Conference taveng::bagels

    I'm taking three weeks in Israel!
    
    I got fed up with feeling lonely and different, which in this country
    are criminal offenses.
    
    If I am unable to do the same next year, I'll just get out the slides
    and prints and notebooks from this year's visit, settle down with
    Pam in front of the fireplace, and re-enjoy being in a place where
    it's "average" to be Jewish, where Christmas is just another workday,
    and where the "Christmas lights" get strung up on Yom Haatzmaut.
    
    Ed

    I'm taking my Christmas holidays early and going to visit my folks
    in Israel during the High Holidays for a month. We have a new
    grandchild for them to spoil.

    It's the best time of year in NY to get tickets to all those shows
    that have been impossible to get tickets to.  Each Christmas Eve
    for the last five years, I've seen a great show, with great seats!
     
    I also seem to get invited to lots of friends homes around the
    holidays...and I really enjoy sharing their different customs. 
    I had the best seafood dinner (the Italians have fish on XMAS) I've
    ever had a few years ago when one of my friends asked me to share
    dinner with her and her family.  It was a lot of fun, and quite
    enjoyable.
                                                               
    
    JayCee

    We're going to Florida (my wife just called me to announce it) so
    that our children can see their Grandma and Grandpa who are moving
    there in October. (actually I think we're going so the kids can
    visit Disney World, but don't let the Grandparents know...)
    
    Av

	RE: .0  Surely you're kidding!  Three 4-day weeks
	in a row.  Take them off.  Get yourself invited
	to a Christian-friend's house (they don't bite...really)
	to decorate a Xmas tree.  It's a lot of fun, and
	you normally get a free dinner and/or drinks.

	There is something we do that is also fun.  Go to
	a local hospital, old-folks home, orphanage, etc.
	and VOLUNTEER to help (unpaid, of course...we all
	are overpaid at DEC :-).  If enough people volunteer,
	a lot of your Christian friends (and future friends)
	will get to celebrate their High Holy Days.

	- ex-floor sweeper at a local hospital every Xmas

       
    re: .5
    
        >RE: .0  Surely you're kidding!  Three 4-day weeks
	>in a row.  Take them off.  Get yourself invited
	>to a Christian-friend's house (they don't bite...really)

        If you're in southern New Hampshire, or within easy driving
        distance, consider yourself invited. We don't bite...really.
        We don't evangelize [promise!], we're laid back, easy on the 
        religious stuff...and we'll even serve a meal to suit *your* 
        requirements, if I can strike a deal for you to teach me how 
        to do that!
    
        That would be great fun! I'd love it! Anybody want to take me
        up on it?
           
        Irena
    
    
                                                      
        
         
        

    	Last year we participated on Xmas day in Project Ezra, which
    provides Jewish volunteers to help provide services on that day.  We
    brought dinner and visited with an elderly shut-in, and it was quite
    rewarding.

    	You can get information on the program in general by contacting the
    Synagogue Council of Massachusetts (426-2139), or the shut-in
    visitation program in particular by contacting Little Brothers/Friends
    of the Elderly (536-2404).  Little Brothers provides this outreach
    service to all kinds of people, including Jewish people on our
    holidays.

    	I look at this as a way to give something back to the community at
    large, which provides the public services (police, fire, etc.) that
    allow us to observe our Shabbat and holidays.

    		David

    .0
    
    How to feel Jewish on 12/25?  Go to a chinese restaurant -- they're
    frequently open.

    I get a kick out of how we need to discuss this even as Rosh Hashanah
    is knocking on our doorstep.  Is the issue related to the fact that
    we do not like that it because it consumes all aspects of life in
    most countries?  Is it related to the fact that we are afraid of
    it?
    
    When I am invited to a home of one who celebrates the holiday, I
    usually go. I do not try to be invited, however, because I do not
    feel lonely or less of a person because I do not choose to celebrate
    Jesus's May birth in December. I admit that I feel different than
    the masses (no pun intended), but then again, so did every Jew since
    Abraham who was different than even his father...
    
    Being different can be a source of inner pride.  Everyone has a
    right to their beliefs and now we approach the High Holy Days for Jews.
    The Jew, the clear minority, has to figure out how to take off a
    few days from work.  A clear distinction from December 25!
    
    L'shannah Tovah
    
    Eli

    re: .0
    
    My my, we haven't even finished the yearly discussion on Rosh Hasshana,
    etc. and now we're into the "christmas depression" issue?
    
    A (return, in my case) trip to Israel sounds like a good idea for
    those with the means and the time.  Project Ezra sounds like a good
    endeavor for the mitzva of charity.  But what the he**, time off
    is time off!
    
    David

reply to : Note 529.8  (SLSTRN::RADWIN)

>                            -< Try the fried rice >-
>    How to feel Jewish on 12/25?  Go to a chinese restaurant -- they're
>    frequently open.

	Yes, indeed.  That's just *exactly* the method.....In order to 
	keep "feeling Jewish" on 12/25, what you should do is to go to 
	eat in a treif restaurant.

	Hmmm. Just what IS "feeling" Jewish? Have you ever considered
	that _living_ Jewishly (oy vey, there's Feinberg with that "m" 
	word again...) might just be the way that renders the "dilemma" 
	of 12/25 (and others) "bitul" (and conversely?) ?  

/don feinberg

       I have to second the idea of visiting a Christian friend's house.
    Surely, any of us can learn something new about Christmas.
    
    Every Christmas, I work at a Soup Kitchen in New Haven serving a
    Christmas meal to the locals.  They have someone dress up as Santa
    and give the clientele gifts also.  It can be very rewarding.  Usually,
    it is a good thing to do for me when I drive from Mass. down to
    NYC to spend some time with Christian friends, and later, my folks
    (they don't mind if I roll in on the morning of the 26th... 8^))
    in NY.
    
    If anyone would like to volunteer, the soup kitchen is the FAIR
    HAVEN SOUP KITCHEN ,ph # 203 - 865 - 7818.  They need "waiters",
    cooks, etc.  They also do it on Thanksgiving, if you're a Brit..  8^)

                                                See you there...
                                                 .steve.

    p.s. if you do it, i can give directions, from memory...

    Hi,
    
    I myself will be making my now annual pilgrimage to the Lake District
    here in England. If you can get away with a few Jewish friends 
    and go up a few mountains you need never know what's happening around
    you!
    
    I'd advise you to banish the TV and Radio. They tend to go over
    the top. You can always catch up on old friends, records, 
    or fix the car/house. 
    
    I used to go to a Zionist Youth Conference in Oxford that always
    coincided with Christmas. At the end you left with enthuasism for
    the year ahead, and without the feeling that christmas had passed
    you by! 
    
    I wonder if you could find a similar such event, organised by a
    Jewish group nearby?
    
    Malcolm

    I can't *afford* to go to Israel again, especially not for three whole
    weeks -- just not in the cards in the near future.  I may manage
    to go to Florida, except that it appears to already be too late
    to get a cheap plane seat, and I don't think I would trust either
    of our (8 1/2 year old) cars to make it that far, especially in
    the winter -- I have an uncle who retired to Florida, but I couldn't
    actually stay with them as they live in a trailer, and are at any
    rate not in very good health anymore.  We may go camping in the
    Florida keys with a college scuba-diving class a friend of ours
    teaches, if he can rent a van to drive our stuff and his down there
    - I'm not much of a camper, but it could be a cheap vacation if
    we manage to put it together (he says you can drive down there in
    24 hours if you drive continuously with the non-driving people sleeping
    in the back of the van on top of the tanks, etc., thus saving expensive
    hotel room costs).
    
    It's not what to do on the Christmas holiday itself (which is a
    Sunday this year anyhow) that depresses me, it's being the one of
    the 5% of the staff here who is at work during that time that gets
    to me.  I do not watch TV and seldom listen to the radio anyhow
    (Paul gets offended when he does turn one or the other on around
    that time of year, by the "buy-buy-buy" mentality).  It's just a
    very lonely time around here: come in to work and no one is here,
    go home and shovel the driveway, pay the heating bill...
    
    I have this complaint every year (ask Paul!  He gets to put up with
    me every year), but I didn't realize that this year was likely to
    be especially depressing until I got hold of this year's fiscal
    year calendar and saw three four-day weeks in a row - a good indicator
    that the office will be even more deserted than usual.
                                    
    One of these years my sister-in-law and her family will actually
    make aliyah (they lived in Israel for a year or so before my niece
    and nephew were born, and want to go back after they have some money
    saved up), and then the whole family will go visit them!

    Most of the ideas in this note are interesting.
    
    I think that if one is in the mood to do volunteer work that is
    the best. The New Haven Kitchen is a service to both your community
    and to yourself(I have found  that helping others is pleasureable).
    
    Another idea if it available in your area, as it is in Dallas, is
    to "replace" workers in hospitals so that they can spend their holidays
    with their families. This has 2 benefits:
    	1) it is just a nice thing to do
    	2) you help to dispell some of the *BULL**** about Jews only
    wanting to help themselves. If you have been following the note
    on the Last Temptation of Christ you can appreciate this.
    The workers you replace are people like nurses aides NOT nurses
    obviously, people who serve meals, janitors sometimes, and other
    non-medical/non-emergency personnel.
    A third benfit is that some of these people then "replace" Jews
    who want to be off for the High Holidays but might not have an easy
    time of arranging it.     

    Well this year I am going to Florida for 12 days.  My folks will
    be down there.
    
    I used to go the big singles jewish dance sponsered by L'Juda in
    New York Christmas Eve with all my jewish friends.   Christmas
    day is great for skiing.  The slopes are pretty much empty!
                                                        
    A lot of my friend used to go to the movies.  When I was in high
    school I would actually attend Christmas service at a Protestant
    Church that one of my friends father was the pastor of.  It was
    to expose myself to another religion.  I also on Christmas used
    to go to the birthday party of a brother of a friend who was born
    on Dec 25th.
    
    Theres plenty of things to do on Christmas day.
    

    question:
    
    I don't understand why it is that you guys have to be at
    work on Christian holidays...Christmas is a legal holiday.
    You shouldn't be here whether you observe it or not.      
    
    It sounds like you *have* to work while everybody else is gone.
    Is it in "exchange" for your own holidays?
    
    Would somebody explain please?                      
    
    Irena
    
    

re: < Note 529.16 by YODA::NEWMAN >

>    I used to go the big singles jewish dance sponsered by L'Juda in
>    New York Christmas Eve with all my jewish friends.   Christmas
>    day is great for skiing.  The slopes are pretty much empty!
                                                        
	A similar group runs a Christmas eve bash in Boston, too...Society of
	Young Jewish Professionals?

--eric--

    A couple of times my parents forgot they couldn't go grocery shopping
    on 12/25, and we ended up having sardines. So after a few years
    they decided that having a day off was a fine excuse for running
    a nice dinner party for our Jewish friends. It ends up being a sort
    of "encore Thanksgiving" in terms of food.
    
    --Dan

    Re: .16
    
    It is not the day we get off for Christmas, but the days surrounding
    them when just about everyone else is on vacation.  Try scheduling
    a meeting for any of the days between Christmas and New Year and see
    how many people show up...
    
    				Paul
    

     I guess I'm a little unclear as to what exactly is causing the
     unease around the issue of people not being in work around
     Christmas.
    
     A similar phenomenon occurs around the 4'th of July or even the
     last two weeks of the summer season, before Labor Day.
    
     For the last 3 or 4 years, I've been taking vacation time between
     Christmas and New Year's Day.
    
     It's such a deal, when I think about it: I have to only take 3
     vacation days to have 9 or 10 days away from this place.
    
     Sounds good to me. :-)
    
       Alan 

    
    .0
    
    Please read Notes 409.2 and 409.13. I reread what I wrote last year
    and still believe it true.
    
    Enjoy.!!!!
    

    re: .22
    
    I have absolutely no problem with your approach.  What bothers me
    is the annual phenomenom of equating christmas and Channukah.
    Channukah is not even a major holiday, and yet society here has
    tried to elevate it to a status of a "Jewish christmas"(haz
    b'halilah!).
    
    David

    
    .23
    
    David, I fully agree with you about equating the 2 holidays, however
    my main point is to get people to understand each others beliefs.
    
    The approach of using the 2 is only because they to a degree co-incide
    time wise. We also spend time teaching each other and our children
    about Passover and Easter. (here again using the basis of time in
    addition to the fact that the 'Last Supper' is also a Passover Seder)
    
    Also another point to my reply was to get .0 to think in a positive
    manner.
    
    We (this conference) look foolish (I believe) even discussing this
    topic as it constantly takes us down a 40 reply rat hole (last year)
    with no real answer (as if one really exists). Maybe this reply
    will be the last.

Please do not complain about the equating of Christmas and
Chanukah before the "holiday shopping" decorations are put up in
the shops.

Things are getting seriously out of whack -- pretty soon, we'll
be discussing Passover in November.

Martin.

    Why not take advantage of the reduced rates on Martha's Vineyard
    and Nantucket? or check out some B&B's in New England? Sturbridge
    Village and most museums are open except for Christmas Day.  Take
    day trips or long weekends to fill up the time.  If it isn't too
    cold, that is a great time of year to enjoy skiing, sight seeing,
    traveling around the area with FEW crowds! think about it, everyone
    is home with the relatives!
    

    re: .25
    
    Think of it this way Martin, come christma time we'll just have
    to refer people to this note or #409.
    
    David

    Another view point. I find that those 10-12 days when lots of people
    are gone can be incredibly productive. Also, I have found the work
    atmosphere to be more relaxed and laid back. 
    
    Long weekends are great for sleeping late and go to sleep late,
    or the opposite if thats what you want. I really like having time
    to myself, and  of course there is always a football game on :-)
    
    What I find a lot more taxing is when the Chagim are of the Thursday,
    Friday, followed by Shabbat variety. By the end of Shabbat after
    Simchat Torah I am going batty. At least in December one can do
    just about anything, while on the Chagim one is kind of stuck.
    
    yoseff
    

    I am a Christian and I don't take time off at christmas 
    so I never thought about this topic.
    
    Being in Field service makes this time of year most enjoyable TO
    work as it is very slow.I have time to do things I normally don't
    have time for.
    
    I have noticed that this topic divides people into two catagories,Jew
    and Christian.Not all Gentiles are Christians.A lot of Non-Christian
    Gentiles enjoy christmas as a time of showing thier Love for other
    people. Some Christians don't celebrate it because it used to be
    a pagen holiday.
    
    Myself I am a scrooge when it comes to the gift giving hassle but
    I do enjoy being with my family when Christmas finally gets here.
    If you enjoy Thanksgiving (do you?) then treat Christmas as
    Thanksgiving II.

    
    Greg
   

    Hi, dear.
    
    I found the answers to your thoughts interesting.  Everyone had
    a solution for you to do something, of course only one person I
    saw invited you to join them.  That's great. It's exactly what I
    thought would be a great thing to do.  It seems no one seems to
    understand what it is like being single AND ALONE--especially at
    holiday time.  
    
    I feel that I know what it is like.  Dec. 25 is my parents anniversary.
    They almost always go away for a few days.  That makes me alone.
    I haven't made any definite plans.  But I usually give some sort
    of party during the holiday season.  The only requisite of this
    party is that you be single and alone.
    
    There has been a few times when it's only been me and one other
    friend whose family lives in Texas.  If you like, I'll include you
    in the invitations, and promise to let you know when I decide when
    I'll do what I feel closer to making arrangements.  
    
    I know, alone is miserable.  Going to concerts, restaurants, and
    the like by myself is a thought that is worse than sitting home
    and watching the rerun of Bing Crosby's White Christmas movie.
    
    So don't be alone.  Join us...  Don't know where you live but I'm
    in the Shrewsbury, MA area.
    
    Until whenever, Season's Greetings!!
    
    Adriane Gilder
    dtn 292-2565
    CSCMA::Gilder