Conference 7.286::pet_birds

    Hi Doug!
    
    I had so many birds at the vets office, I became a veterinary
    technician, and now I work in practice for emergency duty and spend
    my days here at DEC.  First of all....Take the keet off the 8-1
    and go right to the vet!  We have recommended several in the earlier
    notes files.  If you need further vet recommendations, just let
    us know!
    
    Upper respiratory infections are most common in cage birds and for
    many reasons.  also, when a bird shows signs of illness, he has
    been ill for a while.  Untreated upper respiratory can lead to an
    early demise.  You need a real vet with proper meds to cure this
    problem.  Also, any meds you give a  bird must be administered for
    a period of 30 days or more!  5 days won't cut it!
    
    Using an on the market remedie treats symptoms not problems.  If
    the vets suggests using 8-1 or Marvalade, then fine.  But first
    see the vet.
    
    Have you put this new bird in with your original keet?  You may
    expect symptoms from him too in a 10 days or so...Sometimes just
    the stress of bringing a bird from a store to a new home and new
    birds will be enough to create a bacteriological issue.
    
    How is the albino's appetite?  How many droppings is he doing, what
    color are they?  Do you hear any rumbling when the bird breathes?
    
    A vet may tell you, I follow this practice religiously too:
    
    1.  Keep new birds separate for about 3 weeks.  In differet parts
    of the house.  Wash your hands when handling the new bird and going
    to your old birds.
    
    2.  Put this albino keet in a smaller cage with NO perches.  Then
    wrap the cage in Saran wrap, leaving some air space a the bottom
    of the cage and place a heating pad under the cage set on med. 
    The cage temperature should be no more and no less than 85 degrees
    F.  This is important.
    
    3.  Keep an eye on the dropping count and color.  Make the bird
    eat all that you can, even if you have to give him just is favorite
    treats to keep his appetite up!
    
    4.	 You will probably get a prescription for an anitbiotic to
    administer to the bird at .05 ml 2 to 3 times a day!  Or, use medicated
    feed.
    
    No bird in trouble should be denied a vet.  It does not matter if
    the bird cost $5 or $5,000.  They all have problems that come up
    that can be treated!  An office call and meds might cost around
    $35.  In my opinion, it is worth it!
    
    Please, keep us posted!
    
    Jean
    

    Ref.1

    Hi Jean
        
    Thanks for the reply and advice, I guess I will break down and go
    the Vet. Unless someone knows if one of the Vet in the Lunenburg,
    Leominster and Fitchburg area, I will be going to the Littleton
    one.
    
    I have been reading books and it seems that in addition to the heat
    that you reccomended I need to give the bird more darkness so that
    it can get extra sleep. I have been spending time with it at night
    after supper. 
    
    The two birds are can't stand to be apart, but I will separate them
    as you suggested. Rita ( the Albino) has good droppings green and
    white 10 to 20 a day and the only noise I hear is her congestion
    no rumbling. Her appetite isn't great. I have been bringing her
    out of her cage for training, should I have leaving her alone ?
    

    Thanks
    Doug

    Doug, Call Dr. Kilgore now!
    
    Rita's droppings should be black and white, not green!  I was sort
    of afraid they'd be green.  Hopefully, it's just stress.  It sounds
    like she should have some emeraid or emercal in her water.  If you
    cannot find these products, put some sugar in her water.  The dextros
    will help spike her appetite and force her to eat.  It is VERY
    important that she get as much nourishment as possible, even if
    you need to hand feed her a baby formula!
    
    When you call LIttleton, make sure the recepionist knows you need
    to see Dr. Kilgore NOW -- If she tries to give you an appointment
    beyond tomorrow, demand to speak to the dr. immediately!
    
    Please Doug, keep us posted!!!
    
    Jean
    

    I took Rita to Dr Flinkstom in Lunenburg. He gave me some amoxicillian
    drops and said to give her 2 drops 1->2 times a day for 30 days.
    Rita also has scaly mites and the Vet said the mites are could be
    the cause of her respiratory infection. For mites he reccomends
    getting a Shell No Pest Strip and hanging it in the same room. He
    doesn't like to prescribe the traditional ointments for scaly mites
    as he considers them dangerous to the bird. He also says for such
    a small bird he wouldn't feel good about giving and injection as
    the drug(I can't remember the name) is meant for Horses and cattle
    and the normal doseage is 1 cc per 100 lbs. He said if I can't find
    the No Pest Strip he could make a ointment of the injectable drug
    for me.
    
    The office visit was $23 and $4 each for the 2 bottles of amoxicillian.

    I have wrapped the cage in Saran Wrap and put a heating pad under
    it. I am keeping the birds together because if I separate them It
    will cause them extra stress. The cage is still only 75 degrees.
    I will try moving the heating pad inside the cage with a paper cover
    today.
                                      
    
    Do you know where I can buy a Shell No Pest Strip.
    
    Also where are there some good pet shops in the Nashua Area ?
          
    I have tried giving my birds lots of different vegatables, but they
    only seems to like seeds and lettuce. I add preen vitamins to thier
    seeds. I am going to see how they like hard boiled eggs tonight.
    What do your parakeets like ?
    
    Doug
    

    Hi Doug!  Glad to hear you and Rita went to the Dr.!  the mites
    sure can be the cause of a problem...Although the Amoxi-drops is
    a surprise...is it 50 milligrams?  Watch for blood in the stool.
    Antibiotics that are too much, can cause some blood to appear...just
    a word of caution...  You can get the Shell strips at most any Agway
    feed store.  when the Shell is not available, I use the Agway brand
    and hang it where the birds cannot eat it!
    
    Call your vet back though...Norden Industries, a veterinary
    pharmaceutical house makes a mite spray labeled for birds!  If he
    cannot get it for you, I have a case at home!  Also, I used a creme
    called EURAX 10% which eliminated mites in 1 application!  The mites
    most likely came from the store -- notify them too!
    
    Did Dr. Flinkstrom say if the mites were scaley mites or red mites?
    Did he explain about them?   
    
    For Nashua area pet shops, use Browns Agway in Hudson on Lowell
    Road, or Wingsong Aviary on the DW Highway in Merrimack and ask
    for Paul -- not Karen!  
    
    All my birds like a concoction I put together and feed them every
    day...that is in the Feeding notes...I have found that if I offer
    the budgies fruits they only pick and throw them down, but they
    love the greens and squashes!
    
    If you are happy with Dr. Flinkstrom, put his name, address and
    phone number in the vets file too!
    
    Keep us posted Doug!
    
    Jean

    Jean -
    
    I hope black and white it only for parakeets.  Max's (African Grey)
    stools are green and white, have been for the 1 1/2 years we've
    had him.  The vet said they looked fine.
    
    Confused,
    Laura

    Because of metabolisim rates, small hook bills have darker stools.
    Finches have brownish white and parrots are greenish...Cockatiels
    and Quakers go both ways.  HOWEVER***** bright green or kelley green
    or more on the floruecent side stools are not healthy!  See a vet if
    you see  that!  Stools that color is an indication of a virus in
    the system.  Also, all white, watery and something tht looks like
    puffed rice is an indication of micro-organisims (parasites) and
    or organ failure.
    
    j

    I've been thinking about Dougs comment about congestion and mites.
    There are mites called Air Sac mites that live in the trachea. 
    If a bird had mites, and no indication of upper respiratory infection,
    then mites could well have migrated to the trachea.  It may be
    advisable to have the throat swabbed and study the smear under a
    microscope.
    
    Doug has a bottle of pytethrin spray - from Norden Industries -
    that will check all mites.  When the feathrs are sprayed and the
    bird preens, she will ingest some of the spray and will elimiate
    the threat of mites on the trachea.
    
    Pyrethrin is an organic pesticide that comes from chrysimums (sp?)
    that is not harmful to birds.  Malithion is another one, but finding
    pure malithion is hard.  When using pyrethrins and malithion, do
    not use the stuff for cats and dogs unless labled for birds too.
    there are other ingredients in them that will be harmful to birds.
    
    j
    

    Rita seems to be doing O.K., although there is no visiable improvement
    other than the mites seems to have cleared up. I was out of town
    for a couple of days and my wife was feeding the birds and medicating
    Rita. I tried to clean up the amoxicillian a little around her bill
    and put her right back into my 85 degree hospital cage, but afterwards
    she was breathing hard for a long time. I really didn't do that
    much to stress her but it sure took a long time for her to recover.
    When she was breathing hard it almost looked like she was overheating.
    Could this have been the case, the temp was between 80 and 85 ?
                                                    
    A few hours later I had her out for her medicine and she wanted
    to fly around and seemed to have plenty of energy. I quickly gave
    her the medicne and got her back into her cage, so I didn't have
    a repeat of the previous incident.              
                                                    
    
    Other than Rita being sick, it is very disappointing to see how
    much less tame both she and Tweety are now, it seems all the work
    I previously put into taming them has been undone.
    
    Sometime after I get my present birds in good health and feel I
    have gotten them somewhat tamed, I hope to acquire a hand raised male.
        
    Jean, Please remember me if you ever decide to part with Bianca,
    also when do you think you next batch of keets would be ready ?
        
    Doug

    Hi Doug!
    
    We plan to have babies for christmas, tho we did not plan for christmas
    babies, if you know what I mean...  I'll call you!  But, Bianca
    is home to stay!  She gets sweeter every day!  I do feel sorry for
    who ever lost her, but shes ours now and we love her as much as
    anyone can!!!
    
    Rita...does Rita have plenty of air circulating in her cage?  She
    may well have mites migrated in her throat...Keep using the spray.
    And maybe give your vet a jingle...It sounds like you are doing
    what you should.  Being cooped in a hospital cage is like us being
    in the hospital for a while.  You get moody!!!  She is relating
    medication to handling.  When all is said and done, they will both
    be tame again!  Just be patient Doug!
    
    Nice to hear you are making progress.  8^)
    
    j

    HI JEAN,
    
    Thanks for the continued support, I needed a few encouraging words.
    
    I have a couple of small holes in the sides of the box near the
    perch, but if I put anymore the cage won't stay warm enough. The
    box is an 11" x 8" copier box with a couple of glass window installed
    1 on top and 1 on a side. I have a heating pad in the bottom covered
    with news paper, set on the high setting. If I keep the box wrapped
    with a towel the heat will stay around 85.  Should I let them have
    time out of the box at all or just wait it out the 10 days ?
    
    Thanks again,
    Doug
   
                 

    I'd say, as long as you are continuing meds and they *want* to be
    active, try lowering the heat a little each day.  If you keep them
    at 85, then let them out where it may be 70 or less, then back in
    the box, well, you will end up treating pneumonia...and holding
    funeral services.  Limit activity though, they burn up their energy
    very fast, and all the good you do in a week, they can undo in a
    good hearty flight around the kitchen.
    
    If you are having trouble keeping heat in and air circulation up,
    then, by all means begin lowering the heat now.  If they breathe
    the same warm air with bacteria and mites...you probably will not
    be able to cure many ills.  The ideal "hospital cage" is a 10 gallon
    aquarium with a screen top.  In time tho, since you are looking
    into new babies -- you'll be adding more and more as time goes on,
    right???
    
    As always Doug, I'm always happy to try to help!
    
    j
    

    Jean,
        
    I saw in one of the notes where you suggested holding the bird on
    your chest with your hand over its head. I do that sometimes with
    Rita, maybe I will start doing it more while she is sick. That way
    I can have her out of the cage without her geting chilled. I really
    miss having my birds out, but they have only been in thier hospital
    for five days and I don't want to have to start this all over again.
        
    Rita has taming has regressed so much that even if she sees me from
    across the room she leaves the food dish and hides in the corner
    of the cage.
        
    Oh well only a few more days till I can reduce the temp and let
    them fly around, hopefully.
        
    Doug

    Remember I told you about Halley, my first cockatiel.  I paid $99
    for her and $500 in vet bills.  Well, she was one wild little number.
    Buy, but the time we were done medicating and petting and sitting
    up most nites crying over her, cuddled against me, she really became
    a wonderful little thing.  She lives in flight now with lots of
    others, and she's not too keen on being held, but she stands on
    the perch and talks to me and I really believe she is listening
    to me when I talk to her!
    
    Rita and Tweety may do the same thing, maybe you'll have to retrain
    them, but it won't take as long this time around...Good luck!  Make
    sure Rita and Tweety know we all are concerned for them and say
    hello!!!
    
    J  :')

    I started dropping the temperature from 85 degrees , to 80 on Sat
    and 75 on Sunday. Will drop it to 70 today. Just a couple of more
    days and will be able to put Rita and Tweety back into their regular
    cage, and let them loose to really enjoy them again.
                                             
    Rita and Tweety have gotten their strength back and I have started
    feeding "THE MIXTURE" in the morning and giving them seeds only
    at night. They are eating the mixture and don't get nearly as exicited
    about the seeds anymore.
    
    Jean congrats on your article, I couldn't get up to Nashua to buy
    a copy , but would love to see a copy. My mailstop is BPO1 if you
    wouldn't mind sending a copy. 
                          

    
    Good work Doug!  I'm happy to hear the diet change is working this
    well so soon for you!  Getting the temp. down is good, its time,
    and you are doing it purrfectly!  I'm glad they are feeling better!
    
    J

    Rita and Tweety are back in there big cage and seem happy about
    it. I used to feed them in seed cups, but when they were in the
    hospital cage I was feeding them on the bottom, so I am continueing.I
    read somewhere that they profer this.    
                                             
    I had them out free the last two nights and I am surprised how little
    they regressed. Rita is tamer than tweety probably because I had
    to handle her to give her medicine ever morning and night. She and
    I both still don't like the medicine, only 20 more days. Did you
    ever see a white bird with a pink beard ?
                                          
    It is sure good to have my birds back.

    Both birds enjoy being loose and are active when they are out of
    the cage, but I last night I noticed Tweety's tail dipping after
    he was back in the cage. I also snuck up on the cage after I covered
    it and they had gone to sleep. Rita was on the stationary perch    
    with only one foot, but not Tweety.
                                 
    I assume that this means that Tweety is sick now, right ? I hate to
    make a trip to the Vet but want to help him get better. Rita has 10
    days left on her medicine, which I give her orally. I am thinking of
    giving him the same medicine I am giving Rita, but this will be very
    painful. His beak is much sharper and he is stronger that Rita. 
                                 
    If I go to the vet and get  medicine for Tweety and give it to
    him in his water, Rita will be drinking it too. This means she will be
    medicated for 50 days instead of 30. This doesn't sound healthy to me,
    but what do you think ? 
    
    Other than the tail dipping he seems fine, I am hoping I don't have to
    separate them again. 
    
                                   
   
                                                      

    Oh Doug!
    
    How bad is the tail "dipping"?  Is it like I would call "pumping"?
    
    Call your vet...ask him how he feels about using tetracycline treated
    seed.
    
    Tetracycline seed is nice, in that the birds are medicated, and
    your skin stays in tact and nobody is worse for wear!
    
    Feel out the vet first...if he says OK, but has to order you a bag
    of seed, tell him to hang on and call me!
    
    J
    

Hi ,

Since I last wrote about Rita, I have added 3 more parakeets and lost Tweety.
For the last 2 years she has lived in a 3'x2'x18" cage with 3-4 other
parakeets. She has been happy and in good health, with very pretty and Clean
white feathers(except her tail as one of the birds likes to attack the others
tails). When I bought her I figured her to be female, a couple of months
later male, then about 6 months ago, her Cere got real brown so changed my
mind again to Female. It seems hard to tell with a Albino.

About a month Ago I found Rita hardly able to hang on the perch one morning,
Upon examination I found that her toenails were a little overgrown and blamed
it on them. I trimmed them and put her in a heated Aquarium, but over the
next couple of days it became obvious that her feet/legs were becoming more
and more paralyzed. Her Abdomen was very swollen and I thought maybe she was
Egg Bound, but after taken her to Dr. Bill Sager at the Littleton Animal
hospital, it was confirmed that it was A tumor. I am told it is common for
Budgies 4-5 years old to develop them. He gave her a shot and she seemed to
feel a little better and hobbled around the Aquarium a little more and
livelier. Except for the paralysis her she was very Strong(she Took off and flew
around the room several times, but couldn't land well) and in fine feather.
Its hard to see something so healthy but with her contorted legs and feet.

I had made her a series of little perches 1/2 inch high and she would crawl
along them. I added a Mirror to her cage and she liked to look at herself in
it. I changed the paper towels in the bottom of the aquarium every day and had
to wash the big lump of bird poop from her Tail area(she hated this).
Yesterday was the last time she had to endure this, This morning she didn't
wake up.

Thank you Rita for putting up with all my mis-directed attempts to train you
into a interactive pet. I am glad that you had these last couple of years to
interact in a semi-normal atmosphere with your own kind. I also want to thank
you from saving me from the Decision that was at hand, and took care of it
yourself. But most of all I want to thank you for introducing me to
Parakeets/parrots and all the people that are associated with them.

    
    So sorry to hear about your loss.  I have yet to lose any of my beloved
    pets, and can only imagine how you must feel.  I'm sorry.
    
    Donna