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Conference 7.286::fddi

Title:FDDI - The Next Generation
Moderator:NETCAD::STEFANI
Created:Thu Apr 27 1989
Last Modified:Thu Jun 05 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2259
Total number of notes:8590

1452.0. "CDDI vs TPDDI supporting vendors?" by CGOS01::DMARLOWE (Have you been HUBbed lately?) Thu Sep 22 1994 18:25

    Just when you thought the battle of proprietary vs standards was
    all but over, this happens.
    
    A customer of mine is looking at putting some FDDI in.  They have
    been talking to Cisco and since they own Crescendo guess what they
    are pushing?  CDDI.
    
    I have told the customer about proprietary vs standard TPDDI and
    is more or less convinced.  He is asking though what vendors support
    the CDDI vs what vendors support the Green Book.
    
    Any have a list of how few vendors support the CDDI?
    
    And a list that supports the TPDDI (which should be everyone else)?

    dave
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1452.156821::STEFANIHave the # for the Mars Observer?Thu Sep 22 1994 22:2352
    >>Just when you thought the battle of proprietary vs standards was
    >>all but over, this happens.
    
    The battle's over.  No one won...well, Cisco won a little bit.
    
    >>A customer of mine is looking at putting some FDDI in.  They have
    >>been talking to Cisco and since they own Crescendo guess what they
    >>are pushing?  CDDI.
    
    Since "CDDI" came out as a term for Crescendo's NRZ-encoded standard
    for running FDDI over UTP, we've been pushing the issue with customers
    by asking whether they mean the ANSI standard or the proprietary
    Crescendo standard.
    
    Basically, here's how I see it:
    
    	- "TP-PMD" is the proper short name for the ANSI standard, but it
          doesn't roll off the tongue as well as "CDDI".  Most lay people
          don't know the difference and for all intents and purposes,
          "CDDI" has now become the defacto name for the "ANSI TP-PMD"
          standard.  Reading any trade rag on the subject will convince
          you of this.  Customers interchange "CDDI" with "TP-PMD" all
          the time.
        - Since "CDDI" was tied to Crescendo for so long and NONE of the
          competing companies want them to have a leg up, most competing
          companies (like Digital) raise the question on which standard
          the customer wants.  As soon as we suggest that "CDDI" is
          proprietary, their immediate reaction is "Oh no, we want the
          standard stuff".
        - Crescendo has updated most if not all of their "CDDI" gear
          to the ANSI standard.  So even though there is older
          CDDI-standard gear out there, their new stuff should be
          compliant.
    	- Since we're not going to convince customers to start saying
          "TP-PMD" instead of "CDDI", let's be slimey and raise the
          concern that the gear that they buy from Cisco/Crescendo may
          or may not be standard compliant.  OK, so it's slimey...but
          Cisco already has an advertising budget that kills, so let's
          at least try to take advantage of this weakness and get
          customers to buy our standards-compliant gear.
    
    >>I have told the customer about proprietary vs standard TPDDI and
    >>is more or less convinced.  He is asking though what vendors support
    >>the CDDI vs what vendors support the Green Book.
    
    Forget the Green Book, SDDI, or the proprietary CDDI standard.  Almost
    two dozen interoperating TP-PMD products were demoed last year at
    Interop from companies like Digital, IBM, Crescendo, SGI, 3Com, NPI,
    UB, SysKonnect, etc.  Anyone who's anyone today that builds FDDI over
    copper products adheres to the ANSI TP-PMD standard.

       - Larry
1452.2Just to reinforce things a bit56821::B_CRONINFri Sep 23 1994 14:3927
    
    I agree with everything Larry said with one exception - questioning 
    cisco's current product set.
    
    I don't think that we have any reason to trash them - they were part 
    of the interoperability tests, and we all worked well together. We 
    will look ill informed to suggest othewise. If they attack us on
    specifics, then I'll take off the gloves, but I'll do it point by
    point,not as a blanket attack.
    
    As I said, Larry is correct on his statements, and just to reinforce 
    them, here goes:
    
    	1) TP-PMD is the ANSI standard
    	2) CDDI is the well known name, for TP-PMD , and Crescendo's 
    	   current product set meets the standard to the best of our knowledge. 
    	   I would point out the distinction, and then call it wahtever 
    	   they like! 
    	3) It is no longer correct to attack cisco/crescendo (crisco?) 
    	   about the proprietary nature of CDDI - I probably erred in not
    	   updating people on that topic. 
    	4) The Green book is dead. 
    	5) SDDI probably will survive, but no one asks us for it. 
    	6) TP-PMD also supports 150 ohm STP, so if asked about SDDI, 
    	   tell them that its not TP-PMD compliant. That is a true 
    	   statement. Whether we sell product for FDDI on 150 ohm 
    	   cable is a different question. 
1452.356821::STEFANIHave the # for the Mars Observer?Fri Sep 23 1994 19:4113
    >>	3) It is no longer correct to attack cisco/crescendo (crisco?) 
    >>	   about the proprietary nature of CDDI - I probably erred in not
    >>	   updating people on that topic. 
    
    Of course you're right Bill, that's not a good way of doing business,
    but I just hate seeing Cisco get a leg up.  :-)
    
    However, we should definitely make it clear to our customers that we
    do support the ANSI standard with all of our new hub, switch, and
    adapter products even though we still (?) have some Green Book standard
    support in our older FDDI gear.  
    
       - Larry