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Conference unifix::sailing

Title:SAILING
Notice:Please read Note 2.* before participating in this conference
Moderator:UNIFIX::BERENS
Created:Wed Jul 01 1992
Last Modified:Mon Jun 02 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2299
Total number of notes:20724

330.0. "Loose Shrouds" by COIN::ADLEMAN () Tue Jun 03 1986 22:36

    This year, on my check out cruise I found that my jib vibrated on
    close haul sailing.  The foresstay was loose and I thought that
    the boat yard didn't tighten my turnbuckles enough.  Too my dismay
    both the forestay and backstay turnbuckles were already fully  
    tightened!  Could my stays have streched that much over the winter
    or gone unoticed by me last summer?
    
    Anyone have any ideas or comments?  I am looking for a quick, easy,
    and inexpensive fix to this problem.  My boat is a Hunter 34.
    
    thanks
    
    Henry
    

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330.1Shrinking Stainless ShroudsIMBACQ::SIEGMANNWed Jun 04 1986 13:319
    I have noticed that, during the winter, my shrouds tighten quite
    a bit due to temperature. I have taken to loosening them almost
    an inch... I expect that if one took the time to figure out the
    temp vs. length of 40' of stainless you'd come up with some interesting
    figures. As I have a wooden boat I don't normally maintain as tight
    shrouds as fiberglass boats can and don't know if, after shrinkage,
    the stainless has a 'memory'..
    Ed

330.2Rig not tuned or more serious?NECVAX::RODENHISERWed Jun 04 1986 20:2121
  You didn't mention how the boat was stored for the winter. I gather
  that the mast was not unstepped. Hopefully all the rigging was
  loosened. There are considerable distortions and stresses that a
  hull and deck are under when they're not supported by water. You may
  very well have stretched things too far, especially if you didn't
  have some sort of support under the bow and/or stern.  
  Do you have any sort of specific rig tuning instructions from
  Hunter? I think that there is an old note somewhere on the subject.
  It sounds like you may need to loosen everything and start from scratch
  by first making sure that everything is perpendicular, then deal
  with forestay/backstay tensions along with whatever might be
  necessary to pre-tension (bend) the mast. It may be that your
  problem is caused by something other than tension on the stays.
  Does the mast look OK otherwise? Any crooked "S" bends?
  Hopefully you're just out of tune and don't have hull distortion
  or stretched rig.
  
  John
  
   

330.3NO ANSWER.COIN::ADLEMANFri Jun 13 1986 01:413
    I am answering myself.  I really want to read my reply.
    

330.4More on rig tuningNECVAX::RODENHISERMon Jun 16 1986 16:5717
    My new boat was commissioned late last week and rig tuning was
    particularly critical as the mast is a Hood Stowaway. Too much bend
    and they don't furl, etc. On my maiden voyage from Bend over to
    Block it was readily apparent that I didn't have enough tension
    on the forestay. Fortunately I was attending the Sabre Regatta
    and there were factory engineers available to look the situation
    over.
    It appears that the mast needed more 'rake'. Before bending anything,
    the masthead should have been leaning 12 inches aft of perpendicular.
    So despite proper tensions on all the rest of the rig and proper
    bend I still wasn't tuned. One interesting tidbit which maybe should
    have been 'intuitively obvious' to me but wasn't is: with a mast
    of my general length, a two inch change at the backstay turnbuckle
    affects the masthead position by nine inches.

    John

330.5NOT TO WORRYCSSE::GARDINERFri Dec 19 1986 17:5219
    Check out my comments in note 8.  Standing rigging must be tuned
    every year, if not more often.  Get together with your Yardman and
    discuss how they set it up for you when the boat was commissioned.
    WRITE IT DOWN!  It is too easy to mix-up the stay and shroud
    adjustments.
    
    I have a stay tension meter that I use to check initial setting
    and then check it several times during the seasin.  If I find that
    situatuions change and that last year's tuning doesn't seem to be
    the same, I will adjust my rig until it sails like I want it to
    and write down the new tensions in my log.
    
    The truth is that sailing feel is not a matter of rig adjustment,
    rig adjustment is a result of sailing feel.  And feel changes as
    your experience and situations change.  Don't expect everything
    to remain constant, whether it's hardware or expertise.
    
    

330.6another wayPULSAR::BERENSAlan BerensFri Dec 19 1986 19:5537
Our boat has Navtec rod rigging -- oh such lovely stuff -- and a hull
quite resistent to bending. Three springs ago we spent a long, breezy,
and very tiring afternoon tuning our cutter rig -- headstay, forestay,
backstay, upper shrouds, intermediate backstays, forward lower shrouds,
and aft lower shrouds. This was most definitely not my idea of sailing
fun. Eventually, we got it right, mast bend and all. 

At the end of the summer I used an 0-6" dial micrometer to measure the 
gaps between the upper and lower parts of the turnbuckles. The micrometer 
reads to .001". The last two springs after stepping the mast I have
simply reset the turnbuckle gaps to the same spacing as before. Since a
half turn is .025" or so, it is easy to reset the turnbuckles. (Assuming
that the standing rigging hasn't changed length and the hull hasn't
changed shape, resetting the turnbuckle gaps to the same as last year is
equivalent to resetting the rig tension to the same as last year. I
already owned the micrometer.) Both years sailing tests showed no
further twiddling was needed. 

From this I can draw one or more of three conclusions:

  1. Navtec rod doesn't stretch much and returns to a consistent length 
  when loads are removed.

  2. Our hull hasn't changed shape in the last three years.

  3. I am an inept sailor who can't recognize a rig needing adjustment.

I tend to think all three of these possibilities are more or less true.
Even if a little twiddling is needed, resetting the turnbuckle gaps gets 
you very close (a turn or two) to the right tuning. This can make tuning 
a pleasant part of a spring sail.

By the way, I have yet to see a yard set up a rig properly. In fact, I 
don't see how they possibly could unless they, the workers, sailed the 
boat. I now have the yard crane set the mast on its keel step and I do 
all the work from then on. Less cost to me and the job is done right.