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Conference rusure::math

Title:Mathematics at DEC
Moderator:RUSURE::EDP
Created:Mon Feb 03 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2083
Total number of notes:14613

1598.0. "Gauss anecdote; help in Latin translation" by NSDC::RATCLIFF (Heisenberg may have been here) Wed Apr 22 1992 09:25

My cousin is currently writing her MSc dissertation on the history of analytical
geometry. One anecdote reports that Gauss was sent a letter by another
mathematician (von Zweick?) with a criticism of some of Gauss' theories. The 
envelope had the writing
    MAGNA PETIS PHAETON
on it. I can't make sense of that; roughly, I get either
  - "You are demanding great things from the sun", but shouldn't it be PHAETONIS?
  - "Oh sun, you are demanding great things", but shouldn't it be PHAETONE?
The first alternative seems a bit more consistent with the context...

Can someone shed some light on this, my Latin is quite rusty; even better if
someone knows the anecdote and can confirm or correct it (there might have
been transcription errors...)?

Thanks in advance, John.

(Cross-posted in the SPQR conference)
T.RTitleUserPersonal
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1598.1another quoteIOSG::CARLINDick Carlin IOSG, Reading, EnglandThu Sep 24 1992 11:2910
    Sorry, no help, but this seems a good place to enter the following
    trivia question. Does anyone know who said the following?:
    
    "My dear friend. I have made some new discoveries in analysis. Ask
    Jacobi or Gauss publicly to give their opinion, not as to the truth but
    as to the importance of these theorems. Later there will be, I hope,
    some people who find it to their advantage to decipher all this mess.
    Je t'embrasse avec effusion."
    
    Dick
1598.23D::ROTHGeometry is the real life!Thu Sep 24 1992 13:476
    It sounds like the quote attributed to E. Galois.

    His comment about using what we now call Galois theory to solve
    for the roots of polynomials: "In a word, it is impractical."

    - Jim
1598.3Many thanksIOSG::CARLINDick Carlin IOSG, Reading, EnglandThu Sep 24 1992 13:5710
    Jim,
    many thanks for the quick answer. This was question #10 in my son's
    homework. I don't consider it cheating to find it out this way - it's
    only the modern equivalent of going to the library and searching the
    maths history books.
    
    I suppose the mess refers to his hurried scribbling in prison before
    his execution.
    
    Dick
1598.4Phaethon: the full storyDESIR::BUCHANANThe was not found.Thu Sep 24 1992 14:1073
Re .0:

	"Magna petis Phaethon."

	This comes from Ovid's Metamorphoses, I suspect, although I haven't
read the original Latin.   Phaethon & Epaphus were children of single parent
families, living by the Nile.   Their fathers were respectively Apollo &
Jupiter, but weren't around very often.   As boys will, Phaethon & Epaphus 
started boasting about their father's occupation:

	"My Dad's God of Thunder," Epaphus began.
	"Well nah nah my Daddy's Sun God," etc.
	"Well why doesn't he ever come down here then?"
	"Well why doesn't *your* Daddy come here?"
	"Well he did so there when Mummy had been turned into a cow and why 
don't you live in Olympus if your Daddy's so great."

	Eventually by such goading, Phaethon was shamed into running to his
mother and demanded proof of his pedigree.

	"Oh, ask your father," perhaps she said, in the way that busy
mothers will.   Phaethon took her at her word, and ran away to the Palace of
the Sun (far to the East, of course).   When he reached it, Apollo acknowledged
his son, and offered him any boon he wanted (oldest mistake in the book that
one).   So Phaethon replied:

	"Can I drive your chariot please please please?"

	"Magna petis, Phaethon.   It's not so simple, son."    

	EXERCISE FOR SCHOOL OF RHETORIC:  You are Apollo speaking to your son
Phaethon.   In 500 words or less, present your reasons why he should *not*
get to drive the sun chariot across the heavens for the day.   It must have
been a classic piece of homework for Roman kids, along with the debate between
Ajax & Odysseus for who should get the armour of Achilles.

     "It's no picnic, kid, not even Jupiter can handle the chariot:
                (i) very steep at beginning...
                (ii) ...dizzyingly high at noon...
                (iii) ...terrifyingly fast at end
                (iv) danger of getting swept away by motion of heavenly spheres
         	(v) zodiacal monsters [not given by Ovid in correct order]
                (vi) hard to control fiery horses."

 	The adolescent cannot of course be dissuaded, and dawn is busy breaking,
so Phaethon gets his way.   Apollo recommends that he stick to the central
three zones of heavens,  and follow the wheel marks!   The horses gallop off 
wildly since their master is not at the reins.   He gallops too far the North, 
then stops dead, then gets frightened by Scorpio, and loses the reins.   He 
goes all over the sky, often far too low:

Disaster: Earth catches fire shock horror probe!!!
          Cities, nations burn to the ground !!!
          Woods destroyed:
                <long list>
          Mountains heated up into volcanoes:
                <long list>
          Springs, lakes, rivers dried up:
                <very long list>
          Light shines through cracked Earth into Tartarus, scaring ghosts!

Just So:
        How the Ethiopians became dark
        How Libya became a desert

        Eventually, Earth Goddess (Ceres) *pleads* to Jupiter to stop it all.
"safety of Universe at stake."   Jupiter says: "OK, sorry Apollo, nothing else
I can do" and Z-Z-Z-Z-ZAPS Phaethon dead.   Chariot destroyed, wreckage all 
over road, single wheel left spinning slowly on an axle, horses running off by
themselves, and eventually grazing quietly.   Phaethon, a falling star,
lands in the river Eridanus, and is buried nearby.

Andrew.
1598.5modus operandiDESIR::BUCHANANThe was not found.Thu Sep 24 1992 14:187
Re: Evariste Galois

	It was a duel that got him, not an execution.   Ian Stewart's "Galois
Theory" covers the story well, although omits the affectionate and moving tag
at the end of the quote.

Andrew.
1598.6this notesfile contains everythingDESIR::BUCHANANThe was not found.Thu Sep 24 1992 20:161
1353.4 covers it.
1598.7Yes, this notesfile contains everythingVMSDEV::HALLYBFish have no concept of fire.Fri Sep 25 1992 13:521
    I think .4 is a marvelous piece of literature in itself!
1598.8Even soFORTY2::KNOWLESRoad-kill on the Info SuperhighwayMon Jul 04 1994 13:2633
    This has just turned up in the SPQR conference, confirming my guess
    of Ovid as the source (not as diverting as .4, so not cross-posted):
    
    
    b
    
    ps read the rest of the couplet. Was Gauss an up-and-coming
    Wunderkind at the time?
    
                         <<< SMURF::USERA:[NOTES]SPQR.NOTE;1 >>>
                -< SENATVS POPVLVSQVE ROMANVS - FORVM LATINVM >-
================================================================================
Note 4.39                   DOMVS MVRIS - The Rathole                   39 of 39
MROA::NADAMS "hearts of olden glory will be renewed" 14 lines  24-JUN-1994 08:18
                              -< You were right! >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    re: .33
    
    In the better late than never category ... here are lines 54-55
    from the Loeb version of Ovid's Metamorphoses, Book II.
    
    	magna petis, Phaethon, et quae nec viribus istis
    	munera conveniant nec tam puerilibus annis:
    
    Translated as
    
    	Thou askest too great a boon, Phaethon, and one which does
    	not befit thy strength and those so boyish years.
    
    Nancy