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Conference orarep::nomahs::sql_services

Title:SQL/Services Forum
Notice:kits(3) ft info(7) QAR access (8) SPR access (10)
Moderator:SQLSRV::MAVRIS
Created:Thu Oct 13 1988
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2214
Total number of notes:8586

2183.0. "questions/problems re: sql/services v7 - thx" by BROKE::BITHER () Fri Apr 04 1997 15:25

Hi,

I have several questions re: sql/services 7.0 and database class servers.
Also, I found one unexpected behavioral difference between the gui and non-gui 
interfaces.

Non-gui questions/observations:
------------------------------
PROBLEM:
1)  Which of the alter service attributes take effect by only doing
a start service command instead of a server reboot?   (This applies to
non-gui only since this does not seem to be a problem with the gui.)
The reason I ask is that I created a db class service today which failed 
to start due to a bad attach string and due to a bad sql version. So I tried 
to alter the service with a new attach string.  Then did "START SERVICE 
servicename".  Failed with the same message although it did tell me it would 
update the file with the new attach string once it restarted.  I had to drop 
the  service (which created question #2), @sys$manager:sqlsrv$shutdown70, 
@sys$startup: sqlsrv$startup70, and create the service from scratch.  
This worked.  Then ran into the sql version problem which led to 
question #3.

PROBLEM:
2) Drop service didn't really seem to drop it.  I did DROP SERVICE service,
create service again, and start service but it just tried to start old service
definition that I already deleted.  Had to do @sys$manager:sqlsrv$shutdown70,
@sys$startup:sqlsrv$startup70, and create the service from scratch.

PROBLEM:
3) We installed SQL/Services v7.0 multiversion.  Yet when I defined a
db class server and did "SHOW SERVICE servicename FULL" it shows the
sql version as STANDARD instead of 7.0 as specified as the default setting
on pg 2-12 of the config guide.  As a result I had to alter service
to a new sql version.  Ran into problem 1 again. Only way I could do it
was to do @sys$manager:sqlsrv$shutdown70, @sys$startup:sqlsrv$startup70.

Gui questions/observations:
--------------------------
Modifications made to an already existing service such as changing
SQL version and modifying an attach string DO take effect from stopping
and restarting a service.  A server reboot (sqlsrv$shutdown70/startup70)
is not necessary thru this interface as it is for the non-gui interface
(see #1 and #2 above.)

Thanks, Diane
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2183.1M5::JHAYTERFri Apr 04 1997 21:4729
Hi Diane,

Problems 1 and 2: Did you try shutdown/start of the service?
If I alter a running service, shutdown/start works for me.

>3) We installed SQL/Services v7.0 multiversion.  Yet when I defined a
>db class server and did "SHOW SERVICE servicename FULL" it shows the
>sql version as STANDARD instead of 7.0 as specified as the default setting
on pg 2-12 of the config guide.  As a result I had to alter service
>to a new sql version.  Ran into problem 1 again. Only way I could do it
>was to do @sys$manager:sqlsrv$shutdown70, @sys$startup:sqlsrv$startup70.

the table does seem to imply with MV the default would be standard.  but
the create service does say the default is STANDARD.  My guess is the table
is a doc error.

>Gui questions/observations:
>--------------------------
>Modifications made to an already existing service such as changing
>SQL version and modifying an attach string DO take effect from stopping
>and restarting a service.  A server reboot (sqlsrv$shutdown70/startup70)
>is not necessary thru this interface as it is for the non-gui interface
>(see #1 and #2 above.)

When you make a mod to a "running" server, don't you get the message box
for the option to shutdown and restart the service for the change to take
place??

Jerry
2183.2A few explanationsSQLSRV::MAVRISSue Mavris - smavris@us.oracle.comMon Apr 07 1997 17:4134
Hi Diane,

>PROBLEM:
>1)  Which of the alter service attributes take effect by only doing
>a start service command instead of a server reboot?   

There are no service attributes that only take effect after restarting the 
server.  Service attributes either take effect immediately (increasing 
min/max exec for example) or after the service is shutdown and restarted 
(attach string and sql version for example).  

When a service fails, it's not really in a shutdown state.  The next "start" 
service will start the service with the same attributes.  You need to first 
shut service and then start service in order to start the service with the 
new attributes.  I'll see about making this clearer in the documentation.

>2) Drop service didn't really seem to drop it.  I did DROP SERVICE service,
>create service again, and start service but it just tried to start old service
>definition that I already deleted.  Had to do @sys$manager:sqlsrv$shutdown70,
>@sys$startup:sqlsrv$startup70, and create the service from scratch.

I've never seen this problem.  Can you reproduce it.  If so, will you do a 
"show service xxx full" before the drop, after the drop, after the recreate, 
after the start and send me the input?

>3) We installed SQL/Services v7.0 multiversion.  Yet when I defined a
>db class server and did "SHOW SERVICE servicename FULL" it shows the
>sql version as STANDARD instead of 7.0 as specified as the default setting
>on pg 2-12 of the config guide.  

The config guide is incorrect.  The default SQL version is standard 
regardless of how SQL/Services was installed.  We'll get this fixed.

Sue
2183.3ThanksBROKE::BITHERTue Apr 08 1997 16:2872
Hi Sue and Jerry,

Thanks for your responses.

1.

>When a service fails, it's not really in a shutdown state.  The next "start" 
>service will start the service with the same attributes.  You need to first 
>shut service and then start service in order to start the service with the 

I have to stop taking the documentation so literally!  Would you believe
I didn't think there was such a command as "Shutdown service objectname"
because on pg 1-10 there is no example of such a command.  Yet there is
an example of "Start service objectname"  If pg-10 either said
  SHUTDOWN
  START
or
  SHUTDOWN DISPATCHER
  SHUTDOWN SERVER
  SHUTDOWN SERVICE
  START DISPATCHER
  START SERVER
  START SERVICE
instead of
  SHUTDOWN
  START DISPATCHER
  START SERVER
  START SERVICE

I would have tried a shutdown service command.  I thought it was so strange
that you could start it but that you couldn't shut it down.  So I thought
the startup automatically did the shutdown too!

2.

>2) Drop service didn't really seem to drop it.  I did DROP SERVICE service,
>create service again, and start service but it just tried to start old service
>definition that I already deleted.  Had to do @sys$manager:sqlsrv$shutdown70,
>@sys$startup:sqlsrv$startup70, and create the service from scratch.

>I've never seen this problem.  Can you reproduce it.  If so, will you do a
>"show service xxx full" before the drop, after the drop, after the recreate,
>after the start and send me the input?
 
Well, this was all part of the not knowing there was a shutdown service
command.  When a service is started and you try to drop the service it
won't let you.  If it's stopped, you can drop the service and you won't
see it when you do "show service".  But when it has failed, as was my case,
the following happens:
SQLSRV> drop service rdb_70;
SQLSRV> show service rdb_70 full;
Service RDB_70
    State:                    FAILED
  ...etc.
  ...
**********************************************************
** This Service has been deleted from the config file. **
** It will not exist after it is shut down.             **
**********************************************************

So that's what happened.  Now that I know about the shutdown command,
I can get rid of it.

3.

>The config guide is incorrect.  The default SQL version is standard 
>regardless of how SQL/Services was installed.  We'll get this fixed.

Ok great.

Thanks very much, Diane

2183.4a fix is in the worksWEORG::WARDTue Apr 08 1997 19:0524
    Hi Diane and Jerry,
    
    Thanks for finding these doc errors and points of confusion. 
    I'll fix them for the next release.
    
    The one about SHUTDOWN on p 1-10 is a good one. DROP and START
    are clearly indicated for each object type, but SHUTDOWN is not; I'm
    not sure why I did it that way but it lacks what is known as 
    parallelism.  As a consequence it stands out as a point of emphasis 
    as if to say this command operates on only one object type - the server.
    
    In the same table, ALTER, CONNECT, DISCONNECT, and SHOW also fall into this
    same boat in which each does not clearly describe the object or objects
    on which the command operates. 
    
    This is a good example of where brevity can definitely lead to confusion.
    
    Anyway this is an oversight on my part that I'll soon fix. 
    
    If you find any more doc errors or places that need some clarification,
    please add them as notes to this conference. I'll fix them.
    
    Thanks,
    Rod