|
A new born, conditioning ?
I can remember my mother telling me that "She wouldn't be around
forever and you shouldn't expect your wife to wait on you hand and
foot"!
Well she taught me to make do for myself. Cooking, sewing, ironing,
washing and etc. She died before my second wife came along, but
my wife is eternally grateful for this. To tell you the truth so
am I. When I had my own place I never had to face hungry nights
or dirty clothes and such.
When my daughter was born I never put her in a female role. I treated
her as a person right from birth. Even the toys were her choice.
But it's funny she really cared for the girl items rather then male
toys.
So I feel that maybe, just maybe it's more than conditioning!
What do you think?
Cal
|
| This topic had come up in a couple of discussion/support groups
that I'm active in. My own feeling, from discussions and reading
is that a lot of behavior is genetic and driven by the brain's
firmware. Let me explain:
RE: .0-.1
Mom also taught me to cook at an early age since I lived in
a working household. Must be a good cook, since I my ex-wife put
on 20 pounds while we were married, she was a lousy cook, so guess
who the chef was?
As far as your daughter goes....hhmmmmm! Littel girls love
dolls and cuddly things, maybe an inborn instinctual nurturing/
mothing drive being satisfied, I haven's asked many toddlers why
they gravitate one way or another. My folks told me that from a
toddler stage I just loved mechanical things, the radio/phono
console, the tv, the washer, etc. I'de ignore my toys in pref-
erence to these. Myu parent snever pushed me one way or another
in choices; I always wanted cars, trucks, train sets, etc......
the normal male stuff. Our ancient ancestors never had things
like record players or tonka trucks so some of this may have
come from seeing dad drive on family outings.....I dunno, follow-
ing a male role model. From a toddler age ( I was told) I'de
scream my brains out if dad didn't take me into his workshop when
he was tinkering with an appliance. I wound up having an extremely
high mechanical aptitude when tested. Was there something in my
genetic makeup that said I was destined to have the knack for
tinkering. My grandfather traced our lineage back ~450 years and
Our cut of the Levasseur clan have been architects, artists and
other crafty types.
Here's another tough one:
Many people thought that homosexuality was caused by environment
if you wanna follow Freud, close binding mother/distant father,
lack of male contact. It's a fact that most gay males can look back
and trace their MOTSS attraction to age 3-6, not so much as a sexual
attraction but an obsessive interest in males. A lot of the non
gay men in discussion groups I have been in admitted to an asexual
attraction to either sex. Since the littel ones do not have a good
enough understanding of the world at 3-7, underlieing traits, talents
etc usually don't surface until the right/wrong environmental stimuli
do a call to those traits.
My best boyhood friend had an almost identical family envionment
where the decisions as to what he liked were left to him. I never
developed a liking for sports but he became rabidly competitive
in sports without his parents or peers pushing. I developed an
olympic swimmer's body without ever having to work out. Was there
something in my genes that said, hey Ray go for the gold. I was
horrible in phys ed and hte couch told em it was a shame that God
saw fit to endow me with the body I had. Oh well nuff said!
A lot is human conditioning; parental/peer pressures, but I'll
end with a little scenario, if 100 newborns were taken from their
parents and left on an island (assume someone to just feed and
do basic baby maintenance stuff) with no direction, I'de bet that
some would turn out homosexual, some violent, some curious and
creative......it all comes down to the giant gene pool, I dunno
am I making sense?
Ray
|
| RE: .3 Dragging baggage from past experiences
I think that the baggage (in assumptions about women) that I carry
is only a reflection of the filters I see women thru. If I don't
like something I see, it is probably a projection of a part of me
that I haven't yet accepted. I don't have to like it, but when
I accept it as a part of me, then I can lay aside that filter.
Until I understand the part of me that is the same as the part of women
that I don't like, I don't see how I can lay it aside.
|
| My parents certainly tried to raise me in the old traditional female
subserviant role...but it didn't take. ;-)
I'm the oldest of four children, I have a younger sister and two
younger brothers. I have always been the adventurous, gregarious
type of soul. I preferred rough and tumble games that all the boys
were fond of and was never too interested in doll houses or tea
party games.
As the eldest *female* child, I had the biggest hunk of household
chores. My brothers did not do housework, except for emptying the
trash and picking up their own room. I was responsible for the dishes,
laundry, dusting, sweeping, mopping, etc. My sister was not a very
big help here, she was allergic to everything under the sun, including
the sun, so she usually remained sheltered in her spotlessly clean
room while the heavy stuff went on elsewhere in our home.
As the boys grew older, yard work became their responsibility. Pull
them weeds fellas, that's *man's* work. It's probably fairly obvious
that I really resented the entire set-up, but that was back in the
50's and it sure is different today.
All the hours I used to spend with my little brothers building roads
and small cities in the dirt to run tonka trucks down was attributed
to my being a responsible older sister entertaining her brothers.
Actually, it was probably more fun for me than it was for them.
I have three daughters and one son. I have attempted to direct each
of them to make their own choices, but I also made sure that each
one of them knows how to do laundry, cook meals, hoe a garden, change
a flat tire, shop sensibly, and to take responsibility for their
own actions.
I believe somethings may be inborn and attributed to genes, but
some ideas and attitudes are learned processes. Some women are terrific
in traditional male fields and some men are terrific in traditional
female fields. And everyone should do what is best for themselves,
not as they think society dictates.
-sunny-
|