Conference quark::human_relations-v1

 Try printing your note (/noheader) and leaving it on her desk. :-)

 The Doctah

    If it's someone you feel comfortable talking to, tell them that
    their perfume is too strong (you shouldn't be able to smell it in
    the next cube if it's properly used), and it's not to your liking
    and distracts you.
    
    Personally, I would be able to say (truthfully, in my case)
    that I am allergic to perfume.  In your case, you can say that you
    are sensitive to some ingredients in perfume, and request that she
    wear less of it so that she does not set of your allergy reaction.
    
    Or you can say the perfume reminds you of your dearly departed (mother,
    sister, wife, whatever)....and would she please wear less or switch
    to another because you find it difficult to work as the memories
    start pouring back to you....
    
    I don't know.  You can be honest or you can lie.  Or you can move
    to another cube.  Or you can get an air filter/purifier, or a fan
    that pushes the scent away.
    
    -Jody
    

    There's a woman in my area who wears a rose perfume.  I can always
    tell when she gets in because she goes straight to the coffee pot,
    trailing a river of scent behind her . . . goodbye, nasal
    passages.
    
    I don't think it would bother me if I wasn't pregnant, but somehow
    telling her that sounds too much like I'm using my condition to be
    picky and petty.
    
    --bonnie

    Unless she is someone you're pretty friendly with, I don't
    think you really have a right to tell her anything.  She
    obviously likes her particular perfume, and has a right to
    wear it.  
    
    There is someone I've worked with who frankly, has awful body
    odor.  But like it or not, I've decided that's his right.
    
    I sympathize with you, as I too have a really sensitive nose!
    
    jacki
    

    
    When I was pretty young, a manager took me aside and told me that
    I stank and was very offensive.  "Perfume should only be worn so
    that someone very, very close to you could smell it!!", she said.
    Well I was offended that she even had the gall to tell me such a
    thing and I literally fumed (;^>) at the time.  When I realized
    that she did me a big favor by telling me the blunt truth, I was
    very grateful.  
    
    Katie
    
    BTW - I now only like clean, natural, soapy smelling people

    Bonnie,
    
    Do you think telling someone about such a thing is picky and petty? 
    I'm not sure if I read your note right.
    
    Reminds me of smokers vs. nonsmokers...
    
    

>I don't
>    think you really have a right to tell her anything.  She
>    obviously likes her particular perfume, and has a right to
>    wear it.  

 You have the right to work in a place where you are not hindered by other
people's habits and idiosyncracies. You do not have to work in the presence of
smoke, loud music, or other obnoxious odors. 

 As far as her right to wear it goes, that right does not exist when it
infringes upon the rights of others. Like the right to breathe relatively clean
air.

 Absolutely do something. If you don't want to embarrass yourself (or her), try
the anonymous note approach. If she persists, mention it to her.

 The Doctah

    I'm not sure which I find worse, lousy air or anonymous notes. 
    I'm usually one who puts up with a lot, but I think I'd bring myself
    to a confrontation a lot sooner than I'd write an anonymous note.  
    Notes allow no opportunity for give and take, no room for explanation,
    no chance for a smile to ease the impact.  There are methods for
    confrontation that allow more light and generate less heat.  
    
    When I have to confront someone, I pray about it first.  Then I trust
    that whatever I say will be absolutely right, even if it seems wrong at
    the time.  This method allows contact with the person on a subliminal
    level, such the "ground is prepared" for the seed you wish to plant.
    Confrontation still twists my gut, but it seems to work.  
    
    Donald Reinke

    re: .6
    
    No, I'm afraid I'll be *perceived* as being petty and as using my
    condition as an excuse for it.  
    
    I don't mind being perceived as picky on occasion but for some
    reason I find it very galling to have people making concessions
    because I'm in a "delicate condition."
    
    --bonnie

    You could always approach her manager and let him/her handle it.
    
    I, myself, am brutal.  I'd go up to her and ask her if she fell into 
    the perfume bottle this morning.
    
    BTW, .0, what *did* you finally do?
    
    Carol
    

         Yeah.  Her manager or someone else could at least verify that
    you are not being overly sensitive.  Beyond that, the manager would
    probably want to remove any hinderances to people who need to work
    with her.
    
                                        Greg

    	I literally stop breathing if some one is wearing rose scented
    sache' (sp?). Usually older women are prone to smearing this stuff
    on by the quart. When I'd take my mother and friends somewhere she
    warn them that the Maine winters were cold and I would open my window
    all the way if they wore the stuff. 
    
    	I think you should say that presently you are extremely sensitive
    to the aroma and you would be forever in her debt if she could cut
    the stuff with a wipe of a wet cloth after application. Or you'll
    put a contract out on her applicator......
    
    Ken

    Someone told me I was wearing too much perfume.  Actually, they never
    came out and said that....they put it like this....
    
    First thing in the morning this person enters my office and says..
    "whooooo, what kind of perfume are you wearing??!!"  It was the way he
    said it, not what he said.  Of course, I couldn't smell it - wearing it
    everyday you become immune to it, so I was glad the conversation came up.
    
    One day a co-worker walked in with too much cologne and I couldn't help
    but say something - I was choking.  I don't think he took offense - he
    did take the hint, though!  Smells nice in our area these days...
    
    Vicki

RE: < Note 825.10 by SSDEVO::CHAMPION "Letting Go: The Ultimate Adventure" >
>                             -< Rude, but direct >-
>    I, myself, am brutal.
That's brutal?  Brutal is:

   "Phew!! Did the janitor just deliver fresh deodorant to the men's urinals?"

Dan  :-)

    Re 825.10,
    
    So far I've done nothing since I posted that note on Friday AM; she's been 
    at meetings most of the time (it's now Monday lunch).  
    
    I liked your first suggestion about going to her manager which I will use, 
    since I'd like to minimize her embarrassment and my discomfort.  
    
    As far as the brutal approach goes, is it necessary to vent anger on
    her?  I'm looking for a *nice* way to handle this.  Anonymous notes, angry
    remarks and insults don't qualify.  
    
    Any other creative solutions to this?  I'm still open to suggestions.
    
    

    Re. 16
    
    I also see no reason why one has to be rude (or brutal, whatever).
    Is this woman purposely wearing too much perfume to offend everyone?
    I didn't get that impression.
       
    The anonymous notes idea is kinda distant.  I think your best bet
    is to approach her at a time where no one else is around to lessen
    the embarassment and gently (kindly, nicely, however you wanna put
    it) tell her that her perfume is a little strong and would she mind
    not applying quite so much?  You may even add your are allergic
    or some such stuff to it, or simply that strong smells bother you.
     
    I suspect that chances are she will be embarassed, so taking on
    the job of telling her face to face where you can lessen the impact
    with a smile is your best bet.  Having the manager go about it is
    a little circumventing....that sort of thing runs the risk of making
    one feel "told on".  
    
    If she reacts rudely, then I think you have the right to be rude,
    but till then, I think tact and courtesy are the wise approach.
    
    kim

    Maybe you could get her to start reading human_relations??????
    
    --bonnie

    
    	Or, you could do as I did at another company I worked for.
    	I grew-up on a farm, so the smells of same I don't even
    	notice. I brought in a LARGE plastic bag full of REAL RIPE
    	cow droppings and placed it next to my cubes' door, which
    	was next to hers. I think it took all of 3 seconds before
    	she mentioned it. At that point I made the remark, "Gee, I
    	didn't know YOU could smell it, you see I've been around
    	it all my life and don't notice it." She got the message!!
    	
    	G_B

    A friend of mine cracked me up one day by staggering into the room
    exclaiming "Help! I was trapped in an elevator with Estee Lauder!"
    
    I vote for the direct approach, myself, using tactful language.
    
    -roger
    
    

    I don't see any need to be mean or nasty.  What's wrong with just
    saying to the person, "Hi, do you have a couple of minutes?  I need
    to talk to you about something.  I hate to have to say this, and
    I'm really kind of embarrassed, BUT I can always smell your cologne
    in my office.  At first it smells nice, but as the day wears on
    it just gets too strong, and it starts to make me feel nauseous.
     Would it be too much to ask you to either not wear it, wear a
    different brand, or wear less of it?"  Then, only if she responded
    rudely, would I take a tougher approach myself.  (Like bluntly saying
    something mean, or going to her manager.)
    
    Why assume that she is deliberately wearing horrible smelling cologne
    in the hope that she can ruin the lives of other people?  I'm sure
    she just happens to think it smells nice, and has no idea what others
    think of it.
    
    I guess I put too much on one morning, because in the cafeteria
    a man in line behind me getting fruit said, "Ooooh, what's that perfume
    you have on?"  I said, "Poisen" and he said, "Oh, yeah, has it killed
    anybody yet?"  I said, "Not that I know of."  Then, he just laughed.
    I thought it was pretty funny.  I love to wear cologne but I try
    not to wear too much, and I usually wear the cologne most that I
    get the most compliments on.
    
    But, my favorite cat hates my favorite cologne, Poisen!  If he's
    in the room when I spray it on, he always wiggles his nose like
    a rabbit, flashes me a wild, indignant look, and dashes out of the
    room.  I can't help but think, Geesh I spend $50. on a bottle of
    cologne and my *cat* hates it!  (But, I have gotten compliments
    from humans.)
    
    Lorna
    

    Poison, eh? That guy in the cafeteria line deserves a medal! What a
    good way to make your point without hurting anyone's feelings.:-)
    
    The Doctah

    I find this note extremely funny as a co-worker of mine said she
    dreamed last night that I had made a comment that her cologne was
    not very appealing to me and I would appreciate it if she didn't
    wear that brand any more!!

    You do this: Start sneezing like crazy and tell her you are allergic to
    her perfume.
    
    Lynne :-)

    The last note gave me another (less brutal) idea.  Ask her if she
    switched to a different brand of perfume recently.  Whether her answer
    is yes or no, she will probably ask "why?"  Then you can tell her that
    you don't remember this (or the other) brand being so strong before.
    
    Carol
    

Or, if you're uncomfortable going to her directly and uncomfortable getting 
her manager involved, maybe there's someone else in the group who 
would be willing to help you out.  Perhaps you're closer to another person 
in the group who is also close to her and wouldn't mind talking to her 
about a personal issue.  This may be more tricky than simply talking 
directly to her, but obviously it depends on the dynamics of your group.

Sue

    I've always wondered how and if subliminal advertising and its ilk
    worked.  I've never known anyone who has tried it.  They have tapes
    with subliminal suggestions to make people stop eating, stop smoking,
    start sleeping with you etc.  Maybe we could go into business making
    tapes to get people to respond to our wishes without confronting
    them, inject it into office muzak or something.  I envision a whole
    line of tapes.  Your perfume is too strong.  Get a personality.
    Your jokes are rude and sexist.  Stop making those funny noises
    when you work.  Please trim your nose hair.  You have something
    stuck between your teeth.
    
    	The real issue is communicating about things that will evoke
    an emotional response in someone that you don't know well enough.
    Why is it tough?  Why don't we know our co-workers well enough?
    
    	Sorry, creative isn't always useful.

    re -1:
    
    I believe that is illegal.  In any case, I feel that is unethical at
    least.
    
    Eugene

    re .27:
    
    Subliminal advertising is in fact illegal. It also doesn't work. There
    have been several studies on subliminal messages, and they're quite
    effect to make someone do something they probably were going to do
    anyway. Meaning that if someone was thinking about going to get a Coke,
    a subliminal ad for Coke might get them to get up and get one now,
    instead of five minutes from now. 
    
    However, there are two drawbacks -- first, the effect wears off
    quickly. People quickly become inured to it. Second, if people find out
    that subliminal ads are being used, they become *very* hostile. I
    remember reading about a movie theatre that was caught using subliminal
    ads. They went out of business shortly after they were caught because
    people stopped going there.
    
    As far as subliminal learning tapes and the like, I don't believe
    they've ever been shown to either work or not work. In other words,
    they work for some people.
    
    	Jon

    One of the best ways to handle this is the "ingenuous" approach, or as
    my mother puts it, the "kill 'em with kindness" method. It works like
    this:

    You put on your most innocent expression and bounce cheerfully into the
    person's office saying, "Mmmm! So *that's* where the perfume is coming
    from! I smelled it all over the floor and couldn't figure out who had
    it on! I just wanted you to know that *I* think it's nice."

    Practice this in front of the mirror a few times. You have to get it
    right. Laughing in the middle will blow it. You also have to remember
    to put cheerful exclamation points at the ends of your lines, and to
    inflect "*I* think it's nice" in such a way that it says implicitly, "I
    don't care what anyone else says" and thus implies that it's a nuisance
    and you're quite positive that this person's heard the complaints.

    	Jon

    I encountered this problem a few years ago in a group that I used to
    work in.  On the second day of the over-powering perfume I commented to
    the secretary that the perfume was warning everyone that she was
    coming.  (She wasn't unpleasant in any way, so it was meant to be
    humorous.)  Fearing that I might have offended her I later went to her
    desk and explained that I didn't dislike the perfume, but I felt that
    it was a bit strong.  We remained friends, and I still hear from her
    once in a while.  I think that the most important thing is to know
    enough about the personality of the person so that you can comment on
    it in a way that will not offend them.
    
    Rich

Would it help by turning the situation around and asking yourself; How would 
I like to be told if I was the one offending others with my 
perfume/cologne/B-O/nose_hair/bad breath/etc..?  Most likely the offenders 
are unaware of the situation and it would be a kindness if someone told 
them.

I would probably like to be approached in private or taken aside and have 
the offense discreetly brought to my attention in some non-judgemental 
manner.

Jim

    *Gotta* tell ya' what happened to me today.  I was discussing some test
    results with a co-worker when she started sneezing up a storm.  After 
    the habitual "bless you's" I asked her if she was okay.  Sniffling, she 
    said, "It's your perfume!  It smells good, but it's making me sneeze!"
    
    I stifled a laugh and went to the restroom to wash it off.
    
    *blush*
    
    Carol
    

Just my opinion.

I think inventing all kinds of scenarios in order to not hurt her feelings is 
wrong. You would be lying to her and stifling your own feelings. The problem 
here is rather simple in my mind. (It's the solution that's tough. Ha Ha) The 
facts are that this woman's perfume is strong and you find the odor to cause you 
discomfort. I don't know this woman but most likely she is nice enough in 
general. She probably isn't even aware that there _is_ a problem. The objective
now is to make her aware without alienating her. I've always found the direct
approach best. State your problem to her as a matter of fact and not as an 
accusation. Express your honest desire not to offend her but it is a problem you
must solve. Her reaction will probably be surprise and some embarrassment which
becomes abated as you talk further. My experience has been for the other person
to thank me for telling them and saving them further embarrassment.

Another consideration is that she might be hurt and although it isn't our 
intention, it happens. Many self-help books that I've read tell us that we are 
not responsible for the feelings of others. The statements "You make me mad" or
"You hurt my feelings" are inaccurate. People get mad or hurt because _they_
_want_ to feel that way. So, if she's hurt, she owns it. It's one of her growing
experiences.

So, in short, I'd say, talk to her. Be gentle, but, be direct. If it's someone 
you like other than the perfume problem, invite to lunch  afterward.

Pete

    
    When I smell perfume thats that strong, I go up to the woman and
    sniff like a big dog checking out a side of beef.
    
    That usually does the trick...