Conference rocks::weight_control

    Whenever you make anything that calls for browning ground beef,
    pork, turkey, or sausage, try doing the following:
    
    Take a large plastic colander (Rubbermaid makes one, others are
    readily available also) and put it in a microwave-safe dish so that
    the bottom of the colander is at least 2 inches above the bottom
    of the dish.
    
    Put the meat into the colander.  Microwave on high for 2 - 3 minutes
    (depending on amount of meat), stir, cook 1 - 2 minutes, stir, cook
    1 minute, ...  Do this till it's done.
    
    You won't BELIEVE how much gross fat ends up in the bottom of the
    dish!!!!  Yuk!
    
    Since I'm now on WW program, I blot the meat with paper towels after
    I finish cooking it, which removes even more fat.
    
    Trust me, the flavor and texture are not affected by this method
    in any way whatsoever!
    
    							Pat
    

And yet another fat-reducing cooking technique.  Whenever a sauce recipe
calls for melting butter then adding flour, then stirring in the milk
I mix the milk with the flour then heat that mixture.  I never could get
the flour to mix well with the melted butter.

:-).

liz

    Interesting you should mention that.  I recently made a casserole
    from a recipe in the current issue of Cooking Light.  It had a white
    sauce base, and I was surprised to note that the white sauce was
    made from nothing but milk and flour.  Worked like a charm!!!
    
    							Pat
    

    I hav found that most of the fat called for in main-dish recipies
    (as opposed to baked items) can be eliminated, especially if you
    have non-stick pans (such as Silverstone).  I have successfully used
    1 teaspoon of fat (oil, margarine or butter) for each tablespoon
    called for when I use my Silverstone pans.  Sometimes I can get  
    away with no fat at all, using just a spray of PAM.  I've even made 
    omlettes this way!
                                                                         
    Lynn T.

Steaming veggies with soy sauce in the steaming water adds flavor and also 
keeps all the healthy-stuff in the veggies rather than it seeping into the 
water.

    I agree with .4 about using Silverstone; you can easily cut out a lot of
    fat that way.  Also, Baker's Secret pans rarely need to be greased.  If
    there's any fat at all in the recipe, it won't stick.

    As an example, I made cornbread to stuff my (last year's! :-) Digital
    Turkey; The recipe called for greasing the pan, but it popped right out
    even though I didn't grease it at all!

    Re: .1: Regular plastic can meltdown in the microwave; Tupperware makes
    an Ultra 21 bowl & colander set that's approved for microwave use, and
    can take the heat.  They are expensive, but they do have a lifetime
    guarantee (no, I don't work for T-ware, though I am having a party
    tomorrow evening...).

    Beverly

    This isn't really a cooking hint...it's more of a preparation trick:
    
    Have you tried balsamic vinegar?  This stuff is the greatest salad
    dressing available.  It doesn't taste like vinegar.  It is distilled
    a special way (don't ask me how, I don't know) and it has the most
    wonderful rich flavor that I can't describe.  It isn't cheap, but
    it is very concentrated and a teaspoonful will be plenty for one
    serving of salad.
    
    And the best part is (as nearly as I can figure) - It has NO calories!
    
    It's so great that I, a dedicated dressing lover, now find the idea
    of oil on my salad downright repulsive.
    
    Lynn T.

    I have a question about cooking with wine and liquor.  If the dish
    is heated enough to evaporate the alcohol, leaving only the flavor,
    then are the calories less or the same than if the dish isn't heated.
    In other words, do any of those little calories go up in smoke???
    
    							Hopefully,
    							Pat

.8>    In other words, do any of those little calories go up in smoke???

    	Yes.
    
    -mike z

    So how do I count the calories when, say I put 1/2 cup of wine in
    a sauce and then cook all the alcohol out of it?
    
    							Pat

    	I assume the same number of calories.
    
    	There's still lots of sugar and alcohol left even after you
    simmer it for a while.  Yes, some alcohol does vaporize, but how
    much?  I'd only be guessing.
    
    -mike z

    I have a question about substituting ground turkey for ground beef.
    Last night I decided to make the Sloppy Toms recipe that appears
    elsewhere in this file, but to let it cook in the crock pot all
    day today for tonight's dinner.  I had never used ground turkey
    before.  When I browned it, I could tell absolutely no difference
    in the amount of fat that came from it and the amount I normally
    get from browning an equal amount of hamburger.  I looked at the
    label (I had bought packaged Louis Rich since my butcher had sold
    out of it), and it said at least 85% lean.  I usually buy hamburger
    that's 85% lean.  So what's the advantage of using the ground
    turkey?????
    
    							Pat

    Here's some numbers from a chart at my doctors office that might help a
    little:
    
    3 1/2 oz Lean Ground Beef, Broiled:
    
    87 MG. Cholesterol, 272 Calories, 18.5 (GR.?) Fat
    
    3 1/2 oz. Turley, Light meat, roasted, no skin:
    
    86 mg. Cholesterol, 140 Calories, 1.9 (GR. ?) Fat
    
    So, there is less fat in Turket, as well as less calories.  My guess
    might be that what cooked out of the turkey was partly water, as the
    ground turkey is ususally previously frozen.  Also, I have made turkey
    loaf and turkey burgers, and they tend to be on the dry side if you are
    not careful, due to the low fat content.
    
    Hope this helps!
    
    Val

    And I suspect that the "Light meat" was the key. As I recall 
    dark turkey meat is substantially higher in fat than the light meat.
    So, if your ground turkey has a higher ratio of dark to light you'll
    get more fat. 
    
    And what does "85% lean" mean anyway? Is it by weight or by percentage
    of calories?
    
    

.14>    And what does "85% lean" mean anyway? Is it by weight or by percentage
.14>    of calories?
    
    	By weight.
    
    -mike z

    I've been seeing those self-draining meatloaf plans lately in the
    stores.  They want about $6.00 for two loaf pans, one having holes
    in the bottom.  In addition, since I always make a half recipe for
    just the two of us, they're much bigger than I'd want.  But the
    idea is nice.
    
    Sooo...  In about ten minutes, my husband drilled out one of my
    small loaf pans with 15 holes in the bottom.  I set it in a slightly
    larger pan, and...voila...I have a self-draining meatloaf set in
    the size I want, and for a total expenditure of maybe $1.50.
    
    I used it last night, and ended up with a full quarter-inch of grease
    in the bottom of the outside pan.  So I assume it did some good.
    
    							Pat

    I have a question about frozen yogurt.  An ice cream store near
    us has the most WONDERFUL frozen yogurt in the world!  It comes
    in fruit flavors, but also in plain ol' vanilla.  None of the flavors
    I've tried has even a tiny hint of that yogurt twang -- it tastes
    for all the world like smooth, rich ice cream.
    
    Now, for my question.  I have one of those Donvier ice cream makers at
    home.  I love the thing, and make frozen yogurt in it quite often. But
    mine always has that "twang" so characteristic of yogurt, particularly
    when I make it with less than 50% fruit.  Mine is not bad, but it
    certainly isn't as good as the commercial variety I've grown to love. 
    
    OK, what's different about mine?  Well, for starters I use nonfat
    yogurt at home, while the ice cream place advertises their yogurt
    to be 96% fat free.  The only other difference I can think of is
    that I sweeten mine with Equal, while they use sugar.  Would either
    of those things cause a fairly drastic difference in the flavor??
    
    HELP!!
    
    							Pat

    My wife made me the most wonderful treat this past weekend. She
    combined a 20 Oz. low fat plain yogert with 1 package of the nutrasweet
    vanilla pudding (instnt no bake kind) and folded in a can of drained,
    unsweetened pinapple chunks. After chilling for a few hours, enjoy.
    I hear it is even better frozen but knowing how good it tastes,
    I just can't wait that long.

    On that same note, try mixing a 2 mixed alba shakes with 1/2 package
    nutrasweet pudding. Freeze 20 minutes. Yummy! My favorite is vanilla
    shake made with 1 tsp instant coffee in the cold water mixed with
    chocolate pudding.
    
    (sometimes we don't wait, too)
    

	I suspect the difference in the yogurts is the fat content and the 
	sweetness.  You could try adding more Equal.

	I've taken to making the yogurt/pineapple pudding in double batches;
	that way I can use the big (4 cup) carton of yogurt and not have to
	measure any of the ingredients!  I use crushed pineapple instead of
	chunks.

	Someone elsewhere in this conference suggested using chocolate 
	pudding mix and cherries canned in water; it's *great*!  Much less
	tart than the pineapple version.  We're going to experiment with
	other combinations -- I'm looking forward to chocolate-strawberry
	(with fresh berries!  Yum!)

	Beverly

    I'm the brave soul who experimented with chocolate pudding and
    cherries.  The best one yet, though, is pistachio pudding with crushed
    pineapple. Delicious!!!
    
   
    
    							Pat
    
    BTW, I'll try adding more Equal to my frozen yogurt tonight and
    see if it makes a difference.  I REFUSE to add fat!!!  (^;

We've got one of the small, ice cream makers that you keep in the freezer.  
When you get the ice cream blues, take it out, add plain, non-fat yogurt
and any fruit you like (fresh strawberries and bananas, canned (with no sugar)
fruit...add juice and the cut up fruit), put in the stirring blade and put on 
the lid and start stirring.  Makes excellent frozen yogurt in about 20 minutes
...at least ours does.  No need to add Nutrasweet or any other type of sweetner.
 
Judy

    re.21
    
      The banana (sp?) is pretty good too.  I haven't been able to find
    it lately though.
    
    
    Roberta

    When a recipe calls for 3 oz. of meat, does that mean pre-cooked? 
    Sarah (usually RO, but this is my second note today : )

    Yes, uncooked weight, unless otherwise specified.

    They stole the idea I had in 4.36!!
    
4.36> Brown hamburger in frying pan, then empty into strainer and run
4.36> under hot water to remove all fat. When done press the meat with
4.36> a spoon to force the remaining liquid out.
    
    
    Rinse your burger?
    
    Lat year, a widely-reported article by Boston University researchers
    offered a way to reduce the fat in ground meat.  But that was a fairly
    complicate process, involving cooking, straining, refrigerating, skim-
    ming, and remixing.
    
    Now, Univeristy of Minnesota researches have developed an easier tech-
    nique: simply brown ground meat in a non-stick pan, drain off the fat,
    pour hot water over the meat, and drain it again.  Using that process,
    the cut the fat in regular ground beef from 27% to 7%.
    
    As you might expect, some of the flavor gets drained off with the fat.
    And the meat doesn't hold together well.  So it's best for spaghetti
    sauce, casseroles, chili, and other seasoned dishes.
    
    [ source: Consumer Reports on Health, Feb92, p13 ]

    In a recipe I entered recently I made reference to "defatted chicken
    stock."  
    
    You can buy low or non-fat chicken stock (Campbell's Healthy Request is
    great) but if you have regular canned chicken stock (I usually use
    College Inn) here's what I do.  I keep a couple cans in the back of the
    frig...then when I need chicken stock, it's ready to go - all the fat
    is hardened at the top of the can and can easily be scooped out with a
    spoon.
    
    I've heard that dragging and ice cube through stock can also gather up
    the fat (it clings to the ice.)
    
    Another thing you can do is use boullion cubes or dried stock in
    packets (Ox or Knorr).  Those are very low fat as well.
    
    D!

    Even if it's not chilled, the fat will float on the top, and congeal
    into a mass.  I usually open the can and spoon the fat out.
    
    Both College Inn and Swanson have less than a tablespoon of fat per
    can (my eye says it's more like a teaspoon).
    
    Next time, after I spoon the fat out, I'll chill it and see it any more
    collects, but I can't see why it would.

    The advantage of chilling it is not that it gets more fat out, but that
    it is *easier* to get the fat out, because scooping a hard lump is
    easier than some liquid grease on the top.
    
    Also, for forgetful people like me, I often go to the cupboard, grap a
    can and drop it, turn it upside down or otherwise disturb it.  If it
    hasn't been chilled, the fat will mix in and I'll have to wait at least
    15 minutes for it to seperate out again.  If it has been chilled, no
    problem.
    
    I would be curious to see how many grams of fat is in an (un defatted)
    can of chicken stock.
    
    D!

    Diana, it's not liquid at room temps and my kitchen is at least 68F.
    
    I'm making soup tonight so I got the can out this morning, scooped the
    lump of chicken fat out with a spoon, then put the can in the fridge.
    When I took it out, there was no more fat on the surface.
    
    Unless you store your cans in a place that's warmer than my kitchen
    pantry, you shouldn't have to chill the cans.  This was College Inn
    broth, by the way.  Have you tried storing it at room temp?  Was the
    fat congealed or liquid?  Mine was nearly solid and very lumpy, not
    even close to being a liquid.

    Dunno...when I keep mine at room temp it is definitely liquid.  Any,
    it's moot now, because now I use Healthy Request chicken broth which is
    fat free, cheaper (per ounce - about $.65 for 16 oz instead of 14), and
    already fat free, no scooping or chilling required.
    
    D!

    Rice a Roni (and most other rice side dishes) taste just fine with only
    a spray of Pam in the pan, rather than the tablespoon of butter or mar-
    garine the box recommends.
    
    It doesn't brown as nicely, but that doesn't bother me at all.  One
    added benefit is that the rice and pasta absorb the water faster, so
    cooking time is reduced.  Chicken package says 15 to 20 minutes, it
    was done in about 10.

    re .32
    
    Yes, I've found this out too.  Also, I do the same thing with stuffing
    mixes.  And, as I've mentioned somewhere before, one can make packaged
    macaroni and cheese with skim milk and a minimal amount of butter. 
    Comes out to about 2 grams of fat per serving with most brands.  I
    think it tastes better this way, too.
    
    -ellie

    I've had good luck with making boxed macaroni and cheese using skim
    EVAPORATED milk - the texture comes out about the same as with
    butter...high in protein, low in fat!  mmmm
    
    
    D!

    re .34
    
    Ooooooh!  Good idea!  I've also heard of people making whipped "cream"
    out of evaporated skim milk, but I've never tried it.
    
    -ellie

    D!
    
    Do you use the evaporated skim milk in place of butter, or in addition
    to a small amount?
    
    Sounds like a great idea!  I love mac & cheese, but have cut it out of
    my "diet" due to the high fat content.  Would love to add it back in
    again in moderation.  Also, isn't there a lot of fat in the powdered
    cheese?  Dumb question considering everyone here is eating it and
    losing weight, but I always thought there was a lot of fat in it.
    
    Thanks,
    Roberta
    

    Be warned, there may still be a lot of fat left.
    
    Cheese is naturally high in fat, even if you don't add more with the
    extra butter and milk.
    
    Is there any "as packaged" information on the box?

    I use evap milk in place of both the butter and the milk - that is, no
    butter at all.  Kraft Mac+Cheese has 2 grams of fat per serving as
    packaged (ie: without the butter they tell you to add).  There is
    nutritional info on the side.  I found another brand (a store brand -
    don't remember which) that only had 1 gram of fat per serving.  Not bad
    attall.
    
    re: skim milk as whipped cream...I tried this the other day.  I mixed a
    half cup skim milk with a half ounce dried milk (equiv to a half cup
    evap) and whipped it up in to something that looked like whipped cream. 
    (It took a little longer than regular whipped cream.)  however, it
    tasted rather "empty" (for lack of a better term) and it lost it's
    whipped feeling and collapsed back in to merely frothy milk in a matter
    of minutes.  Anyone have any ideas on how to prevent that?  I added a
    little cream of tartar like I do with merangue (sp) but it didn't help.
    
    Diana

    Yes, I don't know how they do it, but that cheese powder is much lower
    in fat than you would expect.  I wish I could buy it without the
    macaroni!  I sprinkle it on popcorn -- it only takes a little bit, and
    then the popcorn tastes like REAL JUNK FOOD.... 8^}
    
    -e

    Mike,
    
    It just so happens I grocery shopped at lunch, and checked the box for
    the Kraft Mac & Cheese info.  As D! stated, it is indeed 2 grams of fat
    uprepared (without the butter and milk; the only ingredients you add to
    make the stuff).  I felt the same way you did initially.... that there
    has got to be some hidden fat in that powdered cheese!
    
    Of course purchasing the pop tarts because there was no fat free cake
    left on the shelves isn't going to do wonders for my eating habits! 
    Will have to count fat grams carefully on the days I eat those.
    
    -Roberta
    
    

    How many servings per package?

    I think there is 4.  So, like with everything, moderation is the key.
    

    Actually I think it's three servings per box, which would make it 6 g
    of fat per box.  not bad...
    
    

    Anyone have a recipe for a low-fat crust for a pie or quiche?  All the
    recipes I have seen, whether based on pastry or cracker crumbs or
    whatever are pretty high in fat.  Someone in here said once that s/he
    uses a yeast based dough to cut down fat; is there a recipe for that? 
    Would it be like making pizza dough?
    
    Tips appreciated.
    
    Diana

    Hmm, you are probably right D! (regarding the mac & cheese servings per
    box).  In any event, I tried it prepared with the evaporated skim milk
    and it is yummy!  I'll admit to using a teaspoon of whipped butter
    along with that for an extra 3 grams fat, but promptly put half the
    portion away for next day's lunch so as not to consume the entire box
    for dinner.  It was really rich and creamy with the evap. skim milk.
    

    6 grams of fat per box is nothing.
    
    Thanks for the tip Diana, I haven't had mac and cheese since college.

    I have some great ones, let me see if I can dig 'em out and my new
    recipe books has some good ones also. 
    
    Until Monday...
    
    Pauline

.39>Yes, I don't know how they do it, but that cheese powder is much lower
.39>in fat than you would expect.  I wish I could buy it without the
    
    It's lower in fat because the cheese topping isn't cheese.
    
    It's usually some salt, some whey (milk protein) and some cheese
    flavoring.

        It's usually some salt, some whey (milk protein) and some cheese
        flavoring.
     
    Mmmm, stop it Mike, you're making me hungry! :-)
    
    ---
    
    Thanks in advance for the dough recipes, Pauline.
    
    D!

    I tried the macaroni and cheese with skimmed evaporated milk.
    
    It was pretty good.
    
    Diana, how'd you learn about that?  Or did you think it up yourself?

    D! Haven't forgotten.  Got married at the beginning of December and I'm 
    getting through the remaining unpacked boxes
    
    Pauline

    Mike, I don't remember.  I think there was a note somewhere in here
    about it, or I heard it from someone who was on a diet or something.  I
    didn't think of it myself, for sure.  I always thought of Mac+Cheese as
    unredeemably Bad For You.  (Actually I heard you didn't need the butter
    - I thought of the evap milk myself because it is richer + creamier
    than regular milk, and so I use it frequently in place of recipes that
    call for cream, or milk+butter.)
    
    Pauline, no hurry, thanks!
    
    D!

    I have a question about evaporated skim milk.  Does anyone else have a
    problem with shelf life?  On two occasions, I purchased e.s.m. only to
    discover, upon opening it, curds and whey.  
    
    (The directions say to shake well before opening, but no amount of
    shaking would have recombined the rubber mass with the ooky liquid.)
    
    Any suggestions?
    
    -jer

	What's the amount of evaporated milk ?  1/2 cup ?

	Karen

    I've never had that problem with evap milk.
    
    However, lately instead of evap milk, I use dried milk mixed with
    regular skim milk (1 cup milk:1 oz dry) for about the same taste and
    texture, but without having to keep the cans around.  It works much
    better with *non-instant* dried milk.  i find the Carnation stuff
    (instant) really yucky.  I get bulk dried non-instant at Bread and
    Circus and it's great.  Not only does it make "evap milk", it is also
    good mixed in to hot cereal, muffins, etc to make them taste richer
    than plain milk.
    
    D!

.54> What's the amount of evaporated milk ?  1/2 cup ?
    
    I used about 1/4 cup, maybe a little less.
    
    Add it slowly while stirring the macaroni.  Stop when you get to the
    consistency you want. I didn't take the time to pour from the can into
    a measuring cup beforehand.

I'm probably wishing, but I love Thai food, in fact, my
favorite dish, Chicken with Panang Curry is the culprit.  


It requires a Can of Coconut Milk.  (aka, Death).

Does anyone have an alternate, low-cal way to make 
curry recipes "good" without using Coconut Milk??????


kath

    
    Kath,
    
    I'm another Thai-food lover, so your note got me thinking...
    
    What about buttermilk or evaporated skim milk flavoured with coconut
    extract?  I haven't tried it yet, but it seems worth a try for curries. 
    For something like Tum Ka Gai (chicken coconut soup) though, I would
    expect that a substitution wouldn't work.
    
    
    							/Rita
    

	This isn't a cooking hint, but it's a cooking related question,
	and I had no idea where to put it.

	Does anyone know how to estimate the weight of skin and bones
	on a chicken breast ?  The grocery store was out of boneless/skinless
	chicken breasts when I went, so I picked up regular (bone-in)
	chicken breasts.  I'm trying to figure out the approximate amount
	of chicken meat per breast.

	Thanks in advance,
	Karen

    Are they split breasts?  Depending on the size of the piece, I usually
    find that 1 piece (ie: 1/2 breast) is about 3-4 ounces of meat (after
    cooking.)
    
    D!

	Thanks!

	(yes, they were split breasts)

	Karen

    I just wanted to tell everyone that CHESTNUTS are very low in fat!
    
    I've never had chestnuts, saw them in the store for the holidays, and
    looked them up in my book.  I don't have the data here, but it was
    something like...one ounce of roasted, peeled chestnut has about 50
    calories, less than one gram of fat or protein (as opposed to most
    nuts, which are mostly fat with a little protein and very little
    carbohydrate.)
    
    So I tried them -- mmm, very sweet! 
    
    D!

    I do them in the microwave. Just carve an x in the flat side and nuke
    for a couple of minutes. You can tell when they're done, they start to
    open. I thought they were no-nos. This is great news!
    
    Amy

    I heard that if you boil sausage before you cook it, that a lot of the
    fat goes in to the water and then down the drain, instead of onto your
    thighs.
    
    So last night I tried it - usually I use turkey sausage but they were
    out so I bought regular pork Italian sausage.  I made pizza - I cut the
    sausage in to pizza-size bits and dropped them in boiling water for
    5-10 minutes.  I don't know *how* much fat you get out this way, but I
    saw a *lot* of fat go down the drain.  The sausage looked grey and
    unappetizing after boiling, but I put it on the pizza and then baked
    the pizza - when it came out, the sausage had a more familiar browned
    look to it.  It tasted delicious!
    
    I hear you can also boil and then fry sausage, too.
    
    Since I don't know how much fat it leaves in I suspect I won't do this
    often, but for when you get those sausage cravings, here's a way to do
    it with less guilt.
    
    Diana

    That's sounds like a great idea!
    
    I'm going to try that the next time I make a pizza.
    
    The last time I made a pizza I used the Schneiders Lite Kolbossa
    Sausage and cut it up into pieces and placed them nicely on the pizza.
    
    3 slices are approx 90 calories and it really tastes good when you also
    add the non-fat mushrooms, low-fat cheese, green peppers, etc.
    
    Not much fat and lots of great taste.
    
    I'm interested to know the fat %/calories in the cooked sausage you
    talked about in the previous note.
    
    J.
    

	I made Van de Kamp's Crisp and Healthy fish fillets for
	dinner the other night.  They're low fat and pretty tasty
	(they don't look as good as they taste).  I was craving
	tartar sauce, so I took a couple tablespoons of Cain's Fat
	Free mayonaise and mixed it with a couple spoonfuls of pickle
	relish.  It wasn't perfect, but it was very very close to regular
	tartar sauce.  A bit of minced onion would have perfected it (Cain's
	uses dehydrated onions in their tartar sauce.)

	Karen