Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    Have you tried seeing a counselor?  It sounds to me like your spouse
    still has feelings of guilt, perhaps of "dirtiness", from the affair
    he/she had.  Sounds like they've become more and more ingrained
    over the past years.   And perhaps he/she is using the strict
    religion as a punishment, or as something to help make the guilt
    bearable.  But this may be all bosh - there may be some other problem
    at the root of it all.  A professional could likely help IF your
    spouse wants to resolve this.  It might actually be better to have
    two sorts of sessions - one for both of you and one for just your
    spouse.  Sometimes it's hard to work out problems when there's
    someone besides a counselor there.
    
    --Louise

    Please don't be shocked by this - it may seem like a wacko suggestion,
    but a couple I know made it work...and that is open marriage.
    However...
    I assume your spouse's strict religious morality totally voids the
    concept of an "open marriage", even if you might find it remotely
    tenable.  Then again - since you've both been hurt in the past -
    this may only propagate the ending by causing more pain.  I second
    the suggestion for counseling - perhaps first alone and then with
    him (if he agrees, of course).
    
    -Jody
    

    gosh oh golly jeekers - I just jumped to conclusions and assumed
    gender roles for the couple.  My sincerest apologies - the suggestion
    would apply in either case.  Terribly sorry...
    
    -Jody
    

    
    	
    When I see in a person:
    
    		a. Guilt
    		b. Adherance to strict, absolutist requirements.
    		c. Depression.
    		d. Addiction. 
    
    	I just cant help but think that they have the "Hole in the soul",
    that was formed by a "Parental abandonment" of some sort during
    their childhood. Again, the 'usual' approach is to look at the person,
    in terms of "what's wrong with them", when, in actuality, there
    is nothing wrong with *them*. 
    	They are only needy, as we all are. It's a special need, however,
    one that was likely not met waaaay back possibly when this person
    was only, oh, 4-10 years of age. A 7 year old cannot understand
    why things happen the way they do sometimes. It hurts the little
    girl (guy?) deeply, so she makes an emotional bond to a fantasy,
    an ideal, in order to cope with the pain. In doing so, her true
    self is swapped for a false self, because facing the true self is
    to also face the pain - something we try our best to avoid. The
    false self happens to carry with it the ideals of the fantasy bond,
    such as perfectionism, unrealistic ideals and absolutest beliefs.
    Unfortunately, this also sets one up for compulsive behavior -
    "addiction" to work is as valid an example as any. Depression results
    from a complete loss of the true self, long buried by the various
    masks that were put into place in various stages of living. But
    the original pain remains - only "by now" the person really has no idea
    of where it comes from, hence, as many of our unanswered dilemmas
    often cause, we become depressed.         
    
    	One way to possibly clear this up is for the chronic compulsive
    person to focus on their own family system of origin, in terms of
    the interrelationships between the constituant members. What rules
    governed the parenting? Any of the parental behaviors happen to
    attack one's idea of self? Did the "real you" ever get a chance
    to develop, or was that subverted by "shoulds", "oughts" and "supposed
    tos"? Could the "real you" possibly be that empty feeling deep inside?
    Would this knowledge allow one to "relax and let go" through finally
    understanding "why" these feelings and habits persist? I think it
    can.
    	
    	Joe Jas
    

    It sounds like you might be suffering from marriage boredom. This
    happens after you've been together for a long time; something like
    a Marriage Encounter weekend or a week at Hedonism II might put
    some zip back in. 
    
    Or a marriage counsellor.
    
    Now that I think about it, a counsellor might be a good starting
    place, just to figure out whether you [singular or plural] do have
    a problem. 
    
    --bonnie

    Ditto on seeing a counselor first.  If your relationship was worth
    getting into, it's worth working on before you decide to leave.
    A counselor can help you to get at the real reasons behind the apparant
    reasons.
    
    Good Luck!
    Barb

    I agree with the suggestion of seeking help through a counsellor.
    You state both of you spend most of your time working, is it out
    of necessity to succeed or to escape confronting the problem?  Getting
    physically involved with someone else will only help to pacify your 
    libido, but will not resolve your problem either.  I agree we should
    all be patient to an extent, but being patient "over the years" can
    sometimes be interpreted as "long suffering"....come on, if your 
    relationship has weathered the storms you described, you owe it to 
    yourself and your partner to seek counselling and stop dragging
    yourselves down.
    
    We only go through life once, why not spend it happy.....I wish you
    both luck! 
         

The following reply is from the anonymous author of the base note.
    
    
    
    Firstly, thank you to all who responded to the base note. 

    Everything that's been said has been of great value. Thank you. Things
    have been looking a little better recently. We're going to try to work
    this out on our own a little longer and we'll be spending more time
    away together. 

    When I wrote the base note, I hadn't caught up on the rest of the
    conference. I have now, and in doing so came across at least two other
    topics along similar lines. Reading those has been useful too. 

    Thanks to the moderators who made this conference possible; it has
    really helped. And a special thank-you to Joe Jas for his perceptive
    insight.