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Conference rusure::math

Title:Mathematics at DEC
Moderator:RUSURE::EDP
Created:Mon Feb 03 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2083
Total number of notes:14613

1320.0. "How fast does a Dancer Fall over?" by FMCSSE::HEINTZE () Sun Oct 28 1990 20:01

    I stumbled across an interesting ("The Physics of Dance") book written
    by a mechanic (ie, a physicist who studies mechanics - what is this
    person called?) who is a ballet dancer.  
    
    Think of a pencil perfectly balanced on end on your perfectly
    motionless desk (with absolutely no air currents).  It won't fall
    over.  Now carefully move the top of the pencil such that the pencil's 
    long axis forms an angle theta[0] with vertical.  Given t (time), what
    is theta?
    
    Ken Laws analyzes this but does not give his derivation.  Can someone
    reference me to a text book for a derivation of this?  I checked my
    trusty Haliday and Resnick to no avail.
    
                               Thanks
    
                               Sieg
    
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    I quote (from appendix E)
    
    Imagine the body as an idealized stick of length L, somewhat heavier at
    the upper end than the lower.  This stick can be lanaced vertically on
    the floor.  If it displaced from the vertical by a small initial angle
    theta[0] it will start toppling, and the angle theta will increase at
    an accelerating rate. 
    
    He gives the equation
    
        mgR[c]sin(theta) = I(alpha) = m(R[g])**2(alpha)
    
    Where
      
       m = mass of of the body
       g = acceleration due to gravity
       R[c] = the distance from the point of support (I assume the floor)
          to the center of gravity.
       I = moment of inertia of the body toppling around an axis thru
         the point of support (I assume the point is where the idealized body
         - or stick - touches the floor)
       R[g] = radius of gyration  = sqrt(I/m)
       alpha = toppling  angular accelaration
    
    Since theta is small, he substitutes theta for sin(theta).  Ok - so far
    I follow.  But then he waves his hands and says
    
       theta = theta[0] cosh(Kt)
    
    where 
    
        theta[0] is the initial angular displacement
        K = sqrt(gR[c])/R[g]
    
    What is the differential equation he uses and solves to get this?
    
    
    
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1320.1PE+KE= constantSMAUG::ABBASISun Oct 28 1990 22:5136
I'll give this a try:

Potential energy + kinetic energy = K (constant)
    
     i=Number of particles in body
Let ---
    \   M(i) L(i)^2   = K1   (represents Moment of inertia about rotaion axis)
    /    
    ---
    i=1
where M(i)= mass of particle i, L(i)= distance of particle i from axis of
rotation.

     i=Number of particles in body
Let ---
    \   M(i) L(i)   = K2   (to use with potional energy calcualtions)
    /    
    ---
    i=1
    
                                                  .
so  g(K2 cos(phi)) + (1/2) Moment of inertia * ( w )^2
       . 
where  w = angular velocity = d(phi)/dt

but Moment of inertia about the axis of rotation= K1

so: g k2 cos(phi) +1/2 K1 (d(phi)/dt)^2 = K

 d(phi)/dt = SQRT (   (k- g k2 cos(phi)) /  (1/2  K1) )

integrate and solve for phi, the integration constants found from
initial conditions, phi=0 at t=0.

/naser   
    
1320.2TRACE::GILBERTOwnership ObligatesMon Oct 29 1990 20:112
    In this problem, you should take care regarding whether the dancer's feet
    slide, or stay in the same spot.
1320.3bumping into realityCSSE::NEILSENI used to be PULSAR::WALLYTue Oct 30 1990 14:483
.0 is not considering another common case, where the dancer has a significant
linear momentum.  This can translate to a large angular momentum around the
fixed point, whether it is the floor or some part of another dancer.
1320.4depending on directionsSMAUG::ABBASIWed Oct 31 1990 01:4915
    ref .-1
    if you have a rod of length L moving at constant speed V from left to
    right, at one point it starts to tilt to the right at the top only
    while the lower point still in contact with the floor and moving
    at the same speed V. so in this case it is the same as if the rod
    was not moving, since the speed is uniform, it is equivelant to
    stationary rod (right ?).
    now if the rod had an accelaration ACC from left to right also, then
    and the rod started to tilt from the top to the left, Then the linear
    accelaration will have an effect of reducing the angular velosity
    of the top point of the rod, since both are movin from left to right ,
    but if the accelaration was from right to left, and the top of
    the rod tilted to the right, then the fall will be in less time,
    (right?)
    /naser
1320.5typoSMAUG::ABBASIWed Oct 31 1990 01:528
    ref .-1 
    for whateve its is worth, I meant to say
    
>    now if the rod had an accelaration ACC from left to right also, then
>    and the rod started to tilt from the top to the left, Then the linear
                                                     ^^^^
                                               should be "right"
    
1320.6a slight clarificationCSSE::NEILSENI used to be PULSAR::WALLYWed Oct 31 1990 14:547
>    if you have a rod of length L moving at constant speed V from left to
>    right, at one point it starts to tilt to the right at the top only
>    while the lower point still in contact with the floor and moving
>    at the same speed V. so in this case it is the same as if the rod

Right, for your case.  But the case I was thinking of is where the lower point,
in contact with the floor, becomes stationary.  Ouch!
1320.7solutionHERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadFri Nov 02 1990 10:3583
1320.8direct answer to the questions in .0HERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadFri Nov 02 1990 13:1471
1320.9yet moreEAGLE1::BESTR D Best, sys arch, I/OFri Nov 02 1990 13:2430
re .0:

>    What is the differential equation he uses and solves to get this?

:	=	2nd derivative wrt time

                        :
Cancel m and substitute theta for alpha:
         :
R[g]^2 * theta = g*R[c] * sin( theta )


Substitute theta for sin( theta ) and divide through by R[g]^2:
:
theta = ( g*R[c]/R[g]^2 ) * theta


Bring theta term to left:
:
theta - ( g*R[c]/R[g]^2 ) * theta  =  0


Call the coefficient of theta 'k'.

Goto PHYSICS notesfile # 159.1 and compare this diff eqn with the bead
equation making the substitutions:

	theta		<->	r
	theta[0]	<->	R
	k		<->	W1
1320.10is this right?HERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadWed Nov 07 1990 09:3959