Conference quark::mennotes

    Try to control these terrible impulses to kill native peoples and steal
    their land?

    Last year I went bungee jumping then took skydiving lessons.
    I just got back from hiking/climbing in Az. I'm planning
    my next vacation already. Time to whitewater raft through
    the Grand Canyon.
    
    re.1 Looks like you got the "Katz" sense of humor. ;)

    Playing horseshoes and drinking beer.

    Jim

    How about landlord'en. Late 20th century cattle rancher I am. Mow the
    north 40, heard em in. Chace em out. Got 6 cattle pens. Fight off injin
    attacks, cattle rustlers. And sand bag against rising cricks.:_)
    Every day is an adventure, collecting rent, evicting dead beats,
    walking behind a snow blower in raging blizzards cause some yha hoo
    needs to get out to by some milk and the paper. Pack a beeper as my six
    gun incase the pipes break.:)
    
    

    Drink beer .. go to redneck bars and two-step wid the ladies .. drink
    beer ... get rowdy at football games .. drink beer .. get a bunch of
    Marines together and go out and whop up on sailors .. drink beer ..
    drive a pickup truck with a gun rack .. drink beer .. get laid ...
    drink beer .. do VAX Notes ...;

    Any questions?

    Bubba

    RE;5
    Gee, is that what I'm really like ?

    How's about we all go visit the local "Nudie Bar" so that I can teach
    you guys how to control your lust...

    Destroying things is always fun. I think dropping a television set out of
    a ten story window would be an incredible thrill. Any other guys feel this
    way? How about women?

    - Jim

        Set the clock on my VCR so it doesn't blink anymore.

        Buy my own ties.

        Run with scissors (apologies to Dr. Crane).

--stephen

re .8 I think the women would take exception to being dropped out of
      a ten story window. Stick to television sets.

    
    
    RE: .8
    
    I think there would be a law against dropping women out windows!
    
    Ken
    

    I get my kicks by admitting, in public notesfiles, that I sometimes
    lust after men.
    
    Lorna
    

    RE: .8
    
        I think there would be a law against dropping women out windows!
    
        Ken
    
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    You must have read about the "Hook Tail" party report that the Navy
    had!:)
    
    

    Wow, now that you mention it it does sound like I like to defenestrate
    women!

    But what I meant is that it only sounds like fun. I never said I would
    actually do it.

    - Jim

    Well, now, there should be nothing wrong with defenestration between
    consenting adults, should there? 
    
    -b

    >But what I meant is that it only sounds like fun. I never said I would
    >actually do it.
    
    Now Jim, there is always an execption to you never.:) I like the way it
    was done to a guy in a movie "Second Shift". Strapped in a chair
    passing thru a basket ball hoop form a 5 story building.:)
    
    

Re: .15

That was "Swing Shift".  (Henry Winkler, Michael Keaton, Shelly Long)

    
    Me, Marina Sirtis, a Harley, and enough $$$$ to keep us on the road
    for at least a year.
    
    
    
    
    sigh
    
    
    Ok, so who do I have to kill. 8^}.
    
    fred();

    Steve,
    
    Yes. Your right. Wasn't sure. Knew the plot. Forgot the title.:) 
    
    Fred,
    
    Who do you wanna rub out?:) I can think of a couple of folks! How about
    your ex or mine!:)

    "Swing Shift" with Henry Winkler etal?
    
    The movie was "Night Shift" (but I don't think they dropped anyone
    from 5 stories into a basketball hoop.)
    
    They ran a prostitution ring from the city morgue during the night.
    (It was a comedy.)  :>  
    
    "Night Shift" had a no-dialogue bit part played by a guy who would
    get much better roles later:  Keven Costner.  (He was one of the
    'frat boys' at a party in the morgue one night.)

    .19
    
    Remember the opening seens? There were two pimps trashing some guy
    because he was snatching some of thier working women. And these two
    men also went after Winkler and Murry. The victum crashed thru a ol 
    glass window and fell thru a basket ball hoop where two young boys were
    playing a little hoop. The victum crashed the game. And Winkler had to 
    pick up the victum for a one way ride to the morgue. 
    
    Yes, it was a comedy. :)

    Oh, I forgot .. hunting be a manly activity.  Nothing I like better
    than gettin' a doe permit and stalking Bambi with a .30/.30 Winchester.
    Not nearly as exiciting as stalking the VC but Bambi don't shoot back,
    yet .. 
    
    Bubba
    

    Darn - yes, it was "Night Shift".  "Swing Shift" was another movie
    entirely.
    
    				Steve

.19> (but I don't think they dropped anyone from 5 stories into a basket-
.19> ball hoop.)
    
    Like George says, it's the opening scene.

    Richard Belzer played the pimp.

    Well, I guess I haven't seen the opening of "Night Shift" as often
    as I've seen the rest of the movie, but now that folks mention it,
    the scene (dropping the guy into a baseketball hoop) does sound 
    familiar.
    
    It was a pretty funny movie.

    Hey Bubba, pick on someone your own size, come to NH and
    hunt Moose!
    
    :-)
    
    ed

    I think that I was impacted with that opening scene because of the
    cruelty of it. Kinda gallo humor. Why not just whack the guy with a
    knife or a gun vs dropping him.

    Anyhow, I will make another pitch for manly things. Like stock car
    racing. Spectator sport event where you get to bring out the family
    wheels and rub alittle paint against the next guy.:) And if you twist
    some metal. YOU will sleep on the couch!:)

    I will second Ed note. Inviting Bubba to NH where the bears do shoot
    back!:) 

    re .18

    Yea, but I need something that will pay some $$$.  Her current
    s.o. doesn't have any more money than I do ;^).

    re .27

    The bears in Colorado won't shoot back, but during huntin' season
    we usually have an abundance of Texans runnin' round loaded for
    bare and just plain loaded that can't tell a bear from a bare.
    It can be a pretty "manly adventure" just to venture into them
    thar hills during huntin' season. ;^).

    fred();

    I would have bet money that someone would write changing diapers,
    babysitting, or shopping for childrens's shoes. Guess I would
    have lost...

Re: .29

Those aren't "adventures", they're just things that have to be done as part of
being a parent.  (Though the shopping for shoes can certainly seem
adventurous at times!)  Though perhaps your point is that to many men, these
tasks are so alien that they seem like adventures?

			Steve

    I can recall one instance when shopping for shoes was an adventure when
    my daughter was small, especially for the salesman.  We were trying to
    buy her a pair of shoes that didn't appeal to her, but seemed very
    sensible to us, and she refused to put them on.  When the salesman
    tried to take her shoe off she kicked him!  I remember him looking up
    at me, with a pained expression, and saying, "I don't think she wants
    to try them on."    :-)
    
    Lorna
    

    Lorna, my son went to pre-school, kindergarten and the first half
    of 1st grade in Hawaii - they didn't allow the kids to wear shoes
    in the classroom, so the kids wore flip-flops mostly and left them
    outside the front door of the class (with their names written on
    each slipper.)
    
    Then we moved to Arizona for the second half of Ryan's first grade,
    so I bought him real shoes for the first time.  At school, the laces
    came undone on one shoe, and Ryan went to the teacher with it (looking
    totally and completely baffled as to what he was supposed to do about
    it.)
    
    The teacher called me in to school - she couldn't believe that a
    6 year old child was not only UNABLE to tie his shoes, but that
    he didn't have the foggiest idea where to begin!  :>
    
    I had to explain to her that it was only the 3rd day of his life
    that he'd ever worn shoes.  She looked even more confused (at first.) :>

.32> of 1st grade in Hawaii - they didn't allow the kids to wear shoes
.32> in the classroom, so the kids wore flip-flops mostly and left them
.32> outside the front door of the class (with their names written on
.32> each slipper.)
    
     Interesting...  Why did they NOT allow shoes?

    
    They didn't allow shoes because so many children wore flip-flops
    that 'real shoes' would create the danger of damaging the toes
    and feet of other kids.  By having all the kids leave their shoes
    outside the door, everyone was barefoot in the classroom (and the
    children could wear whatever shoes they liked to wear on the way
    to school.)
    
    When I went to my son's classrooms, though, I almost never saw
    anything other than a big pile of *flip flops* (with little names
    written on them) outside the door.
    

    
    nahh, nuzzle up to that moose and whisper sweet moose nothings
    into her ear.

    The biggest, manliest adventure/challenge since time began:
    
    UNDERSTANDING AND INTERACTING WITH WOMEN!!!!!
    
                                             

    re .36, I can tell you right now, your first step would be to learn to
    enjoy gift shops!
    
    Lorna
    

    Interacting with women is fun and rewarding; understanding them is
    another story altogether.
    
    -- Mike

    Lorna:
    
    I do enjoy quality/unique ones.  The ones with aromas that bowl you
    over, or ones that have the usual tacky, cutesy craft junk (baskets, 
    wreaths, painted wood with any barnyard animal, candles, etc.) that are
    like the plague to me.
    
    Which brings up a question?  Why is it wherever there are women, there
    you will find "crafts".  I know two women who own their business, one
    a photography store, the other a Mailboxes/packaging. And yep, right
    there in the middle of the photo equipment, envelopes, etc. are shelves
    and racks of the usual tacky craftsy stuff for sale. I am not talking
    about those crafts that artistic, but rather those that are nothing
    more than "cute".  Contrast this stuff with quilts, needlework, etc.
    and you can see a difference.  So what is the allure of crafts?
    
    More importantly, what is the male equivalent of "crafts"?
    
    Paul 

    re: what is the male equivalent of "crafts"?
    
    bowling

    re male euivalent of "crafts"
    
    Wood shop
    Metal shop
    Auto shop
    Garden/lawn/farming
    etc
    
    fred()

    Let's not discuss bowling.  I have the second worst average in my
    league (which, I might add, has both male and female bowlers.)
    
    -- Mike

Given some of the examples I've seen, I'd say that the "male equivalent of
crafts" (if there needs to be one, since many men do crafts), is plumbing
and wiring.  At least there seem to be a lot of amateurs out there!

			Steve

    
    Male equivalent of crafts?
    
    Music.
    Poetry.
    Fiction.
    Software engineering.
    
    Now, for "stereotypes", if you get to hit something, it's probably a 
    stereotypical "male" thing.  Hence carpentry, carving, etc.  
    
    ;-)
    
    

    Don't forget model trains. Many of us *love* model trains.

    re .45, oh, since when don't women make & enjoy music, write & read
    poetry, and fiction, and some women are even software engineers.  With
    the possible exception of software engineering, I don't think you can
    say that women don't appreciate any of those as much as men do.
    
    Also, there are a lot of men who are involved in crafts.  For example,
    many glass artists are men, and a high percentage of people who design
    and make handcrafted jewelry are men.
    
    Lorna
    

    Boy, what I started!
    
    A little differentiation.
    
    In my opinion crafts are not art.  Crafts tend to be simply tacky,
    cutesy stuff, like ceramics, painted wood with pigs, sheep, cows,
    ducks, baskets filled with bows, flowers, etc. or wreaths, and the
    latest fad flags..
    
    Carving, woodworking, glass work, quilting, needlework, jewelry, mentioned
    in the last few are  artistic.
    
    Plumbing, carpentry are skilled trades and usually fix a problem.
    
    Bowling, etc is recreational.
    
    I don't think there is a male equivalent for crafts.  The closest thing
    I can come up with is what kids do a summer camp with gimp, coin
    holders, pot holders, popsickle stick creations.
    
    Crafts are a)not art, b)done to fix no problem, c)cute, d)done for
    decorative reasons, e)faddish (remember the glass grapes done for
    coffee tables back in th 60s).
    
      

    
    >Carving, woodworking, glass work, quilting, needlework, jewelry, mentioned
    >in the last few are  artistic.
    
    Well, at least according to the New Hampshire League of Craftsmen,
    everything listed here is a craft.  
    
    >Crafts tend to be simply tacky, cutesy stuff, like ceramics, painted
    >wood with pigs, sheep, cows, ducks, baskets filled with bows, flowers,
    >etc. or wreaths, and the latest fad flags.
    
    The male equivalent of this: beer can collections.

    One mans trackie is anothers treasure!:) I gotta collection of ceramic
    pink flamingos on coat hanger wire standing on my lawn with exploding
    tire plants!:)

    re .50, well, they probably look *cute* in front of the trailer, right? 
    :-)
    
    re .48, yeah, as .49 sort've said, I think we have different ideas of
    what are considered crafts.  It sounds to me like you're just not into
    "country" decorating.  :-)   I've been to some craft shows where there
    were some very high quality things - blown glass, quilts, metalwork,
    jewelry, and many of the crafts people were men.
    
    Anyway, how about Elvis paintings on velvet?  Whose responsible for
    that crap?  Was it first painted by a man or a woman?  And what about
    those paintings of the kids with big eyes?  I think it was a man who
    first painted those!   (*pret-ty* tacky imo)   :-)
    
    
    Lorna
    

    Hey, you forgot to mention the velvet paintings of dogs playing poker.
    :-)
    
    -- Mike

I'll bet the guy who did the big-eyed kids made plenty of money.

	My answer to the question, "What is the male equivalent of crafts?",
	would be hobbies.

    re .54, but, there are women who have hobbies that don't involve making
    crafts.  I really don't think it's a gender thing.
    
    Lorna
    

    The first one was art, the 10000 reproductions by 1000
    different people are crafts.
    
    No?  Oh well, back to the software....
    
    ed

    The differnce between crafts and hobbies is when you try to make money
    with your craft and the IRS has you in on the carpet and says," Tell me
    Mr.So-an-so. Is this a business or a hobbie?":_} You sitting there,
    knowing full well you have blown the family fortune, with a shoe box
    full of reciepts. No clue on where you went wrong. Just know that your
    in deep waters, and might be looking at the Graybar Motel for your next
    place of residency.:)

Re: 61.33 (SOLVIT::SOULE)
>Interesting...  Why did they NOT allow shoes?

61.34 (CSC32::CONLON)
>>They didn't allow shoes because so many children wore flip-flops that 
>>'real shoes' would create the danger of damaging the toes and feet 
>>of other kids.

The reason is that shoes are for wearing outside. There aren't many 
cultures in the world that allow people to track dirt, dust, sand, mud, 
animal poop, etc. into the house, especially if you sit on the floor. 

Mike  

    	I gave up wearing shoes and socks for a couple of years and my
    parents insisted that I wash my feet before coming into the house. They
    never required people wearing shoes to either wash them or take them
    off. I thought it was a bit unfair, but it was their house, and I
    didn't spend too much time there per year. Once you get used to it it
    is mostly more comfortable without in a British climate, though I could
    imagine it being less comfortable in colder or very much hotter
    climates.

>I gave up wearing shoes and socks for a couple of years and my
>parents insisted that I wash my feet before coming into the house. 

Reasonable, imho.

>They never required people wearing shoes to either wash them or take 
>them off. 

Unreasonable, of course. The same thing applies to stores that have "No 
Bare Feet" signs. Like, it's ok as long as the dirt and dog poop is 
packed into the soles of your Nikes?

>...I could imagine it being less comfortable in colder or very much hotter
>climates.

Take off whatever footwear you wear outside. Put on whatever you want 
inside. Slippers are nice. Keep a pair of slip-ons near the door for quick 
trips outside, like to get the mail.

Mike

    re .53
    
    Yeah, the guy (Keene was his name) who did those dreadful big-eyed
    waifs made a pack of money.  Then, some years later he and his wife
    divorced, and somehow in the process of it all it came out that she,
    not he, had been the actual artist.  Each claimed to be the artist, and
    the judge ordered them each to draw one of the offending pictures in
    court, and the husband failed.  So this was tacky "craft" by a woman.
    (I can't bring myself to call this stuff art....)
    
    -ellie