Conference wahoo::fishing

    I have nearly completed my first rod (all that is left is applying
    the Flex coat epoxy and glue on the butt cap), and I can fill you
    in on many of the short falls they leave out of books etc.
    
    I have a fenwick pacific stick that is 7ft and made for 12-30 line,
    .5 to 1.5 oz lures and I really like it. I have a listing of fenwick
    blanks and could probably figure out what this rod is. It will start
    with SP84X where X is the how fast a tapper the blank has. The blank
    I am using is a Lamiglass (8ft Cod), they make very good salt water
    blanks. I have been told Fisher blanks are top of the line and
    for a graphite one you pay around $100. Add about $30 for guides,
    $8 fuji reel seat, 5-7 for grips plus thread and glue this is an
    expensive rod. A glass blank should run around $25-30.
    
    I have more info is you need it.
    
    Bruce

    
   G Loomis has the better blank.  They are currently out in front of the
   pack, technologically speaking, with the recent introduction of IMX
   graphite which has an amazing strength to weight ratio.  IMX is new for
   88 and probably is not available in what you are looking for.  What you
   may want is an IM6 blank which is about 20% lighter while being
   stronger than standard graphite. 
    
      G Loomis
      P.O. Box E, Dept. A, Woodland, Wa 98674, 206-225-6516 
   
      Give em a call and ask for distributors in your area or for a 
      catalog.

    Bagel, try calling Dale Clemens (Pa. 215 395-5119), or Angler's
    Mail (Wa. 206 225-6359). Both have large supplies of all major
    manufacturers blanks, but having dealt with Clemens a lot, I can
    tell you that you'll learn more in a 5 minute phone conversation
    with his people than in every note ever written.
     I've built a bunch of rods, so if I can be of help, give me a call
    at 234-4410 or at PIGGY::VARLEY. By the way, from what I've read
    I agree with John on the IMX blanks from Loomis. Any of their higher
    grade blanks or Sage blanks should be super, and Clemens has his
    own stuff that is also great.
    
    Tight Ones,
    
    Jack (the skoal bandit) Varley.

    I have built a number of Fly rods, both graphite and glass. For
    the extra $, I personally perfer the graphite. Building rods takes
    time and patience and you mind as well spend a little more and get
    a better material. Most of the blanks/kits I've purchased came from
    a mail order company called Cabela's (800-237-4444). I've had good
    luck with Cabela's, in fact on one rod the cork handle they sent
    me had a piece of cork broken out of it so I called them back and
    three days later I had a new replacement cork together with a rosewood
    reel seat and hardware, no questions, no cost. They handle both
    a Cabela brand of blanks called Fish Eagle and Fenwicks line of
    blanks. I've used both brands and perfer the Cabela's brand. The
    Fish Eagle II fly rod blanks are a semi-translucent forest green
    which is rather nice looking. They also carry a complete supply
    of rod building materials and hardware. If you don't have their
    new spring catalog, I suggest you give them a call and get on the
    mailing list. 

Bagel,
    
    I have Clemans catalogue im my office. I can give you prices and
    blank numbers from it if you know what you want.
    
    Bruce (took::sweet or dtn 226-7613)

    Just out of curiousity, to indulge a novice (me) could you guys
    tell me why you want to build your own rods rather than buy one?
    Some of the prices you were quoting for blanks and guides sound
    rather high, especially compared to ready-made rods.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Ed

    I built a $200 flyrod for $65 and some hours. It is nice feeling
    using a rod you built yourself.
    
    Rich

    It's really only cheaper to build your own rod, given the amount
    of quality products around, if you concentrate on the high end of
    the market, and consider your labor as "free". When I started building
    Bass rods back in 1974, I did so for a simple reason - there was
    nothing available on the market suited to my needs. This was especially
    true in the case of spinning rods for worms or spinnerbaits; we
    were forced to use a Fenwick #CA 574 (if memory serves me) casting
    blank, spine it on the reverse side and install spinning components.
    One thing that used to be true on less expensive rods is that unless
    you built 'em yourself, you couldn't be sure the guides were centered
    on or opposed to the "spine". Also, by building rods yourself you
    have a choice of components and wrappings, and you can test case
    a rod until the guide sizing and spacing yields the desired results.
    Other than that, there's no difference...
    
    -That Rod Wrappin' Skoal Bandit

    On the cod rod I just built I saved at least $40 on components alone,
    never mind the fact I used 4 thread colors of my own choosing and
    put a sharp diamond wrap on the butt. Also the rod is custom fit
    for me, I wanted an extra long grip and a roller tip for instance.
    Not to mention how great it will feel to jig up a 40lb cow cod on
    a rod I made myself. You just can't by that in a store. Custom rods
    will perform better, for instance, most factory rods are not splinned
    (the guides are not on the strong side of the blank) and this may
    cause them to break when stressed to hard.
    
    Lastly, there is no better way to spend the winter then buidling
    a rod and dreaming about the fish you will catch with it.
    
    So much for my two cents...
    
    Bruce

    Well, thanks for all the input so far.
    
    To get a bit more more specific...
    
    	My research to-date has steered me towards the Lamiglas GLB841M
        Is anyone familiar with this blank?
        Is anyone familiar with a like blank from another manufacturer?
    	Can anyone find it for less than $74 including shipping?
    
    
    Re: -2  WHY????
    		A. My wrapping bench is in the basement away from the
    		   family hub-ub.
    		B. I have a supply of cold brews near the wrapping bench
    		C. Its fun.(Used to be more fun before I had a basement
    			and wrapped 9 ft. rods in the living room)
    		D. Most factory built surf rods only vary in length-
    			actions, etc are all the same.
    		E. Its fun
    		F. I "LOVE" the challenge of trying to get "trick' butt
    			wraps right.
    		G. Its fun.
    		H. I suspect a strange effect when Flex-coat and Coors
    			are mixed.
    		I. It proves that I can do everything the guy in the	
    			tackle shop can do EXCEPT spend January in 
    			Florida.
    
    		Re the cost factor: After several years, I have convinced
    anyone and everyone who might give me a Birthday present to give
    cash, except for my wife- she gets the honor of buying the reel
    to mount on the new rod! 
    
    	Also, as has been mentioned in other notes, there is a certain
    satisfaction in catching fish with a rod you have built from scratch.
    (Not to mention admiration from the crusty old 'regulars' on the
    beach or dock)
    
    Bagel  
    		D. 

>>    ...for instance, most factory rods are not splinned
>>    (the guides are not on the strong side of the blank) and this may
>>    cause them to break when stressed to hard.

Bruce,

Not that I'm into making my own rods, but how does one know which side of a 
rod blank is the "strong side"??

Joe

    Joe,
    
    There are two basic ways I have read about and tried. First you
    can roll the rod (put the butt on a table and hold the blank in
    the middle and up near the tip and press in the middle) and try
    to feel the rod jump. This works best on lighter action rods. On
    heavy action rods (like my cod rod or stiff IGFA rods) the best
    thing to do if you can not make the rod jump is to sight down the
    rod and look for the bow in the rod that makes the tip point up.
    Once you have found the spline ( the spline is where the seam of
    the rod is and the material tends to be thicker here) you want to
    put the guides on the the spline or 180 degrees opposite the spline.
    A boat rod (conventional) would have the  guides on the side that
    the tip
    points up since that uses the added strength of that side of the
    rod.
    
    If you try an experiment, you will find that most rods feel stiffer
    when bent in one direction verses another, this is the action you
    want to take advantage of.
    
    Hope this makes sense...
    
    Bruce
           

Bruce,
What would your estimate be for someone building there own 
stand-up tuna rod? In catalogs like Outer Banks etc Daiwa has
30-80 lb. rods for around $130 +/-. I cannot figure out how to 
compete with prices like that. Any ideas?
Norm

    I'll agree with some of what Cap't. Codfish says, but with
    reservations. In his book, Clemens mentions a "spline" and a "spine",
    and his basic approach is to mount spinning and fly rod guides opposite
    the strong side, and casting and boat rods on the strong side -
    just like the Cap't. says.
     Where we differ is that Clemens cautions against merely sighting
    down the blank to determine the strong side, and relies on the
    "rolling" technique described previously. I have never been able
    to understand what happens when you roll a blank and it jumps, although
    you can feel it. How do you know right at that point exactly where
    the strong and weak sides are ? I therefore did what any sane equipment
    freak would do; I buttonholed Steve Rajeff and a Sage factory guy
    at the centrum and asked them. they said that for most normal rod
    blanks, they put the butt on the floor, and pressed down on the
    tip with the palm of their hand. the rod goes into a slight "c"
    position, and always jumps to the same place. Mark the inside with
    a dot and there's the weak side. The strong side is opposite. For
    two piece rods, do this with the tip; do the butt section if possible,
    but it's not as much of a concern. I have seen tips work off under
    stress, when positioned improperly so this is important.
     Better rod shops have devices (Clemens sells one) to do this for
    any strength rod, but if you order the blank from a good outfit,
    ask them to do it for you (it's cheating, but who wants to build
    a bad rod?).
     I know I haven't defined "spline/spine", but just think strong
    side (boat/casting rod), and weak side (fly/spinning - even surf
    spinning rod), and you'll be o.k.
    
    Skoal, Bruthuh !
    
    -the bandit. 

    re .13
    
    Norm,
    
     First let me say I can't comment on the quality of diawa standup
    rods.
    
     But, I have seen GREAT differences in the blank prices for stand
    up rods. For instance, the sabre blank was about $50 in clemans
    while the fenwick was about $30. They say you get what you pay for??
    So the sabre must be a 'better' blank. Since I do not have enough
    experience I really don't know why the sabre costs so much more and
    why it may be better. This does explaine why you see stand up rods
    ranging from $100 to $200. Another example of quality and cost is
    the Aftco Aluminum butt. The Butt costs about $55 which includes
    the reel seat, the reel seat alone is about $15. Put an aftco
    butt on the rod and you are definitely talking a $200 rod. What
    are the advantages to the Aftco butt vs. a straight through model,
    I don't know?
    
    For your $130, I would say you could build a top of the line rod,
    I doubt the diawa falls in this class.
    
    One thing I do know, the time to find out is NOT when you have a
    100 lb plus yellow fin hanging off the other end.
    
    Bruce (a.k.a. Capt Codfish)
          

    re .13 again...
    
    I have the clemens catalogue in front of me...just for yuks lets
    price out a couple of standup rods.
    
    Rod 1.
    	SABRE 655XXH Blank 50-130lb		51.15
        Aftco Heavy Duty Roller Guide Set	32.95
    	Aftco #12 tip                            6.62
    	Aftco 5.5 inch reel seat	 	15.11
    	Aftco gimbal				 3.99
    	10" Butt Grip	       			 4.19
        14" Fore Grip				 5.72
        3 Rolls Thread				 3.00
    						======
    					       $122.43
    This is a high quality rod!
    
    Swap in Fuji SIC guides for the rollers and you get:
        
        #20,#18,#16,#16,#12,#12 guides	       43.29
    	#12 tip 				9.99
    					       =====
    					       53.28
    Now we are up to $136.14
    
    The fenwick 50-130 blank is 31.85
    It takes a 14 tip but the cost is the same as the 12.
                                                         
    
    Hope this helps. I think I will build a rod very similar to the
    one I have described.
    
    Bruce
                                   
    (oh, add in a PENN 50TW or 80T, about another $325.)

    re: estimate
    How about Daiwa 900H and this will cut down the total cost but still
    end up with a good system?
    
    Now I must decide whether to buy or build. 
    Thanks
    norm
    

    Another reel to consider are the Shimano "Beast Master" series.
    I am not sure of the models but I think they have one that falls
    in the 50lb class, that has a lever drag. Anyone have any experience
    with these reels?
    
    Bruce

    Re: -2?  (the 2 stand-up rods)
    
    In deciding between the two blanks, don't go on cost alone. The
    difference between a size 12 and a size 14 tip can be significant!
    Also, given different tip diameters, what is the difference in butt
    diameter? In this situation, I strongly suggest you get your hands
    on both blanks and compare them - their respective actions may be
    very different, as well as the inherent power of the blank. 
    Another hint: both manufacturers use these blanks for production
    rods. You might want to compare the finished products in deciding
    which blank to use.
    
    Rich
    

    re:-1
    
    These are the specs from Clemens on 3 standups in the same tackle
    class:
    
    Fenwick LBE 667   5 1/2 ft 50-130 .995 butt 14 tip 10 1/4 oz  $31.85
    Sabre   655 XXH   5 1/2 ft 50-120 .935 butt 12 tip xxx        $51.15
    Shakespeare
            USWT66-8  5 1/2 ft 50-130 .860 butt 16 tip xxx        $28.72
    
    
    Draw your own conclusions...
    
    Bruce

    By the way for those that are confused by what some of those numbers
    mean...I know I was until some one explained them to me.
    
    Tips are measured in terms of the rod diameter at the tip in 64ths
    of an inch, ie. a 16 tip is 1/4 has a 1/4 inch diameter.
    
    Guides are measured in terms of the outside diameter of the 
    ring in millimeters, ie. a #20 guide has a 20 millimeter ring.
    
    The rod butt is measured by how many thousandths of an inch the
    outside diameter of the butt is. ie. .995 is just under an inch.
    
    So much for standards...
    
    Bruce
    
    B

    Re: .20
    
    And I assume these are all "E" glass?   
    
    (we just needed a little more confusion)
    
    Bagel
    

    The fenwick is E glass, Shakespeare is a glass ugly stick and I
    am not sure about the Sabre.
    
    Bruce

    re:.23
    
    Another possibility for a blank from Shakespeare might be one their
    "Guts Butt" blanks. These shafts have tremendously strong butt
    sections, as they add extra layers of material there. This can produce
    strength approaching that of a separate butt section in a "blank
    thru" configuration.
    
    Some other suggestions for stand-up rods would include any of the
    "RT" (IGFA rated) blanks from the better manufacturers like Lamiglas,
    Fischer, Dynaflex (and those mentioned in earlier replies). A lot
    of custom builders down this way use 50# trolling blanks as the basis for
    stand-up rods.
    
    
    Gee, we still have to discuss grips, reel seat, guides/tips, wraps,
    finishes, etc, etc, etc...
    
    Bagel       _who_is_still_trying_to_decide_on_a_popping_blank_
    

    I finished the first ever "SWEET STIK" this weekend. It came out
    much better than I would have thought for a first rod. I have a
    short list of things I would do differently to improve the next
    one. Over all, I would have to encourage anyone to try it. I highly
    recommend power winding ( I did this with a sewing machine motor),
    doing it by hand seems hopeless.
    
    This warm weather has me just dying to put on the lower unit and
    try out the new rod!!! I sure wish spring  would come.
    
    FYI...I went to the Boston boat show, disappointing overall. None
    of the new 25' 8.5' beam boats were shown.
    
    Bruce (Hopeing for warm weather and calm sea's...)

    One source I didn't see mentioned in this topic is Midland tackle.
    They don't carry as many items as Clemens but they are somewhat
    cheaper.  They also ocassionaly send out a close-out sheet with
    some good buys and bad junk.  I purchased several blanks from the
    close-out sheet and was not dissapointed.
    
    I agree with the comments about Clemens.  Fortunatly they are only
    about a half hour from where I live.  When I stop in they are always
    very willing to spend as much time as necessary to help you out.
    
    
    The address for Midland Tackle
                    66 route 17
                    Sloatsburg, N.Y.
                    10974-2399
    
    
                    914-753-5540
    
    Waitin' for the thaw
                          JOE D
    

Re: -1
    
    Joe...Do I detect an offer of delivery service?? 
    
    BTW.. I didn't realize I omitted Midland in this topic. Especially
    since I get most (95%) of my rod building supplies there. (Takes
    me about 45 minutes to get there.)
    
    BTW (again)   Missed you at the NJBBA meeting.
    
    Re: the Midland Closeout sheets. This is a good source for "junk
    blanks" for building gaffs. I never understood why surf gaffs are
    only 12" long. I hate bending over in the surf, so I build my gaffs
    about 2.5 foot long. I use a section of blank cut to length. My
    first cut is from the tip, cutting back until the shank of a 10/0
    to 14/0 hook will fit inside snugly. Next I cut off the eye of the
    hook and the barb. The hook is then epoxied into the blank. I usually
    wrap the 'butt' with cork tape. It is usually a good idea to wrap
    the tip with rod winding thread to beef it up. I like to use the
    same wrapping scheme that I use on my rods.
    
    Bagel
    

    	I need some help with a newer rod.  I have a Daiwa SKG31.
    Yesterday, I noticed that the lacquer (plastic or ????) on the guide
    wrapping for the butt guide is cracking and breaking.  Does anyone
    know what type of sealer, etc. is being used on most of the new
    graphite rods and specifically Daiwa?  Secondly, can I just re-paint
    the area over the guide foot and have it last or must I remove all
    of the old covering and start fresh?  If I must remove the old
    covering, what is the best way to do this?  I will have a couple weeks
    to do this since I am going to be at a convention this weekend.

I seem to recall an article in one of my recent bass magazines (either 
InFisherman, BassMasters or Bassin) that discussed rod repair.  They 
suggested that you use a saftey razor and carefully slice the varnish or 
sealer off the windings until you can can remove the old windings.  Then, 
use a real fine grit sandpaper (400-600) to smooth it out.  Wrap the footing 
and re-varnish it with a suitable lacquer.  It didn't sound too difficult.

-Joe-

    My limited experience in rod building yields the following info...
    
    First it is not uncommon to see the clear epoxy finish crack on
    a new rod. This can come from the wraps being to tight or loose.
    The finishes I have seen are two part epoxies. Heat will definitly
    soften the finish. Things like acetone will disolve the epoxy when
    it is stiff uncured (for clean up) I do not know if it will soften
    cured epoxy. There are probably two ways to go. One is just to put
    a new coat of Flex Coat over the existing finish. The second is
    to cut off the old wrap and rewrap the guide and refinish it. The
    third choice is the do nothing alternative, if the theard is
    intact and the guide is not loose then you do really have a 
    problem except for looks.
    
    Hope this helps...maybe someone else has more experience.
    
    Bruce

    re: .28
    Wayne, sorry I missed this note. I trust you've recieved my mail
    message by now. 
    
    re: .29
    I forgot to mention LIGHT sanding where the old wrap was. This always
    scares me (potential for sanding too deep)
    
    re: .30
    I do NOT recommend the use of any solvent for use directly on the
    blank. Fiberglass, Graphite and the compounds are all basically
    PLASTICS (or at least the resins). 
    
    Best bet is to cut away the old wrap/finish, lightly sand IF needed,
    and a good coating of a two part epoxy should make the rod look
    like new (or better) and last many, many seasons.
    
    Bagel

	I was given a 6 ft boat rod that needs new guides and some other
cosmetic work. I have refinished the handle and stripped the guides off.
The problem I have now is the rod finish doesn't look to great. It appears 
the rod was painted/coated originally and I would like to recoat in a different
color. Is there a paint that is flexible enough to put on a rod?

Rich

    I don't know anything about rod building, but the most flexible,
    durable and good looking paint I know of is polyurethane. It's plastic,
    so it should be very durable. Try the Plasti-kote brand.
    
    Ed

    I believe that most places that have rod building supplies will
    have the proper finish.  It is some type of varnish -- don't know
    if it is special or not.  Try Bass Pro, Cabellos (sp?), etc.

	From your node I assume you're in SHR.  Dick's Tackle on Grafton St.
in Worcester has rod building supplies, they do custom rod building themselves,
and you might be able to pump them for info on how to proceed (presuming of
course you buy something).

				Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

						Al

    Thanks for the replies. I did call Dick's tackle and got the word
    I expected: "Forget it". He explained that the colors IN rods are 
    baked into the glass. Oh well, It looks like when I am done I'll 
    have a nice looking handle with nice bright guides on a dull glass
    rod. Oh, the problem with painting is it will crack and chip in short
    order. 
    
    One more question: I have never wrapped a Boat-Rod before and am not 
    sure of the size thread to use on a 6' rod I would have to say it is 
    a med./heavy action. Just guessing, the label is worn. 
    
    Thanks
    Rich
    

    Always use size A thread for the underwrap. I would then use size
    D for the over wrap. You may want to triple wrap (ie. 2 overwraps)
    if the rod will be heavly stressed like for cod jigging.
    
    
    Bruce

    re:.36
    Use size D or size E for the wraps on this rod. 
    If you use an underwrap, a smaller size (A) is ok, since this is
    mainly to be a buffer between the blank and guide feet (the larger
    sizes can be used here too.)
    
    One idea to restore the finish, or at least make it look better:
    try some automotive paste wax. Use this after you wrap and epoxy
    the guides. Since the blank is fiberglass, boat polish/wax might
    work also. While I'm thinking about it....Has anyone tried
    "Star-Brite"finish restorer? This is sold for fiberglass boats-
    maybe this would work. 
    
    Bagel

     Thanks for the info.. Bagel, I think I will do a little test spot
    on the rod with what you have mentioned. It only makes sense that it
    should work. 
    
    Thanks for the input guys.
    Rich

	Does anyone out there know of a source for PERFECTION (brand) guides?
    
        Last night I had to replace another Fuji Hardloy guide on my
    	favorite surf rod. That's 2 in the last 2 months. Granted the
    rod sees a lot of work, but only from the beach. The guides have
    failed in the same manner both times: the steel ring cracks and
    cermaic insert ends up riding the line. 
    SInce the Perfections on my jetty rods have held up for a longer
    period, under much more severe conditions, I'm serious contemplating
    a re-wrap using Perfections. 
    
    BTW- I also remember that the shock rings on Perfections could be
    died with RIT, enabling one to produce a totally color-coordinated
    rod.
    
    Bagel
    

    Bagel,
    
      I know someone up here that could get them but he will charge
    double what they cost. Did you check clemans or midland catalogues?
    
    Bruce

    Bruce- 
    	I spoke to Midland, they don't carry Perfection any more...they
    were my original source. 
    	As for Clemens, et al...I have been sorely remiss the past few
    years in keeping my catalog collection up-to-date. Guess I'll have
    to invest in some stamps and start writing those $2 dollar checks
    for the 'free' catalogs.
    
    Rich
    

    Bagel,
    
      I have clemans at home, I will try to remember it tomorrow. What
    sizes do you need and what type?
    
    Bruce

Re -1
    Thanks, Bruce, but I'm not yet up to the point of ordering anything.
    Since I average one 'new build' per year, plus refurbs, I try to
    put together 1 bulk buy to keep me busy in January and February.
    To date, I've narrowed down my decision on the new build to: 
    a rod     ;-)
    
    Thanks 
    
    Bagel
    

    Bagel,
    
     I looked in clemans and did not see any perfection guides. BTW
    I though perfection were low and guides?? I am also in the
    process of deciding what rod to build this winter. With the new
    boat I am thinking of a building an IGFA chair tuna rod and maybe
    getting a portable fighting chair do next year I can after charlie
    with rod and reel.
    
    Bruce

Netcraft carries Perfection Guides.

Netcraft Co.
2800 Tremainsville Road
Toledo, Ohio 43613		(I don't have a phone number)

I've used these guys for other stuff and been happy with the products
and their service.

				Al

    Yo bagel,
    
      What is the correct phone number for Midland Tackle? The one
    earlier in this note is wrong. I seem to have lost my midland 
    catalogue and want to call for a new one.
    
    This should be a good time to bring this note back to life...Now
    that it is rod building season. How about it...who is building
    what?
    
    Bruce

    Yo Cap'n Bacala...
    
    	From the front of the '88 Midland Catalog:
    
    		1-800-521-0146  (ordering only, except NY, Alaska, Hawaii)
    
    		1-914-753-5440
    
    
    As to what I'm building:
    
    	I'M SOOOOOO CONFUSED!!!!!
    
    	Right now I want to build one of everything  :-)  
    
    	Most likely builds:  (another) 9' surf spinner (glass)
    				       10' graphite surf spin 
    				       7'  graphite 'red-fin' rod (again)
    					Long conventional surf rod
    					Very long surf spin
    			(shudders) F/W spin rod...IF I want to pay for
    					a license ;-) (and really risk
    						divorce)
    
    	Bagel	

    Thanks, a catalogue with my name on it is on the way. 
    
    First I am re-wrapping Walt's bamboo salmon rod, still havent got
    the guides for it yet. Second I am replacing the tip top on on of
    my cod rods with an aftco roller top. Then I start with the new
    stuff.
    
    1. I would like to build a rod for my wife...I hope this would heighten
    her interest in fishing and thus get me more fishing time. This
    would probably be a 7' spinning rod for blues (best chance to get
    her fishing is in the nice warm days of July and Aug). Probably
    glass with fuji hardloy guides.
    
    2. For myself, I am going to build the beefiest standup rod I can.
    I would like to find about a 6 1/2 foot blank with an 80-130 rating.
    I am going to put about a 12/0 senator on this and try to take
    a giant on it. I can use the rod either standing up with a harness
    or in a deck chair with a gimbal (this is why I would go 6 /12 feet
    instead of 5 1/2. This rod will have aftco rollers from stripper
    to tip top.
    
    3. If I have any money left another cod rod.
    
    Bruce

    RE-1
    
    Gee Bruce, you (and Walt) are brave  :-)....be REAL CAREFUL with
    that bamboo. The bugaboo here is the amount of tension on the wraps.
    It won't take too much to have the threads actually crush the shaft.
    I recommend a "snug" tension, and reliance on epoxy/varnish to keep
    things in place. (Varnish is probably the way to go to be "faithful"
    to the bamboo tradition).
    
    C'moooon, replacing a tip is a field repair...or at least routine
    maintenance.
    
    May I make a recommendation for your lovely (I'm sure) wife's rod?
    	well, I will anyway
    	Take a look at the Lamiglass MB84 series. This 7 footer comes
    in regular glass or S-glass, and several different action/powers.
    The best bet, based on the projected usage, might be the MB842F.
    I have one built as is for spinning, and it handles lures from about
    0.5 to 1.5 ounces with ease. It's a fairly light (weight) rod even
    when fully assembled, and matches nicely with a Penn 450. If you
    look around, this blank can be found in _colors_! In addition to
    'Lami-honey', I've seen it in white and black. The black has a 'spiral'
    finish, rather than smooth.
    If the stock blank is too fast or not powerful enough, the tip can
    be cut back some. I did one up as a conventional jigging stick by
    taking off 3 inches at the tip. This was a pretty powerful stick,
    mated with a Penn 940.(BTW- Idid this one in royal blue/gold/black
    on the honey blank and it looked super with the gold reel).
    Either way, this can be a good multi-purpose rod for the wife. She
    would be able to use HER ROD for everything from flounder to choppers,
    and still know she was fighting fish.
    
    Your rod sounds like a project ;-). I think there was one written
    up in the Fisherman last winter, based on a Sabre blank.
    Just one question here...(I've never done stand-up tuna)  Can one
    stand up with a 12/0 ????  ;-)
    
    3. I'm sure the money will be found.
    
    Bagel

    A 12/0 is big to standup with but people use 80 internationals which
    are as heavy I am sure. But to have a hope of landing a giant i
    think you need at least 600-800 yards of 80#. As I said the rod
    is a comprise, a true chair rod is to heavy and long to stand up
    and stroke a fish, but if I can get a little extra length to
    get the line over the transome I can sit down for a while.
    It is good stuff to think about over the winter...
    
    Bruce

I have a question on rod repair.  I have an old-style 6'6" ugly stick (SP1101)
and the supports on the tip are broken.  I have tied them down with mono
as a field repair but I'd like to put a new tip on it for the spring.  Can
I do this myself (I've never fixed a rod before)? or should I get someone
to do it for me (Who?  In the greater Nashua area).  The below picture may
help you understand the problem better.  Also, the ceramic insert in the eye
is lose as the plastic holding it in place is worn from 5 years of use.

Thanks in advance,
Tim

   _____
||/     \
||\_____/
||     /
||    /
||   /
||  /
|| /
||/ <-- The supports have come lose here.
||
||

    Tip tops are easy to replace. Just heat it gently until the epoxy
    becomes soft and slide off. Use a constant heat source that you
    can rotate and move the tip in and out of and as it heats up pull
    off with pliers (don't use a match!). Then take it to a tackle shop
    and get a matching on and put it on using 2 part 5 minute expoxy.
    I have jsut pulled the tip top of a cod rod and need to get the
    replacement, anyone have access to a #24 mildrum stainless tip?
    It sounds like you guide maybe a fuji hardloy or copy of one.
    
    Bruce

     Heat the tip very gently (!!!!), because too much heat (especially
    on graphite or graphite comp. rods can turn the fibers to mush.
    Use ferrule cement (available at tackle stores) instead of epoxy
    to re-tip. The epoxy requires too much heat to loosen, should you
    ever need to replace your new tip.
    
     If the ceramic shock ring is cracked on a guide, cut the guide off
    and bring it in to your shop so they can size a replacement. You
    can also find the size written on the foot of the guide (if it's
    as "Fuji" brand) in the form of a number (8, 10 etc.).
     
      --The Skoal Bandit

Okay, I get the idea.  Now, if this were your favorite rod, what would you use
to heat the tip up with?  I am planning to replace the whole tip which will
eliminate the ceramic shock ring altogether.  I actually found a broken top
1/5 of a rod while fishing one day, I'll have to check and see if that tip
is usable.

Thanks again,
Tim

    re: .55
    
    If it was *my* favorite rod...
    	Well, the books always recommend using an alcohol lamp.
    	But....I use a Bic lighter, with the flame turned low, held
    relatively far away. It is important that you keep the flame moving
    back and forth while you rotate the rod.
        That will get the old tip off.
    
    To install the new one, first, heat the Ferrule cement with the
    lighter until it is almost fluid. Smear this on the rod and slide
    the tip on. Make sure the tip is (at least) close to being lined
    up. Heat the tip again, very gently, to set the tip. At this point,
    you can make the final line-up. After the cement cools fully, the
    excess can be removed with a finger nail. 
    
    Rich

    Thanks for all the help on this subject.  I have successfully removed
    the old tip from my rod using an improvised alcohol lamp made from
    rubbing alcohol, a shot glass, tinfoil and some tissue wadding.
    (worked great!).  I also removed the tip off the broken rod piece
    I mentioned earlier and it appears to fit on my rod.  My final question
    is where (in greater Nashua area only, please!) can I buy ferrule
    cement?  Is this strictly a fishing/tackle store item or can I get
    it in a hardware store as well?
    
    Thanks for the help.
    
    Tight lines (is_this_possible_in_the_winter?__I_suppose_if_you_are_
    trolling_for_your_cat_it_might_be)
    
    Tim
    

     Zyla's or Hunter's (in New Boston).
    
    --The Bandit

Well Ed, 

You got me pegged.  The sad news is that the shot glass fell in the garbage
disposal and it ain't no shot glass no more.  Too bad, it was a nice, heavy
Umass one from my undergraduate days...Next time I'm in Amherst (MA) I'll have
to get another.  Now what will I use when I heat the ferrule cement toput
the new tip on??  I'll think of something.

Re: MacGuyver:  It is always a challenge to figure out what he's trying to do
before anyone else watching the show.  Since I have been interested in all
the physical sciences since my days of mr. wizard, I usually manage to do
this.

I'm 50% Irish and 50% Italian.

    I'm 50% English, 50% Irish, 50% Scottish, and 50% French Canadien...
    
    

     the Canuck must have done the math..."half you three come here"...
    
    --The Bandit.

    This Canuck always wanted a job with the Telephone Company, and
    when he finally got hired they sent him out on his first day to
    put in telephone poles. They showed him the ones put in the day
    before by another guy, and told him that they didn't expect him 
    to put in quite as many because he was new at it. Well, the end
    of the day comes, and they ask him how many he'd done. "Three",
    he says. "Three?? You should have at least been able to do five
    or six! The last guy did seven on his first day"! "Yeah", says the
    Canuck, "but did he put them in all the way???"
    
     

    Here's my winter project -
    
    I want to build a light-med saltwater trolling rod. - no wire - Something
    for jigging bass and dragging Hoochies/jigs/rappalas.  I had in
    mind using 20lb line +/- and a small penn reel.
    
    Question #1	- Is a roller tip out of the question ? I've never used
    		one, but I'm concerned that it would foul while jigging.
    
    #2		Suggestions on blanks - Unlike most of the charters
    		I've taken, I usually slow or stop the boat when fighing
    		a fish.  So I need a rod to handle the fish, not the
    		fish and the boat.
    
    #3		Grips - I've used cork and foam.  I like both but the
    		foam was easier to work with.  Any strong preferences?
    
    #4		I like the nylon reel seats - the last ones I used were
    		Fuji but they were on freshwater rods.  Any problem
    		using them in the salt ?
                        

    re: .65
    
    	First, a question: What kind of "jigging for bass" do you you
    do? Do you mean using Diamond Jigs or Bucktails? Do you jig while
    drifting, stemming the tide, or trolling? [Bet you thought this
    was going to be easy, huh? ;-)] 
    Since you specify  "no wire", does this eliminate trolling jigs?
    
    Some Answers:
    
    #1 Roller tips could be used, but a carboloy would work as well,
    with less maintenance. A roller tip would pretty much eliminate
    any chance of casting a jig (I think).
    
    #2 Blanks: graphite or glass? I think something in a 20 # class
    	might do the job here. There's a lot to choose from.
    
    #3 Grips: I would use foam. I dearly love cork, especially on a
    graphite rod, but it won't take the wear and tear of sliding in
    and out of rod holders. The major advantage of cork is its sensitivity.
    Since you'll be using a conventional reel, a thumb on the line will
    provide all the feel you'll need. Go with the foam.
    
    #4 I've used the Fuji seats on saltwater rods with no problems...but
    not (yet) in a trolling situation. I would probably go with chrome
    over brass. This may depend on the reel and blank being used. I'm
    not sure how big these seats come.
    
    Bagel
    

    What I ment by 'jigging' for bass is probably close to 'stemming the
    tide'.   The jig is worked out into a rip - either by trolling close
    or by holding the boat more or less stationary to the rip and letting 
    out line.  Once the jig is in the rip, jiging styles vary - Some
    raise the rod butt high, invert the tip and make short strong snaps.
    (Similar to the motion you'd use with a paddle)  Others -myself
    included - find this to be more like work and soon switch to other
    syles.
     
    These rods are heavy (30-40) and seem to have a fairly stiff
    butt/middle with a soft tip.                    
    
     I think what I want is a softer overall action. 
    
    I didnt follow your comment "no wire = no trolling with a jig".
    

    re no wire = no trolling with a jig
    
    alot of people troll witch or hair jigs for blue and stripers with
    wire line. the wire line gets the jig in the strike zone. You troll
    at about 3 knots, and jig at the same time.
    
    The Doctah

    I built a cod (jigging)  rod with a roller. The main disadvatage
    to rollers is their extra weight. They also cost more. I can toss
    a cod jig about 70ft with my roller top but then the jig weighs
    about a pound. You might want to try a 7 foot spinning blank and
    cut off the top 6 inches. I would use hyphalon (sp) grips and put
    a gimbel on it if you are going to troll. I used the fuji reel
    seat on my cod rod (6/0 senator reel) and had no problems. Your
    reel will be much smaller so you should be all set. If decide not
    to use the roller then just go with hardloy guides (remeber no wire!),
    otherwise you can use some mildrim stainless guide to match an
    aftco light roller. If you want a blank with more backbone but
    less sensitivty try a 20# trolling blank, this may cost a bit more
    also.
    
    Good luck.
    
    Capt. Codfish

    re: .67 &.68
    
    no wire=no trolling....
    
    The Doctah understood.... A common technique along the North Jersey
    shore is to troll lead-heads (bucktails) on wire. The proper technique
    calls for constant jigging. This is done using a very short short
    rod (~5' overall), and wire to get the jig down. The angler then
    stands facing aft, with the rod held at a 45 deg. angle across the
    body. The rod tip is then manipulated so that the jigging action
    is both up and down and fore and aft. This style of fishing is
    extremely tiring, but also very productive. If it sounds tough so-far,
    consider this...most guys who do this do it while standing up in
    a 12 - 14 foot tin boat on the ocean.
    
    Bagel
    

    The other day I was thumbing through the Cabela's catalog in the
    reading room, when I stopped to look at the selection of rod building
    kits. It seems as though they have quite an assortment, and the blanks
    are top-quality graphite - IM6 as I recall. The prices for bass
    spinning rod kits seemed quite reasonable, but they didn't go into
    detail about what else you might need besides what comes in their
    kits.
    
    I'd like to know if anyone else in this conference has built a rod
    from a Cabela's kit and also what kind of equipment do you need
    to wrap a rod. What is wrapping for anyway? Lots of rods in the stores
    don't seem to have any wrapping at all. I know that you can make
    a plain rod look pretty fancy with custom thread wrapping, but what's
    involved in this? It looks like it's tricky and requires special
    equipment.
        
    If it's not too time consuming, I might like to try making a rod over
    the winter, but I want to know what's involved before I get in over
    my head.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Ed
    

    
     I built a Cabela's kit rod a couple of winters ago,a 9'6" 
    fly rod for #6-7 line.The kit was pretty complete,the only
    additional things I needed was a flat and a rat tail file.The
    rod handles fairly well,butI havent compared it to a really
    good rod yet.This was the third rod I'd built.After the first,
    I also made a wooden rod wrapper like in the Cabela's catalog.
    I cant believe I built the first rod(an ultralight fibergass
    Fenwick)without it.I use only one color for wrapping,thats 
    agravating enough.
    
                     Mike who_will_build_another_soon.

    I can now turn out a rod in about 30 hours at the bench, this is
    with a motor and using multiple colors, triple wraps and a diamond
    wrap on the butt. Since I am doing this as a business now each rod
    is unique and must be perfect so it takes a little more time. If
    you only double wrap and just use two thread colors (over, under)
    you can cut down on the time considerably. Alot depends on the guides.
    The large guides (or rollers) on salt water rods take longer to
    wrap. The hardest part of building a rod is putting on the grips
    and reel seat. The wraps just take knowing a few 'tricks' and patience.
    The last part, putting on the polymer finish is critical to getting
    that perfect finish, you will need a low rpm motor to do this or
    stand there an rotate the rods every ten minutes for a couple of
    hours.
    
    Also I do not use kits since each rod is built to the owners specs....
    
    Bruce