Conference rocks::weight_control

772.0. "Burning Fat [from the Internet]" by ASICS::LESLIE (Suicide is painful) Wed Oct 07 1992 17:49

Article: 4612
Xref: rdg.dec.com misc.fitness:11452 rec.running:4612
Newsgroups: misc.fitness,rec.running
Path: rdg.dec.com!news.crl.dec.com!deccrl!decwrl!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!linac!att!princeton!phoenix.Princeton.EDU!rks
From: rks@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Ramesh K. Sitaraman)
Subject: Fat Burning Primer
Message-ID: <1992Sep29.062604.10132@Princeton.EDU>
Originator: news@nimaster
Sender: news@Princeton.EDU (USENET News System)
Nntp-Posting-Host: phoenix.princeton.edu
Organization: Princeton University
References: <1992Sep24.202957.26082@crpmks.uucp> <1992Sep28.162914.27105@exu.ericsson.se>
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1992 06:26:04 GMT
Lines: 46
 
There seems to be a lot of debate and a few misconceptions about
Fat burning, Stamina etc. Here are a few basics. They are based on
standard scientific sources.
 
1. There are 3 sources of energy : Muscle glycogen, Liver Glycogen,
Fat (triglycerides).
 
2. During excercise the glucose and fatty acid in the blood is utilised.
Fatty acid in blood stream is utilised in preference to glucose 
for various reasons. (There are organs like the brain that can use only
one ene{gy source : glucose)
 
3. Then why can't we run on fat FOREVER ??? Because the fatty acid 
concentration in blood can never be much. In fact, it seldom
exceeds (in Molars) the concentration of Glucose !!! Why this
"transportation problem" for fats ?? There ain't much Albumin to
transport the fat and fat in excess in blood stream will deposit on
viens constrict and more directly cause blood clots and kill you !!!
 
4. As you workout aerobically, the fat acids start increasing in concentration
in the blood stream. SO LONGER YOU WORK OUT THE GREATER PERCENTAGE OF WHAT
YOU BURN IS FAT ! But remmeber that the fat concentration cannot 
go up too much. Only about 50 percent of your energy can come from fat.
 
5. So what happens if I run out of glucose ? Can I run on fat ?
Very Very painfully perhaps. Genrally your glucose will last about
17 to 18 miles. Then you run out causing the famous WALL in the marathon.
 
6. Only long sustained exercise ( 30 -40 mins) is guaranteed to burn
fat (see fat mobilisation etc above). I have seen it work on me and 
others. I dont know what zip code these other guys are from.
 
7. Some person said doing exercise with breaks as being better
for burning fat. Not true. Neither does it build stamina.
(Doing intervals to build stamina is fine. But it should not constitute
more than small fraction of your total excercise duration. Most
of it should be of the long continous endurance building type.)
 
 
		-Ramesh 
 
-- 
ARPA:  rks@cs.princeton.edu  
       rks@phoenix.princeton.edu 
AT&T:  (609) 683 5394 (Home)  
       (609) 258 1794 (Off) 

Article: 4619
Xref: rdg.dec.com misc.fitness:11478 rec.running:4619
Newsgroups: misc.fitness,rec.running
Path: rdg.dec.com!news.crl.dec.com!deccrl!caen!sdd.hp.com!think.com!ames!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!ucla-cs!ficus.cs.ucla.edu!page
From: page@ficus.cs.ucla.edu (Thomas Page)
Subject: Re: Fat Burning Primer
Message-ID: <1992Sep29.155747.24138@cs.ucla.edu>
Sender: usenet@cs.ucla.edu (Mr Usenet)
Nntp-Posting-Host: wingfield.cs.ucla.edu
Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department
References: <1992Sep24.202957.26082@crpmks.uucp> <1992Sep28.162914.27105@exu.ericsson.se> <1992Sep29.062604.10132@Princeton.EDU>
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 92 15:57:47 GMT
Lines: 99
 
In article <1992Sep29.062604.10132@Princeton.EDU>, rks@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Ramesh K. Sitaraman) writes:
|> There seems to be a lot of debate and a few misconceptions about
|> Fat burning, Stamina etc. Here are a few basics. They are based on
|> standard scientific sources.
 
Ramesh:  Thanks for raising the scientific level of the discussion.  This is
not a flame, just a few additions.
 
 
|> 
|> 1. There are 3 sources of energy : Muscle glycogen, Liver Glycogen,
|> Fat (triglycerides).
 
There is also blood glycogen.  This is what the brain runs off of.
 
|> 
|> 2. During excercise the glucose and fatty acid in the blood is utilised.
|> Fatty acid in blood stream is utilised in preference to glucose 
|> for various reasons. (There are organs like the brain that can use only
|> one ene{gy source : glucose)
 
Muscle glycogen is used before blood or liver glycogen.  When you carbo load
before a race, you are packing in the muscle glycogen.  You only have a few
minutes supply of blood glycogen once you start using that for running. 
 
|> 
|> 3. Then why can't we run on fat FOREVER ??? Because the fatty acid 
|> concentration in blood can never be much. In fact, it seldom
|> exceeds (in Molars) the concentration of Glucose !!! Why this
|> "transportation problem" for fats ?? There ain't much Albumin to
|> transport the fat and fat in excess in blood stream will deposit on
|> viens constrict and more directly cause blood clots and kill you !!!
|> 
 
Noakes' book "Lore of Running" phrases it as "fat burns in a glycogen flame."
Even a lean marathoner has a virtually unlimited supply of fat.  But you are
limited in your ability to mobilize the fat from the stores (fat deposits you
know where), and you have the limited amount of glycogen needed to burn along
with the fat.
 
 
|> 4. As you workout aerobically, the fat acids start increasing in concentration
|> in the blood stream. SO LONGER YOU WORK OUT THE GREATER PERCENTAGE OF WHAT
|> YOU BURN IS FAT ! But remmeber that the fat concentration cannot 
|> go up too much. Only about 50 percent of your energy can come from fat.
|> 
|> 5. So what happens if I run out of glucose ? Can I run on fat ?
|> Very Very painfully perhaps. Genrally your glucose will last about
|> 17 to 18 miles. Then you run out causing the famous WALL in the marathon.
 
The "17 to 18 miles" part is too simplistic.  Many of us have run marathons
without hitting the wall.  The elite marathoners almost never hit the wall.
Ultra runners run 30, 50 or 100 miles without hitting the wall.  Your rate
of glycogen usage is a complex function of your running efficiency, what
percentage of VO2max you run (typically 85% for an all out marathon), what
your VO2max is, how much glycogen you are able to store in your muscles, your
state of fitness, etc.
 
|> 
|> 6. Only long sustained exercise ( 30 -40 mins) is guaranteed to burn
|> fat (see fat mobilisation etc above). I have seen it work on me and 
|> others. I dont know what zip code these other guys are from.
 
I'm not sure what you are talking about concerning zip codes.  During the first
10 minutes of exercise, you burn almost exclusively glycogen.  From 10-30
minutes, you gradually increase the percentage of energy from fat, and hit a
plateau between 30 and 40.  So, keep running beyond 30-40 and you will keep
burning a maximum amount of fat.  The real magic of the 30-40 minute range is
that if you stop running there, you will continue to burn a large percentage of
fat, for several hours.
 
|> 
|> 7. Some person said doing exercise with breaks as being better
|> for burning fat. Not true. Neither does it build stamina.
|> (Doing intervals to build stamina is fine. But it should not constitute
|> more than small fraction of your total excercise duration. Most
|> of it should be of the long continous endurance building type.)
 
For the reason stated above, taking short breaks will not cause you to stop
burning fat.  If by taking walking breaks in the middle of your long runs you
can keep going significantly longer, then taking walking breaks will increase
the fat you burn.  Also, if you are training for a marathon, you need to get in
those 3+ hour runs.  If you need a couple of walking breaks to keep going that
long, you are better off taking them than quitting at 16 miles.  Of course, if
you can't run continuously for 3+ hours what you are concerned about is finishing
the marathon, not racing it fast, so by all means take walking breaks.  If you
want to get fast, train until you don't have to walk.
|>
|> 
|> 		-Ramesh 
|> 
|> -- 
|> ARPA:  rks@cs.princeton.edu  
|>        rks@phoenix.princeton.edu 
|> AT&T:  (609) 683 5394 (Home)  
|>        (609) 258 1794 (Off) 
 
Tom
page@cs.ucla.edu
    

    Maybe the person who mentioned taking breaks between exercising meant
    not to raise your heart rate too much.
    For example:  lowering your arms at intervals while doing step aerobics 
    instead of doing arm work the whole time?  It's a known fact that if
    the heart rate is raised too much, you stop burning fat, and start to 
    use muscle tissue. 
    
     

    When they say that if you exercise for 30-40 minutes, you continue to
    burn fat for several hours afterwards, what do they mean by "30-40
    minutes"?  Is that 30-40 minutes off heart-at-target-rate or 30-40
    minutes total?
    
    I do aerobics...the whole class, including warm-up, cool down and
    toning exersizes lasts an hour, so I am probably only at my target
    heart rate for 20-30 minutes.
    
    Diana

    I think that that's good.  Kathy Smith explains it in detail on her Fat
    Burning tape. You might rent it to get the info.
    
    
    Donna

.2>  Is that 30-40 minutes of heart-at-target-rate
    
    Yes.