Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    run, don't walk, to your local EAP office.  They can tell you about
    programs for your Mom so she can work through this with your stepfather
    and your sister.  
    
    good luck,
    Marge

    Your sister is at a tough age that is very rebelious. It seems that
    being spoiled, and getting her own way all her life, has developed
    her into a monster. She is manipulating both you parents by playing
    one against the other. I can't really suggest anything for your parents
    because they should have been firm with her a long time ago. 
    
    I don't know what kind of relationship you have with her since you've
    been married, or if she respects your advice. But I would suggest
    having a long talk to her. Try to talk to her as a freind so she
    doesn't get defensive.  Have her put herself in your parents shoes
    so she can really see what she's been doing.
    
    Good Luck!
    

    I had a sister like that once.
    
    the bad news:  nothing worked as far as changing her behaviour
    
    the good news:  she out grew it [mostly anyway, she _is_ still human]
    		    by the time she was 21.
    
    It was a l-o-n-g eight years!!!  I was married before she turned into
    Godzilla, although she had always been spoiled. [I'm 10 years older].
    When it became apparent that any attempt at trying to alter the
    relationship would fail, I finally told the basically 'I'll always
    love you but I'm not going to let you abuse me anymore. See you when
    you want to see me.'  She told me to sh*t twice and die [or soething
    like that]. I maintained my distance and sure enough three years ago I
    started getting letters and pictures of her daughter and phone calls.
    We're fine. My sister is a lovely person who has been through a hell of
    her own making and lived to tell about it.
    
    Unfortunately, my parents felt unable to make the same commitment to
    self-preservation.  Their relationship with their youngest is not good
    because they are still fighting the same battles over and over again.
    
    The hard news is that you can't make it better. Your sister has to and
    to do that she has to want to.  Love your folks -- they need love --
    and encourage them to do what is best for them.  They may have been
    mistaken in spoiling your sister, but they should not have to pay for
    that mistake with lives of misery.
    
      Ann

    Point the first: You don't own the responsibility for your sister's
    misbehaviour; she does.  You *can't* fix it.  All you can do is fix the
    way you feel about it so you don't cry yourself to sleep.
    
    2- your sister hasn't grown up.  She may never; my older step brother
    hasn't, my younger brother might yet.  Both were spoiled, both were
    permitted to be irresponsible, and both have continued to act just as
    they were raised.  Irresponsibly.
    
    For as long as you permit it in the relationship with your sister,
    you will be granting her the power to manipulate you because of your
    feelings.  I watched my little brother tear people up; my sister, my
    dad, my mom, my stepmother...anybody that cared about him, he injured
    by abusing their trust.
    
    I refused to grant him the power.  I set rules for our interactions; I
    treated him with respect but I didn't permit him to manipulate me.  He
    soon enough learned not to try, and our relationship is cordial now...
    moreso than with anyone he abused...he is 22.  He may just make it yet.
    
    No one can hurt you unless you permit them...and when her track
    record is as you have described it, you are fooling yourself if
    you keep letting her hurt you.  I've been there.  You can keep
    caring about her...but you need to protect yourself from her, first.
                                
    Best of luck.
    
    DougO
    

    If your parents are tired of her behavior there is (or was) a group
    called "Tough Love" that can help parents cope with hard-to-handle
    children.  There is also a very good book with the same name that
    offers a wealth of information and how-to-do-it approaches to giving
    "Tough Love."  I've had a daughter I had to handle in this manner
    and she has turned out to be a wonderful, beautiful woman.  It was
    worth the pain of being "tough" when that was what mattered.
    
    You might want to try the approach yourself.  It really helps to
    get you out of the misery and reaction mode and into an "I can handle
    this" action mode.
    
    Best Wishes for Success,
    Barb

    Re: .0
    
    >I'm afraid I'm going to end up hating her for the way she acts, but
    >then I think, "well, it's not her fault, she didn't spoil herself."
    
    Not entirely, but she allowed herself to be spoiled.  While environment
    is a contributing factor, everyone has the ability to choose her/his
    own behavior.  The important question is whether she recognizes the
    pain she causes, in fact whether she is capable of turning her
    perception away from herself for a change.  It might be that it just
    never occurred to her that she's hurting someone.  On the other hand,
    it might be that she's well aware of it and simply doesn't care.  In
    that case, I don't hold much hope for improvement.

    I'd say if the parents are unhappy about the situation, they should
    insist on family counseling if they want to try to change things,
    and insist she go with them.  She's still a minor, still their child,
    and if they ever want things to change they'd better do it now.
    
    If they find the situation tolerable, or acceptable, then let sleeping
    dogs lie and try not to worry about it.  If they don't want to change
    anything, there's nothing you can do.
    
    -Jody
    

"She's still a minor, still their child, and if they ever want things to change
they'd better do it now."

She may still be a minor child, and they may be able to force her to go to
counseling; they may even get her to change.  But the results are not likely to
be favorable.  For her to grow/change *she* has to want to.  If they repress her
current behavior, quite likely it will pop up in a nastier form.

Jim. 

    You described me to a tea.  I read this note yesterday and
    it amazes me how much your sister and I are alike.  Well, 
    I was the same way at her age.  The good news is I grew out
    of it, got help, and realized the pain I was causing my family
    as well as myself.  I was very selfish and didn't want any
    part of my family, what they had to say, responsibilities,
    the whole mess.  People tried there hardest to help me,
    talk to me, get me to counseling.  At that time I wanted 
    no part of it and resented anyone who tried to tell me what
    to do.  I finally reached a point where the pain was so great
    I could not live with myself anymore and got some help.
    
    Today, I get along great with my family and care very deeply
    about them.  I am sorry I put them through so much pain, but
    I must say our relationship is so much better today than I
    ever thought imaginable.  I guess what I am trying to say is
    there is hope for your sister, but sometimes the best thing
    you can do for a person is to let them go.  Take care of yourself
    and how you deal with this situation, don't try to fix her and
    hopefully your parents will do the same.  Otherwise they may
    drive thelmselves crazy trying to help a person who really
    does not want any.  
    
    I wish you the best of luck with this situation, as I know
    it is very hard on everyone involved.  

    
    This is going to be from a person that was just as horrible as a
    teenager could possibly be.  There wasn't anything that could be
    mentioned that I hadn't put my parents through.  When I turned 18
    though my father said, "There's the door.  Don't let it hit you
    in the but on the way out."  I could coming crying back to my parents
    as much as I wanted and if it was a viable problem and not something
    "I did to myself" then they offered there support.  
    There is a program called "Tough Love" that my mother read the book
    about.  My opnion is this gril has walked on people for so long
    that she just doesn't care who she hurts.  Let her feel a little
    pain for a change.  Punish the crime accordingly.  
    I walked out of it being very resentful towards my parents for a
    long time.  Now at 22 (though sometimes we clash) I am trying very
    hard to resolve things.  As are my parents.  Our lifestyles are
    different but when you lived one way for so long its hard to adapt
    to "real life".  Now sometimess they bite thier tounges and sit
    back and watch as I make my mistakes, listen when I come crying
    due to the consequences, but they don't hold my hand and and say,
    "There, Sweetie, Mummy and Daddy will make it all better."  They
    say, "Hey your an adult.  Your capable of resolving this.  Do something
    or live with it!"  
    Its tough to turn your back on your child like that but sometimes
    it has to be done.  Your Mother will really need the support of
    your Dad for this too.  It can tear a house a apart.  So can your
    sister too though.
    
    Katrina

    Sorry I haven't responded, but I've been out with a sinus infection.
    Spent from Wed. afternoon until Sat. in bed, only getting up to
    take another dose of medicine or go to the bathroom.  I appreciate
    all of the suggestions and replies.  I think things have kind of
    mellowed out right now after my mother threatened to move out and
    just let my dad and my sister have the run of the house.  I think
    it woke my dad up and maybe now, if nothing else, at least he will
    support my mom in her efforts to discipline my sister.  
    
    re. -1,
    
    How old were you when you finally saw the pain you were causing
    your family?  
    I'm happy for you that you were able to overcome it.  I guess all
    we can really do is just sit back and wait.  I love my sister dearly
    and I hate to just sit back, though, because I know no one likes
    to be around her when she's constantly saying something ugly or
    smart.  
    
    Thanks again.

    
    re: -1
    
    It wasn't until I was already out of the house for a while that
    I took a good look at what my role in the deterioration of my
    relationships with my other family members where.  I was always
    the "victim".  I don't know what ever happend to make me change
    my mind but now the things that I hated my mother for are the things
    that I respect most about her.  I've learned to "handle" my dad
    and that little brother that was nothing but somebody to terrorize
    means the world to me.  
    
    I think what happens is if you go through enough, are hurt by enough
    people you realize that your family loves you and they are with
    you til the end.  Mum and Dad didn't stop loving me because I made
    there life a living hell at times.  They did the best they could
    and we all came out on top.  So far.  
    
    Sometimes you have to be cruel when you love soembody.  Sometimes
    its the only way they'll learn.
    
    My parents were never cruel..... Just tough.
    
    couldn't have asked for better.  If I had to pick my own parents,
    I would have chosen the same ones I have right now.
    
    Katrina