Conference quark::mennotes-v1

I can see some of your argumanets, but the number of deletions in that file 
was ridiculous.

Jerry

	The Men note was much more controversial, animated, humourous, and 
MORE FUN than this note is turning out to be....perhaps its seasonal...I
notice soapbox has taken a down turn too.....I don't know what happened to
the Men note....I'm sad about its demise but it was bound to happen......
like a mayfly I suppose......burn't itself out after a few short hours of 
furied activity.......sad but unavoidable in the circumstances.....

And Jerry is only pissed off cos he got some notes deleted without the normal
ceremony! (I happily didn't have any notes deleted...don't think so anyway)

	Lets liven this one up a little shall we?

Richard.

>And Jerry is only pissed off cos he got some notes deleted without the normal
>ceremony! (I happily didn't have any notes deleted...don't think so anyway)

When I read over the topics where I got deleted they read *completely* 
differently without the relevant replies. As for the "normal ceremony", it 
gives you, the aggrieved party, the opportunity to extract the offending 
note to a text file whilst it is in the hidden phase (NB a note is never 
hidden to the author). It is worthy of note here, that the data protection 
act in britain would expect archives to be kept of deleted notes.

Still, as said before, MEN.NOTE is history so...


>	Lets liven this one up a little shall we?

Agreed.

    While I found some good notes in MEN, about 85% of it seemed to
    be "rooster strutting", which I found obnoxious.  I deleted it from
    my notebook several days before it disappeared.  I have high hopes
    for this new conference - let's stop griping and make this conference
    USEFUL - not just a place to act macho.
    
    					Steve

    re .0:
    
    Some of the replies after 11.5 mention (or imply) the personality of
    one of the moderators of the conference MEN as contributing to it's
    downfall.  THAT aspect of note 11 HAD TO STOP.  That was the ONLY reason
    I shut down note 11.  If the mentioned party objects to those postings, 
    they will be removed.  
    
    SEVERAL of the moderators of this file (prior to it's creation) spent
    time helping the MEN conference moderator with problems he had with the
    operation of the VAXnotes product on his cluster. More specifically,
    THIS MODERATOR spent 1+ hours trying to address several problems on
    ZEPPO/CARLIN [link limiting & a problem that resulted from an improper
    upgrade to V1.1 notes].  Finally, THIS MODERATOR [I guess I'm
    capitalizing "this moderator" because 11.8 mentions 'the moderator(s)
    of mennotes' - plural happens to imply me - so maybe I'm a tad steamed]
    - let's start that last one over - THIS MODERATOR, recalls writing only
    two notes in MEN.NOTE: an intentionally humorous response to note 3.0
    [what are men's issues?] and a reply introducing himself.   NEITHER
    were "always abusive, often vulgar, sometimes obscene" as 11.8 asserts.
     
    As it was not the policy of the MEN conference moderators to 1) discuss
    "moderation" problems in public or 2) acknowledge the help of any of the
    moderators in this conference for anything; I'm not surprised that you
    would categorize 11.5 as juvenile.  You're entitled to your opinion.
    The remaining [not deleted] notes in MEN.NOTE may not have allowed you
    to draw any other conclusion. 
    
    Where are we now?
    
    1) I have no problems continuing on with the type of material that
       appeared later in the life of MEN.NOTE, sans the defacto "delete 
       if you disagree with me" policy.
    
    2) We are happy to discuss problems you have with this conference
       by mail or in this conference.  Why?  Because the decisions
       we make regarding this conference WILL STAND UP TO PUBLIC SCRUTINY.
    
    Can we get back to business?
                       
    - M

        An addition... flames that this conference is "less fun"
        than brand X are meaningless.  Any conference is what you
        make of it, and there's no reason why this conference shouldn't
        be enjoyable... just as long as what you enjoy isn't directly
        insulting to readers.  And that restriction isn't at all
        unique with this conference.
        
        If you want lively topics... or even humorous topics (but please
        make it clear that they *are* humorous topics... not everyone
        catches on immediately, and a "humorous" topic which offends
        someone isn't very humorous)... feel free to start them.  Don't
        wait for someone else to do it and then complain that they
        aren't here. 
        
        The well-written rules and regulations for this conference come
        down to one thing: use a little common courtesy and remember
        that you're effectively talking to other people face to face.
        If you wouldn't say it in a group of live people, most of whom
        are strangers, don't say it here. 
        
        It's *easy* to get hotter than necessary replying to a faceless
        name on your terminal screen.  Just try to remember that
        those faceless names are people sitting at their own screens,
        and take it easy.
        
        Let the fun flow, OK?  And hopefully a lot of serious and
        honest discussion of who and/or what we all are.  There's
        gotta be more to us than just superficial humor, after all!
        (right?)
        
        	/dave

    re previous plea.
    
    Has the file MEN.NOTES physcially been deleted?.
    If not, can it be put 'on the air' for 24 hours to allow extractions?.
    If not, and it is still there somewhere, then I will 'host' the
    dead file for 24 hours to allow nostalgic reading and extractions.
    
    David TMCUK2:: Banks
    

    After reviewing what scant records I have, I find that I was mistaken
    in my accusations of the our current moderators. I'm sorry, I was
    confused by a similarity in usernames.
    
    You (current moderators) have my permission to set my "letting off
    steam" note as hidden, or delete it, since it served the purpose
    for which I posted it, to let off some steam.
    
    	More light!
    	-- Charles

    Re: .4
    
    Steve, I'm sorry that you found a lot of the material in MEN to
    be "rooster strutting". I feel that may have been a misperection
    that the bulk of a lot of the material was SERIOUS. I personally
    was having a good time and entered a number of humourous replies
    (I hope) and a few serious replies when the topic beckoned and the
    mood allowed. I found the topic on "Wasted Cloth" to be an example
    of those quirky instances in the universe where forces (in this
    case clothing designers) have an impact on our everyday lives, with
    or without our consents. I found the topic a little ironic and. to
    be honest, I'd never really thouhgt about it before. My notes had
    not reflected the serious/humorous mood too well since I never learned
    all the :), :^) 0^0...code that is pasing around the E-net. I really
    don't have time to read all of ETIQUITTE and write them all down
    ( if that is indeed their origin ).
    
    The latter comments off of my basenote mentioned that this conference
    would be what we made of it. I agree totally. But what is it that
    we want? My base note was prompted by my reading to that date. The
    general atmosphere of this conference had struck me as very
    conservative and, dare I say, stuffy. It seemed like everyone here
    was being on their very best of behavior lest they be deleted or
    censured. I was waiting for a librarian to stick her head around
    the corner at any moment and go SHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
    
    I'm not sure that this conference has a DIRECTION base note or not.
    Some of the files that I follow do. (I don't know how to do a DIR
    while in the editor (Hints via MAIL greatly appreciated.)). If no
    such note exists, I am more than willing to open it up.
    
    Herein lies the fix: Shall this be a serious counterpart to WOMENNOTES
    with a lot of heated debate and beating of chests and gnashing of
    teeth or should this conference be more open to banter and frivolity
    as was "BRAND X", or ( for the sake of moderation ) a mixture of
    the two. I agree that certaing rules of decorum need to apply to
    keep our members from getting too out of control, but should this
    conference be limited only to serious topics. I Promise to be on
    my best behavior ( really tough for me ) and not enter serious topic
    notes unless I have an equally serious response. But is OK to enter
    less serious notes? I don't want to get lynched for having a good
    time. If it's all serious, I'd just as soon follow the directions
    of the base note title. I already have enough "work" files to
    follow. If this is not a fun oasis, I'd just as soon hit the dusty
    trail.
    
    More comments welcomed and requested,
    Jim