Conference taveng::bagels

    Perhaps what's going on is that these people are now too old to
    be worth protecting.
    
    Apparently, the US let in many of these guys because of thier 
    usefulness as intellegence sources, and thier known anti-Communism.
    Most of them are too old to be useful now, so they can be used to
    generate good publicity.
    				-John Bishop

    RE.: .-1
    
    GOOD PUBLICITY...
    
    in that case, kill 'em silently, slowly... we don't need the media
    for a good revenge. Just kill 'em, slowly, silently, no mess!

    The CIA got caught.
    
    A few years ago, the Justice Dept. did some poking around and dug
    up a whole slew of Nazis who were recruited after the war as "spies".
    For the most part they weren't too useful, but they generally fooled
    the CIA into believing that they knew something important.  And
    since the CIA was filled with fanatical anti-communists, Nazis were
    considered friedly.  It was the US, remember, who got Klaus Barbie
    out of France and into Bolivia when the French govt. was looking
    for him around '52.
    
    (To be fair, the "CIA" was a different organization then, whose
    name slips me, that was later merged into the current CIA.  The
    "real" CIA in 1947 was not involved.)
    
    The CJP sponsored a lecture by the Justice Dept. investigator a
    few years ago.  I can't remember his name.  He was also on "60 Minutes"
    and has a book out.

    re .-1
    The precusor to the CIA was OSS (Office of Strategic Services I
    think).
    
    Bill Casey was with them during WWII.
    

    The agency responsible for "changing the focus" was the army's Counter
    Intelligence Dept. (CID).  My Father-in-law was in this during the
    war (being a German Jew, he speaks German), but opted out when they
    decided that Nazis weren't such bad guys after all, and that Communism
    is the real enemy of humanity (besides it keeps America's
    military-industrial complex humming, doesn't it?).
    
    Also re: .3 - The former special prosecutor's name is Allan Ryan.
    
    David

    	Our justice system in America tries to assure that everyone
    is treated justly. Amendment 14 to the constitution is the equal
    justice under the law amendment. That means that the congress will
    not make any law that will be detrimental to any one person or group.
    Because of this justice system, a lawyer can use the laws to get
    extensions and trial delays that go on for several years. It was
    several years ago that these 'men' entered our justice system. It
    is only now that their last appeals are making the media.
    I would rather see them use the delaying tactics then for congress
    to pass a law that Jews must be killed on alternate Thursdays.
    The laws that protect me must also protect John Demjanjuk, Carl Linus,
    Curt Waldheim, Clouse Barbi and all those mumzehs ( bastards ).

    Some of the mumzehs have been pretty useful for the US.
    
    Wernher von Braun is a good example. Where's the justice been, in
    his case? Most of the V2's on London have been aimed on civilians.
    
    Chris

>    Wernher von Braun is a good example. Where's the justice been, in
>    his case? Most of the V2's on London have been aimed on civilians.
I don't intend to carry a brief for von Braun, but wasn't he a scientist
who was engaged in research on weapons systems? I have never heard of any
war crimes accusations hurled at him, unless you consider any act that
contributes to a war as criminal. If that should be your argument, then
Einstien and Oppenhiemer could also be classified as criminals, since they
contributed (in a very direct manner) to the development of a weapon that
was targeted specifically at civilians more than the V2 was, the justification
for its usage notwithstanding!!

-parthi

    The issue concerning von Braun was that he knowingly used slave
    labor in the research, manufacturing and testing of rockets, and
    in the mining of fuel.  By no stretch of the imagination has Einstein
    or Oppenheimer ever had such involvement.  No one is suggesting
    that any nation (even one we are at war with) has no right to arm
    itself.
    
    Von Braun never satisfactorily addressed the charges, which were
    quite well documented.  The US government apparently needed his
    "talents" so much in fighting the "space race" with the USSR that
    it lowered its usual high moral and ethical standards :-)
    
    I have no doubt that the Soviets got some good propaganda out of
    it -- I wonder if they had their own Nazis cranking out rockets,
    too?

>    Von Braun never satisfactorily addressed the charges, which were
>    quite well documented.  The US government apparently needed his
>    "talents" so much in fighting the "space race" with the USSR that
I have read that the German War Ministry did indeed use slave labour to
procure fuel and materials for the Peenumunde group. But I was under the
impression that von Braun himself never had any direct contact with the
labourers; not that it is any excuse, but a difference neverthless.
Guess I have to go back to my books.
    
-parthi

    One of the stories I've heard is that at the end of the war, Russian
    spies within the western intelligence agencies (the Philby gang?)
    saw to it that the Russians got the better choice of Nazi rocket
    scientists.  Von Braun may have been the best that the US got a
    hold of, since much of the picking (by the British and Americans)
    was being done by moles.
    
    The Russians must have had this macabre line, "our Nazis are better
    than your Nazis."  
    
    This and more came out of the recent investigation of the way the
    US sheltered and transported Nazi war criminals, like Barbie and
    Mengele, to safety.