Conference vmszoo::rc

    jim,
    
    glad to see you thinking l4 again.  i continue to enjoy my cub, its so
    reliable and fun to fly.  i'd like to build a nice one that i could
    take to scale fun flys at fields too small or rough for a warbird.
    
    i still think the st2500 is a great choice for this bird.  ignore those
    that say a big glo fuel engine is too expensive to run.  in the case
    of my jug, i should be so lucky to have fuel expense approach
    significant, and i can't beat the power to weight ratio.  in the case
    of the cub, you can fly at so slow a throttle setting you can stay up
    30+ minutes on a 16oz tank with plenty to spare.  you can literally
    take off and fly at just above idle - sounds great flying around at
    only 3k rpm.  only problem with the st2500 is its size (weight is no
    problem, add a bit of tailweight or move firewall back (careful of
    affect on prop hub postion relative to cowl).  i mounted mine sideways
    but dont have a cowl.  if i had a cowl the engine head would stick out.
    i'll opt for that over having the engine inverted and the muffler
    tightly packed in the cowl.
    
    also st2500's are amazingly cheap.  cheaper than an os 60 longstroke
    i believe.
    
    with rubber bands holding the wings to the fuse, an access panel may
    not be necessary if the cabin doors open.
    
    have fun
    kevin
    

I am in the process of building a Carl Goldburg Piper Cub.  I am 
going to build it as an "L4".  Does any one know where I can get 
any information on the color scheme/ squadron/ etc...?  I've checked
Janes, and other aircraft books.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.




HOGIE

    Hogie,
    
    Unless someone just happens to have a trove of info on a specific
    aircraft, it's difficult at times to simply pull an answer out of the
    hat for a question like yours.  As Alton Ryder indicated in his pointer
    to this topic, there are many commercial, mail-order aviation book
    houses around, perhaps on of the largest being: 
    
    			Zenith Books 
    			P.O. Box One
    			Osceola, 
    			WI     54020
    			Toll Free Order Hotline: 1-800-826-6600
    
    Essentiall, any in-depth history/bio of the Piper J3 Cub should contain
    pix of the Cub in its L4 warsuit.  Another possible soutrce is:
    
    			Scale Model Research (run by Bob Banka)
    			2334 Ticonderoga Way
    			Costa Mesa,
    			CA	       92626
    			Tel: (714) 979-8058
    
    Bob has over 3000 full color photo-paks available on just about any
    aircraft you could imagine and I'd almost bet money he'd have something
    for you on the L4.
    
    Other sources are a little more obscure but can produce a wealth of
    info.  Check out the aviation section of yer' local bookstores; many
    documentation gems await discovery in these establishments.  Many hobby
    shops also carry a line of this type book.  If they don't have a title
    specific to yer' needs, you can contact the publisher(s) of the books
    on hand and inquire into the L4.
    
    Bottom line, there's no pat answer for the quest for documentation. 
    Ultimately, it boils down to digging out the info on yer' own though
    using this notesfile as a resource is a good first step...I gathered
    quite a pile of data on the Lavochkin LA5FN/LA-7 by starting here.  So,
    if any of our noters can assist Hogie with his search for L4
    documentation, I'm sure he'll be ever grateful.
						 __
				|      |        / |\	   	       
      	         \|/		|______|__(o/--/  | \	   	       
      | |        00	       <|  ~~~  ____ 04 ---- | --------------------
    |_|_|        (O>o		|\)____/___|\_____|_/	   Adios amigos, Al
      |     \__(O_\_	        |	  |___/	 o	   (The Desert Rat)

>    			Scale Model Research (run by Bob Banka)
>    			2334 Ticonderoga Way
>    			Costa Mesa,
>    			CA	       92626
>    			Tel: (714) 979-8058

In a rather old catalog I see one listing that Bob has for the L4.
I will quote from the catalogue.

L-4 Observer - Olive W/star/bar.  N43RY. W/gear, strut, greenhouse,
    surface details, interior and instruments.  (*)1136/36 24.00

                                                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
                                                 this means:
                                                 * = 3 views available
                                                 1136 = stock number
                                                 36 photos in pack
                                                 $24.00 US price

Warning - since you are thinking of making a Cub into an L4.
Depending on how serious you are at this it may be a lot more work
than you think.  That is an L4 is not just a Cub with a different
paint job - they have more and different windows.  Take a look
at any add for Balsa USA and you can usually see pictures of their
1/4 scale J3 Cub and L4.  Alto they share most of the parts they
are different kits.

Also Bob Banka lists another L4B Grasshopper.  Again Olive but this
time with a light gray belly and invasion stripes.  37 pictures for
$27.50 or 16 pictures for $14.00.

I have no idea what the difference is between an Observer and a Grasshopper.
If you know - it might make a good trivia question!

Warning - my catalogue is not fresh so give Bob a call and make
it a point to ask general questions - like "What is the difference..."
"How many L4's do you have pictures of?", "Do you have any pictures
of a J3 in Olive Drab?" (I know he has many colors of J3s).
Bob will talk your ear off and help you decide what to do next.

I called him a couple of years ago and asked if he had any
info on a Berliner-Joyce P16.  He dug around for a few minutes
and told me there were none in any museum and he had a picture
and a 3 view that copied out of some book and mailed me - NO CHARGE.

You didn't say where you were located (or if you did I forgot) but
there are several L4's in museums.  1 each in FL,OH,OK, and CO.
There are L4B's in AL,OK.

If your close enough to any of those states and want full addresses
just send me mail or ask in here.

If you want to see a J3 in person - just go to ANY small airport
and if you don't find one outside ask someone.

P.S.  I discovered a nice L19 Cessna "Bird Dog" at a local airport
      being used as a glider tow plane.

Bye          --+--
Kay R. Fisher  |
---------------O---------------
################################################################################

Kay, you said there was an L4 in a museum in "CO"-- is that
Colorado by chance???  Heck, where is there an airplane museum in 
Colorado, least of all an L4.  All they have in museums around
here are Indians.

However, I do seem to remember one in the Liberal Kansas
museum...tho I don't think I took a picture of it.

>      <<< Note 1081.5 by CLOSUS::TAVARES "John--Stay Low, Keep Moving!" >>>
>                       -< Airplane Museum In Colorado? >-
>
>Kay, you said there was an L4 in a museum in "CO"-- is that
>Colorado by chance???  Heck, where is there an airplane museum in 
>Colorado, least of all an L4.  All they have in museums around
>here are Indians.

The L4 is in Denver at J.W. Duff Aircraft Salvage.  
  Over 500 Aircraft - Some Complete.  Mostly fuselage and wings.
  The L4 must be one of the complete ones:-)

Other places in Colorado.

Colorado Springs - U.S. Air Force Academy 
  B52 "Diamond Lil"

Colorado Springs - Edwards J. Paterson, Space Command Museum, Paterson AFB
  Several including a P40, P47.

Denver - Lowery Heritage Museum, Lowery AFB
  Several including a B52, B29 and a B18

Pueblo - Fred Weisbord Aircraft Museum.  Pueblo Memorial Airport
  Several including a B-29, F9F, and P2V.

Bye          --+--
Kay R. Fisher  |
---------------O---------------
################################################################################

    That must be Peterson AFB in the Springs, isn't it.  I never heard of
    Paterson except in NJ.  
    
    

>        <<< Note 1081.7 by ALLVAX::BRET "Crazy Hawaiian DTN 289-1604" >>>
>
>    That must be Peterson AFB in the Springs, isn't it.  I never heard of
>    Paterson except in NJ.  

Yes - the book was correct - I typed it wrong.

Bye          --+--
Kay R. Fisher  |
---------------O---------------
################################################################################
    
    

    Does anyone have the current telephone number for Balsa USA?
    
    Thanks,
    
    Ollie
    

    Balsa Usa   1-800-BALSAUS   From Latest RCM
    
    
    Charlie
    

    Thanks for the phone # Charlie.  I called them and got the following
    information on the Piper L4:
    
    Span = 9'
    Fuse = 68"
    Wing area = 1,610 sq. in.
    Wing Cord = 16"
    Weight = 9 3/4 to 13 lbs.
    Engine = .60 - .90 2 stroke
             .90 to 1.20 4 stroke
    
    12/23 Price = $112.95
    
    Balsa USA
    P.O. Box 164
    Marinette, WI 54143
    
    
    Ollie
    

    If you don't mind an "older" model, Jim C. has one he's been building
    for a few years now. I think he wants it to be as scale as possible
    INCLUDING AGE.........8^)

    Is Jim working in 1/4 scale years or 1:1 years on his ageing process?
    
    Let's see - three years * 4  he's back to about 1981.  Another 15 years
    and he'll be back to scale date for an L-4.   :-)
    
    
    

  Boy...you take a liiitttlllleeee bit of time building ONE airplane and they
jump all over you!  I'm just taking my time so the plane comes out right!  I'm
also testing the affect of cold and time on the UFO glue.  So far the UFO isn't
holding up well at all!!!!!!


  Well Ollie, it's that very same plane that I've been 'building' for...ah....
a SHORT time now (as compared to the age of mother Earth that is...).

  This is an INTENSE kit to build!  You get some plans (that don't match from
view to view) and about 20 pages of typed instructions.  It takes a while to 
figure out some of what they're trying to tell you to do.  If you have questions
I'll do my best to help you out.  

  My L4 is completely framed up...and has been that way for 2 years now.  I'm
serious when I say that the UFO glue isn't holding up!  MANY of the glue joints
are just falling apart.  I'm going to have to go back and re-glue everything
with Zap-a-Gap or epoxy.

  I suggest you get a Miter Master for this plane.  That's one of those sanding
blocks that allows you to sand precise angles.  You'll need that to get a good
fit in all those sticks you'll be cutting!

  And make sure you have LOTS of space to build it!  This sucker is BIG!!!


                 Have fun!


                     Jim