Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    I'm making my second attempt at quitting smoking right now.  I figure
    I'll quarter my normal # of cigarettes for a week, then stop.  Cold
    turkey didn't work last time, so I'm going to try a modified version.
    
    I saw a study explaining the difficulty with quitting cigarettes.
    The addictiveness of nicotine is not the only problem; it is the
    delivery.  Each time you take a drag, your body gets a little rush.
    So the # of doses of nicotine a day is not simply the number of
    cigarettes, but actually the number of drags.
    
    The hardest thing is that although 1) it is disgusting, smelly,
    etc, 2) I can't taste or smell as well as before, 3) I gross out
    others with my smoke, and of course 4) it is certain to kill me,
    I still find it hard to even _want_ to quit.
    
    Lee

    
    
    	If you want a horror story then I'll be glad to tell you what
    	happened to my Dad Xtine.. I'll tell you the pain that he went
    	thru and the pain we all went thru watching him fade away to
    	nothing..
    
    	If you want to hear it then lemme know..
    
    	I hope you can give them up.. I'd hate to see someone go thru
    	that again.. Especially a friend.
    
    						mike

re .0
My mother and uncle died of emphysema being that they were both heavy
smokers. If you could have seen them dying I think you would have
been scared. One possible thing for you perhaps is to volunteer in
a hospital and watch some people dying from emphysema or lung cancer.

Re: .3  

Mike, thanks.  I'm sorry about your father.  Hearing about it isn't the sort of 
thing that would help.  I know people die from cancer, I have a close relative 
getting used to life without a larynx, and I know it can be a long and horrible 
way to go, because that's what I've heard.  I'd like to see a little bit of it.
Maybe then I'd be scared enough.  Whatever that means.

Re: .2  

Bob, there's a conference called "No_smoking".  I didn't think it would be a 
friendly or supportive place to write my note -- I already know how offensive my
habit is to some and I know how harmful my second-hand smoke is.  Knowing this 
does nothing to encourage me to quit, it only makes me feel guilty.  However, I 
did go look there a minute ago, and after a scan of the first 120 notes, I found
about 10 that might be of interest to me.

As for not wanting to quit:  on a "gut" level, this is true.  Why should I
want to?  It _feels_ good in many ways.  If I vomited every time I took a drag,
I know I wouldn't be smoking for very long.  If a cattle prod materialized from
out of nowhere and every time I took a drag I got a little jolt in the chest, I 
probably wouldn't be smoking for very long.  I've had this habit for a long time
now and it's very comforting to me.  If I'm feeling anxious (which is a great 
deal of the time), it relieves a little of that anxiety.  If I am mad, a 
cigarette seems to calm me down.  If nothing else it has the soothing effect of 
a ritual.  Not smoking makes me feel crazy.  I do not know what to do with my 
hands (no rude jokes, please)!  I do not like spending my waking hours thinking 
of nothing else but smoking.  I'd like some encouragement to carry on.  I'd like
to hear from others who've been through the same thing because I think they're 
the ones who can help me to help myself.  The note title was a lousy one, I 
admit.

I suppose what I'm looking for from other noters is their story of how hard it
was for them (I guess that means I don't want to hear from people who just
decided to quit, never had another cigarette, never missed it, etc.) -- and if 
they've managed to kick the habit, what helped them to do so.  I'm also looking 
for people to say to me "I know you're doing a very hard thing.  Good luck!"  I 
want encouragement and understanding.  I want pats on the back.  I know too many
people who have said "Well, thank god you've finally decided to quit that 
stinking habit!"  That doesn't help.  If anything, I get the urge to light up so
I can blow smoke at them...

Sometimes I feel as though I can't live without a smoke.  Pretty difficult to 
comprehend, isn't it, since intellectually I know that I very probably won't 
live a very long or enjoyable life with them.

Chewing gum with a vengence...

CQ

    If this indeed a note about addictions, I know what you are going
    through.  Although I have never smoked, I can empathize with you--my
    addiction is FOOD.  Since I exercise so much, it's easy for me to
    justify over-eating.  I went on the Scarsdale diet and lost 12 lbs.,
    but unless I keep right with it, I gain.  
    
    Like you, I try scare-tactics from time to time.  (The scariest
    is looking at myself in an old bathing suit when I've gained too
    much weight!)  I wish there were an easy way for both of us, but
    I guess (from my own experience) vigilance is an answer (how dull).
    Re: smokers, I've watched my mom and a good friend give it up "cold
    turkey"--they made it, and to this day don't smoke.  I won't kid
    you--they suffered (we ALL suffered!), but took the "one day at
    a time" approach.
    
    I wish you luck with your efforts, and I think that by running you
    are setting yourself up for success---you may be replacing the bad
    habit with a good one.
    
    Best of luck,
    
    Jane 

    How about coffee?  Ever tried to give this up?  If you are like
    me, turbo charged metabolism, coffee can be fatal.  (well, not
    really).
    
    Many people are addicted to coffee, I know I am.  Someday
    they'll make something that tastes like the real thing....
    minus the caffeine.
    
    Jeanne
                                                        
    

    re: .0
    
    I can understand the problem, and can also sympathise wih you over
    the desire to stop smoking. I had my last (i hope) cigarette 5 months
    ago. I just never realised how addicted to the little suckers i
    was. Fortunately I had a lot of support from friends.....one in
    particular.
    
    Anyway...Dec runs a smoking cessation clinic every once in awhile,
    that is where i went to get "un-hooked". There are no gross pictures,
    no black lungs...except the ones that you bring. The person running
    it just gets everyone to talk about their habit...HONESTLY. There
    is no bullshit...you either want to stop or you don't. They give
    you the method, show you how to use the method, and prove to you
    it works. I would check with helth services in your area, to find
    out when the next program will be. Remember though, even if you
    go thru the program, and continue to smoke...it will never be the
    same...smoking that is. It does something to you...i can't describe
    it and neither can some friends who continue to smoke...but i have
    a feeling......it's GUILT.
    

There are other addictions that people are more afraid to admit to.

For instance, some people are addicted to sex.  Some are addicted
to masturbation.

This, of course, brings up the whole question about what's an addiction
versus what's just a "hobby" or a "pastime".

I think an addiction is generally associated with the item under question
depriving one of other aspects of their life.

/Eric

    re .8
    I also went to the Digital sponsored smoke out clinic. I liked
    their approach and would recommend it to other people who want
    to quit.
    
    Bonnie

    I work with 30 non-smokers.  The peer pressure to quit is tremendous.
    My manager got me an atomic smoke filter, I'm isolated from my
    technical resources.  It sure gets lonely...
    I quit for a week last month and couldn't work, talk think or function.
    I had a conferance with my manager and he offered to pay for a quit
    smoking treatment program.  We got 3 brochures from three hospitals
    that have different programs.  I don't want the scare tactics, I
    assisted on autopsies in the military so there isn't much that grosses
    me out.  I figure its the monitoring of the habit, slowly breaking
    it and replacing it with something non-addictive.  Cold turkey does
    work for some people, but I learned from one clinic that an addictive
    personality has a harder time because the comfort zone is being
    violated.  A replacement needs to be found, I didn't realize how
    hard that would be to find!  My first seminar is on the 30th of
    March.  I would be willing to share what I find out if anyone is
    interested.  
    BTW I checked out no_smoking and would rather not be preached to
    about the advantages, I do know them.  I want a method that works,
    I didn't see any in there.  As for myself quiting.....I will. 
    Maybe there should be a support group for all of us who are trying
    but I don't think cold turkey quitters should be allowed, or
    non-smokers who preach hell and damnation.  I wouldn't mind a group
    of people who offer encouragement to people who are *currently*
    trying to quit because they are too.
    any takers???  send me mail...
    
    vivian
    

  Right now, your feelings for continuing to smoke are stronger than your
  reasons for quitting.  You already have all the reasons you need to
  quit, and if you don't, there are lots of people who will be happy to
  give you more.  Your "scare tactics" seem to be an attempt to address
  these feelings, but they fail because you respond with the reasons you
  already know, but not your feelings, so you wind up in an endless circle.
  
  Get in touch with your own feelings on the matter.  Understand both
  sides.  Why do you like to smoke?  What does it do for you?  Is there
  anything else you can do that will give you the same feelings?  Then, on
  the other side, why do you want to quit?  Would the feeling after quitting
  be "better" than the feeling you have about smoking?
  
  One more thing:  these are *your* feelings and they don't have to be
  justified to anyone else.  But sometimes knowing what your feelings
  are can help you make a decision of what you *want* to do.  When you
  want to do something and you know the pros and cons of your decision,
  it makes it that much easier to do it.
  
  
  						Terza
  
  
  P.S.- I wouldn't ignore that feeling of a "slow suicide."  That's serious.
        That would say to me that my system is ringing the alarm and I'd
        better do something about it.  Definitely scary, but true.
  
  
  

    I apologize in advance for the flaming I'm about to do, but I think
    someone should say something. 

    I'm getting a little tired of the, "all you have to do is give it up"
    attitude that most people seem to have about smoking and other forms
    of addiction.

    Addiction is a medical condition. It is *not* a matter of will power.
    If you are addicted to something, be it nicotine, alcohol, or morphine
    (heroin is simply a derivative of morphine), it means that there are
    biological reasons why you can't give it up.

    Asking someone to understand their feelings about smoking (assuming, of
    course, that this person is addicted and doesn't merely have a habit)
    is a little like asking them to understand their feelings about oxygen.
    You don't get the luxury of having feelings about something you're
    addicted to. 

    I'm sorry if this is scary, but it is. No one likes talking about the
    loss of control and an apparent loss of free will. This is why we like
    to pretend that giving up smoking is simply a matter of will power.

    Current medical evidence says that of 100 smokers, 85 will be able to
    quit with the proper assistance, support from loved ones, and large
    quantities of coffee stirrers. The other 15 are addicted. Sounds pretty
    good, eh? Well, of 100 heroin addicts, 95 will be able to quit with the
    proper assistance. This means that for every person who is really and
    truly addicted to heroin, there are three addicted to nicotine (per
    capita, anyway). Another way to look at this is that nicotine is three
    times as addictive as heroin.

    If you've tried to stop smoking and can't, stop kicking yourself. Go
    see your doctor. *Insist* on getting some sort of nicotine replacement.
    If your doctor balks, listen closely, but carefully. I'm not a doctor,
    and I'm not up on the latest on addiction therapy. There may be new
    techniques that mere laymen know nothing about. But stop kicking
    yourself, don't let people give you guilt trips, and get medical help. 

    	Jon

Re: .13
  
  
>    I'm getting a little tired of the, "all you have to do is give it up"
>    attitude that most people seem to have about smoking and other forms
>    of addiction.
  
  Excuse me, but I don't believe anyone is saying that all you have to do
  is give it up.  At least, I hope not.  And, if anyone is implying that
  it's easy, they are just fooling themselves and not helping the person
  asking for help.

>    Addiction is a medical condition. It is *not* a matter of will power.
>    If you are addicted to something, be it nicotine, alcohol, or morphine
>    (heroin is simply a derivative of morphine), it means that there are
>    biological reasons why you can't give it up.>
  
  I don't disagree with any of the statements you made here.  But, I,
  personally, don't believe biological reasons can ever be the *cause* of
  addiction, although they may be a significant part of the vicious cycle.

>    Asking someone to understand their feelings about smoking (assuming, of
>    course, that this person is addicted and doesn't merely have a habit)
>    is a little like asking them to understand their feelings about oxygen.
>    You don't get the luxury of having feelings about something you're
>    addicted to. 
  
  But that's exactly my point.  You don't have the necessity, not luxury,
  of understanding your own feelings about an activity you willing engaged
  in, even though you may not be biologically capable of just giving it
  up right at this very moment.

>    I'm sorry if this is scary, but it is. No one likes talking about the
>    loss of control and an apparent loss of free will. This is why we like
>    to pretend that giving up smoking is simply a matter of will power.
  
  It *is* scary.  That is why "scare-tactics" will never work.  None of
  them come even close to the fear and knowledge that you've given up
  a portion of control over your own free will.
  
>     Another way to look at this is that nicotine is three times as
>     addictive as heroin. 
  
  I strongly disagree with your logic here.  The statistics you quoted
  simply say there are three times as many people addicted to nicotine
  as there are addicted to heroin, not that nicotine is three times as
  addictive as heroin.  But don't let statistics, whatever they may be,
  keep you from seeking help for a condition you want to change.  The
  key phrase here is "want to change."  Want to change does not imply the
  automatic ability to fix it.  If that were true, there wouldn't be an
  addiction in the first place.


  In any case, I apologize if it seemed that my reply was trying to lay
  a guilt trip or imply that it was at all simple.  In reading back over
  it, I realized that it was easy to give up could have been implied.
  
  What I was trying to say was that by getting in touch with your feelings
  about it, you would be better able to determine whether you really wanted
  to change it, not that knowing your feelings would give you the means to
  change it with.  See the difference?  In other words, knowing your feelings
  would bring you one step closer to determining a solution, not give you the
  solution. 
  
  Thanks for the opportunity to clarify my response.
  
  
  							Terza
  
  
  

    Thanks Jon,
    
    Also, I have had some return mail, and we *are* starting a support
    group for gonna quits.  If there are any other takers, let me know
    and I will send out the distribution.  I start the class on the
    30th, and will be sending out what I find out after that.  
    
    vivian
    btw, good thoughts from others are welcome, we *are* gonna quit,
    without massive destruction in our wake.............
    
    

    Was I glad to ever read these notes.  I am happy for all of you
    that "want to change" a bad habit.  I'm lucky.  I never got caught
    up in habits (drugs, alcohol, caffeine, nicotine) but there's one
    thing that I am trying to make people in my office area realize.
    While smokers feel the "right to" support their habit (by smoking
    in public buildings), non-smokers have a "right to" clean air. 
    So, we ask management, how can this happen "at the same time". 
    It can't.  That is why I am becoming very instrumental in getting
    this building (personnel) aware that the percentage of smokers here
    is higher than the national average.  When I spoke with personnel,
    I'll have you know that Digital (the Company) is planning something
    very radical for Fiscal Year 88 as far as smoking is concerned.
    I take it from this manager that Digital will be "helping" the smoker
    to break his/her habit by designating smoking areas and offering
    health advice packages and aids in quitting.  I really hope that
    this program gets in place for 1) the smoker will learn to deal
    with the reasons he/she "needs" smoking in their lives and how to
    combat this and 2) I am medically affected by transient smoke in
    my environment (allerigic rhinitis) and working here is unbearable.
    
    In a report titled Action on Smoking in Health, it states Smoking 
    is the number one national health problem that is curable.  It also
    stated that transient smoke inhaled by non-smokers CAUSES lung cancer.
    My grandmother died of lung cancer and SHE DIDN'T EVEN SMOKE.  My
    boyfriends' mother's aunt was told by doctors time after time that
    she had better quit smoking.  Guess what?  It was her HUSBAND that
    smoked, NOT HER.
    
    I can't live without clean air in my working environment.  Smoke
    filled air WILL KILL ME if the problem isn't cleaned up.  I could
    leave the company and become a hermit but that won't make the problem
    go away.
    
    I know this might sound flame-high but I am sort of angry because
    I don't work with many considerate people.  They know I am allergic
    and get nosebleeds but they continue to fume around me.  It isn't
    fair and I plan working with the Digital Doctor to do something
    about it.
    
    flame-off  Good luck in breaking a breakable habit.

    Re: .16
    
    About 2/3 of our floor in ZK is now designated non-smoking.  There
    is a conference room reserved for smokers.  It can be done today
    - you need not wait.
    				Steve

    Steve, I wish it were that simple but I've gotten no where with
    management.  All they do is move me around in cubicles that are
    worse off than the previous one.  I really don't know what else
    to do so I escalated it to Personnel because I felt that "they"
    can help me.
    
    I'm patiently waiting but in the meantime, I take my prescriptions
    (4 x daily)  and take breathers outside about 3 times a day.  BTW,
    this building has very poor circulation and I'm not alone in my
    complaints.
    
    I know there is a smokers notes somewhere.  Can anyone tell me the
    nodename and I will add it to my conferences and discuss this issue
    in greater detail in there.
    
    Thanks.....

    The conference is REGENT::NO_SMOKING.
    
    KP7, etc.

    Thanks, Jerry.