Conference rocks::weight_control

    Too bad you can't participate of on the notes file directly. I was
    very moved by your entry via Kristy. I wish you were closer so I
    could give you the hugs and comfort you obviously need but for now,
    this conference will have to do.
    
    Don't take this the wrong way but from one who has been there -
    NO MATTER WHAT THE COST OR DIFFICULTIES, GET YOURSELF INTO THERAPY
    WITH A PSYCHOLOGIST (preferably one with eating disorders as a
    specialty) RIGHT AWAY!!!!! Being fat is one thing but being depressed
    over being fat is a bigger problem. You must work out the first
    before you will be comfortable at succeeding in weight loss.
    
    Analogy:  If you have headaches all the time, taking pain killers
    might solve the pain problem but does nothing for the tumor that
    was causing the headaches. In fact, masking the true cause and not
    dealing with the tumor only makes it worse. So deal with the real
    problem which is the root of your depression and the symptoms, your
    100 extra pounds, will be easier to clear up.
    
    Best of luck, hope to see your fowarded notes again. 
    
    Joel

Please, please, please DON'T DO IT FOR HIM, DO IT FOR YOU!!!

You're caught in a vicious cycle that kind of goes like this:

I'm fat, so I'm not worth it
  I'm not worth it, so I'll eat more and get fatter
    I'm fatter, so I'm not worth it, so now I'll buy my clothes at <your least
    favorite discount store that sells polyester knits in size 20+>
      I look like sh** in these polyester knits so I know I'm not worth it

And on and on.  It really feeds on itself.

I agree 10000000% with .1, please get therapy.  You are NOT a crybaby, you
are on the right track by starting to seek help here.  You need to learn
to turn some of your energy inward and start seeing yourself from the
inside out.  Maybe you do have problems with sex that have nothing to do
with being overweight.  How scary to think that they might not go away if
you become slender.  Therapy will help.

The reason I stressed to do it for yourself is that YOU are the only person
you will live with for the rest of your life.  You must realize that you
are worth it (much easier said than done).  What if you got slender and
he left you then?!  Your reason for being slender just walked out the door.
BUT, you still have YOU!!

Perhaps a different health club would be better for YOU.  I prefer the Y
because the women there aren't so in to wearing leotards with legs cut up
to the armpits and down to the navel.  Maybe going at a different time
without your husband would be better for YOU.  I know the Y here offers
special classes for people who are very heavy.  Don't know about your
location.  Our's also offers a substantial discount to DECCIES.

Don't step on the scale everyday, make it once a week.  Also, take your
measurements and check those every now and again.

Reward yourself for any progress you make.  It's a real challange to 
eat only half a steak if you're used to eating the whole thing!  So, go
get a manicure or buy a book you've been wanting to read.  Treat yourself
as you would treat your bestfriend.

Please keep in touch with us!!  WE CARE!

Please feel free to contact me by mail or phone if you need a boost.
You can remain completely anonomous if you would like.  I'd be happy to
just provide a voice on the other end of the phone.

Liz
523-2793 DTN
719-260-2793 (Colorado)

    My heart goes out to you; *please* don't get down on yourself because you
    need to ask for help.  A lot of us in this conference know the despair
    you're in the middle of feels like; wanting to help others through it is
    part of why we're here.  It's not in your head, and it's entirely valid
    and justified.  Don't ever let anyone tell you that you shouldn't feel
    the way you do; there are reasons for it.  You *can* work through it, but
    you have to accept it first (a lesson I'm still learning!).

    .1 and .2 are right on target about therapy.  If you've never been in
    therapy it can be scary, but just remember that no one is going to force
    you to talk about things you're not ready to address yet.  When you're in
    the middle of emotional problems, it helps a lot to have someone you can
    talk to who doesn't have their own emotional issues with you (such as
    your husband or a random friend).  If you don't have any idea where to
    go for therapy, I'd suggest the EAP (employee assistance program) as the
    first place to go; they should know what resources are available, and
    they're a benefit of your employment at Digital.

    At some point, though possibly not right away, you'll probably want your
    husband to join you for counseling.  A therapist may be able to help him
    learn how to be supportive of you, in ways that won't be a burden to him.
    It can be difficult to know what to say when to a person who 

    The fact that you're working out on a regular basis is great; try not to
    think of it just in terms of your weight.  There's more to fitness than
    the number on the scale.  Also, even if you're not losing weight, the
    exercise will help you to hold steady.  I try to make that my goal
    whenever circumstances (usually my emotional state) prevent me from
    actively losing.

    I'd like to join Liz in offering support in mail or by phone.  Feel free
    to call or write anytime; you're far from alone in this.

    (:) <-------a hug
    Beverly
    DTN 264-5366
    home 603-641-9398

    PS: Thanks, Kristy, for acting as messenger!  You're one of the most
    	caring people I know.  We miss you at MKO!

    Please, please, please, get some help!  Therapy will make it so much
    easier.  I agree with the other replies.  It's been said before, but
    I'll repeat it, do it for YOURSELF.  It sounds like your husband could
    also use some therapy if he is blaming things on your weight.  If you
    want to lose weight for yourself, find some therapy and a food plan
    that you can handle.  Since you don't have access to notes, I'll list a
    few here:  Weight Watchers.  They have support meetings, you are
    supposed to go once a week, but can go more often.  The plan allows you
    to eat just about anything but in limited quantities and teaches you
    how to do that, while also teaching good, nutritious eating habits. 
    There is the Diet Center, the Weight Loss Clinic, etc.  Also, one of
    the most drastic (I think) is the Opti-Fast, which is supervised by
    medical personnel and is a fast with powders mixed with water providing
    nutrition.  Check with your doctor; he or she can provide you with a
    basic food plan to follow that should you.  Become aware of nutrition
    guidelines and calorie counts; sometimes a change in simple things will
    make a difference (Example, switching from eating a bagel to an English
    muffin saves approx 200 calories).    
    
    Keep up the exercise; it's good for you, and helps relieve stress.  I
    agree with the previous noter who said to go at a different time than
    your husband.  Then you could concentrate on your exercise program and
    not have him distracting you.  Go when you are comfortable; find out
    when the place has few people in it and try to go then.
    
    Feel good about you; you care and are trying; that's what counts.
    Reward yourself for being good; If I go to exercise 3 times this week,
    I will: 1. get myself that new book I've been wanting  2.  Take a long
    bubble bath  3. Rent that movie I've been wanting to (and watch it)!
    There are all sorts of rewards.
    
    Remember, we care!
    
    

    Another place to look for support is Overeaters Anonymous.  They're free,
    and the basic set-up is similar to AA.  I've never been to them (I've
    been successful with Weight Watchers, but they're less into the spiritual
    side of things than OA).  I know of quite a few people who've been helped
    there.

    If you consider something like Opti-fast, be very sure that it's right
    for you before committing to it, and realize that reaching goal weight
    will not make all your problems go away (carefree, happy-all-the-time
    lives are a myth).  You'll also need to learn new eating habits after
    the fast, to keep the weight off (harder for some people than the fast).

    Beverly

    I haven't written much in this notesfile lately, but your note has
    really moved me. I can only support what other people have already
    said before, about getting some help from outside, be it a therapist,
    or OA, or any other organization/person. Your husband can't really
    understand your problem because he doesn't have it, and if you are
    "ashamed" of yourself around him, then he won't be able to help
    you anyway.
    
    I have just gone through a period of depression myself, and I kept
    crying all the time - sometime in front of the children, which made
    me even more unhappy about myself - and accusing my husband of all
    sorts of things he hadn't done and probably wouldn't dream of doing.
    
    I managed to snap out of it "by myself", mostly because my husband
    was very supportive and very patient ... and also because the days
    are getting longer again, and the winter has not been too cold,
    and maybe for other unformulated reasons, but this may not be possible
    for you, depending on how depressed you are already.
    
    I send you many big hugs, though I won't propose to talk to you
    over the phone ... as I live in Switzerland!
    
    In empathy,   Joana
                       

    Reaching out and asking for help is not being a "crybaby".  Give
    youself some credit for doing the asking.  It's not easy.  I have been
    there too.  All I can do is echo all the other folks who have already
    replied here.  But I do believe therapy is the best way to begin.  I
    have an eating disorder and have been struggling with therapy for 
    awhile and have finally found some peace through my therapist and
    working a program of recovery.  It is a lot of work, and when I feel
    like I am not worth it, I have to tell myself that I AM.  So are you!
    But do it for yourself, not to make someone else happy.  By working on
    myself, my relationships with the people in my life gets better.
    Thank you for putting your note here and giving me the chance to give
    back some of what I have been given.  Help is only a phone call away.
    
    Judy
    237-2388

2 things,

  1:  You said you've been overweight forever,  therefore I conclude you were
fat when you got married and this is not something that has developed in the
last 7 years. I don't know your situation, but I suspect your fears of your
husband leaving you are mostly rooted in your low self-esteem,  you think he
doesn't like you because YOU DON'T LIKE YOU.  Not to  be repetitive, but lose
the weight, get the help, do whatever it takes for YOU because it's what YOU
want, it's what YOU need, not because it is something you need to do to KEEP
him.
      I've been married 17 years, 6 months and 3 days (not all blissful, but
I'm not complaining). Once two people have been together a few years, the
importance of physical appearance which may have brought you together initially
is now minimal. Of much greater value is your attitude, confidence, support,
fidelity, humor, personality, common goals, common concern for each other and
the outside world. 

   2: I would like to believe that you CAN directly participate in this  notes
file. What you need to do is have someone provide you and  account on their
machine, and you can SET HOST to that account to  participate in NOTES. Surely
someone can provide this service.

Hang in there, whoever you are.  Keep in touch...

Al

    
    It sounds as though you are depressed because you feel helpless.
    The bottom line is--you are not helpless, even though it feels that
    way most of the time.  What you need is a good, supportive environment.
    You need to meet people who have been where you are now--people
    who feel good about themselves and who can help you to feel good
    about yourself too.
    
    Try going to at least 3-4 meetings of Overeater's Anonymous.  It's
    not for everyone, but if you feel as though you're powerless over
    food, then it may be for you.  I know about it because a very close
    friend of mine went there--even though she felt a little wierd the
    first couple of times.  She's still going--she's lost over 50 lbs.--and
    she looks and feels great.  She does it "one day at a time."
    
    Try it and see.  You also might want to look into Optifast--but
    my impression is that Optifast is a "quick fix."  If you don't change
    (or learn how to change) your eating habits, the weight will come
    right back on--and then some (example: my secretary's mother who
    lost 80 lbs. and put on 95 lbs.--net gain: 15 lbs.).  Anyway, if
    you decide to go with Optifast, going to Overeater's Anonymous meetings
    at the same time, or going to a therapist specializing in eating
    disorders might be a good idea.
    
    Good luck.  We hear you and we're with you (PS  this is the first
    time I've written in this conference--your note really got me. 
    Just know that you're valuable and worthwhile).
    
    Bonnie
    
    

    Dear Kristy's friend,
    
    Because of your note and note #45 in this conference..I went to EAP and
    got some guidance. I begin regular therapt next Monday the 20th.
    Luckily, my problem is not as severe as yours. My husband has always
    been gentle and supportive of me. I was fat when we married and I'm
    about 30 pounds fatter now. I'm proud to have a husband who doesn't
    judge me for my size and so I think my undertaking may be a little
    easier for me. I recognize the fact that I'm not "in control" with my
    eating habits any more. I don't know what the answers are yet, I'm not
    even real sure of the questions. ;-) But I do know that I need help to
    get started in the proper direction and get some control over my the
    way I view food. My love is with you...I pray that you are able to take
    all the information that is being shared here and apply it to your own
    life. When you need an ear...a shoulder...or anything...please do send
    mail...perhaps we can help each other.
                                            With love,
                                             -sunny-

    	Dear Kristy's friend,
    
    	I am replying to this note to add my support.  Like many others,
    I am in the 100+ club.  It has taken me many years to come to terms
    with this.  What I have learned, is simply this.  
    	You have to like yourself, for what you see in yourself, is what 
    others of any worth will see in you as well.  There is a great deal of
    bigotry that an overweight person has to deal with.  YOU have to
    believe in yourself and have confidence in your abilities.  I know
    this is difficult, but by all means, use the resources available.
    It is YOUR life, it doesn't mean diddly what others think.  As has
    already been stated, you have already taken the first step by asking
    Kristy to post your note.  By all means don't stop there.  Talking
    to others about a problem does not necessarily cause the problem
    to go away.  What it does do is 1) let you know that you are not
    alone 2) help you view your problem from a different angle, and
    3) ultimately helps you to help yourself.
    	You are by no means a "crybaby", only honest and by the sound
    of it, scared.  I have not been active in this notes file, however
    as I too am in the "Change my eating habits" stage, I soon will
    be.  My apologies for rambling (It comes from reading notes well
    past my bed time.)  If you would like to talk, please send me mail.
    My node address is EMASS::SICA.
    
    						Paul Sica
    
    P.S.  Thanks Kristy for posting your friends message.

    Like several others in this note, I am also a first time responder
    to this notes file.  This note hit home with me because I've had
    very similar feelings with my husband ... I'm now about 50 pounds
    heavier than I was when we were married 2 1/2 years ago.  I went
    through a very bad year (problems at home and at work) and just
    ate and ate and ate ... not only did I gain weight, but the problems
    seemed to get worse.  I felt worse about myself and just kept eating.
    
    My husband is also thin, but in my case I'm lucky - because he's
    been very supportive.  I also go through periods where I can't
    understand how he could still love me ... because I feel so bad
    about myself.  But his answer always is that its 'his job' to love
    me, and while he would prefer a thinner wife, he doesn't love me
    any less.  It has impacted our 'physical' relationship as well ...
    because he's so thin, it makes me much more self conscious.  You're
    not alone in this department at all.
    
    I've been a life time dieter (since age 5, actually), but this
    time around I knew I was heavier than I had ever been in my entire
    life.  I kept putting off dieting programs (which I've done so many
    times before), because I was just plain scared of getting ON the
    scale.  I finally decided to join Weight Watchers right here at
    work, and (fortunately) I had a co-worker who insisted that I go
    with her to the first meeting.  Otherwise I might have backed down.
    To make it easier, didn't look at the scale when I was weighed in,
    and then didn't weigh in again for another 2 weeks.  By then I had
    a decent loss and had started to feel motivated.  And once you're
    motivated, its easier to stay with a diet.
    
    Several points here - first, when you're very overweight, the weight
    comes off fairly quickly at the beginning - like 3-5 pounds a week,
    versus the 1-2 pounds a week for the anorexics (anyone under 150
    lbs, at least in my opinion).  Secondly, once you lose your first
    10-20 pounds you start to feel more motivated - and its easier to
    stay with the diet.  And finally, at a group meeting like Weight
    Watchers you're in a room with a group of people JUST LIKE YOURSELF-
    my biggest fear was that I was going to be the fattest person in
    the room.  I may have been in the top 5 - but that means there were
    at least 5 other people who also had a way to go.
    
    As for exercise - I love to ski, and when I'm thinner consider myself
    to be fairly active. But with all this weight I have a very difficult
    time of exercising - the last time I tried to ski I had to stop
    every 100 feet or so just to rest and catch my breath.  Rather than
    exercising you might want to consider a "fun" activity - like
    raquetball, or karate (lots of cute guys), or even swimming. That
    way you won't be surrounded by leotard exercise kittens.  In the
    past I've found that I'm more motivated to stay with something like
    that, rather than going to a gym or spa.
    
    And as for your husband, hang in there.  Not to put down men, but
    he is of the male species ... and if there's sexy women to look
    at, most men will look.  (Of course if he starts to drool and foam
    at the mouth thats another issue) - but it doesn't mean he's going
    to run off with someone else.  You might want to channel him into
    a sport (like raquetball) with you, so he has less to look at. 
    It works two ways - I always find myself looking at the hunks at
    the gym as well.  As long as you just look and don't touch though,
    it seems to be okay.
                                              
    A final word on diets - i have also tried them all.  What I found
    is that the diets that deprive you (e.g., liquid diets, special
    foods in cans, or mostly salad diets) are the WORST ones to go on.
    You'll lose the weight quickly, but once you're free you'll want
    to make up for all the food you COULDN'T eat for months - I lost
    35 pounds the last time around, and then gained back 50.  Because
    all I could eat was salad, chicken, and fish for 4 months on that
    diet.  
    
    Because of that I highly recommend Weight Watchers - in my
    case they have a lot of sweets, which is my downfall.  But on the
    diet I can eat a Weight Watchers brownie or cake or ice cream, fill
    my craving, and still stay "legal".  Last week they added wine to
    their list, and I've heard that in coming weeks they'll even teach
    us how to eat in restaurants.  And of course the frozen dinners
    (I actually prefer Lean Cuisine myself) are so easy when you come
    home from work, and are hungry NOW.  Its a very easy diet to follow,
    because in some ways it doesn't even feel like dieting.
    
    Good luck - if you would like to send mail to discuss any of this
    further, please feel free to do so, at CIMNET::MILLER - 
    
    Robin                                                  

    Robin,

    Most of your note contains some really good comments and helpful advice,
    but the line about

> the anorexics (anyone under 150 lbs, at least in my opinion).

    calls to me for comment.  Anorexia is a real disease, similar in some
    ways to Compulsive Overeating (which you and I suffer from).  Both are
    compulsive behaviors toward food.  Will you suddenly be anorexic the day
    you successfully reach a weight under 150?

    All of us who have problems dealing with food need to work together to
    educate each other and the rest of the world about the difference between
    these diseases and a lack of willpower.  There are people with both
    problems in the Eating Disorders conference; you might be surprised at
    how similar the stories sound.

    Beverly

    Re -1:
    
    Thank you Beverly.  You took the words right out of my mouth...
    
    
    Jayne
    

    	One point however, to say that some one LOOKS anerexic is not
    the same as saying someone has anerexia.  Several people that I
    know look anerexic, ie too thin for their bone structure. (They
    have looked that way for many years, runs in their family im told.)
    
    Beverly, your response is appropriate in the sense that a weight
    # does not make one anerexic.
    
    						Paul