[Search for users] [Overall Top Noters] [List of all Conferences] [Download this site]

Conference quokka::non_custodial_parents

Title:Welcome to the Non-Custodial Parents Conference
Notice:Please read 1.* before writing anything
Moderator:MIASYS::HETRICK
Created:Sun Feb 25 1990
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:420
Total number of notes:4370

154.0. "community property, spouses of NCPs, etc." by MEIS::TILLSON (Sugar Magnolia) Fri Aug 30 1991 15:06

I am about to be transferred to Houston, Texas.  My SO, an NCP, will be coming
with me.  His divorce is final in October, and we will be marrying at that
time.  (Nit:  Even if we did not make any legal effort to marry, we have been
cohabiting long enough to fall under Texas commonlaw marriage regulations.)

His ex-spouse and his son live in Delaware.  She divorced him in Massachusetts.
She will also be remarrying (to a merchant marine) in October.

My SO was honourably discharged from the US Army last summer.  He was in for 7
years and was an award-winning journalist/public affairs specialist.  Since his
discharge he has been unable to find work here in New England, even flipping
burgers at a fast food joint.  His divorce decree specifies no child support,
but instead specifies that he report to the court weekly with documentation
that he has applied for at least 6 jobs each week in an attempt to find
employment.  The employment situation is much better in Texas than iin
Massachusetts, and he should be able to find work right away.   In the
meantime, I am supporting him.

I understand that when one enters into a relationship with someone who has
child/ren that the child/ren are part and parcel - its a package deal.  I don't
have an issue with that.  I love my stepson very much, plan to provide for him
as well as I can.  If he ever needs/chooses to live with us, I am prepared for
that and would accept it without question.

I currently own a home (in which I have significant equity) of my own, which
will be sold during relocation.  I will be purchasing another home in Houston. 
I am making an offer on a house that is large enough that my stepson can have
his own room there, both for visits and for if/when he chooses to live with us.
Any additional money from the sale of my home here will be put into
educational bonds for my stepson and for any other children we may have later
on.  

Once again, I have no issue with contributing to *voluntary* support of my
stepson.  I am concerned, however, after reading here, about what will happen
after we are legally married (which is technically as soon as we are Texas
residents.)

I assume that after my SO starts work in Texas, the court will reassess his
child support liability.  I've seen/read about the horror stories in here about
new spouse's pay being considered in determining child support.  I have no
intention of handing over any of my pay stubs to the court, but what about tax
returns, etc.?  If we file jointly, can the courts demand his/our tax returns
and base support on my income in that manner?  Also, Texas is a community
property state.  Legally, the property that I buy there (including all the
equity from the sale of my home here) will be half his.  Can the courts take
this into account?  Fortunately (I think!?) Texas has homestead laws that say
that your home cannot be resold or foreclosed on for outstanding debts other
that nonpayment of mortgage or taxes, so at least that much should be
safe...Is it possible that my pay could be garnished for *his* child support?

Please don't think I am cold.  Once again, I wish very much to contribute
*voluntarily* to the support of my stepson - educational money, a place to
stay, plane tickets to visit dad, additional "stuff" that kids always seem to
need/want, etc...I don't even have an issue with providing the majority of the
support for my SO should the courts decide to sap his pay down to an unlivable
level (as they seem to do so often to NCPs).  But I've worked very hard over
the years to provide a decent standard of living for myself and anyone else I
*choose* to share it with.  I don't want to see that lost to me.  I don't want
to have to diminsh my lifestyle because my SO was previously ditched by woman
that had his child.  While I may *choose* to support his child (and him, for
that matter) to some extent, I don't believe I ought to be obligated to support
someone else's child.

Do any of you have any suggestions (*before* I move, marry, buy property, etc.)
on how I can protect myself?  On what sorts of legal troubles/liability I am
likely to run into?  Also, which court is likely to have jurisdiction - which
state's laws will apply?  Texas, where he lives?  Delaware, where the ex and
child live?  Massachusetts, where the divorce was issued?  

Thoughts?  Comments?  Suggestions?  Thanks.



					/Rita




T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
154.1AIMHI::RAUHHome of The Cruel SpaFri Aug 30 1991 15:313
    Rita,
    
    	Write a motion to shoot the ex. :)
154.2Free advice is worth every cent 8^)CSC32::HADDOCKAll Irk and No PayFri Aug 30 1991 16:0229
    re .1  Down George Down.:^)
    
    re .0
    
    	This brings up a lot of questions because so many states have
    so many ways of dealing with things.  May want to spend $75 or
    so on a lawyer in Mas to answer the questions about support and 
    maybe another $75 or so in Texas to get everything answered "for
    sure".  Again I am not a lawyer.  But...
    
    1) I'd look into buying the house *before* I got married.  I don't
       know if Texas's community property deals with property *before*
       marriage.  Many/most states say that anything you owned before
       marriage is *yours* not *ours*.  
    
    2) I have found that the courts are more considerate of the non-ncp/
       spouse's income when considering child support.  If filing jointly
       and you can try making a notation that the tax return includes
       *both* incomes.  May pay you to check this out with a lawyer and
       file separately if necessary.  Filing separately can cost you more
       in taxes, but save you more in the long run.  Probaly won't be
       able to get away from *all* of the expense of the situation. Even 
       though it may cost you some $$$ up front, it will probably save 
       some $$$$ in the long run.  It's better to go in with a plan of 
       action and  *know* what is going to happen and what can be done 
       about it.  Better to find out for sure now than try to *react* 
       after the &^%$# hits the fan.
    
    fred();
154.3Check on a pre-nuptual agreementLJOHUB::GODINFri Aug 30 1991 16:0728
    Rita, I can't offer you any legal advice, but I can share what has
    worked (so far) for me and my spouse (not the father of my children). 
    Prior to getting married, we reached a pre-nuptual agreement that the
    children are mine, not his, and that he is in no way responsible for
    their care, upkeep, or education.  If he voluntarily contributes toward
    these items, it will be of his own free-will and not expected or
    required because we happened to get married to each other.
    
    So far that agreement has been honored.  I hasten to add that it has
    never been put to a truly legal test.  The only test has been when I
    was required to file a financial statement when my daughter applied for
    financial aid from her college.  We were required to list my spouse's
    assets (and did), but I added a note about the pre-nuptual agreement, 
    and the college assessed the "student's custodial parent" and the 
    "student's non-custodial parent" certain amounts, but not the 
    "student's step-parents."  
    
    A lawyer (I'd suggest while you're still in Mass., a non-community
    property state) could advise you about whether a pre-nuptual agreement
    reached here would hold up, if tested, in Texas.
    
    I don't get as upset as many of the non-custodial parents in this
    conference over custody and child-support.  But I do get rabid when it
    comes to any hint that a court/school/ex-spouse could FORCE my husband
    to provide any support for children he had no involvement in begetting.
    
    Good luck.
    Karen
154.4AIMHI::RAUHHome of The Cruel SpaFri Aug 30 1991 16:2820
    Sorry got carried away. Just having fun.:) But reguardless, what ever
    happens, your marriage to this man or any other person is like a
    partnership in a business. Because of the legal rights that outside
    influences will have upon you. Just as two guys going into business and
    thier wives have nothing to do with its operation. If one of the
    partners die, the surviorship would flop over to the wife of the
    decessed partner. Hence goes the term in the busines world of "getting
    into bed with the partners." Or if there was a divorce in the
    partnership 25% of the business would belong to the non working wife of
    that 4 some. Not to get flamed on guys and gals. Just to bring up the
    points made on how our courts legally look at things in a
    rational/nonrational manner. And how it might effect you in life. 
    
    In the same mannor, depending upon how, who, what wrote the final will
    have a BIG effect upon your relationship with your new SO. So, good
    luck, have fun. And remember that there is a life after divorce.
    Hopefully the both of you will have learned from past mistakes. 
    
    I still believe writing a motion to shoot the ex is the best plan.:)
    
154.5The laws are different in every state- Bite the bullet and talk to a lawyer Bite the bullet and talk to a TExan lawyer GLOSSA::BRUCKERTFri Aug 30 1991 16:4210
		The issue/concerns your raise are all valid one. The key
	elemenet is to not do something now that will hurt you later. Talk
	to a Texan lawyer befoer you get married. First time consultations
	usually come a little cheaper anyway. An inexpesive piece of legal
	work now might save you mcuh agony later. Only a texas divorce
	lawyer would know Texas divorce law well enough to give you good advice.
	An ounce of prevention........
		PS- The cohabitation law probably doesn't apply, since you
	weren't cohabitating in Texas-but ask the lawyer.
154.6Bigamy?SRATGA::SCARBERRY_CIFri Aug 30 1991 19:334
    Just wondering?
    
    If the divorce is not final until October, then legally how can
    you and your SO be considered common-law husband/wife.  
154.7good luck in your moveLUNER::MACKINNONTue Sep 03 1991 12:4316
    
    
    I think you would have to have lived in Texas for the specified 
    amount of time to be considered married in that state.
    
    I would definately get a lawyer from Texas to discuss these issues
    with.  It will prepare you for what is coming.  A friend of mine
    was divorced in TX and for what it's worth they seem to have some
    of the best laws concerning these types of situations.  Meaning
    they seem to have one of the most equitable set of laws.
    
    I have been told that in a community property state, the only thing
    that becomes fair game is something that was purchased jointly.
    Buy your house and put it in a trust.  Noone can get at it that way.
    
    Talk to a laywer.  
154.8been there!CECV01::BEANAttila the Hun was a LIBERAL!Tue Sep 03 1991 12:5238
    the normal disclaimers apply... as one prominent (?) noter says: free
    advise is worth every penny...
    
    
    so here goes, rita..  
    
    I lived in Texas (San Antonio) for 20 years and got my divorce there in
    1988.  re:
    
    1.  community property state:  yes, Texas is a community property
    state, BUT!!! if the receipts you get from your MA. house are your
    private property, and unless someone else owns the house with you, they
    are, AND if you use those receipts to purchase a new house in TX. (even
    after you are re-married)... then that portion of the new house which
    was purchased with your private funds REMAINS YOUR PRIVATE PROPERTY! 
    This I know for fact because the exact same thing happened to me with a
    home my ex and I purchased with her own private (inheritance) funds. 
    Your private money is protected from any court action.
    
    2. Texas law SPECIFICALLY prohibits the attachment of the spouse's
    income in any computation for support from a NCP.  Texas law will
    protect YOUR income... and will use only your husband's income in
    computing child support.  The catch here is that since your SOs kids
    are NOT IN TEXAS, Texas does not have jurisdiction.  I don't know how
    the state where they live operates.  But, they would have one hell of a
    time attaching your wages from 2000 miles away, and I am sure TEXAS law
    would not do it for them.
    
    By the way, avoid, at ALL COSTS having your or your husbands wages
    garnished.  that is absolutely the worst way to have child support
    payments handled.  his kids need to have that money... but they need to
    have HIM GIVE IT TO THEM.. not some ponderous government agency.
    
    
    if you have any questions about Texas you may feel free to contact me.
    
    
    tony
154.9a little info a bit lateDANALI::JIMCMy lifestyle = Full Catastrophe LivingFri Nov 22 1991 17:3723
    FWIW and from my experience (your mileage may vary) (standard
    disclaimers, etc.)
    
    Jurisdiction is with the child.  For Jurisdiction to change, the child
    must reside in the new state for more than 6 months.  So in your case
    it will be Delaware.
    
    They can attach pay from 2000 miles away, it is called URESA (the
    Uniform Riciprocal Enforcement and Support Act) but it is cumbersome
    and bureaucratic as the dickens (a twelve part form in quintuplicate
    using carbons and they usually lose the first submission ;-).  
    
    A whole lot depends on what the childs mother does.  If She is
    cooperative (don't laugh y'all, it happens) then it should be fine, you
    just work it out, he reports his job, establishes his income and pays
    support.  If she is vindictive, you can play games until the cows come
    home without resolving anything or having any peace of mind.  
    
    On the personal side, I love your attitude and think the two of you
    have a good chance of making it.  He is awfully lucky to have you in
    his life and I hope he appreciates you (I woulda).
    
    jimc