Conference turris::cooks

                                 ICING???
    
    Does anyone out there know the difference between icing and 
    frosting??? 
    
    Also any recipie's for white icing/frosting???
    
                                           mjw

    I would call a cake topping "icing" if it is basically powdered
    sugar mixed with some liquid, used to glaze the cake, and "frosting"
    if it has some fat in it (like butter) to make a fluffy topping.
    But then, I may be wrong: I seldom bake cakes.

    When I was taking cake decorating classes we were told Frosting
    is what you cover the cake with and icing is the stiff stuff you
    decorate it with.  
    
    Bernice

As requested, some recipes - courtesy of the FANNIE FARMER COOKBOOK and
my collection of goodies over the years:

			CONFECTIONER'S FROSTING

This is the traditional "wedding cake white" frosting used to decorate
cakes.  It can be tinted any color you wish, and it never gets dry.

1/3 cup (3/4 dL) vegetable shortning
1/8 teaspoon salt
approx. 2 cups (1/2 L) confectioner's sugar
approx. 2 Tablespoons cream

cream shortning and salt together, then beat in the sugar.  Stir in
the cream and beat well, adding more sugar or more milk to get the
desired consistency.  This will frost an 8 inch, 2 layer cake.

			PORTSMOUTH FROSTING

4 Tablespoons melted butter
1/4 cup (1/2 dL) cream
1 teaspoon vanilla or rum
approx. 3 cups confectioner's sugar

Mix butter, cream, and vanilla or rum together in a bowl.  Slowly beat in
the sugar until thick and creamy.  This will frost a two layer 8 or 9 inch
cake.

			ROYAL FROSTING

1 cup (1/4 L) confectioner"s sugar
1/4 teaspoon cream of tartar
1 egg white (from extra large egg)

mix all ingredients in a deep bowl.  Add 1/3 cup boiling water while
beating at high speed.  Continue to beat for 6 to 10 minutes until
the frosting is thick enough to stand in peaks.  


			BUTTER FROSTING

8 Tablespoons butter
1 egg yolk
2 cups (1/2 L) confectioner's sugar
1 teaspoon vanilla

Beat butter until light and creamy.  Stir in egg yolk and continue to beat
while adding the sugar 2 tablespoons at a time.  Beat in vanilla.  Beat
mix until light and fluffy.  Frost a 13" X 9" sheet cake or two layer
9" cake generously.


		TRADITIONAL BUTTER CREAM FROSTING

1 cup (200 g) sugar
1 egg yolk
1/2 pound chilled butter

boil the sugar and 1/2 cup water in a heavy bottomed pan without stirring
until the mixture reaches 240 degrees F. (medium soft ball stage) While
the sugar syrup is cooking, beat egg yolk well.  slowly pour the syrup
over the beaten yolk, beating constantly.  Beat in small bits of the
cold butter until it is all incorporated.  Continue to beat until the
frosting is of spreading consistency.  Generous amount for 2 layer 9"
cake.

	This may become:

		chocolate - melt 8 ounces semi-sweet chocolate and
                            add after the butter is incorporated.

		coffee - add 4 teaspoons instant coffee to the frosting
			 after the butter has been added.

	 	rum mocha - add 3 tablespoons rum and 4 teaspoons
			    instant coffee after the butter has been added.


			7 MINUTE FROSTING

1 and 1/2 cups sugar
1/4 teaspoon cream of tartar
1/8 teaspoon salt
2 egg whites
2 teaspoons vanilla

mix sugar, cream of tartar, salt, egg whites, and 1/4 cup water in a
pot or bowl over simmering water.  beat steadily over low heat with
an electric mixer until the frosting stands in peaks...approx. 5 to 7
minutes...no more.  Remove from heat and continue beating until of
spreading consistency.  Beat in vanilla.  

	This can become:

		Caramel - omit vanilla.  Substitute 1 cup dark brown
			  sugar for 1 cup of the white sugar.

		coconut - stir in 1/2 cup shredded coconut before
			  frosting.

		lemon or orange - omit vanilla.  Substitute lemon or
			          orange juice for water.  Add 1 teaspoon
				  lemon or orange rind before spreading.

		Peppermint - omit vanilla.  Add 1/2 teaspoon oil of
			     peppermint (green food coloring is optional).

And for variety, fillings:

			BASIC CREAM FILLING

1 cup (1/4 L) whole milk
1/2 cup (100 g) sugar
3 tablespoons flour
1/8 teaspoon salt
2 egg yolks slightly beaten
2 teaspoons vanilla

Heat milk until very hot, but not boiling (I use double boiler for this).
Mix sugar, flour, and salt together in a bowl.  stir in the hot milk,
and beat until well blended.  Pour back into the pan, and continue stirring
vigorously over low heat for 4 - 5 minutes until very thick and smooth.
Add egg yolks and cook for a few more minutes (still stirring).  Cool,
stirring from time to time, then stir in the vanilla.  This is a fine
filling for a chocolate butter cream covered cake, and fills cream puffs
or other pastries.


			CHOCOLATE WHIPPED CREAM FILLING

4 ounces (115 g) unsweetened chocolate
2 tablespoons butter
1 cup (1/4 L) heavy cream
2 cups (1/2 L) confectioner's sugar
1/8 teaspoon salt

melt chocolate and butter together in a small pan or bowl over simmering
water.  combine the cream, 1 cup of the sugar, and salt in a bowl.
Add the chocolate and butter mixture, beating all the time.  Beat while
adding the sugar (slowly) for approx. 10 minutes.  



			FRENCH STRAWBERRY FILLING

1 egg white
1/8 teaspoon salt
1 cup (1/4 L) heavy cream
1/3 cup confectioner's sugar
1 teaspoon vanilla
1/2 cup mashed strawberries

Beat egg white until foamy, add salt, and continue beating until stiff but
not dry.  Beat cream separately until it forms soft peaks, then slowly
beat in the sugar and vanilla.  Fold egg whites into cream mixture. and
then fold in crushed berries.

    HELP!  I (foolishly) volunteered to bake my sister's wedding cake.	
    She and her fiance not being the usual sort of folks, they have
    requested the following:

    A hazelnut cake with cherry filling with
    a Grandmarnier butter-cream frosting

    Does anyone have a recipe for any of that?  Or how about a hint
    of where to start looking.  (i've been haunting book store's cookbook
    sections lately).  Many thanks to any who can help.

    edith

    A hazelnut cake with cherry filling with
    a Grandmarnier butter-cream frosting

Any recipe for walnut cake can be converted to hazelnut with good results as
the nuts are approx. the same fat content.  Bake 1/2 recipe to taste test and
adjust spices as needed.

The Grand Marnier butter cream recipe can be improvised from the classic
buttercream frosting recipe (I put one in a reply to a note somewhere
in this notes file....look for DIR/TITLE=FROSTING or ICING and my reply has
a bunch of recipes, one of which is a standard buttercream which can be
seasoned with Brandy or Grand Marnier or chocolate and one of which is
a filling recipe which can be made to work with cherries rather than
strawberries)

Let us know the final recipes you improvise!

Frosting recipes are in note 1089.3

Try making the buttercream frosting and beating in approx. 3 tablespoons
Grand Marnier.

for the cherry filling, I'd use dark sweet cherries for flavor, but the
marischino cherry is a prettier color..nice and red. 

    I HAVE BEEN READING MARTH STEWART'S WEDDINGS.
    
    SHE DEVOTES A CHAPTER TO VARIOUS TYPES OF CAKES, AND INCLUDES A
    BUTTERCREAM FROSTING.  THEY ARE VERY UNUSUAL.  SHE ALSO GIVES TIPS
    ON HOW TO FROST, ETC.  IF YOU WANT A LIST OF ANY OF HER TYPES OF
    CAKES, OR RECIPES PLEASE CONTACT ME DIRECTLY (CPO::), OR GO TO YOUR
    LIBRARY AND CHECK OUT HER BOOK.
    
    
    

    Hopefully this will help also.  Reprinted w/o permission from GRANDMA
    ROSES BOOK OF SINFULLY DELICIOUS CAKES,COOKIES.....
    
    			Cake
    
    3 c. heavy cream			3 c. all-purpose flour
    6 lasrge eggs			1/2 tsp sale
    3 c. sugar				4 tsp baking powder
    2 tsp vanilla			2 c. finely ground toasted
    2 tsp orange flavoring		     hazelnuts
    
    Preheat oven to 350.  Thoroughly grease and flour FOUR 9" layer-cake
    pans.  Whip the cream, but not till it becomes very stiff, and set
    aside in refrigerator.  Beat eggs until thick, gradually adding sugar.
    Add vanilla and orange flavoring.  Sift flour with salt and baking
    powder and fold one-quarter of the flour mixture into the eggs.
     Mix remaining flour with ground nuts and fold into the egg batter
    alternately with the whipped cream, until all ingredients are
    incorporated.  Pour batter into pans evenly.  Bake for about 25-30
    minutes.  Remove from heat and let rest for about 10 minutes before
    removing from pans.  Cool thoroughly.
    
    		Brandy Butter Filling
    
    2 eggs				2 tbsp cornstarch
    6 tbsp cognac			About 2 c. apricot preserves
    8 tbsp sweet butter			1-1/2 c. finely ground toasted
    2 c. plus 4 tbsp sugar		   hazelnuts
    
    Beat the eggs and add cognac, 4 tbsp butter, 2 c. sugar, and
    cornstarch.  Cook over moderate heat and simmer, stirring, for about
    5 minutes.  Remove from heat, add remaining butter and beat until
    smooth.  As it cools, the filling will continue to thicken.  When
    cake layers have cooled, spread the filling between them.  Strain
    apricot preserved, add remaining sugar, and cook until thick, about
    10 minutes.  Paint the sides of the cake with this apricot glaze
    and then sprinkle the sides with hazelnuts.  Work quickly because
    the gla dries quickly.
    
    
    		Royal Frosting
    
    2 egg whites 	      	1 tsp lemon juice	2 tsp cognac
    Dash of salt		3 c. confec. sugar	1 semisweet
    							chocolate bar
    
    Beat all ingredients until thick.  Frost top of cake and, if you
    wish, decorate with chocolate curls.
    
    
    Pam		  
    				
       
    

    See the note replies from note 1365 for recipes.  Hope they help.

    Depending on where you live.......most party stores carry Wilton
    cake pans and Cake Decorating Books this is your best bet.
    
    Anne

    I took a cake decorating class a few years ago at Sears and if I
    remember correctly we used Crisco instead of butter.  Will check
    my recipe this weekend.
    
    Carla                                              
    
    

    I took a class several years back, and this is the recipe
    I've been using ever since:
    
    1/2 c. Crisco
    1 lb. confectioners sugar
    1/4 c. water
    1/2 tsp. vanilla
    1/4 tsp. salt (I usually omit the salt)         
    
    Beat until smooth - it's great for figure piping and flowers.
    It holds its shape very well, and it's not overly sweet.  If
    you want a more buttercreamy taste, substitute butter or
    margarine for the Crisco (or go half and half) and milk for 
    the water.  The problem with adding margarine or butter is
    the icing won't be snow white.
    
    Pam

    I've been having a problem making chocolate frosting to frost cookies
    with. After the frosting dry's it will get white blotches all over.It
    doesn't change the taste,but it looks awful. I usually use
    confectionary sugar,cocoa or choco-bake,and water. Sometimes the
    frosting comes out ok and sometimes it doesn't.
      I would appreciate any helpful hints to this problem.
    Thanks
    Louie
    

    Try using melted chocolate chips (Nestles) 1 1/2 cup chips and 
    1 Tbls crisco. Melt in the microwave, mix welland spreas on cookies.
    This gives a nice shiny finish.

    My basic chocolate frosting recipe is:
    
    1 square unsweetened Baker's chocolate
    1 Tablespoon (or so) butter or margarine
    1 teaspon vanilla extract/flavoring (yes, vanilla!)
    1 cup (or so) confectioner's sugar
    1 Tablespoon (or so) milk
    
    
    Melt the chocolate and the butter in the same bowl (in a double
    boiler or in the microwave).  Add the vanilla, and the confectioner's
    sugar.  Add enough milk (about 1 Tablespoon, sometimes more) until
    the frosting is the consistency that you desire.
    
    
    ... and while I'm at it, here's my recipe for:
    
    Butter Cream Frosting:
    ---------------------
    Same ingredients as above, except omit the unsweetened chocolate
    
    Same directions as above.
    
    

  I've recently started playing with cake decorating, and was wondering if
anyone has any suggestions or hints for how to know when you've got the
right consistency icing for the particular decoration you're trying to make?

  I know that you need stiff icing for flowers, medium for most decorations,
and thin for the base icing on the cake.  But how do you know when "stiff"
is stiff enough?

  I've also had the problem when practicing to make roses that the icing in
the bag starts to get too soft from my hands, so I tend to keep half in the
fridge while I work with the other half.

  I tried an all-crisco and no-butter version of buttercream icing this
weekend, but the stuff was so darn thick, I couldn't squeeze it out of the
bag!

--Sharon

    
    	Sharon  -1
    		
    	You need to have the frosting very stiff in order for the
    petals of the roses to stand up.  The reason you are having a hard
    time is your hand isn't used to it.  But practice enough and soon
    you'll be making the roses with no problems.  I took cake decorating
    lessons years ago, so I know this is what happens.
    
    	For stiffness or thinness, you just know when its right.  Try a
    little frosting, then add more sugar or drops of water until its
    the right consistency.
    
    	Linda
    

    
    You might try gumpaste.  I've never worked with it myself...but
    the results are beautiful.
    
    dm

    I have done quite a bit of cake decorating, and most everything
    that I do is from the same consistasncy frosting, I guess from your
    discription it would be medium. I never use a stif frosting.  Until
    recently I always used the crisco based frosting, but I just learned
    to make Italian Buttercream and it is wonderful. You can't make
    flowers and intricate decorations, but for frosting and edging it
    is very easy to work with.  If I can remember I try to post the
    recipe. The only problem is it's all in weights and not cups, I
    take cooking lessons from a chef from the Hayatt in Cambridge and
    they do everything by weight.

  Weights are fine -- we do most of our baking by weights, anyway!

  Do you think using a hand-held electric mixer would result in a different
consistency icing than if I used a stand-alone mixer?  I would think I
bigger mixer could whip the icing better....

--Sharon

    A week or so ago I said I would enter the Italian Buttercream, I
    can't remember which note it was, but I'll enter it here.
    
     6   oz. egg whites
    13.5 oz. sugar
     3   oz. water
    10   oz. unsalted butter
     4   oz. shortening (crisco)
    pinch of salt
     1   tsp. vanilla
    
     1   tsp. instant coffee (optional)
    
    
    
    1. Boil water and 1/2 the sugar tp 250 degrees F.
    
    2. Whip egg whites and remaining sugar to a stiff froth.  Slowly
    pour sugar water into egg whites whipping constantly. continue whipping
    for a few minutes.
    
    3. eat butter, shotrening, salt,and vanilla for 15 minutes in another
    bowl or until light and white.
                                
    4.  Add creamed butter mixture to egg white mixture and whip together.
    
    I using coffee, mix instant coffee with a few drops of water to
    desolve, and whip into butttercream mixture.
    
    
    These instructions are from an advanced cooking class and I hav
    tried my best to make them understood by an inexperienced cook.
    I have a baking scale so weights are not a problem for me.  The
    egg whites are by weight and the number of eggs used will vary due
    to the size of the egg.
    
    Most of the recipes used are divisions of large quantity recipes
    used in hotels.

    Yummy Chocolate Fudge Frosting
    
    1 tablespoon butter or margarine
    3 (1 ounce) squares  unsweetened chocolate
    1/4 cup milk
    1 (3 ounce) package cream cheese
    3 cups confectioner's sugar
    1/2 teaspoon salt
    1 teaspoon vanilla extract
    
    Combine butter, chocolate and milk in a double
    boiler and heat until chocolate is melted.  Cool.
    In a large mixing bowl, combine cream cheese and
    cooled chocolate mixture.  Cream.  Add confectioner's
    sugar and beat until mix is light and fluffy, about
    1-2 minutes.  Scrape sides of bowl as necessary. 
    
    Use for cookies or cake.  IT'S YUMMY!!!
    
    **As a side note, I use the notes file so much,
    that I thought the least I could do to repay all
    of the ideas I've gotten out of it, was to insert
    some of my recipes that I don't think have been
    inserted before...Hope someone can use them!
    
    Jen.

    
    1/2 cup crisco oil
    1/2 cup butter
    1 lb conf sugar
    1 tsp vanilla
    3 tbs milk
    
    Beat together, adding conf sugar in doses.  Whip and refrigerate.
    

    1 cup crisco shortening (not oil)
    1 lb confectioners sugar
    1 tsp vanilla
    1/4 hot water (or less)
    
    Mix the shortening, sugar, and vanilla.  SLOWLY add the water, beating
    continuously, until the right consistency is achieved.  It usually 
    doesn't take the whole amount of water to get to this consistency.
    
    This is similar to .7, but because no butter is used, it can be stored
    without being refrigerated.  Just keep tightly sealed.
    
    
    
    Sharon

  However, taste-wise, the recipe with the butter is much more appealing to
eat.  I imagine you can achieve the buttery taste by adding the butter
flavoring that is sold by Wilton's.  Though, personally, I'd rather have
the "real thing"!

--Sharon

    RE.8
    Add 1/2 tsp salt to that recipe and you will have a much better flavor.

    Hi all.  I'm looking for a new frosting recipe and I'm hoping
    someone can help out.  You know the new frosting that bakeries,
    etc have been using lately?  By lately, I mean in the past 2 years.
    It's not a thick sugary frosting that they usually use on cakes,
    but rather a light airy frosty.  It tastes like it has a whip
    cream or mousse base.
    
    Can anyone help out with one?  
    
    Thanks,
    Shirley

    My mother always puts marshmallow in her frosting. It does seem to
    make it lighter.
    
    Linda
    

    A really light frosting that never fails to surprise people is to make
    one with Spry in it.
    
    I used to know an older cook, many moons ago, and that was the way she
    made the absolutely lightest white frosting I ever put in my mouth.   I
    may have the recipe if anyone is interested.
    
    I know, it sounds terrible .. but it's not.
    
    Mary Lou

    Spry and Crisco are just about the same thing, and that is pretty much
    what bakerys use any how. I use Crisco in almost all my fancy decorated
    cakes, and always get lots of raves, I've never understood why, I don't
    really care for it myself.
     
    The problem with using whipped cream in a frosting is that it breaks
    down rather quickly.  If the cake is going to be totally consumed at
    one sitting, that go ahead and frost it with the cream.  Another
    alternative is to use Cool Whip or something like that, I has a longer
    staying power than whipped cream.
    

    I haven't thought about Spry icing for a long time!  My mom made me a
    castle birthday cake once that used ice cream cones (upside down) for the
    turrets, Hershey bar squares for the door and drawbridge, etc.  It was
    really pretty, and she did it the night before.  Well, by party time,
    the cones had absorbed the shortening and just keeled right over!
    
    Terry
    

    This recipe is from a Slovakian woman who piped it into what she called
    clothespin cookies.  Very flaky dough was wrapped around pieces of
    dowling and baked.  The cookies were about 1 to 1 1/2" long.  They did
    not get soggy and were delicious.  I never mastered the cookies but did
    use the icing.  
                   
    
    Blend 6 tablespoons of flour into 1 cup of milk and strain it.  Cook to
    a paste (really thick).  Set aside to cool.
    
    Cream 1 cup of Spry (and she always said Crisco didn't work) with 1 cup
    of sugar, add *cooled* flour paste, 1 teaspoon of vanilla, and dash of
    salt.
    
    Beat to spreading consistancy with a mixer.
    
    Enjoy!
    
    Mary Lou

whipped cream is "stabilized" when used for frostings.  You can buy a
stabilizing powder (flavored with vanilla and sugar) in most cake baking supply
stores.  The one I've used is made in germany.  I also stabilize my own
whipping cream by heating 1/4 cup whipping cream over simmering water just
until it is hot to the touch.  Add 1 packet of unflavored gelatin powder
(KNOX brand in the USA) and stir to dissolve the gelatin.  Set aside to cool
for approx. 6 minutes.  Pour 1 and 3/4 cup chilled whipping cream into a
bowl.  While mixing the cold cream with a mixer set on low speed, slowly add
the warmed cream and gelatin mixture.  Mix well but do not beat into peaks.  
Place in fridge until it gets cool and begins to thicken.  Remove from fridge
and begin to whip, adding superfine sugar (or castor sugar in Europe) to
taste, one tablespoon at a time.  Add 1 teaspoon vanilla while whipping.
Beat to stiff peaks.  This will hold, under refrigeration, for a day or so.
You never want to leave a whipped cream frosting for longer than that - and
you always want to make this and serve it the first day for best appearance.

This makes vanilla whipped cream frosting.  Other flavors may be created
by adding different extracts or melted, cooled chocolate while whipping the
cream into stiff peaks.  A GREAT flavor frosting is to add orange extract,
giving an orange sherbet flavor - great on white cake.  I add 1/2 teaspoon
orange extract.

NOTE:  If you do not add the gelatin mixture gradually enough, it will
clump up...remove all clumps and discard.  heat another 1/4 cup cream and
dissolve the gelatin in it and try again.  If you have enough cream, you
haven't hurt anything.  I've done this a few times.

    Here's a real simple one, and my current favorite.  It's a white
    choclate whipped cream and it is DELICIOUS.  It's in the Cake Bible
    in case you have it.
    
    	Ingriedients:  8 oz Heavy Cream
    		       3 oz White Chocolate
    
    There is enough sugar in the white chocolate to sweeten the whipped
    cream perfectly, and apparently the cocoa butter acts as a stabilizer.
    It does need to be refrigerated, however, or it will start to melt, but
    then again most creamed based frostings will do that.  One other thing,
    since just about all the flavor for this frosting comes from the white
    chocolate, it is *imperative* that you use high quality chocolate.  I
    recommend the 3 oz Tobler bars (which is also exactly what the recipe
    calls for).  Although I have never done it, I would avoid using those
    white chocolate chips that you find in the baking section of the
    supermarket.  I would bet that the frosting would come out like Cool
    Whip <uck>, and it wouldn't even be as stabile as Cool Whip.
    
    Anyway, on to business:
    
    	Refrigerate your mixing bowl and wisks.
    
    	Break the white chocolate into pieces and melt over (not in) warm
    	water.  Allow to cool to tepid.
    
    	Whip cream until it begins to thicken.  Add tepid chocolate and mix
    	until it is "whipped cream" texture.
    
    Pretty simple, huh?
    
    				-David

    
    re: .8
    
    This technique is indeed very good. I used it recently to make a Black
    Forest Cake and was very pleased with the result. I used Lindt white
    chocolate (Blancor).
    
    A similar technique which is even richer and creamier is to increase
    the chocolate to match the cream (in their respective ounces);
    whisk/blend/process chocolate and hot cream until smooth; refrigerate
    until cold; whip until stiff (do not overbeat).  An added tablespoon or
    so of Grand Marnier is very nice.  I like to use this with raspberry
    puree between sponge cake layers.  
    
    
    
    

    I'm looking for suggestions on what tip I should use to decorate a
    "Cookie Monster" cake?  My 2 year old nephew asked me to make the
    cookie monster for him, and I'm really stuck on the tip.  In case you
    aren't familiar with Sesame Street, Cookie Monster is a big, blue,
    shaggy puppet.  How would I make him look shaggy?  What tip, and which
    size, would you suggest?  Cake is needed for Saturday (Nov. 17), so
    speedy assistance is appreciated!
    Sarah

    How about taking some blue food coloring and either 
    
    	-dye some shaved cocoanut and sprinkling it on, or
    	-melt and dye some white chocolate, let it harden, shave
    	it, and sprinkle it on the freshly iced cake.
    
    Depends on whether your nephew likes cocoanut - some kids
    despise it.
    
    --Louise

  The Wilton Yearbook has a bunch of cakes that come out looking "shaggy".
I'll look tonight to see what tip they use for making "hair".

--Sharon

    THe last cookie monster cake I saw just used one of the larger star
    tips and covered the entire cake with these blue stars.  It looked
    kind of hairy once it was done.  Not sure of the exact tip number 
    though.
    
    \Caroline

    I am not a cake decorator by any means, but I believe the method my
    cousin uses for her monster and teddy bear type cakes is called
    "Pulled" frosting.
    
    I watched her do it once, so someone more experienced may have more
    to add on this subject, but from what I saw, Janet used a tip with a
    reasonably small hole and 'pulled' the bag away from the cake as she 
    squeezed out about 1/4 inch of frosting.  Each pull equals 1 'hair'.
    
    It takes patience, practice and alot of frosting, but the results are
    stunning.
    
    Good luck!
    
    dm 

  The tip that Wilton recommends for "hair" is tip 233.  The tip has about 
10 or 12 holes in it.  The technique is to "pull" the tip, as described in 
the previous note.  Though this tip would certainly speed up the job, over
a single-hole tip!

  You could also try using one of the small star tips and the pull technique.

--Sharon

    Thanks for all the suggestions.  I'm guessing if I used the "pull"
    method, I would want softer consistency for the icing?  I'll try that,
    but if it doesn't work, Louise had a great idea for the white
    chocolate-dyed blue shreds (brother-in-law HATES coconut...what kind of
    a person hates coconut?? : ), so I'll have to try the white chocolate.
    Thanks again everyone!  Wish me luck!
    
    Sarah (official cake baker and decorator for the family)
           

    I have started the hobby of cake decorating (without any classes so
    far) and am looking for some experienced help.
    
    I have been staying with the more simple ideas - star tips, basic lines
    etc - usually copying a picture (or party invitation) on a cake top. 
    The only problem I have is kid's don't like the taste of the basic
    buttercream recipe found in the Wilton books.  Any ideas on how to add
    flavor to the frosting?  The recipe I use calls for 1/2c butter 1/2c
    crisco 1lb sugar vanilla flavoring and milk.  It works great for the
    decorations, but the kids won't eat it!
    
    Thanks
    -sandy
    
    

I have to ask what they don't like?  Not sweet enough?  Too sweet?  Too bland?

If you are using unsalted butter, you may need a small amount of salt to 
balance the flavors.  Or maybe more vanilla.  By the way, make sure you are
using PURE VANILLA EXTRACT, not just cheapo fake vanilla flavoring.  The latter
tastes AWFUL!!!  You might even want to skip the extract entirely and flavor 
the sugar by storing a vanilla bean in it.

Also, taste the shortening.  It may have picked up an off flavor from sitting on
the shelf too long.  You might want to reduce the amount of shortening, and 
increase the butter.  If you decide to experiment with adding flavorings (like
artifical butter, or whatever), taste the flavoring first.  If your reaction is
"WOW!  TOO STRONG!"  that's good.  If it's "BLEACHH!!!", you probably don't 
want it in your icing.

	Am I missing something, or couldn't you add other types
	of flavorings?  There are quite a few extracts other than
	vanilla that you could try, like orange, lemon, peppermint,
	strawberry, etc.  Might they like any of those?


	Diane

    I've used the same Wilton's recipe on decorative cakes without any 
    complaints - especially from kids!  
    
    --Sharon
    

    Maybe my kids are more accustomed to the canned chocolate frosting.
    
    I am doing a cake this weekend for my nieces first birthday.  I told my
    sister to make the cake and frost it with whatever she wants and I will
    make a decoration on top of that.
    
    Now that I think about it, my son doesn't have a sweet tooth (he must be
    adopted) and could care less about sugary stuff.  I think he prefers
    real flavors versus artificial flavors (rich chocolate vs extract). 
    Maybe I'll try other flavors.  I also think he has seen me use the
    coloring and thinks it adds to the taste (although he won't believe me
    when I say it doesn't).
    
    It was very discouraging to spend an hour decorating a cake with one of
    the dalmations only to have it nibbled by the kids.  Even I wasn't
    impressed with the cake.
    
    I'll keep on trying.
    -sandy
    

    I decorate quite a few cakes for family occassions, and have finally
    given up on Crisco.  All it does is add an oily texture to the
    frosting.  I use a cream-cheese frosting and just make sure it stays
    refrigerated until about 1 hour before serving.  You can vary the
    texture by adding cream or milk, or increasing the confectioners' sugar
    to make it stiff.  It really has the best flavor and can be tinted. For
    chocolate, I still eliminate the Crisco and just use butter, semi-sweet
    chocolate, and confectioners sugar.  Make a small test batch and see
    for yourself.  The Crisco version feels oily on your tongue.  It may be
    the texture, not the flavor to which the kids' objected.  
    Sarah 

somewhere in this conference is a note I entered a long time ago that has
a traditional buttercream frosting recipe.  It is the best tasting frosting
I've eaten, and it makes lovely decorations.  It has no shortning, but does
contain butter.  It can be turned into chocolate frosting very easily -
if I'm not mistaken the recipe to do so is included.  AT any rate, the
frosting recipe is in the New Fanny Farmer baking recipe book.  If you
enjoy decorating cakes, you need a good buttercream frosting recipe....it
will taste as good as it looks.

Re .7:

I would like to make coffee flavored whip cream.  

I have been able to do this using regular instant coffee granules.  I ground the 
instant coffee granules to a powder in a blender.  The coffee powder dissolves
in the whip cream.

What I would like to use is some ground toasted praline coffee (not instant) that
I also have.  I have tried making the coffee and then putting about a 1/4 cup
of it into the whip cream (2 cups) as I was beating it.  I could taste the 
coffee, but I could also taste the water.  I wasn't very happy with this.

I have seen a recipe (Maida Heatter) where coffee, eggs and sugar are cooked, 
then used to melt chocolate.  The cooled chocolate sauce is then folded into 
just-whipped cream.  I was thinking of trying this recipe but omitting the 
chocolate.  

I would appreciate any ideas that anyone might have.

Thanks,

Geeta

    Maybe try "brewing" the coffee in the cream in a saucepan until it
    tastes right to you, strain out the coffee, cool the cream, then whip
    it. I would take care not to heat the cream too high, but maybe just
    heating it up, then turning off the flame to let the coffee soak until
    the right flavor is achieved.
    Sarah

I made the coffee (to taste), then put it in a saucepan with an equal amount of
sugar (1/4 cup coffee, 1/4 cup sugar).  I let the coffee and sugar cook until 
I had a syrup.  When the syrup had cooled down, I mixed in the whipping cream
(about 2 cups), and let the whole thing chill.  Then I whipped it.  I did have
toasted-praline flavored whip cream.

I didn't have any problems whipping the cream.  In other words, I was able to get
stiff peaks, and I didn't notice any aberrations in the taste.

Thanks for your comments!

Geeta

	What I've always used is a 50/50 instant coffee/hot water mix. 
This gives a real intense coffee flavor.



							Robert

If what you are trying to do is get the flavor of FLAVORED coffee, try buying
the flavor concentrates they use to flavor the coffee beans.  The you can use
the easy instant coffee route to get the coffee flavor, and add the extract to
get your toasted praline flavor.