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Conference unifix::sailing

Title:SAILING
Notice:Please read Note 2.* before participating in this conference
Moderator:UNIFIX::BERENS
Created:Wed Jul 01 1992
Last Modified:Mon Jun 02 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2299
Total number of notes:20724

729.0. "Boat Dreaming/Buying" by DECWET::OMEARA () Thu Jan 14 1988 21:58

    It's Boat Show time in Seattle, and I'm looking wistfully at used
    liveaboards.  What is a good rule of thumb for the percentage to
    take off when making an offer?  I've heard vague rumors that you
    can knock off anywhere from 30-40%, depending on the type of boat,
    how long it has been on the market, owner motivation, etc.  Can
    anyone give me some more definitive feedback?
    
    Thanks,
    
    -Marj

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729.1Transforming Dreams Into RealityCHARON::HOLZERMon Jan 18 1988 16:4343
A few thoughts about your query.....

UNDERSTAND WHAT YOUR NEEDS IN A BOAT ARE.
Things to consider might include size, price range, performance and your
own cruising goals. You didn't mention what type of boat you are considering..
but a barge in a marina is one thing and an offshore cruiser is another.

UNDERSTAND THE MARKET FOR VESSELS OF THAT TYPE
Presently there is a glut of sailboats on the market and you can get some
great values. You might read the ads in the back of the boating magazines
to get an idea of what the range of prices are.
Be sure to consider the quality, condition, age, equipment and present location.

ONCE YOU UNDERSTAND YOUR NEEDS AND THE MARKET it might be safe to go to a show
(with a checkbook in you pocket).

LIVEABOARD BOATS GENERALLY ARE NOT A COMMODITY
	Its easy to say you should get 50% off of wrinkled tomatoes or 
20% off of a new car. Realize that you might be buying someone's home.
A home that has provided safety under adverse conditions and helped
someone realize a dream.
	If you would like a rule of thumb...an offer of 10% below what you
feel the boat is actually worth based on the boats condition and market value
might allow you negotiate well. The asking price might be inflated by the amount
that the owner has invested and the glut of used sailboats on the market...
knowing the market ahead of time is critical.

MAKE ANY OFFER CONTINGENT ON A SURVEY, SEA TRIALS, FINANCING AND YOUR ABILITY
 TO FIND A PLACE TO KEEP THE BOAT.
	Depending on where you live, finding dockage that will allow you
to liveaboard can be difficult. Some areas have waiting lists of several years.

ONE FINAL THOUGHT.....
	 Before you make a major financial commitment to a liveaboard boat
realize that the romantic vision of what life might be like on a liveaboard
boat is quite different from the reality. Consider chartering a boat of the
type you're considering for a few weeks prior to taking the leap.

			Good luck...............Rich




729.2modifications neededPULSAR::BERENSAlan BerensMon Jan 18 1988 19:4318
Some thoughts: 

Production boats are designed for casual use by casual sailors.
Relatively few owners ever really equip their boats well or make the
modifications needed to make their boats safe and comfortable in any
weather or sea condition. 

A comfortable liveaboard boat has almost certainly been greatly modified
by its owner(s), past and present. The modifications probably took much
thought, time, effort, and expense to implement and make the boat more
valuable. I would expect that a liveaboard boat would be priced at, and
should sell for, considerably more than a non-liveaboard sistership. 
There are a number of good books available that describe modifications 
that make a boat more liveable. Reading them will give an idea of the 
amount of effort it takes to make a boat truly liveable. And I would 
suspect that most owners did the work themselves, yard labor rates being 
what they are. 

729.3What kind of sailing?EXPERT::SPENCERTue Jan 19 1988 15:115
When you say "live-aboard", do you mean live aboard under sail, or do you 
mean live aboard at the dock with relatively light duty weekend sailing?

John.

729.4IT ALL DEPENDSWILVAX::LANEThu Feb 25 1988 21:159
    SEE NOTE 732.  I THINK YOU HAVE A NEIGHBOR IN SEATTLE WHO IS
    ALSO LOOKING FOR A LIVEABOARD.    
    
    MY BOAT IS FOR SALE AND I'M NOT PARTICULARLY INTERESTED IN REDUCING
    THE PRICE AT ALL BUT THAT'S BECAUSE I'M NOT SURE I CAN LIVE WITHOUT
    IT !  IT'S IMPORTANT TO KNOW WHAT'S MOTIVATING THE SELLER BEFORE
    YOU START NEGOTIATING.