Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    Among other things I would suggest you send a copy of this note
    to your friend. Even if she won't listen to you, I think reading
    this may just help her better understand what your going through.
    If she can look past the barriers she has been seeing she may decide your
    friendship is worth the effort. 
    
    I hope you benefit form the support offered by the noting community.
    Previous notes have been right on target saying that it is more
    than just the base noter that is helped by subsequent comments...
    
    Gail
    
    
    

    It is good to have a strong support group, not just one person.
    Perhaps your friend felt that you were becoming too attached to
    her.  Could it be that you were?  When I have had "down" times, I
    turn to a number of different people for being a sounding board;
     in that way, I get many ideas, rather than just one.  Could you begin 
    "networking" with other people you feel comfortable with as well as
    your friend?  This may help to take some of the reserve out of your
    friend's attitude toward you.  If she sees that you are sharing
    your problems with others, she may feel less threatened.
    
    You also may want to consider additional help from a counselor.  I
    have found that they can be very helpful in stressful times.
    
    Good Thoughts-
    Barb

    I second the suggestion for a counselor.  I don't mean a shrink
    if you are uncomfortable with that kind of therapy, but some counselors
    are more like friends - except they are trained in ways to help
    people with problems how to overcome them.
    
    I think this woman has probably gotten the wrong idea - and there
    may be no way to convince her otherwise.  I know it's all very
    confusing, but interpersonal relationships which occur on the fringe
    of marriages can get botched very easily.  Perhaps her marriage
    is on a rocky foundation to begin with.  Perhaps she is afraid of
    getting closer to you.  Perhaps she is afraid of your emotional
    problems, and thinks you are so unstable as to be unable to control
    how you feel about her.  I cannot fathom the truth from here - but
    I know that some counseling might help - and if you have had bad
    experiences with counselors before, please realize that THEY ARE
    NOT ALL THE SAME!  There are some really great people out there,
    capable of helping you a lot.  Also, asking a friend to help with
    such an intensely personal problem may not make them feel comfortable,
    as perhaps they don't feel competent in the area of helping other
    people that way.
    
    I wish I could give you the answers, but I'm afraid you'll have
    to ferret them out yourself.
    
    -Jody
    

I wonder if people in your mutual working environment mentioned something to 
her that you don't even know about, or if someone somehow got through to her 
husband that she was spending a lot of time with you; someone she knew may have 
observed the two of you at lunch and said something that caused a problem with 
her husband.  Male-female friendships are really touchy issues for a lot of 
people surrounding them.  There are a lot of insecurities in this world.  I 
once made a big issue out of a friendship between a guy I was seeing, and a 
female friend of his who was married to someone else.  I was at a weird stage 
in my life then.  A year later, I finally realized what were my own 
insecurities, and I apologized to them both (he couldn't take my b.s. any more 
and we stopped seeing each other.  Now I have someone special in my life, and 
he and I are able to be good friends).

I think the idea of broadening your circle of friends is a good one.  It sounds 
like you're able to form good, trusting bonds with people, and trusting each 
person with a little bit about yourself might help.  I'm not a therapist (nor 
do I play one on TV), so I don't have pat answers, just ideas based upon my 
experiences.

Good luck
Meredith

    I was once in a situation where a friend of mine was in
    desparate emotional trouble, afraid she might commit suicide
    without an adult around.  I (and others) took turns staying
    with her while she worked through things with her therapist.
    Eventually she felt strong enough to live alone, but she
    still depended on us a lot.  It reached the point where I
    simply did not have the energy to help her as much as she
    needed my help, but I found it real hard (then) to say so,
    and it seemed easier to just kind of avoid her for a while. 

    If your friend is having trouble of her own, this may be the
    only way she can see, right now, of turning her energies away
    from you and toward what she needs.  Give her time, and I
    second the earlier suggestion that it might help to talk to
    some other people also.

    -- Linda

    I wouldn't be surprised if rumors are circulating. I've been the
    victim of rumors recently based on only a couple of lunches with a
    male friend.  I can imagine the kind of tales that must circulate
    when you see someone daily.  I'm fortunate that I don't give a --
    er, expletive deleted -- and that my husband is very supportive
    and open.  Not everyone is so thick-skinned and not every husband
    is so supportive.  She might well be feeling, through no fault of
    hers or yours, that she has to choose between you and her husband. 

    Forgive me if this is off base, but have you investigated medical
    treatment of your underlying condition?  Some diseases can cause
    paranoid symptoms, as can many metabolic imbalances. A family
    friend who was diagnosed under the same label received regular
    doses of medication (lithium, I think?) that helped control his
    bouts of depression and left him with more energy to devote to his
    other problems.  I know this isn't related to your question or
    your pain over your relationship with your friend, but I thought
    I'd mention it since a lot of people aren't aware there can be a
    physical reason behind emotional turmoil. 
    
    --bonnie

    I remember when I took "One Minute Manager" with the authors of
    the book and course in '80.  One statement that stuck in my mind was 
    that you will never know what it is like to receive something
    until you start giving.  Then they proceeded to sell the thin, double
    space lined book to us at $10 a whack.
                                    
    
    Witholding something inside ourselves to keep us preserved is
    smart but it stinks.  There is always a level of mistrust that
    it projects, a certain distance it projects.  It stinks. And it
    gets worse with every new generation.  
    
    Personally, hurt me, use me, lie to me, cheat on me.  But don't
    do nothing to me.  Because I am human not a machine although
    at times I feel like one.

    Regarding your friend, I can understand her behavior as the result
    of several issues:
    
    	1) Friends can't always be strong enough to handle someone else's
    	problems.  Friends have problems too.  You could help resolve
    	this potential issue by asking "can you deal with some emotional
    	issues today?  If you can't, I'll understand." before you dump
    	on someone.  That tells them that you are thinking of them,
    	not just your own problems.
    
    	2) Friends need breathing room.  You can't be her mommie, always
    	looking after her, worrying when she's a few hours late at work.
    	I would be really peeved if someone called me at home when I
    	was late for work.  She may be feeling like you're asking her
    	to report in to you whenever her schedule changes, and you should
    	not be doing this.  If she was out for a few days without notifying
    	anyone at work, ok, call.  But not a few HOURS!  Respect her
    	privacy.
    
    	3) Rumors can be deadly.  I tend to ask people about rumors
    	I hear about them, and 9/10 times I find they're false.  Many
    	people don't ask the rumoree (??), and just pass on the usually
    	false information.
    
    	4) Perhaps there WAS an attraction, and she needed some space
    	and time to separate her feelings from her "better intentions",
    	so she would not be tempted to do something she'd regret.

    As for your own problems, people have given a lot of good advice
    here.  See a councelor - your friends can support you, but they
    aren't trained and won't see some of the signs a good counselor
    will see.  Friends also have their own needs - a counselor has a defined
    relationship to you, and there won't be any conflict between his/her
    needs and yours, as there will be with friends.
    
    Good luck,
    	Louise

    
    	I have some questions which may help you out. Please consider
    them as a constructive input.    
    
    	Do you really believe that you deserve the label you mentioned
    recieving? Is it really your self disposition, what you judge yourself
    to be too? Without disrespecting the possibility mentioned in .6,
    is this actually real, or is it only what you believe (and apparently
    been told) to be real?
    
    	Do you believe that people should go to the extent you're willing
    to go to in an effort to please another? Can you think of anyone
    else that's as responsible? Certainly not the person who "just
    left you a note..." Would you continue to give that person a ride
    if she called and asked again? Would it be nice if she could depend
    on you?
    
    	Why does the sudden abandonment by your friend make you so upset?
    You seem to take it very seriously and overreact; it nearly
    incapacitated you. Do all intimate relationships eventually become
    difficult for you, for one reason or another?
    
    	You cant understand why a person has difficulty entertaining
    an intimate emotional relationship with someone, say, on top of a marriage,
    job, and whatever else is going on in their life. Do you believe
    "normal" people do this kind of thing all the time with each other?
    Do you realize having such a relationship is an exception, not the
    norm?
    	
    	I know what I want to say, but it's very difficult because;
    1) I am not a psychotherapist and am not qualified to open my mouth
    to anyone about what to do, and, 2) It's hard to word what I'm thinking
    without the possibility of it being taken as judgemental. However,
    I can point you toward thinking about something. I'd say consider your
    early life and times, when you were a youngster, as possibly being
    the source and reason of your seeking the "intimate emotional
    relationship" you believe you need to feel better now. If you can
    see this possibility, well, we have a file where we all are, and would
    be glad to have you with us! There is a lot of exchange of Love and 
    support there too. Please consider it, and all the best to you!
    
    	Joe Jas           
    
    	
    
    		                       
    

    I am in the middle of a divorce.  My marriage was a long, turmoiled
    one, and there were/are emotional mountains that I've encountered.
    Only reason I mention this is to illustrate that I empathise with
    your situation.
    
    I found out two years ago, when I was trying to obtain a divorce
    (same woman), that by "dumping" my problems on many of my friends,
    I began to feel *worse* for it.  Not only because *I* had to relive
    each unpleasant episode every time I *explained* to a new friend,
    but also because I began to feel badly about burdening *them* with
    my problem.  It also affected me because each of them had their
    own problems/examples which they (quite rightly) unloaded right
    back to me!  I became kind of overwhelmed with all these issues
    and found that talking them out with so many different folks wasn't
    really helping me.  It was just eliciting their sympathy for me.
    
    Well, this time, I didn't spread the word and talk to them all.
     I had a small number of close friends (about three) with whom I
    confided.  And the MENnotes.  *THEY* provided the greatest source
    of help.  UNBIASED, UNAFFECTED and clear.
    
    My advise (that's what you want, isn't it?):
    1.  Arragne through the Employee Assistance Program to see a
    counsellor.  Their training, experience CAN really help.  They are
    free of expense, and will, if necessary, connect you to someone
    who can help further.  DEC insurance, once you pass the $125
    deductable, will pick up 80% of the tab for further help.  Call
    the insurance co. to get the rules.
    2.  Don't try to share your problems with *everybody*.  Not everyone
    can deal with other folks problems, and (the voice of experience)
    you may overburden them. 
    3.  Lighten up.  Get outside.  Work out, be strenuous, sweat a lot.
    Laugh a bit, ride a bike, DO SOMETHING!
    4.  DON'T EXPECT OTHERS to be as willing to committ to you as you
    are to them.  You appear to be VERY generous with yourself.  Others
    are usually not go willing to go the extra mile as you.  Dont expect
    thkem to, and when they DO...let them know you appreciate it.
    
    Good luck.....good living
    
    tony

    Hi--
    
    You asked where you can find a good counsellor.  From my own
    experience, TALK to people, as you are doing.  Your best referrals
    are word-of-mouth.  Also try Stoneybrook (DEC's own counselling
    facility/staff) for direction, and possibly a counsellor there.
    You need to interview a few of them, to be sure you get one that
    you are comfortable with.  Since you are comfortable with women,
    a woman counsellor would probably be a good idea.  You will find
    that you can let your hair down in a safe environment with this
    person, and a way to deal with your issues at a pace that suits
    you.  
    
    I can't stress enough how much help this can be.  Going to a counsellor
    is a sign of strength;  not weakness.  It shows a willingness to
    help yourself, and to grow.
    
    Previous noters are correct about going to friends for "heavy-duty"
    help.  Often the desire is there (on their part) to help, but the
    necessary skill (and personal detachment) is not.  This can be very
    wearing on a frienship--no fault to the friend, it just is hard
    to know what to do or say.
    
    Please keep us posted, and please remember that you are not alone.
    
    Take care,
    
    Jane
    
    

    In reading the rest of the replies, I came up with a few additonal
    thoughts to share...
    
    1) Is there a reason you continue to give yourself labels like
    "paranoid"?  I have found that when you spend too much time focusing
    on the problem, you can't see the solution.  Broadly speaking, it's
    also a form of procrastination. Since you are enmeshed in the problem, 
    you don't have to work on the solution, thereby keeping the problem
    as THE center of your life and nurturing what you DON'T want, rather
    than what you DO want. Why not simply start chipping away at the
    stone little by little until you've finally got the finished product
    the way you want it to be?
    
    2) Have you ever considered subliminal tapes to help you in your
    efforts?  My family listens regularly to subliminal tapes on whatever
    we need help in, and we have found them to be a wonderful help!
    Thus far, subliminals have helped with creative thinking, goal setting,
    bed wetting, improving grades in school, and feeling more properous.
    There are many different flavors available for just about anything you
    need help with and they are reasonably priced. We play them as
    background music while we do some other activity or as we fall
    asleep--the idea being that while your conscious mind is busy with
    the music, your subconscious mind is picking up the messages behind
    the music. You don't have to believe they work for subliminals to
    be effective. You only need to be persistent in playing them regularly
    for at least 30 days.  They are NOT a cure all.  They can be very
    helpful is speeding up solutions to problems though, which is why
    I'm sharing the idea with you.
    
    3) Finally, just remember that you're not alone. I think that all
    of us who have responded want you to know that even strangers can
    care, and we all want you to be successful in your search for peace
    of mind; so hang in there!
    
    Best Wishes-
    Barb