Conference bookie::movies

    dc I believe the last Movies file was "lost" due to system problems -
    lots and lots of excellent movies, reviews and information will surely
    be missed.
    
    Joyce

        If I had to make a nomination for "Best Song at the Right Time" in
    a movie it would be a toss-up for me between.... drum roll please.
    
    The Wind Beneath My Wings, from " Beaches " 
    
    and
    
    A Whole New World, from "Aladdin (never know if it is 2 d's or 2 l's)
    
    Both of these songs were perfect for the moment in the movie.
    
    Paul
    

  Got one better than that. In Robin Hood the theme started to play as Maid
Marian's boat went off into the mist with the light shinning through her hair.
It was very romantic. 

  Also Strouse's "Also Spoke Zerathurstra" at several points during 2001 was
very dramatic. And of course we all know sharks just can't eat if they don't
crank up the Jaw's theme ahead of time. 

  But my all time favorite for music timing was in the Graduate. Duston Hoffman
(I forget the character's name) and Mrs Robinson (Ann Bankcorft) were in the
hotel room alone for the 1st time. A very nervous Hoffman had just finished
brushing his teeth and as he and Mrs. Robinson turned of the light and sank
into the pillow they started to play Simon and Garfunkle's Sound of Silence
("Hello darkness my old friend, I've come to talk with you again..."). It was
perfect. 

  George

Definately the music from Enya in LA story when the storm comes up and the
compass and altimeter on the plane start going crazy..

I thought it fit the mood and the scene perfectly...

John

re .3

> Got one better than that. In Robin Hood the theme started to play as Maid
>Marian's boat went off into the mist with the light shinning through her hair.
>It was very romantic. 

Which Robin Hood? There have been at least half a dozen Robin Hood films.

Film music is without a doubt a very important element. Many films have been
substantially improved by a good score. In quite a few films it's the best
thing about that film.

Just randomly a few films improved condsiderably by an excellent score:

The Red Pony                 (Aaron Copeland)
The Man From Snowy River     (Bruce Rowland)
The Ghost and Mrs Muir       (Benard Herrmann)
The Informer                 (Max Steiner)
Excaliber                    (Orf, Wagner)

And a couple of films that have been hurt by a poor or inappropiate score:

The Angel and the Badman  (just plain bad, more like a tv western score)
Ladyhawke                 (wildly inappropiate for this film)


Randy

RE    <<< Note 15.5 by 28994::WSA038::SATTERFIELD "Close enough for jazz." >>>

>Which Robin Hood? There have been at least half a dozen Robin Hood films.

  How many had Maid Marian going off in a boat with her hair back lit?

  For those who are confused, I was refering to the latest Robin Hood with
Kevin Costner.

  George

    Take away the soundtrack from "Mo' Money" and there is no movie !! ;-)
    
    

    
    'Adagio for Strings' by Samuel Barber
    
    From Platoon ...
    
    - acp

    
    The soundtrack to ANGEL HEART..a movie with Mickey Rourke..its
    excellent...
    
    MUSIC BY: COURTNEY PINE
    PRODUCED BY: TREVOR HORNE

    The Movie "Harry's Game" AKA in vhs release, "Belfast Assassin" was an
    utterly forgettable film. poorly acted and poorly paced, though closely
    following Gerald Seymour's book.  The theme for this movie was by
    Clannad and is quite possibly the most haunting thing i have ever
    heard.  It is available on several of their records.
    
    Andrew
    

    If it hasn't been noted before, "Harry's Game" (the song by Clannad)
    was also featured in Patriot Games (the movie and the soundtrack:). 
    
    
    A trivia bit we could all probably do without, but what the hey.
    
    kim

re    <<< Note 15.12 by 37966::RIVERS "may this vale be my silver lining." >>>

  >  If it hasn't been noted before, "Harry's Game" (the song by Clannad)
  >  was also featured in Patriot Games (the movie and the soundtrack:). 
 
  >  A trivia bit we could all probably do without, but what the hey.
    
    kim

    Where would a movie note be with out trivia. :-)
    Clannad is also featured in Last of the Mohicans.
    Does anyone know what group or singer is doing the background music in
    the latest Volkswagen TV commercial, it sounds like Clannad or maybe Enya
    or maybe Loreena McKinnet or..........

   Thanks
   BArry

    I think the VW commerical (if memory serves,it's a tempermental thing)
    is Enya, although I *think* we're all supposed to be fooled into
    thinking this is some kind of Germanic song.  :)
    
    kim

    "Reservoir Dogs" - Super Sounds of the '70s

    "Performance" - "Memo From Turner"

    "Duck Soup"- Fredonian anthem and call to arms

    "Citizen Kane"'s tribute to Good Ol' Charlie Kane

    "Swordsman II" - big pop number "Immortal Heroes" (might have the
    adjective wrong)

    "Stage Fright" and "Rancho Notorious" - my picks for crawliest Marlene
    Dietrich numbers

    "Eraserhead"'s journey into the nightmarish underbelly of Fats Waller

    "To Have and Have Not" - "How Little We Know"

    "Gentlemen Prefer Blondes" - "Anyone Here for Love" and "Diamonds Are a
    Girl's Best Friend"; over the top and into your pants

    Just about everything from "Ball of Fire" including the matchbox boogie
    and the perfessors' barbershop quartet harmonies
    
    To polish off the Howard Hawks section, how about the "Rio Bravo"
    singalong and "Bringing Up Baby"'s many renditions of "Everything Is
    Not All Right Susan"?

    "Sunnyside"'s pre-Code iceberg-melting production number and "Keep Your
    Sunny Side Up (Up)", the scariest lockjawed grin before Gene Kelly

    Jean-Luc Godard always gives great soundtrack but favorite splashy
    numbers are "Sad Movies Always Make Me Cry" from "The Married Woman",
    and the "Band of Outsiders" dance

    "The President's Analyst" - hilariously intentionally inappropriate
    hippie folk song scene and hilariously  unintentionally inappropriate
    breathy joy-to-the-world I (Heart) New York scene

    Hope & Crosby off on the Road to Morocco with several renditions of
    "Moonlight Becomes You"
    
    "The Long Goodbye"s from "The Long Goodbye"
    

    I see that one of the documentaries nominated for an Academy
    Award this year is "Music for the Movies: Bernard Hermann".
    If anyone sees that this is playing in the greater Boston
    area (which means anywhere within two hours of Boston,
    north, west or south), please note it here.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Richard

    
    Rumble Fish, by Stewart Copeland (Don't Box Me In vocal by Stan Ridgway)
    
    1920's Harlem jazz, lots of good stuff from The Cotton Club ...
    
    Carmine Coppola's excellent work on all 3 Godfather movies ...
    
    And of course, the judicious use of The End by The Doors in Apocalypse Now.
    
    - acp

    Clannad did the VW commercial, it is Harry's Game.  they have done
    quite a lot of soundtrack work, mostly for television, including some
    documentary work and the Robin of Sherwood TV series in England.  Enya
    is the little sister of three of the members of Clannad, thus the
    similarities, she did a series in England called "The Celts" and did a
    song for the movie "Far and Away", the song is called "Book of Days"
    and covered the closing credits.
    
    Andrew,  a major Clannad fan 
    
    

    I love Nino Rota. He has done music for Fellini's movies,
    and there's a CD compilation out that's very good. He defies
    categorization.
    
    My husband thinks that the woman who did the music for "The
    Crying Game", Anne Dudley, is also in the band Art of Noise.
    Anyone know for sure?
    
    Lucy

Playing in my mind this morning, as occasionally happens, is a truly cloying
song about "Marmalade, Molasses, and Honey," sung by Andy Williams, which was
featured in a western called "The Life and Times of Judge Roy Bean" that I saw
in the mid-1970s.  The movie starred Paul Newman.

An unfortunately memorable piece of "movie music."

-Stephen

    Oh god, and that mid-'60s practice of putting pop song stakes through
    the heart of perfectly fine British dramas ("Alfie", "Georgie Girl",
    ...)
    

    
    ...Don't forget (I mean, how can you?) "To Sir, With Love"!
    
    gloria
    

I highly recommend the sound track from Point of No Return, featuring the
music of Nina Simone, a blues singer (deceased?)

Regards
Barry

    
    Last time I heard, Nina Simone is alive and well - thank goodness.
    
    gloria

To clarify this topic some it might be good if we differentiate between the
film score and diegetic music. Diegetic music emananates naturally from the
plot, someone sings or plays an instrument or there is a band playing that
we can see or even someone turning on a radio. The film score is not a part
of the story itself even though it can add much to our enjoyment. In other
words the characters in the film can hear diegetic music but not the score.



Randy

    Diegetic?  Sounds like the name of a pill for heartburn relief.
    
    

    I used to have an LP of movie music by Bernard Hermann . It contained
    music from the films 'Journey to the centre of the earth', 'The
    seventh voyage of sinbad', ' the day the earth stood still' and '
    faranheit 451'. The music was excellent, unique and featured some very
    early electronic instruments. Has anyone seen this out on CD.
    
    whilst the Samuel barber Adagio for strings is most often remembered
    from Platoon, I always think of David Lynch's 'The Elephant man'. this
    music was included during the section at the end where John merryck
    wants to sleep like a normal man, just for once. I think you hear Ann
    bancrofts line about ' Nothing lasts forever', a very moving moment as
    I recall.

re .27

I think a dog food commercial would be a moving moment if Barber's Adagio
for Strings were played over it. One of the most moving pieces of music
ever written.

There are at least two or three cd's of Herrmann's film music out, I'm not
sure which would include those pieces.


Randy

    Well what a stroke of luck. the LP I refered to earlier containing
    music from scores by Bernard herrman is on CD AND was in a sale at Our
    price in basingstoke for #5.99 (UK price) I of course snapped it up.
    for anyone interested its on the DECCA MOVIE MAGIC LABEL, which I guess
    is under the LONDON name in the US.
    from memory the scores are very rich , with quite a lot of pastiche.
    the music from the seventh voyage of sinabd borrows from Scheherazade
    and Journey to the centre of the earth reminds me of sinfonia
    antarctica by ralpg Vaughan-Williams.
    
    its worth 5.99 just for the music that accompanies GORT ( 'KLAATU
    BERRADA NICTU' ) in the section from the day the Earth Stood Still. 	

    "Bela Lugosi's Dead", by Bauhaus and "performed" in the movie "The
    Hunger", by Peter Murphy and Daniel Ash of the aforementioned band, was
    possibly the most appropriate music possible for the opening scene in
    which two vampires, played by David Bowie and Catherine Deneuve, pick
    up a couple for their periodic feast.  fatastic opening shot.
    
    Andrew
    

    
    Into trailer Walt Disney's film there is a music that was used into
    Gatorade spot (their with some champions sports like JP Papin, Franco
    Baresi, Sergei Bubka, and so on) some months ago. Can someone tell from
    which opera it start from ??
    
    I suppose that the soundtrack is from a classic opera (like Carmina
    burana) and also I cannot help you because I don't know what is the
    original film title.
    
    Thanks in advance 
    
    Roberto
    

    
    Another reply for remember a great musician for film :
    
                        ENNIO MORRICONE !!!
    
    Don't forget him !!!
    
    Roberto

    
    Another think...Someone of you can give me the song list from the
    picture "Oliver & Co." by Walt Disney production.
    
    I know that the Dog Guest star use the B.Joel's voice, is right ??
    
    Roberto
    

    Some soundtrack musings.  I've always loved soundtracks, used to by
    them all the time as a kid.  If I liked the movie, I'd go find the
    soundtrack. (anyone remember the film "Swashbuckler" with Robert Shaw,
    Genieve Bujold, Peter Boyle, Beau Bridges and Geoffrey "The UN-Cola!"
    Holden?  I have that soundtrack.  Still.  :)   I've always liked
    scores to films over soundtracks that are simply a collection of songs
    capable of being played on the radio (Top40 material), but sometimes,
    I'll get the latter.
    
    "True Romance" has a very nice soundtrack, although I don't think most
    of the songs were written for the film.  I especially liked the main
    title  "You're So Cool", by Hans Zimmer, the big-bandesque
    "(Love is) The Tender Trap" by Robert Palmer, and "Viens Mallika Sous
    le Dome Edais from Lokme"/Delibes as arranged by Howard Blake (that's
    what it sez on the insert sheet, really).  I believe the latter either
    came from or was featured in the movie, "The Hunger", as well.
    
    "Basic Instinct", like the movie or not, has a nice score to it by
    Jerry Goldsmith.  The main theme is great, I think, which is basically
    (hah hah) why I bought the soundtrack.  I like the dance club music in
    the movie, but it is not, alas, to be found on the soundtrack CD.
    
    I'd have to recommend the soundtrack to "Edward Scissorhands" for sheer
    fairy-tale musical fun (by Danny Elfman, who else?)  Very pretty, very
    sad in places.  Just like the movie.
    
    "The Nightmare Before Xmas" soundtrack has similarities -- of course
    Elfman's stuff tends to *be* quite smiliar -- and the songs, while
    rather unimpressive in the movie, can really grow on you after
    repeated listenings, especially Oogie Boogie's Song.  
    
    
       

    I think some of my favorite music from movies were:
    
    Superman The Movie
    Somewhere In Time
    The Rocketeer
    Without A Clue  (I would love to get this soundtrack, but can't find it
    			anywhere!)
    Star Trek II: The Wrath Of Khan (unfortunatly, the Reliant attacking
    music was very much the same music used in ALIENS, when the aliens
    attacked, both tracks done by James Horner...)
    
    Michael

    I am very surprised that Mr Lucas has not been mentioned up till
    now,after all he is the man responsible for THX standard,THE STAR WARS
    trilogy has to be one of the best soundtracks of all time,other
    excellent soundtracks are ALIENS -James Horner,Predator_Alan Silvestri,
    Apocacalypse Now-Doors,Deliverance-Dual Banjo's,First Blood/Rambo,Star
    Trek series.
    
                              Rich.

RE .37 - I trust you know, however, that George Lucas didn't write the music
for "Star Wars". You can thank soon-to-be-former-Boston-Pops-conductor 
John Williams for that (and for the Indiana Jones scores and for "Close
Encounters" and for "E.T." and for scores of other scores :-) ).

						-- Nina

re .last:  Which means that you can thank Richard Wagner (from whom 
Williams borrows so many themes)....

    Williams also wrote the soundtrack to Jaws, and Superman The Movie,
    etc.
    
    What themes did he borrow from Richard Wagner? (very curious!)
    
    Michael
    

Call me out, eh?  I'll have to go through the trilogy again to match
up the themes but Siegfried's theme has been reworked into the music
by Williams, the hunter's call into the opening bit of Star Wars.
The bit that follows Siegfried's death but before the funeral march
is used for those dark, dramatic moments.  I have no complaints
with a composer developing on other's work; it produces some depth
and avoids the Schoenberg Syndrome.  ("Look!  There are white keys
*and* black keys.  Aren't I clever?")  It's just that Williams seems
to cross the line between 'developement from' over to 'derivative of'.
To use the SNL comparison, "Ah, Williams.  I liked it the first time
I heard it.  Bayreuth, 1875."  All IMHO.  :-)

Now Jerry Goldsmith is a movie score composer that I have few complaints
about.  He can take a given style imposed by the movie (miltary march,
japanese folk songs, etc.) and produce a score that can stand on its
own.  Puts more thought and effort into his work than many of the
directors and screenwriters do in their media.  I'd like to see a
credit list for him.  It must be rather impressive by now...

monty

    Jerry Goldsmith, is he the one who did ALIEN and STAR TREK THE MOTION
    PICTURE?
    
    Michael
    

    No, that's James Horner.
    
    Jerry Goldsmith did, off the top of my head, the score for "Basic
    Instinct", and (oh, geez, brain freeze).  Well, at least I remembered
    one.  I want to say he did the score for the somewhat forgotten
    "Swashbuckler" (a really fun movie and a really fun score), but I'm not
    100% sure. I have the record somewhere.
    
    
    kim

Actually, I believe he did do one or more of the Star Trek movie scores.
Also Patton, Shogun (I believe).  Planet of the Apes, Total Recall,
Logan's Run and many others...

    on a related subject I recently saw in a UK film magazine that James
    Horner has recorded his long discarded *original* score for 2001: A
    Space Odyssey. Apparently it was turned down in favour of the Straus
    (R), Strauss(J), Ligetti & Katchaturian combination.
    
    Be very interesting to hear his ideas, though I imagine it would be
    hard to surpass "Derrrrrrr Derrrrrrrr Derrrrrrrr, Dahhhh dahhhh dundun
    dundundundundudndundudn ............................"
    
    John Williams also borrows quite a lot of motifs/style from Ralph
    vaugh-Williams (IMHO) being a lover of the 9 symphonies of RVW I hear
    quite a lot of them used by J.W. 

    
    Jerry Goldsmith wrote the score for Star Trek: The Motion Picture, and
    his theme is currently used in the titles for Star Trek: The Next
    Generation, and I believe he scored parts of Alien.  One of my favorite
    works by him is the score he did for Supergirl, music that rose above
    the movie to which it was attached.
    
    DFW

    Jerry Goldsmith also composed the score for "The Wind and the Lion" and
    the theme and first years score for "The Man from U.N.C.L.E."
    
    The background music in the opening sequence in ST:TMP (the scene
    where the Klingon ships are destroyed) is based on a theme he first
    used in The Wind and the Lion.

    I know James Horner did music for Star Trek II:The Wrath Of Khan,
    Aliens, but I do believe Goldsmith did the first (if only parts of)
    Alien, and Star Trek The Motion Picture. Interesting regarding the
    Klingon theme, I didn't know that.....
    
    Michael
    
    

Re: Horner's 2001.  This was recently played on the local station WCRB but
I missed it.  Has anyone heard it and come away with any impressions?

Hmmm, Vaughn-Williams as an influence on John Williams.  Hadn't made
a connection and I too like Vaughn-Williams.  Can you provide a before/after
pair so I can find the influence myself?

monty

    I believe it was Alex North who had his score for 2001 discarded by
    Kubrick. James Horner didn't turn up until the 80s.
    
    Nick

    re -.1
    
    yes of course you are right! now which one wrote the score for 'The
    Right Stuff' ?
    
    re -.2 Well certainly I've noticed similarities with some of the later
    symphonies such as 6 ,7 & 8 but I have to admit it's not very
    scientific. Try listeneing to the 3rd symphony ('Pastoral'),
     also I also hear a lot of RVW in the *EXCELLENT* film music of
    Bernard Hermann . maybe I just hear too much RVW ;-)
    
    has anyone heard any of BH's classical compositions, I think he wrote a
    symphony as well as some chamber works. I love his music for 'Day the
    Earth stood still' and 'Journey To the Centre Of the Earth' which in
    tunr borrows a lot from Holst's the planets

    Well, gosh, I stand corrected many times.  Of the Star Trek films, I
    only have the soundtrack to II, which is a James Horner effort.  I
    guess I thought he'd have done the first one, too.
    
    kim

re .50: Unscientific is alright here.  :-)  I don't think I've ever
heard the Pastoral.  I'm partial to the Sea Symphony, Sinfonia Antarctica,
and Fantasia on a theme....  I'll give it a try.

re other: yes, it was North.

On on obituary note, Leo Termen died last month, without whom we'd
never have had the soundtrack to 'Forbidden Planet.'

monty

    was he the Russian who invented the strange electronic instrument in
    the 1930's ? I recently saw a TV documentary about him, it was so
    strange I thought it was an april fool untill they had Mr Moog and
    Brian Wilson acclaiming the guy ( it was used on 'Good Vibrations').
    
    The instrument was a box with a metal hoop poking out of one side and a
    metal rod climbing from the top. One controlled pitch the other volume.
    The thing was that since the instrument worked on the interaction of
    the soloist with magnetic fields it was played without being touched.

That's it.  I was reading an obituary in German and his Russian name was
transcribed as 'Termen.'  In English, the name and the instrument are
written 'Theremin.'  Some bits from memory from the obit:  'Cosmic'
said Albert Einstein of his music in 1927(?); seemed to get into some
political trouble during the Stalin years; recovered later.  Included
a photo with an early instrument.

monty

    The TV programme I mentioned siad that he was kidnapped from the U.S
    and taken back to Russia where he worked on various 'special electronic
    projects'. only in the 1970's was it found out in the West that he was
    still alive, and in the programme they re-united him with his original
    'theremin soloist ' in New York.
    
    The programme was fascintaing and frustrating at the same time, what
    had he been doing in Russia, why had'nt his group of friends try to
    find him ? There were also throw away lines that left you dumb struck.
    
    A dancer who worked for him (He had an larger version of the theremin
    which you played by dancing on it !) said that Theremin had a working
    colour TV system in about 1930 ! Nothing more was made of this.
    
    The thing was made even more weird when they  interviewed theremin
    today (programme was a few years old). he spoke english but had been
    speaking Russian so long, and was so old that most of what he said was
    very jumbled and reversed. he looked like Peter Cushing.
    
    Fascinating stuff

    >     John Williams also borrows quite a lot of motifs/style from Ralph
    > vaugh-Williams (IMHO) being a lover of the 9 symphonies of RVW I hear
    > quite a lot of them used by J.W. 
    
    IMHO, he has also borrowed heavily from Holst. Compare the opening
    theme from Star Wars as the star destroyer passes overhead to the Mars
    movement of the Planets symphony, for starters. Nonetheless, I like his
    music, though it gets repetitious after  a few dozen movies. Things
    like this make me think, are there really *any* musical themes that
    have not already been used?
    
    			Jim

    
    (a little promotion here)
    
    the rainier symphony (yours truly conducting) will be doing a
    program of film music on our next concert (february 5):
    
    north by northwest - bernard herrmann
    the magnificent seven - elmer bernstein
    murder on the orient express - richard rodney bennett
    the godfather - nino rota
    superman - john williams
    don juan - max steiner
    lieutenant kije - sergei prokofiev
    the umbrellas of cherbourg - michel legrand
    
    

    Paris Texas - Ry Cooder
    Southern Comfort - Ry Cooder
    The Long Riders - Ry Cooder
    The Border - Ry Cooder
    Johnny Handsome - Ry Cooder
    Crossroads - Ry Cooder
    Street of fire - Ry Cooder
    Performance - Ry Cooder
    Alamo Bay - Ry Cooder
    
    
    andy

    
    	Ummm, movies set in the south?
    
    							GTI
    

    Good try :-)
    
    I Really only put the note there to draw people's attention, who may
    not have already known about Cooder's prolific soundtrack work.
    
    In fact, there is a new one just out but I can't remember the title.
    
    You could also add Blue Collar.
    
    For the trivia buffs, Southern Comfort never came out on disc that I am
    aware of (shame because there was some great Cajun music in it).
    
    andy

re: .16

The remake of Ball of Fire, A Song is Born, is nowhere near as good musically
even though it's supposed to be about music. But Benny Goodman as the professor
who is writing the encyclopedia volume on jazz makes it just about worth
watching for the moment he starts to play. (When I saw the film, I didn't know
what Benny Goodman looked like...)

I'd also like to put in a word for two European composers...

Ernst (?) Korngold was a successful mainstream German composer who took to film
music like a fish to water and never seemed to suffer from the temperamental and
practical problems of other composers in Hollywood. I think of him as
post-Wagnerian in the same sort of way as John Williams in Star Wars. Korngold
did a lot of swashbucklers and historical romps, for example The Sea Hawk and
The Private Lives of Elizabeth and Essex. I think he was under contract to
Warners in the 1930s, or maybe Sam Goldwyn loaned him out a lot.

Miklos Rosza was a young Hungarian emigre who worked for Korda at London films
in the 1930s. He produced some brilliant through-composed scores for Korda, and
went on to do the same for Powell and Pressburger. His score is one of the
unambiguously good things about Black Narcissus. (I assume it's his -- our www
server is down and I can't check...) He also did the score of Billy Wilder's The
Private Life of Sherlock Holmes, which I think is a seriously underrated
romantic movie. Rosza was closer to Dvorak or Vaughn Williams (who also had a go
at a through composed score in Scott of the Antarctic) than to Wagner.

    reply to note 15.61 by 41188::HELSOM
    - The European connection -
    *A Song is Born* Well, although a pretty nice movie, it's sad when
    the producers didn't let all those orchestras and combo's play a
    complete number. I hate that. The music clips are just teasers.
    
    *Erich Wolfgang Korngold* PLEASE do not forget his wonderful music
    for THE ADVENTURES OF ROBIN HOOD (1939), starring Errol Flynn! There
    you have two masterpieces in one movie, you'll enjoy it as much while
    just listening to the soundtrack as watching, believe me.
    
    There are MANY great composers in the field of film music, but it's
    hard to beat the above, Max Steiner, Miklos Rosza and Bernard Herrmann
    for example.
    
    Happily, there has been reissues on CD of scores by the above mentioned
    gentlemen.
    
    Keep watching ... and listening!
    Hans