the Device. If at the end of 10 seconds it still cant find 
it, then it gives up. It wuld seem to be quite easy for this 10 seconds to 
pass, if you are indead starting many applications in DECW$LOGIN, and Banner
is one of the first. There are two solutions, until I increase the delay
period. That  is to either, start Banner last, or spawn a command file,
which starts all the other aplications. Either one of these solutions 
seems to get the Terminal Device created before the 10 second delay 
expires.

Re .-1

	Banner will trap OPCOM messages. You have to enable OPCOM messages
on the Terminal DEVICE created by the Session manager, prior to activating
Banner. Theer are command files somewhere in the DECwindows Notes file
on how to do that. Once you have enabled OPCOM messages, run Banner, and 
it will trap all the messages broadcaste, including the OPCOM messages.

Jim

The newest CHILD will start an early terminal emulator process if one is
not already running, so you can use CHILD commands from DECW$LOGIN.COM.

For now, if you issue a CHILD command before starting BANNER, you might
make out better.

For future, if BANNER were to steal the source file DECW_TERM_PORT.C
from CHILD, and use that instead of DECW$TERM_PORT, it would be able to
run from DECW$LOGIN.COM without the arbitrary delay.  The parameter list
is the same as the VMS binding.

[Be forwarned that DECW_TERM_PORT.C uses an UNDOCUMENTED INTERFACE to
DECTerm, however, I expect that future versions of DECW$TERM_PORT will
also have this capability.]

    I'm having the same ACCVIO as .9 under T5.2-40B.  This is a brand
    new DECwindows system with no previous DECW$BANNER.DAT files
    hanging around.  I installed from the 22-Nov-1988 kit.
    What could I be doing wrong?
    
    
    				-John
    
    Here is the stack dump...
    
    (hiyall)$ mcr decw$banner
    %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation, reason mask=00, virtual
    address=00000000, PC=0001D32F, PSL=03C00004
    
      Improperly handled condition, image exit forced.
    
            Signal arguments              Stack contents
    
            Number = 00000005                20101214
            Name   = 0000000C                20202020
                     00000000                20202020
                     00000000                20202020
                     0001D32F                00202020
                     03C00004                7FF38854
                                             00000000
                                             27FC0000
                                             0014801C
                                             7FF38878
    
            Register dump
    
            R0 = 00000001  R1 = 00002845  R2 = 80004F64  R3 = 7FF38834
            R4 = 0000000C  R5 = 00000053  R6 = 0000FFC8  R7 = 0000F59C
            R8 = 00002724  R9 = 000101C8  R10= 00000077  R11= 0000FEFC
            AP = 7FF387E4  FP = 7FF387A4  SP = 7FF38820  PC = 0001D32F
            PSL= 03C00004

    I found the "problem".  Under T5.2-40B, only 2 CWPS symbols are
    undefined (instead of the 10 under V5.1).  When DECW$BANNER was trying
    to show the numbers in the CWPS display, it ACCVIOed.  I turned the
    CWPS display off in the DECW$SYSTEM_DEFAULTS:DECW$BANNER.DAT file
    and everything is working now.
    
    				-John

Well thats what I get for trying to be to clever! If you can send me the two 
symbols that are still undefined, I'll comment them out of the display,
and send you a new kit, that will stop this unfortunate behavour!

Thanks

	Jim

    I have the following problem, has anyone else experienced any thing
    similar.
    
    I have just installed vms 5.1 on a system where the user does not
    have privileges other then tmpmbx and netmbx.  I installed Banner
    and it works fine from system account.  However for the user it
    just creates the banner, paints the screen with the banner, then
    just as the calendar comes up, the banner goes away.  This does
    not happen from the system account.
    
    I set the users process quotas to match the systems.  On bootup,
    I did notice that their was an error activating
    DECW$TRANSPORT_COMMON.exe...it said protected images have to be
    installed.  However, when I went into the install utility to install
    it, it was already installed.
    
    Does anyone have an idea why banner will work from system account
    but not a users account.
    
    Any help will be appreciated.
    
    Pam

    
    Was common installed with "/protect"?
    
    Do you have software laying around in multiple directories such as in
    sys$specific:[syslib] as well as ...$common:[syslib]?  If so, clean up.
    
    					monty

    I checked for multiple sys$lib files ... none.  I don't remember
    anything unusual about the install...why would it install in a manner
    that would cause problems for users without privs.
    
    I tried installing the file mentioned in .19 with priv in
    systartup_v5.com , I put it right before I asked decwindows to be
    installed...decwindows could not come up.   Where should I place
    this install with priv's command.
    
    Any further advice is sure welcome!!!

Banner will need to be installed with the following priv's as reported
by kitinstal when you installed it. Banner does NOT have to be installed
/PROTECT! This should be done in your startup file, before or after
DECWindows should not cause any difference.

Jim

	The installation of DECwindows Banner has completed. DECwindows
Banner requires the following privileges to operate correctly.
	
	CMKRNL, WORLD, SYSPRV, SYSNAM, PRMMBX, ALTPRI

	If you wish the run DECwindows banner from non-privileged accounts,
the image SYS$SYSTEM:DECW$BANNER.EXE must be installed with the above 
priveleges. Refer to the online help, accesable via the MB2 popup menu, for
further information on DECwindows Banner.

	The most efective way of runing DEcwindows Banner is to add the 
following lines to your SYS$LOGIN:DECW$LOGIN.COM

	$SET PROC/PRIV=(CMKRNL,WORLD,SYSPRV,SYSNAM,PRMMBX,ALTPRI)
	$SPAWN/NOWAIT/PROC=DECW$BANNER RUN SYS$SYSTEM:DECW$BANNER.EXE

	Note: If you have installed the DECW$BANNER.EXE with the necessary
privileges it is not necessary to turn on privileges in the DECW$LOGIN.COM
file.

    I too have experienced the stack dump problem under T5.2. Am I to
    understand that I will need a new kit as well, or is there some
    where in the .DAT file I can delete or comment out the symbols myself
    ?
    

You have to disable the CWPS display, you can do this, by editing
SYS$LOGIN:DECW$BANNER.DAT and the version in SYS$SHARE setting the 
value DECW$BANNER.cwps_window: to 0! That will disable the CWPS 
display, and stop the dump.

Jim

    Thank you for the assistance. I am a bit puzzled by the DECW$BANNER.DAT
    file placement. in note 80.17, there file was located in
    DECW$SYSTEM_DEFAULT. I never had a copy of the .DAT file in my
    SYS$LOGIN.  Is it that you get that file once BANNER is fired up,
    in which case the dump was occuring prior to successful startup.
    Or perhaps the installation went bad.
    
    In any event, I was able to get a copy of someone else file and
    placed it in my SYS$LOGIN and up she came.
    
    Thank you again.
    

    The DECW$BANNER.DAT file gets created in your SYS$LOGIN: directory,
    when you first customize Banner. It is identical in format to 
    that present in DECW$SYSTEM_DEFAULTS, except for the values of the
    resources described within, which reflect your customization.
    
    Jim Saunders

    If BANNER (image id V1.0) is running on my VMS V5.1 VS2000, I get
    the error
    
    %SYSTEM-F-DEVACTIVE, device is active
    
    if I either $ SET HOST /DTE TTA2: or $ SET HOST 0.  If I then exit
    BANNER, no problems.  Known problem?  I've goofed?
    
    cheers,  Ken.

    I get no such problem on my PVAX with SET HOST 0.  I've got no interest
    in doing SET HOST /DTE, nor do I have a modem on my system so I
    can't test that one.
    
    	- Dave

    This sounds very unusual. I cant say I have ever seen this, or had
    anybody report such a problem before. It will have to wait a couple
    of weeks till I'm back on my home soil, before I can look into it,
    but in the mean time if you can gather any other information please
    send me mail on FIZBUZ::SAUNDERS. I'll look into the problem when
    I get back to Valbonne.
    
    Jim

    As luck would have it, my bootnode is out on a demo, so I can't
    give you any further information.  As part of the monitor I/O display,
    BANNER watches Ethernet ports ESA%d:6 or something (I'm on a CCT
    again) which could cause the $ SET H 0 problems.
    
    I use the $ SET H /DTE TTA2 to connect through to a terminal server,
    not to a modem.  This is because VWSLAT doesn't allow you to give
    terminal server commands if you need to troubleshoot a problem.
    
    Cheers,  Ken.

    Use the PE monitor instead, its better at that. This could be the
    problem, I cant off hand remember of the devices are allocated,
    or assigned to get these statistics, I'll have a play when I 
    get back, but if that is the case, the answers going to be 'dont
    do that', I suspect.
    
    Jim

    I'm trying to run BANNER on my VS2000 running VMS 5.1.  I'm starting
    it up using SPAWN.  The privileges have been preinstalled.
    
    What I get is most of the windows up, but when the main window is
    put up, it disappears and the following error message appears in
    my DECterm window:
    
    	X toolkit Warning: Window Manager is confused
    
    I tried getting into help with MB2, but what I get is a brief flash
    of the screen, followed by nothing.
    
    Can anyone help ?  Also, does any documentation exist for BANNER?
    
    Thanks,
    
    L.
    
    P.S. If the Window Manager is confused, you can imagine how I feel...

Ths is an odd problem. I've seen the Window Manager message many time, but never
known it to do any harm. Does it cause banner to exit, or does banner keep
on working afterwards? You can access the help via DCL if you are having a
problem (It is the only documentation on banner), by giving a command such as
HELP/LIBRARY=SYS$SHARE:DECW$BANNER.HLB. I have no idea what actually causes the
window manager message, I dont believe it is associated with banner in any way.

What actually happens to Banner when the mesager occurs?

Jim

    The window manager message you are seeing is
    associated with the application.  In this case
    I assume its BANNER,  although I'm not familiar
    with BANNER.  I am familiar with the Window Manager.
    
    Another way of wording the "window manager is confused"
    message is "window using default settings".  (please..
    let's not get into a whole dissertation on what a
    stupid message this is, we KNOW its a stupid message)
    
    Window Manager is not printing this message,  the
    toolkit intrinsics are (and the application links
    with the toolkit intrinsics).
    
    The values that the application sets for the shell
    get overwritten,  so the window manager has to use
    default window settings. (i.e., sizes)
    
    -N

Your reply suggests that its the applications fault, something that upto
know I had never considered. As far as I can tell this does not happen on 
a regular basis. I have seen it maybe once a month, with no real reason 
associated, except for the fact a lot was going on, as far as applications
running, when this message pop's out. As far as I can see it has no adverse 
affects on the running of the application, and all the shell window attributes
etc, requested by Banner seem to have been honoured? Is it possible that Banner
is the cause of the message, or just the unlucky application, and any other
application activated at that point in time, would have caused the response?

Jim

    Sorry,  it is not directly the applications "fault".
    It is in the toolkit intrinsics (which the applications
    use).
    
    The application will continue to run smoothly.  The window
    manager uses default values and the user will never detect
    anything wrong.
    
    In the X calls there are XSetWMHints and XSetNormalHints.
    WMHints and NormalHints are both properties.  The properties
    contains many "values" with a flag word indicating which
    "value" in the property is being set.  (At least this is
    what everyone assumes).  However, the "XSet" calls
    do a XChangeProperty on the PROPERTY (i.e,  the whole
    WMHints structure, or the whole NormalHints structures).
    Whatever values are in the Hints overwrite the previous
    values,  regardless of what the flag word indicates.
    
    The window manager receives property changes and the value
    from the server and relies on this being accurate -- because
    the window manager can start and stop and still be able
    to place frames around windows,  create icons etc.....
    
    In order to XSet calls to only change a value it would
    have to retrieve the values from the server (another
    round trip to the server) which for performance reasons
    isn't a great idea.
    
    So,  the hints structure should remain valid at all times.
    If you use XSet... calls,  please follow this advice.
    
    - N

I'm having problems getting the DECwindows BANNER message box to display any
messages.  Could someone please explain what function it serves over and above
the session manager message display?  Does it give you a popup when you get a
message?  In other words, is it worth the struggle?  (BTW, I just scanned this
topic while writing this note and found some leads on how to make it work--
DECwindows NOTES, like most DECwindows apps, is too cool for words).

It also seems to require some privilege over and above the six the kit tells
you to install it with (CMKRNL SYSNAM PRMMBX ALTPRI WORLD SYSPRV).

Thanks for any help you can give.

                                                             -- Mike Scott

Let me know if you still have a problem, should not need any moe priv's than
listed in the installation procedure. It will popup whe any type of broadcaste
is trapped by the device it has allocated (session terminal, of DECterm terminal).

Jim

    I've got it working now.  However, it does seem to require some
    privilege other than the six documented ones.  I set BANNER up to be
    spawned by DECW$LOGIN and give my process all privileges before running
    it.  The problem seems to be with creating some mailbox--does it use a
    permanent mailbox or something?
    
    Thanks.
    
    								-- Mikey

    re .-1  "does it use a permanent mailbox or something?"
    
    But PRMMBX is in the standard priv list for BANNER -- you
    yourself mentioned it a few replies back.  Sure you're installing
    it correctly?
    

RE: .40

You're right!  I just checked and it is intalled with the six privileges I
mentioned, including PRMMBX.  I dunno why it isn't working, then.  I just know
it fails with a complaint about creating a mailbox.  I will try starting it
in an unprivileged process sometime soon and insert the log here.

                                                              -- Mikey

I discovered that I had two copies of DECW$BANNER on my system:  one in
SYS$SYSDEVICE:[SYS0.SYSEXE] and one in SYS$SYSDEVICE:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.SYSEXE].
The former was the installed one, and was *not* world readable.  I reduced to
one copy and now it works fine, even from unprivileged accounts.

                                                        -- Mikey

Where is the Banner Kit located?

Thanks,
Helena

    Helena
    
    	   don't think me rude, but have you read the contents of this
    topic? Your question was asked as .0 and answered in .1!
    
    Andy

    I have attempted to run Banner V0.00 on VMS V5.2-42W and get the
    attached error message. Has anyone managed to get Banner working
    on V5.2-42W?
    
    Joe
    
    
    
    %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation, reason mask=00, virtual
    address=00000000, PC
    =0001D32F, PSL=03C00004
    
      Improperly handled condition, image exit forced.
    
            Signal arguments              Stack contents
    
            Number = 00000005                20801214
            Name   = 0000000C                20202020
                     00000000                20202020
                     00000000                20202020
                     0001D32F                00202020
                     03C00004                7FF39C54
                                             00000000
                                             27FC0000
                                             00149644
                                             7FF39C78
    
            Register dump
    
            R0 = 00000000  R1 = 00002857  R2 = 80004F64  R3 = 7FF39C34
            R4 = 0000000E  R5 = 0000006D  R6 = 0000FFC8  R7 = 0000F59C
            R8 = 00002724  R9 = 000101C8  R10= 0000009C  R11= 0000FEFC
            AP = 7FF39BE4  FP = 7FF39BA4  SP = 7FF39C20  PC = 0001D32F
            PSL= 03C00004
    
     

  Well, my system is still V5.2-42N, and the banner runs fine. 
  After scanning the -42W mup saveset, I don't see anything in it that 
  should affect the banner at all...

  Make sure you don't have random DECW$BANNER.* files in SYS$SPECIFIC:
  directories - that will definitely cause the banner some grief.

  I upgrade to -42W yesterday and the banner is still working....

If you have the symbol DECW$BANNER.cwps_window set to 1, in the DECW$BANNER.DAT 
file, you will get an ACCVIO on any 5.2 system. This is due to the two undefined 
symbols which you will see at link time, which banner did not expect to be 
undefined. I'll put a new kit together for 5.2 systems, when I have had a
chance to test a few things out on V5.2. In the meantime edit the DECW$BANNER.DAT
files in SYS$SHARE, and your SYS$LOGIN, and set the above symbol to 0, if you
are getting ACCVIO's.

Jim

The Banner Processes Window appears not to take into account interrupt
stack time when computing the CPU percent for each process.  I had my
workstation running a consistent 30-40% on the interrupt stack and several
processes taking the remaining CPU.  When adding the CPU percent for the 3 
or 4 processes in the process window I got very close to 100%.  I only
expected to see 60-70% of the CPU being consumed by the processes.

				_Greg

Ah, I never thought of that, when calculating the process times, I get the 
null time for that CPU, and then calculate the process percentages for the
time that CPU was doing something. I suppose I should remove both the NULL time,
the Interupt time before calculating the cpu percentage for the processes? 
What about exec, is that process specific, or system overhead as well? 

Jim

    Hi Jim,
    
    	Exec time is process specific so only null and interrupt stack time
    need be handled for the process display.
    
    				_Greg

Although the Overview HELP text comes up fine, when I choose any of the other
topics from the lower list box, I get an error indicating that HELP can't find
the 

Couldn't find frame OVERVIEW SETUP_OPTIONS in SYS$HELP:DECW$BANNER.HLB

although the VMSINSTAL procedure went fine (except for the expected 2
undefined symbols.)

Any ideas?

Jeff

Yes the help sub-system does not seem to be working any longer. You can access
it from VMS using VMS help, if you point the help library at 
sys$help:decw$banner.hlb. I'm not sure why the frames can no longer me found, 
I have to talk to the help people to see whats going on.

Jim

    I'm having the same problem as reply .27 had...
    
    I $SPAWN/NOWAIT/PROC=DECW$BANNER RUN SYS$SYSTEM:DECW$BANNER.EXE
    
    from a window, and Banner comes up fine. However, if I try to set host
    from that one window immediatedly after spawning and before the banner
    begins to display, I get the message - 
    
    Failed to assign the Session Manager's terminal
    
    and once the banner is up, set host will return 
    %SYSTEM-F-DEVACTIVE, device is active
    
    I did an INSTALL ADD SYS$SYSTEM:DECW$BANNER
    /PRIV=(CMKRNL,WORLD,SYSPRV,PRMMBX,ALTPRI) after installing banner
    because I couldn't start banner from a nonpriv'd session.
	
    ?

Re .54, .55 -- /INPUT=NL: would also be a good idea. Otherwise, the first ^Y
will kill banner...

Martin

    RE: .last three and .27 (by me)
    
    I fixed the problem by spawning /input=nl:.  When I wrote a command
    procedure to start Banner, I did the right thing.  It was just when
    I was starting it by hand that I got lazy and didn't give the input
    = null qualifier.
    
    cheers,  Ken.

Here's an interesting problem....

I recently performed a full install of VMS V5.2.

I then installed the DECwindows V2.0 Field Test software and then 
reinstalled BANNER.

When I run it from DCL, or when I invoke the application from my
SYS$LOGIN:DECW$LOGIN.COM, it works correctly in the same manner as it did
under VMS V5.1 and DECwindows V1.0.

However, since DECwindows V2.0 provides the capability for using the 
autostart mechanism from the session manager window, I moved the the 
startup commands from DECW$LOGIN.COM to the appropriate DECwindows 
application menus.  When I try to start BANNER in this way, the desired 
banner windows appear on the workstation briefly and then disappear.

I have included a copy of the account log with the error message that
occurred when the image aborted.



DECW$BANNER Image Termination
-----------------------------

Username:          SYSTEM            UIC:               [SYSTEM]
Account:           SYSTEM            Finish time:       31-JUL-1989 13:39:21.16
Process ID:        00000090          Start time:        31-JUL-1989 13:39:01.42
Owner ID:                            Elapsed time:                0 00:00:19.74
Terminal name:     MBA179:           Processor time:              0 00:00:05.87
Remote node addr:                    Priority:          1
Remote node name:                    Privilege <31-00>: FFFFFFFF
Remote ID:                           Privilege <63-32>: FFFFFFFF
Queue entry:                         Final status code: 10000454
Queue name:
Job name:
Final status text: %SYSTEM-F-ROPRAND, reserved operand fault at PC=!XL, PSL=!XL

Page faults:             1373        Direct IO:                 63
Page fault reads:          33        Buffered IO:               29
Peak working set:        1631        Volumes mounted:            0
Peak page file:          1654        Images executed:            2

Image name: DWJNES$DUA0:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.][SYSEXE]DECW$BANNER.EXE

Banner seems to run OK on my V5.2 SSB system, but when I do this:

$ type decw$banner.log

I get this:

Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal
Falied to assign the Session Manager's terminal

As a result of doing this:

$ spawn/nowait/input=nl:/output=decw$banner.log/proc=decw$banner_'DNumber' -
  run sys$system:decw$banner

Using this:

        Image Identification Information

                image name: "DECW$BANNER"
                image file identification: "V1.0"
                link date/time: 15-JUN-1989 21:40:26.78
                linker identification: "05-05"

BTW, What does ``falied'' mean?   ;-)

Since we upgraded to VMS V5.2 (SSB) the PE counters  have been showing
up as zero.  Anyone have a fix for this?

	Tony

Yes this is odd, normally the only thing that would make banner exit in this
way (After displaying its windows), is lack of priv's. However your dump seems
to show ALL priv's were turned on, (Maybe I've read this wrong?). Banner 
should have written an error reprt to sys$output just before it exited
I dont suppose the Session manager has recorded that anywhere? 

I see the session manager record the exit status as SYSTEM-F-ROPRAND, anyone 
know how accurate that is? I've never seen banner exit like that. 

Sorry I cant be more helpful, but I really need to see the dump generated 
by banner, and I dont know if the session manager has recorded that anywhere?

Jim

re .59

	Banner is trying to allocate the session managers terminal to get 
a broadcaste mailbox on it. It tries for 10 seconds and then gives up. I have 
found that 10 seconbds is not always eneugh time for the session manager to 
finish itsd work, and create the device, in the  next kit, the wait timer will
be longer. If you are running banner from DECW$LOGIN, I have found that 
putting banner as the very last thing you do, normally fix's the problem.

re .60

	Yep all the addresses for fetching the PE statistics have change 
in V5.2, you will have to wait for me to build a new kit. This will either 
be soon or not so soon, depending if the addresses I have for the PE statistics
in V5.2 are correct or not.

Jim

Re: .58 and .61

> Yes this is odd, normally the only thing that would make banner exit in this
> way (After displaying its windows), is lack of priv's. However your dump seems
> to show ALL priv's were turned on, (Maybe I've read this wrong?). Banner 
> should have written an error reprt to sys$output just before it exited

No, it did not report anything to sys$output before it exited.

> I dont suppose the Session manager has recorded that anywhere? 

No, it hasn't.  I've checked several of the DECwindows related log files, 
specifically my SYS$LOGIN:DECW$SM.LOG, and there is no information regarding 
the BANNER process that aborted in any of them.

Is there any thing else that I should be checking?

BTW, the BANNER program is INSTALLED at boot time, with the appropriate 
privileges, but I don't think that this should have any effect.

Regards,

Andrew

No priv's is the only normal fault, that would cause banner to exit after putting
up its windows. The priv in question would be PRMBX, when banner tries to get
the session managers terminal. There could be something else like SYS$OUTPUT
doesnt actually exist when your running banner in auto startup, but that I 
would think is very unlikely. Can the session manager auto-start a command
file? If so you may like to write a command file which assigns SYS$OUTPUT, and
SYS$ERROR to a log file and then runs banner, so we can see why banner exits.

Otherwise I'll try to experiment when I get V5.2 up and running.

Sorry I cant be more helpful,

	Jim 

We have upgraded several vax stations to 5.2.  Banner used to be well behaved,
now, like others have noted, we get

Falied[sic] to assign the Session Manager's terminal

repeated many times in the log for banner.

Depending on the individual station several things might happen if we try
to use help.  Drag down the menu, select help.  Help screen comes up, maybe, or
the session manager will abort popping all the icons back to windows on the 
display.  On the stations that leave up the help screen, double clicking on
an item will result in an error to obtain the requested module from the
decw$banner help library.

A couple of the stations even appear to function correctly, we are not sure why,
although they appear to be running code that was installed on intermediate dates
with systems that don't work.

Is there a kit/installation procedure on the network that has been known to
install a version of banner on VMS5.2 that is well behaved?

Bruce

    It has worked ok for me, throughout all reasonable
    combinations of VMS V5.2, VMS T5.2-1, DECwindows V1, DECwindows V2.
    
    I suspect that it works for me because I'm not using the same
    options that you are.  Is there some kind of message-trapping
    optin which involved assigning a channel to the SM terminal?
    Try disabling that option and seeing if everything's ok - at
    least it'll help you narrow down the problem.
    
    My kit can be copied from MU::KITS:BANNER000.A, but it's way old - 
    November 1988.  I've never had to "reinstal" it either.
    
    (Hmm, I wonder if the mechanism I use to send OPCOM messages
     to the Session Mgr window has been broken...)
    
    

Re .-1

	Most of what you have mentioned in -1 are in fact bugs in banner.
The help system in the last kit was broken because of a help bug in the
Banner HLB file. The disapearing Icons, is Banner blowing away the 
window manager. This isn't banners fault in fact, but people who choice to
have banner without a title bar should never try to use help, as thier 
window manager will die immediatly. 

	As for the message window, I'm not sure, I suspect it is still 
working as normal, and it is just that you are running banner to quickly 
and the session manager has not created the terminal device by the time
banner is looking for it. This will be fixed in the next kit. 

I should have a new kit next week, as long as I can sort out the PE display
for V5.2, and check out all the bug fixes I've made since the last kit. 

Jim

One more problem if I may. With banner running, and with titles on windows, 
pulling down menu, selecting help, double clicking on any subjects (eg
Setup Options) yields the error

Couldn't find frame OVERVIEW SETUP_OPTIONS in SYS$HELP:DECW$BANNER.HLB library

which is true, the requested info is not in the library.  

Is this the error that was alluded to a couple of replies back? or is this
something on my installations only?

Bruce

Oh, and after the error has been obtained the first time, and the help has been
exited from, a further request for help from the pull down yields

Couldn't find frame OVERVIEW in SYS$HELP:DECW$BANNER.HLB library

again, is this banner bug, or something I did?

BTW thanks for banner, I find it quite useful, these questions should not be
construed to be other than questions. thanks

Bruce

No this is a problem between Banner and the Help widget, it is not a fault of
your installation procedure. The banner help file has unfortunatly a couple
of text lines that upset the help widget, and VMS help. You can access the 
the Banner help file from VMS using VMShelp, that works O.K if you use the 
/LIBRARY qualifier, but you can not get any help out of the help file 
at DECwindows level.

Sorry

	Jim

The only reference I've seen to the current location of Banner is in reply .01
of this note, and it refers to MPGS.  I thot at one time that Banner was
distributed by the program author on FIZBUF (or something similar)

Since I need to get the "latest" copy of Banner installed on my workstation,
how about re-announcing the current location..

Mark

	Can someone tell me what is BANNER. I have a vaxstation 11/GPX. I 
	would be interested to know what it could do for me.


		Thanks in advance,

			stephen

	Why not just install it and try it?

							mike

Banner is the DECwindows version of the UIS Banner program. It gives you a 
graphical display of some of your more important system characteristics, like 
who's burning all your CPU time, why your workstation seems to have stopped etc.
It also gives you some small toys to keep the workstation from falling asleep 
while its waiting for you to type something. 

On a more serious tack, it is a highly customizable, and in many cases very 
useful internal program for DECwindows workstation users. The best bet is to 
install it, select the help from the popup menu, and customise it to something 
that meets your needs.

If you have any comments, suggestions for the future, feel free to forward them 
to me.

Jim

    
    
    OK, where's the kit? 
    MPGS::SYS$KITS:[DECW.UTIL] does not exist. 
    
    I can't find another reference in this notesfile for a more current
    kit location.
    
    

    I keep a copy here:

    Directory CIMTWO""::DECW$PUBLIC:[BANNER]

    BANNER001.A;1                        28-AUG-1989 11:48:02.00
    BANNER002.A;3                        19-OCT-1989 16:32:26.00

    It's not guaranteed to be the latest though.

              Dave

    
    RE: .75
    
>   I can't find another reference in this notesfile for a more current
>   kit location.
    
    See note 1609.
    

    re .75
    
>    OK, where's the kit? 
>    MPGS::SYS$KITS:[DECW.UTIL] does not exist. 
    
    I've moved all of the VMS and DECwindows kits from Sys$Kits: to
    VMS$Kits:; the directory names haven't changed.
    
    /harley

    
    I am trying to run banner from a non-priviledged account (after
    INSTALLing it) - and I can run it from a DECterm but when I try
    to run it from AUTOstart (or from the DCL window in FileView)
    it creates the windows (with data) then crashes - here is the 
    message (anyone got any clues?)
    
    will
    
     Improperly handled condition, image exit forced.
    
            Signal arguments              Stack contents
    
            Number = 00000003                00000005
            Name   = 00000454                7FF2791C
                     8014B0F0                00000001
                     03C00000                80482440
                                             7FFEDFFE
                                             03C00000
                                             00000000
                                             203C0000
                                             7FF279B0
                                             7FF27984
    
            Register dump
    
            R0 = 80482440  R1 = 7FF27974  R2 = 00000003  R3 = 7FFEDC1C
            R4 = 8038D7F0  R5 = 00000001  R6 = 00000000  R7 = 00000001
            R8 = 00000001  R9 = 00000000  R10= 00002F36  R11= 0008006B
            AP = 7FF27850  FP = 7FF27810  SP = 7FF27884  PC = 8014B0F0
            PSL= 03C00000
    

	Do you do a RUN SYS$SYSTEM:DECW$BANNER??

							mike

    RE: .79

    Also, you can't have the message window enabled if you autostart it.

              Dave

    
    re 80,81
    
    I first used RUN SYS$SYSTEM:DECW$BANNER.EXE - that didn't work..
    then I tried to run a com file that contained that process - that
    didn't work also.
    
    re 81 
    
    Would this make the program bomb? - Do I have to go into banner.dat
    and set some flag to disable messaging?
    
    will
    

    RE: 82

    Yes, this would make the program bomb out.  It comes up, puts data in
    most of the windows, and then everything disappears.  It sounded
    exactly like your problem, which is why I mentioned it.

    To get around this, I ran DECW$BANNER from a DECterm window, after
    giving myself privileges.  I forget why this makes things work, but
    it does.  I then customize BANNER to not run the messages window,
    save the customizations, and then stop it.  This then allows ne
    to successfully autostart BANNER.  I have a command file to this
    in my case, since I don't install BANNER, and it needs privs to
    run.  The command file allows me to give the BANNER process the
    required privs before starting it.

                Dave

    
    re -1
    
    That fix worked - thanks
    
    will

Banner tends to ACCVIO on VMS T5.4-4ET. It only does it sporadically but its
usually right after starting it up from a DECterm...(SPAWN/NOWAIT/INPUT=NL:)

                image name: "DECW$BANNER"
                image file identification: "BANNER T0.03"
                link date/time: 26-APR-1990 10:38:47.14
                linker identification: "05-05"

Ed

Banner looks like it becomes unstable on VMS V5.4. All people I know who have 
seen this problem, have had no further problems after re-installing the kit. 
Therefore I recommend that everybody upgrading to V5.4, should re-install 
Banner afterwards.

Jim

    What version needs to be installed on VMS 5.4?  I installed V0.5 and
    only half the display comes up.
    
    Mike

    V0.5? The latest kit I'm using is 0.3 and that is seemingly the current
    kit.
    
    No problems on VMS T5.4-4GE....
    
    
    						- andy

    Yeah I did find a V0.5 (all 21K blocks worth).  I'll try V0.3.
    
    Thanks,
    Mike

    I dont recommend anybody tries to use the V0.5 kit, it was built for
    some people who needed some special display for DECWorld. It still has 
    some nasty window manager problems, and possibly isnt to stable. I hope
    to have these problems ironed out over the next couple of weeks, time
    permitting. In the mean time I suggest you stick with the V0.3 kit
    for VMS V5.4, although avoid using the message trapping facility as
    this would seem to be getting very flaky.
    
    Jim

I'm shure this has been asked before but I couldn't find it anywhere.

Is BANNER for internal use only or may it also be given to customer?

	Edwin

I'm afraid that Banner is classed under on of those 'Unsupported Internal Use ONLY"
catagories. There is currently no plans, nor any reasonable way it would seem to
make it anything else than that.

Sorry

	Jim

RE .90

I will atest that Banner 0.5 does have some problems with runing T5.4-4HW.

However, I did have some error messages when I installed it:

-------------

%BANNER-I-LINK1,  Building the DECwindows Banner image.

%LINK-W-NUDFSYMS, 3 undefined symbols:
%LINK-I-UDFSYM,         DXMCREATEHELP
%LINK-I-UDFSYM,         DXMHELPWIDGETCLASS
%LINK-I-UDFSYM,         DXMHELPWIDGETCLASSREC
%LINK-W-USEUNDEF, undefined symbol DXMHELPWIDGETCLASSREC referenced
        in psect $CODE offset %X00000019
        in module MRMINIT file DSA0:[SYS136.SYSUPD.BANNER005]DECW$MOTIF$MRM.OLB;3
%LINK-W-USEUNDEF, undefined symbol DXMCREATEHELP referenced
        in psect $CODE offset %X0000001F
        in module MRMINIT file DSA0:[SYS136.SYSUPD.BANNER005]DECW$MOTIF$MRM.OLB;3

%BANNER-I-HLB1,  Building the DECwindows Banner help file.

%LIBRAR-S-INSERTED, module OVERVIEW inserted in DSA0:[SYS136.SYSUPD.BANNER005]DECW$
BANNER.HLB;1

%BANNER-I-FILES,  Defining target directories for DECwindows banner files.


        The installation of DECwindows Banner has completed. DECwindows...

------------

I don't know if this has anything to do with the these problems found (prior to 
exceeding the I-give-up threshold, so they may be incomplete):

1.  Cannot get boarders around individual boxes.
2.  Cannot change what disks get monitored 

Did they get these problems at DECworld?

I did get the setup box, though, and what's down the pike looks exciting!

...Install, install, it's off to VMS I go...

Back to V0.3  

Thanks

--dave--

Dont go back to 003, (Well  you might have already done it by know), copy the
new kit Banner006, it is much more operational than 005 was, which was only a
special for some people who need TP displays. 006 still has a host of little 
problems, like no resize buttons etc, but it is operational in both modes, and 
I'm not going to have the time to work on it over the next couple months I thought
it was probably best to make a kit out of it, for those people who had pinched the 
005 kit :-)

Jim

P.S I'll be making a new note, with release note sort of information in it 
sometime today.

Great, thanks.  I was about to install 003, then decided to read the note first 
(Ohhhh, how novel! :^)).  Good thing I did.... I'll copy 006 tonight and install it
Monday!

--dave--

    Can anybody tell me why Banner has grown from about 1100 blocks
    to over 21,000 blocks? What does Banner do differently from the
    old UIS banner?
    
    Steve Boyack

RE: .96

It uses DECwindows instead of UIS.

--PSW

    
    21,000 blocks???  Sheesh, there are entire operating systems smaller
    than that.
    
    

    That's only the size of the 006 saveset.  It had to contain a bunch
    of MOTIF libraries in order to link, since it was an advanced MOTIF
    implementation.  The final .EXE sizes will be much smaller.

               Dave

    Running Banner006, the following happens when running under
    DECwindows:
    
    - ICON Box gives full expanded disk/directory specification which
    can be very, very long.
    
    - Small Banner window saying "demo" can't be dismissed.
    
    - Resize boxes are disabled, therefore can't resize windows.
    
    - default size of page i/o box is too small, information is
    partially  missing.
    
    - pop-up menu for setup options requires MB3 instead of MB1
    
    - setupbox: if TP display disabled, TP options are greyed out but
    if i re-enter the setup box, they've been turned back on...even
    after saving....
    
    - cluster display: one system, that is in the cluster, is displayed
    twice.  The first instance displays it as a member of the cluster. 
    The second instance displays it as -BRK (not in the cluster).  This
    instance repeats itself everytime the display is updated until it
    scrolls past the window's bottom line.  Shows up red.  Both
    instances have dropped the last letter of the node name also.
    
    - print queue display: not accurate.  Does not display all active
    jobs.
    
    Runing under MOTIF:
    
    - if display is directed to an ULTRIX v4.0 MOTIF V1.1 station, the
    Ultrix station's window manager hangs and all windows can not be
    moved unless the banner process is terminated.
    
    -Nick
    

>    - ICON Box gives full expanded disk/directory specification which
>    can be very, very long.

  Look a few notes back, there are instructions on how to change this

>    - Resize boxes are disabled, therefore can't resize windows.

  I've mentioned this and would like to know why but I love Banner anyway... 

>    - pop-up menu for setup options requires MB3 instead of MB1

  A I understand it, it's suppose to be that way.

-Craig