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Conference vmsnet::hunting$note:hunting

Title:The Hunting Notesfile
Notice:Registry #7, For Sale #15, Success #270
Moderator:SALEM::PAPPALARDO
Created:Wed Sep 02 1987
Last Modified:Tue Jun 03 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1561
Total number of notes:17784

715.0. "More Big Bore" by NRADM::GERMANO () Fri Aug 03 1990 14:51

    HOHWY, I appreciate the info on Royal Arms. I'll send off for
    infomation from them this week. Funny, I don't remember hearing about
    them. How did you come across them? I sent for and received A-Square's
    cataloge. I was interested in the line of heads. I deer hunt in Maine
    when I can. I usually take my .375. Although I have'nt had the occasion
    to shoot at any Whitetails with it, I though a head that was a rapid
    expander would be the best. Either that or aim for bone! A's Lion loads
    sound like they'd work well. I've been loading Hornady's 270 grain
    round nose. They shoot real well. I do very little shooting at black
    bull's eye's. My Whitworth has freight train sights. No adjustments
    other than tapping or filing. Unfortunatley, the 100 yard leaf hit
    around 6 in. low @50 yards and never really recovers. So I use the 200
    yard leaf. It's dead on @0->75 and around 3 inched high @100. Since I'm
    already sighted in, I shoot mostly at archery style deer targets. Much
    more realistic and satisfing when your first shoot of the day is on the
    money. 
    I'd really like to build a .400 bore. Not for hunting as much as pride
    in ownership. Shooting big bores is always fun. Working up loads with
    those big bullets excite me!
    
    I don't know what if any role the Enfield 17's played in Military
    stuff. I do know that these and Brno's are/were the "usual" standard
    for building large bore rifles. I know there's others but they don't
    come to mind. I understand that some of the old mediums used for large
    bore rifles need to be re-case hardened. I understand their too brittle
    in their original form and could'nt take the pressures. Speaking of
    pressures,does anyone know if Cordite powder is still available?
    
    Recently my brother had to oportunity to fire A-Square's .416 Rem. up
    at Dudley Sportman's club. He's not a big bore buff so he declind the
    offer. He said their a massive rifle. I wonder why! 
    
    Have you seen the Weatherby film of Roy's kid shooting Cape Buffalo
    with their .416. They used muzzle breaks so the recoil was manageable.
    But when you see the bullet hit home you can just imagine the energy!
    
    Pg
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715.1DEPOT::CABRALFri Aug 03 1990 15:0411
    RE:0
     Interesting stuff, that cordite. It's not actually powder at all. It
    looks just like thin spaghetti, and burns clean, without hardly a trace
    of residue. I believe it was common mostly to British manufacturers.
     I had a fellow at Kittery Trading post demonstrate it once, but
    I think it was his own personal supply that he had on hand to impress
    people like me.
     I've never seen any around, but I've never actively looked for it,
    either. Maybe you should let your fingers do the walking.
    
    Bob
715.2DECALP::HOHWYJust another ProgrammerMon Aug 06 1990 11:1344

	Pg, I came across the Royal Arms in an add in Guns magazine.
	This publication seems to place a lot of emphasis on custom
	built guns (both the wallhanger/multi-million-$$$-type and
	the more "practical" ones). So one tends to find a lot of
	advertisement from companies offering related services.

	I am not sure that we are of the same opinion on bullet
	performance. I subscribe to the "penetration" view, you
	seem to belong to the "expansion" school :-). It would
	certainly be interesting to see how the A-Square Lion 
	loads performs on Whitetail... Hmmm, I would think you
	ran a pretty good risk of loosing a LOT of meat. In
	particular if you were not presented with a broadside
	shot, or if bullet placement was not 100%. But I'll bet
	the 375 H&H gets the job done :-). You really *are* a
	big bore fan! (Or is that another .375 caliber ? There is
	a .375 Win, correct?)

	I think the A-Square is massive because 1) they wanted the
	weight up - makes the big bores easier to shoot 2) they
	have designed their own stock intended to cut felt recoil.
	I have also heard the comment that the stock looks something
	like a tree trunk with the bark taken off :-). Certainly not 
	a "mountain" rifle! I'll let you know when I get mine. I 
	really wonder how it feels like shooting one of those cannons? 

	Those Weatherby chamberings are always something different,
	aren't they. The more horse power the better!! How would
	you like to try and fire a .460 Weatherby Magnum ! Their 
	.416 seems to be the typical Weatherby turbo-charge job.
	All the other 416 chamberings seem to aim for around 2400
	fps with a 400 grs bullet, but not Weatherby: 2700 fps ....
	That should generate some noticable recoil...
	
	Oh, by the way, Pg, do you distinguish between the commands
	"WRITE" and "REPLY" in NOTES? Sometimes we seem to start
	a new note at a slightly unexpected place. Not that it matters
	to me, but maybe it is a bit confusing for future references.

	Enough for now, take care.

							- Mike
715.3big bullets = big holesNRADM::GERMANOWed Aug 08 1990 19:0120
    Mike, I don't know what my school of thought I might be. I DO know that
    any cartridge I'd use for deer sized game would demonstrate complete
    penetration except possibly when hit end-to-end. There's not much meat
    in the way when a deer is hit behind the shoulder. Rib bones break quit
    easily even when hit with smallish well constructed bullets. I hit a
    4X4 mulie out west. I hit him just alittle too high. But that 150 grain
    .308 certainly did it's job. It did'nt make a big difference to him
    either! I think he ran about a foot. 
    
    Recoil does'nt bother me so I believe I'd shoot anything. I know my
    .375 isn't considered a benchrest rifle. After 20 rounds from the bench
    you begin to realize that. .460's, why not. I've been hit harder over a
    girl! Those rifles shot in Weatherby's movie had muzzel breaks. It made
    those rifles look very manageable. Let me know how you make out with
    yours.
    
    Ijust type in reply at the prompt for reply. That puts me at the top of
    the buffer. Or write at prompt will create a note. 
    
    Pg
715.4DECALP::HOHWYJust another ProgrammerThu Aug 09 1990 07:0527
	Pg, seems like we think alike anyway! I have been trying to
	get some of the new Barnes X-bullets in cal. .30 for some
	time now. They are supposed to be EXCELLENT: deep penetration,
	no core seperation (no core at all in fact :-) and yet
	expand reliably on thin skinned animals. Unfortunately my
	low price supplier (Midsouth) has problems obtaining merchandise
	from Barnes, so no luck this far. I might just get desperate
	enough to buy some at full price from Barnes (assuming they
	have some?) even though they are expensive. 

	Hey, Man, you really dig those big boomers! .460... not for
	me thank you. Still, if one got the chance ... I would take
	some courage though. I think you are right about the muzzle
	breaks, though some people think that the price you pay
	in noise and blast is too high. Maybe the thing to do is to
	use the break on the range and take it off in the field. 
	No one seems to notice recoil much with a trophy buck in 
	his sights :-)

	The write/reply seems to be what I use.. Ah well, doesn't
	really matter anyway.

	A good day to you.


						- Mike
715.5more on Barnes XSA1794::CHARBONNDin the dark the innocent can't seeThu Aug 09 1990 10:324
    I picked up some Barnes X-bullets (7mm 140 gr) cost was
    about $23 for 50. Expensive, but when considered against the 
    cost of licenses, fees, vacation time, and the possibility
    of losing an animal with a lesser bullet, worth it.
715.6DECALP::HOHWYJust another ProgrammerThu Aug 09 1990 11:5318
	I managed to get some Barnes X-bullets in .416 cal, 350 grs
	from Midsouth (cost: $ 20.92 for 50). But the .30 cal, 165
	grs ($ 14.29 for 50) have eluded me sofar. I suppose I have
	just been too mean yet to go and pay the full price for them
	:-). Midsouth keep threatning with taking Barnes out
	of their catalog if they don't deliver their merchandise.
	I keep telling them to bear with Barnes. After all they
	are a small operation. I once called them, spoke to a real
	nice lady who told me that they had somthing like 6 employees
	in total. So they are not really a big time operation.

	One of these days I'll just take the plunge and buy the
	X at full price and be done with it. They sound like they
	are worth it!


							- Mike