Conference turris::womannotes-v1

    Forgive my denseness, but what is "feminine protection" -- an escort
    service for late workers? How about a Sanibag?  
    
    Liz

    Where do you work?  It's always been a dime that I know if!

    re .1  Feminine protection includes tampons and napkins.  They can
    be "purchased" in ladies rooms throughout Digital, for ten cents.
    
    A Sanibag is what you put them in when you are through.  Then you
    throw them in the wastebasket.

re: .2
Yes, they're a dime here too. They were a nickle at Prime.

There free at the Best Western Royal Plaza in Marlboro...

    Sure, I'm not proud, I'd accept free "feminine protection" anytime.
    
    (I hate trying to cram a few in my purse, and then they pop out when
    I'm at a cash register paying for something.  I always wonder if
    any men notice them and think, "God, how uncool.")
    
    Lorna
    

Getting "feminine protection" free sure beats banging on broken machines or
running back to your office for change (or your own supplies!).

re carrying them in your purse:  I have a small zippered "change purse".
It holds about 2 days worth of supplies, and no one would be any wiser if it
fell out of my purse.  A small cosmetic case would probably work, too.

Jill

    Personally, I'd settle for a machine that worked all the time. If
    I had a dime for all the dimes I've lost, I'd have a lot of dimes.
    
    Bahama Mama

    And when the machine doesn't work trying to come up with
    alternate solutions!
    
    The building where I work had varying prices, some places
    5 cents and some places 10. It always seemed that what ever
    change you had it was wrong for the facility you were in!
    
    I wonder - if women were in charge of plant management if
    the  feminine supplies would be free. They can't cost much more
    than t.p and paper towels.

    It's not paying for it, but the logistics that always get to me.
    If I don't plan properly, or have something spontaneous come up
    during the day, and I don't have adequate protection (or don't know
    I'll need it that day!), it can be a logistical nightmare to figure
    out where and when I can get it.  One more detail to deal with!
    If only you could count on all public restrooms (I'd settle just
    being able to count on finding a public restroom!)
    
    Gloria

    Maybe I am being naive (not unusual for me!), but what's wrong with
    just keeping a box of your favorite brand of "supplies" in your
    desk?  That's what I do.  I ALWAYS assume that any given vending
    machine is going to be out of whatever I was hoping to buy from
    it.  Anyhow, it is cheaper to buy tampons by the box.
    
    IN my purse, I have a couple of little snap-closed plastic boxes
    to carry them in.

re: .12 

Well, my purse isn't that big, and I'm not always in my facility, and
I'm not always at my desk when I discover I need one (so I have to put
myself together, walk all the way back to my desk, etc.). I just think
the darn things should be free. When we need them, we need them (just
like t.p.).
	Mez

			
    re .2
    Sanibags do not go into the wastebasket, they go into the OSHA approved
    stainless steel containers strategically placed in ladies room stalls
    for this purpose.
    
    Thanks to others for good suggestions...I've had usual problems
    of losing at vending machine roulette, and having to walk the
    building with wads of makeshift solutions until I found a machine
    willing to dispense feminine protection for my nickel.  Often
    I had to settle for what was available rather than my protection
    of choice.
    
    In lieu of getting them free, I'd like to be able to get them reliably.
    Most of my expriences were in the MK01 plant.  I haven't been here
    at ZK long enough to evaluate the situation.
    
    

    re: .0
    
    They're also free at IBM in the US.  
    
    In Europe no one even has vending machines.  
    

 < re .2
 <  Sanibags do not go into the wastebasket, they go into the OSHA approved
 <  stainless steel containers strategically placed in ladies room stalls
 <  for this purpose.
    
    Not all bathrooms have these (or the Sanibags) and in the facility
    I'm in, the steel containers hang on the wall, but are broken, so
    anything dropped in, drops right out..... and complaining to facility
    maintenance doesn't seem to help.
    
    Finally, after many years, I am finally able to go into a store and
    carry around the box of pads/tampons without embarrassment. I do put
    them inside of something when carrying them in my purse (I use an old
    slip-in eye glass case) though. And, I still am uncomfortable at work
    carrying something from my desk to the bathroom (how many put it up
    their sleeve, or into a deep pocket or even feel self-conscience about
    taking your purse with you, since that may be the only time you carry
    your purse to the bathroom?) 
    
    When you think of it though, it is as much a part of our needs as
    toilet paper is, and they don't charge for that.... just because
    only "half" of the population needs it, it's a luxury?

    

I very often stick them up my sleeve!

Free stuff is a great idea, but I, too, would settle for a reliable 
pay-as-you-go source.  I'd also like to see super tampons, as regular
just doesn't hack it.  Hmm.  Our bathroom dispenses "regular" tampons
and heavy duty hospital grade napkins.  I'd rather it were the other
way around -- heavy duty tampons and light duty pads.

CQ

    Why don't we get together with other women in our plant and make
    our feelings known to the plant manager? I know that about a year
    ago I sent a Decmail about the varied prices in the WMO machines
    to the man in charge (I got his name from a woman guard!) and also
    complained about the lack of seat protectors in the women's
    bathroom near the customer conference room. He called me up -
    some what to my embarassment - and agreed to fix both problems.
    (It turned out that they were in the process of phasing out old
    nickel machines and replacing them with dime machines and never
    realized what kind of a problem this would cause.) He said that
    I was the first woman who had ever complained about anything to
    do with the bathrooms since he had been in his job. I know it is
    embarassing but if a few of us can speak up we may be able to 
    get some changes made. No one is going to know that the machines
    are often broken or we think that feminine supplies should be
    as free as t.p. or paper towels unless we say something! About
    22 yearago I played a small role in a rebelion at my college
    over the rough t.p. then supplied on campus. Not only did the
    one young woman who started the complaint get a free case from
    a manufacturer, we got rid of the sandpaper subsitute that had
    been being supplied! So speak to a few other women in your building
    and lets see what we can do!
    Bonnie

>    And, I still am uncomfortable at work
>    carrying something from my desk to the bathroom (how many put it up
>    their sleeve, or into a deep pocket or even feel self-conscience about
>    taking your purse with you, since that may be the only time you carry
>    your purse to the bathroom?) 


Hopefully we'll be able to get building management to provide the
necessary supplies in the necessary places.  In the meanwhile, to
avoid embarassment, try carrying a tampon in one of those round 
travel toothbrush holders.  If you take that to the bathroom
everyone just thinks you're brushing your teeth.    
    

Doesn't Tampax sell/give away little plastic boxes for this purpose?  

The obligatory anecdote...
When I was in high school, I was the first in my group to have a car, so I
drove all my friends everywhere.  One day I found one of those little
plastic boxes in the back seat, although I didn't know what it was right
away.  Oddly enough, none of my friends would admit to having left it in the
car.  Is carrying tampons like buying condoms?  That is, everyone has to do
it, but no one wants to be public about it?  (Art Buchwald's column in
yesterday's paper had a good description of teenagers buying condoms.)

    yes, tampax gives away those little plastic boxes, but they're just
    as obvious as the tampax are! 

Can I interject something here that is confusing me??

*Why* do you *care* that anyone knows that the little black box is carrying
tampons?

*Why* does it *matter* that your tampon somehow makes it's way to the top
of the junque in your purse?

Only two kinds of people are going to see it:  women (who surely would
understand and appreciate what it is and who are not uncomfortable
with it) and men (who go to great lengths to avoid even DISCUSSING
it and have come up with interesting pseudo-names for it because they
can't BEAR to say the word 'menstruation'... I don't know about YOU,
but it's NO 'friend' of mine!!!!).  And don't you think if WE stopped
wanting to carry it in little plastic boxes to keep men from getting
embarassed, they'd STOP getting embarassed about it and we'd stop
having to struggle with those *@(*^$ little boxes?

Don't HIDE it from them, TEACH it to them!

Menstruation is shameful or dirty or embarassing??  In whose eyes?

On a visit to my new girlfriend's house several years ago, a trip to
the bathroom found me staring into a strange assortment of tampons
nestled in a candy disk on the sink.  I had never seen such an
array before and stared at it a minute, and then thought "Gee, how
great!! No struggling under counters or in drawers...!!"

It is an all-woman house, and who cares what males might think upon
entering the bathroom?

It's a fact of life for us.  Why encourage guys to pretend it just
doesn't happen, or there is something embrassing about it?  I don't
hide my Kleenex box...

Bugsy

    Way to go TABER!!  I was wondering when someone was going to come
    in here and say that.  Now, that you did, I dont have to.
    
    My reaction to alot of the gripes is "What's the big deal"?
    
    Happy in menses, one small thing to put up with once a month....
    :-)  Cathy

Re: -.1,-.2:

Fully agree.  The drug stores don't supply brown bags to get the
tampons (or condoms, etc for that matter) to the register.  As a
male, I have no problem with that.  In fact, I believe we are all 
better off (including children) if we don't hide such things.

But, maybe it a bigger issue at work, where you are among people you
know???


	~Mike

    I'm not embarassed to carry tampax around, but I am slightly
    embarassed to make it obvious to all and sundry that I am 
    having my period. 

    Generally, I'm not embarassed about things sexual or gender-specific,
    and certainly not menstruation. But, I don't like people to know
    when I'm OTR at work. *Because*, being OTR is often used as just another
    way to trivialize women's anger, emotions, and so on. Not that the
    people I work with would do it on purpose. It's just another one
    of those awful prejudices we picked up in our early years. Maybe
    I should be less protective of the fact that I am when I am, to
    combat prejudice (another cause :-))!
    	Mez

    I kind of like the little blue plastic freebie boxes (I think that
    they come from Playtex), not because it is any less obvious what
    is inside, but because they are solid enough to keep what is obviously
    in there from getting mangled or dirty in my purse the rest of the
    month.
    
    I'm not crazy about people spotting tampons in my purse either -
    I guess I am concerned that there may still be people around who
    think that women "go crazy" during their periods.

    I find it interesting that everyone who has replied here just seems
    to assume that all women use tampons.  Well, I don't.  I have never
    been able to stand the way they feel.  I use the stick on sanitary
    napkins.  (Interesting bit of trivia, eh, guys?)  There is one brand
    that comes all folded up small and I used to buy those.  But, since
    my divorce I have been trying to economize so I now buy the Stop
    n Shop brand which costs 1/3 the price but is not folded up.  Now
    these moth**s are difficult to squeeze into a purse and I'll be
    darned if I'll trot down the hall to the ladies room happily waving
    one in my hand!!  (I would probably be called into some engineering
    manager's office and told that a secretary should know better!)
    
    However, buying them in the store doesn't embarrass me at all. 
    It's not MY fault I need them :-) !
    
    Re .23, having your period may be "one small thing to put up with
    once a month" for you and, if so, you're lucky!  For me it's meant
    being in acute pain for 2 to 5 days a month for over half my life!
    
    Lorna
    

    I got over buying the darn things by the time I was 14, but before
    then it was pure hell.  But I wanted tampons,and my mother didn't
    agree, so it was buy or do without.  No big deal.  The college guy
    at the counter seemed oblivious to it..
    
    I hate trotting off the ladies room with my purse.  I tend to collect
    skirts with pockets, and that is one of the reasons (change and
    tampons!!).  Failing that, I stick them in my sleeve, and hope I
    don't get waylaid for an active job.  
    
    I personally don't care who knows, but at work it feels a bit like
    having your underwear showing or something...just not appropriate.
    Now at home I have all 4 sizes lined up against the wall (super-plus,
    super, regular, and slender-regular).  That's luxury for me!  I
    was thinking that it would be nice to make a wooden container for
    the wall with space for all 4 sizes.  It would also keep the cats
    from their most favorite habit of carrying the unopened ones around...
    
    

    You think you women have problems - when I was young, my mother
    used to send me to the store to buy her tampons, and once, when
    I was 16, she sent me to her gynecologist to pick up birth control
    pills.  I didn't know in advance about this ("Steve, please pick
    up my prescription from my doctor"), but when I walked into that
    waiting room full of women, whose eyes were all on me,and realized 
    what my mother had done to me, I wanted to sink into the floor.
    
    As a man, my response to the question of "what would I do if you
    spilled your purse and some tampons fell out?"  I'd ignore it and
    try not to let you feel embarassed.
    
    I've long since given up being embarrassed when buying "masculine
    protection" items from female store clerks.  I was indeed terrified
    for quite a while of this.
    				Steve

    re: .22
    Hi Bugsy
    I thought you might like this little anecdote.
    A few years ago, I was dating a lady with an 11 yearr old son. We
    decided to go backpacking (camping) together, but as she was packing,
    her son asked her if she remembered to pack ALL her NEEDED things.
    When she queried her son on "What things", he said "You know, those
    things you wear between your legs when you bleed a little ?"
    
    She witheld her 'shock' long enough top assure him that she indeed
    did remember them. She is one proud lady, I'll tell you.
    
    I agree: Tell the men. If they're half the man you NEED them to be,
    they'll understand. I got my "breakin'" when my wife came home after
    her 2nd preganccy, and "needed" some sanitary pads "FAST"!.
    
    Well, I got them. I also got over the 'embarassement' of purchasing
    them, when it was time to do so, as part of the normal regimen of
    doing the 'food' shopping.
   
    Bob
    

    re male embarassment
    My grandmother used to send my uncle out to get my mother's
    cramp medication lo these 60 years ago. He would always go to
    a drug store across town where they didn't know him.
    
    I recall stories from the pre modess days of how embarassed
    girls were to have to give their mothers their bloody rags
    to wash. Ever wonder how women handled it in the wagon trains
    or under the primitive conditions of the pioneers or early
    colonial settlers? I know moss (prickly and itchy) used to
    be commonly used.

    re -.1:        MOSS?!?!?!Bleaghhh!!
    
    Lee

        Not to gross anyone out, but I couldn't resist after Lee's
        reaction (.33) to "moss"... :-)
        
        Anyone read Jean Auel's Clan of the Cave Bear, etc.?  The series
        is based on a great deal of archeological research, so most
        likely such aspects are reasonably accurate... among the
        northern tribes in The Mammoth Hunters, the common absorbant
        material was... 
        
	        	mammoth dung
        
        So things could be worse!  :-)
        
        	/dave

    Mammoth dung??  UCCHHH!!
    
    When I was a kid, I had a hormone imbalance problem, and had extremely
    heavy periods that lasted three weeks out of every four, during
    which I had to wear two super-size napkins, one under the other,
    and change them every 3-4 hours (even at night - had to set alarm,
    or clean up mess in the morning).  This was NO FUN in junior high
    school!!  Bleah!  I also used to get really anemic (which you might
    find strange, if you know me these days).
    
    Now that that is under control, I can use tampons, and my period
    lasts 7-8 days.  I only find it a real problem for about two days.
    
    I wonder how many people quit using tampons because of the toxic-shock
    scare?  The only person I know who ever got toxic shock was a man
    who was recovering from an operation (on his liver, I think) - he
    is still pretty sick, in fact, poor fellow.  I consider the risk
    miniscule compared to my memories of those disgusting pairs of gross
    pads...of course, it wouldn't be like that these days, but still!

    Actually mammoth dung would be better than moss. It was *dry* remember
    and should have been about the color, odor and consistancy of
    peat moss. How about animals skins fur side out, which were used
    by women who lacked rags in early America (and other places)? 
    I think I'd find disposing of those worse than a peat moss type substance.

re moss and dung:

Wow, next month I'll give thanks for cotton, that's for sure!

re embarrassment:

I never really thought about why I'd be embarrassed being "caught" carrying a
tampon to the ladies' room.  But then again, I'm embarrassed sometimes carrying
a candy bar to my office! :-)  There's probably a correlation, though...

I'm in the middle of reading Nancy Friday's "My Mother, My Self", and they had
a chapter on menstruation.  When Nancy was being interviewed (to reverse the
roles :-)), the media woman (sic) said something to the effect of "Why do I feel
ashamed buying tampons at the store?".  Nancy explained that somewhere there
were primitive emotions of shame, being dirty, etc. associated with
menstruation.  The interviewer said something like "No, I don't feel any of
those.  But why am I ashamed buying tampons?"  Although we might (rightfully)
feel we have no reason to be embarrassed, there's still a little something
inside.

I'm really enjoying and getting a lot out of the book, by the way.

Teach your children well...

Jill

    If you're in a situation where you are asked to have your purse
    searched, and you'd just as soon not have someone poke around in your
    purse, sometimes leaving items of feminine hygiene on top can
    prevent an embarrassed male security guard from searching much farther.
    (Of course, if he's really doing his job he won't get embarrassed.) 

    						Val

    I was in a singing group which performed at Walpole State Prison
    (Mass. maximum security facility for you out-of staters).  We were
    searched very thoroughly, had to leave our belongings in lockers,
    and then were searched again.  We couldn't have anything in our
    pockets, and I *had* to have a couple of cough drops and tampons.
    The prison official accompanying us had to carry them for me, and
    (blush!) I had to get them from him when needed.   (...um, do you
    think I could have my tampon?...what!!oh, yes, I have it right here!)

    When I first started menstruating (about 13 years ago), I didn't
    have the kind of mother that discussed what this all meant.  I thought
    it was a curse or something or that I was bleeding to death (did
    anyone else feel this way?) and she said, "go talk to your sisters
    about it".  I used to cry all the time (not only of the pain and
    inconvience it gave me in the 7th grade, but because I didn't know
    "why this happened to me".)  Well, you find these things out sooner
    or later and you get used to it.  But, the thing that bothered me
    were those belts you had to use.  I hated that thing.  I always
    felt that if anything happened to that belt, I would loos-o the
    pad-o and.  So, first day of school, Freshman year high
    school, I tried using the Kotex brand tampons (the ones with the
    sticks) and I stuck it up too high.  Boy was I in pain that first
    day of school.  Now, I barely feel them (tampax kind) and I am ever
    so lucky that I only have to use about 3 per cycle (it only lasts
    about  2 - 3 days) and when I don't use them, those pantiliners come
    in handy.  Those were a blessing when invented.
    
    Cheery that even with inconvenience, it's better than "my mother's
    day".
                      

    Anybody else think that the person who invented those charming
    elastic belts with the nasty metal hooks probably never had to
    wear one?  

I was 10 years old when my mother gave me my first "junior starter" kit.
Really!! Moddess made a kit that had a small size belt, several small
napkins, and a booklet called (giggle) Your Friend.  My mother then
demonstrated (fully clothed, I might add) how you strap this thing
on while I just stared on in horror.

Mom was jumping the gun a bit, tho'.  I didn't end up starting until
6 years later... She was about ready to haul me to a doctor because
she thought I was backwards or something. Well, I was, but not in the
way that she was worried about. I ended up giving the Junior Starter kit 
to my younger brother and he soaked them with water and hit my older
brother Kurt with them.

When I did start (lord I remember that awful Halloween morning when
I felt SO lousy), I tried to use a tampon because I was *NOT* going
to use that awful belt and those hunks of cotton!!!  

I didn't know how to use it right and stuck it in backwards because
the applicator broke and I didn't want to throw it away (WHERE do you
throw an unused one so no one can find it?) and I had to manually
insert it and I put the roped end in instead, figuring I'd just
pull it out when the time came.

Well, the time came, but no rope and no ability to "grab" onto
it, but the more I tried, the further away it got until I could
no longer even touch it.

And BOY did THAT hurt!!!!

I had to go and tell my mother about it and she lectured me from
MONTHS about NEVER using tampons because they were unhealthy...
and I had to go to some stupid doctor who laughed at me for a
good half an hour....

But I continued to use them because I hated the napkins so much...

On another note, one of my favorite memories is my Dad coming home
from work with a GIGANTIC box of Moddess napkins under his arm,  no
bag or anything!!!  Hee hee... The box was BRIGHT pink and you could
see it for 2 blocks when he came up the hill... and my mother ALWAYS
turned scarlet and hissed "Sten, you put that in a BAG next time!"
and my father would laugh and tell her they never had a bag big
enough.  That was true.  He always brought home something like a
500-count size....

He did it just to amuse himself.  My dad was 6'4" and about 250
pounds at the time.... He could afford to laugh at himself and nobody
ever dared comment about it

But... i think i told this story before :*)

Bugs

    There's a feminist comedian who refers to the belts as "large elastic
    tourniquets with little pieces of shrapnel attached"!  Very accurate
    description!

    My Mom bought me the same Modess kit and showed me how to use it
    when I was in the 3rd grade!!!(Yes, I was 8 years old).
    
    I hated that belt so much that I used tampax from day 1 (5 years
    later).  My parents were divorced when it came, tho.  Poor Dad...
    
    Lee

I remember hating those pads, too.  I remember being afraid that my boyfriend 
would pull me down to sit on his lap and feel it on his leg... I also remember 
being 12 years old and starting my period on the day that I was supposed to be 
swimming in my first competition.  I spent about an hour in the bathroom trying 
to get the g.d. tampax inserted, while my oldest sister coached and encouraged 
me from the other side of the closed door.  I squatted, I sat, I put one leg up 
on the edge of the toilet bowl (as illustrated), and as I got more desperate, I 
laid down on the floor, and used up half a jar of vaseline, to no avail!  >Sigh<

CQ

    re .42
    I think all of us must remember the day we first got "our
    friend". I remember I went to bed and wouldn't get up for
    several hours, but my youngest sister started on a long car
   rtrip. She got out of the car at a rest stop and discovered
    she was soaked through. I don't think she had it again for
    over 6 months! We certainly have a lot of euphimisms for
    menstruation too: "my friend", "period", "curse", etc. etc.
    
    Bonnie

    Starting my period wasn't really traumatic -- I knew about it from
    one of those cute little illustrated booklets my Mother had given
    me (though we never discussed it).  What was awful was dealing with
    the snickers and side glances from my stepfather and anyone else
    he chose to tell.  Thirteen-year-olds already feel conspicuous enough.
    
    I, too, started using tampons as soon as I saved enough babysitting
    money to buy them regularly.  Now, with much heavier periods, I use
    tampons sometimes and pads sometimes.  Those belts were terrible
    -- they showed through everything I wore.  I used to get out of
    phys ed class not because of cramps, but because we were required
    to take showers!  Imagine managing that without embarassment!
    
    Gloria  

> Note 197.41 by STUBBI::B_REINKE "the fire and the rose are one" >
                                  -< ouch... >-

>    Anybody else think that the person who invented those charming
>    elastic belts with the nasty metal hooks probably never had to
>    wear one?  



Many times I cursed this person, all the while sure that it was a Man.
;-) ;-)

    Re; .49  But if his manager wasn't a woman, do you think that
    would have made a difference.
    
    
    I remember reading somewhere the line, "If men went through 
    menopause, there would be champagne and cigars!"
    
    Well, if men could menstruate, protection would probably be free
    and menstruation would probably be considered a much publicized
    passage to manhood.  (Hallmark would probably put out a card for
    it.
    
    Also, .49, maybe they dissapeared quickly because women actually
    needed them.

    My 12 year old duaghter started her *friend* a couple of months
    back.... since I hated those pads too... I wanted to start her
    out on Tampax.... no way... "Oh Mom thats gross" was what I heard...
    imagine my surprsie when my supply of Tampax started getting low...
    it finally dawned on me that SHE was using them... after a talk,
    she hates pads - and only after using them for a two day period... I
    now get her the junior size...
    
    What I thought was cute was when she did start, she brought out a
    book for Moms, given to her in fifth grade - she had saved it for
    me until that famous day, because she hadn't started before so "I
    didn't need to read it until then"... I laughed all day!!!
    
    Gale

>    If you're in a situation where you are asked to have your purse
>    searched, and you'd just as soon not have someone poke around in your
>    purse, sometimes leaving items of feminine hygiene on top can
>    prevent an embarrassed male security guard from searching much farther.


I stuffed the 500 in cash into the bottom of the tampax box, shoved it 
under the car seat, and then toured the Smithsonian for 4 hours.  We 
returned to find the car window smashed with most of our stuff gone,  
but the box and money were still there.

    Meigs

    
    Re: .53
    
         UNFAIR! UNFAIR!  Does the thieves union know about this?
    
                              Bubba
    

    Well they may soon if we spread it about!
    
    BJ

    <--(.55)

	A couple of years ago a security guard in the Vienna airport
decided that my wife's plastic bag of foot powder was something more
enjoyable and instituted a luggage ransack which *did not* stop with
the little plastic boxes, nor with the paper seals, but not until
here entire supply had been shredded up with an Xacto knife...and, you
guessed it, he couldn't have picked a worse day...
	...boy, did the only all-night drugstore in Vienna have fun
with *my* German...

    <== re -1
    
    Be happy there wasn't a body search.  A friend of mine had one once;
    they left no orifice unexamined.
    
    Lee