Conference 7.286::pet_birds

    A pet bird such as a cockatoo requires a lot of Maintenance as well as
    a lot of personal attention/companionship, if it is not to be paired as
    in breeding. Dog owners may disagree , but IMHO they require more than
    a dog. Acquiring a bird should not be a spontaneous thing, and you
    should be prepared to care for this bird for its entire life which can
    be in excess of 50 years ! Too many people purchase birds and find it
    is either too much work or they can not stand the noise, mess and
    expense of maintaining the Bird. this results is the bird being
    traumatized from being passed from home to home.
    
    Before you jump into the purchase of a Bird , you should thoroughly
    research how much is involved in their proper care. I don't mean to
    attack you but if have to ask what a Goffin looks like, I don't think
    you have done a lot of research.
    
    Doug

Henry,

   Don't mind Doug. He'd just trying to scare you off;-);-) He has the same 
message for everyone. It's sort of his "hot button", and legitimately so.
He'd save a lot of keystrokes if he'd just create a special topic with a nice,
gentle "be sure you know what you're getting into" note and then point;-);-);-)

   I don't know diddly about Goffin's, but I've got a Mollucan, a Lesser Sulfur
Crested, and 2 Umbrella's. My Mollucan is an import and a product of just what 
Doug's concerned about, as are most of my 20+ birds. She was socially neglected
when the novelty wore off, when other things in that family became more
important. She's not particularly friendly, but does like being stroked. She's
getting better each day. The Lesser Sulfur is afraid of me and has ripped my
hands to shreds in my patient attempts to get her to cozy up to me. My wife has
a better relationship. This bird was left in a chicken coop with a bunch of
cockatiels for 4 months (owner had to leave the birds behind with a roommate
who was afraid of the birds.) The only human contact was feeding and that was
toss in the food and water and run before you  got bit. It will be some time
before Kayla comes around. The 2 Umbrellas are the clowns of our menagerie. The
youngest is by far the gentlest of all our birds and just craves attention all
the time. Probably more than any other of the hook-bills, the cockatoos want to
be cuddled and nuzzled and babied. 

   Cockatoos seem to have 3 things going against them as pets for couples with
young kids (Brian and his younger sister are 9 & 7 or so right?) First, they
are relatively expensive, second that beak can remove a finger, and third the
bird requires lots of time and attention; limited time and attention properly
directed toward the kids as they grow up. 

   One thing that can be done as the family attention gets directed away from
a lone bird is to pair it up with a playmate. Then the 2 birds can entertain
each other and are less dependent on you. A pair of amazons is generally less
expensive than a pair of cockatoos. 

   I'm just throwing out food for thought before you lay your hard earned money
on the line, only to regret it 5 years from now.

Al

Have you talked with Damiano lately?  We talk about once a week either over the
net or on the phone. 

Catch ya later...

    Thanks for the reply's (both of you)! My wife and I have really fallen
    in love with a couple of Cockatoo's we've seen in pet shops. The
    friendliest one was being sat for. However Al's right with a 7 and 9yr
    old in the household we believe it would be best to hold off for now.
    The kids require most if not all our attention at this time and it would 
    not be fair for the bird nor the family. We just thought we'd start
    doing some research and reading to familiarize ourselves with the
    different varieties. The purchase of such a bird will probably be a
    gift to ourselves after the kids are grown.  But if they live 50 years,
    then the bird will be a gift for our kids someday :>)..:>)..
    Doug...
    The reason I was asking about the Goffin was because we have not yet
    seen this variety in the pet shops, but had read some about them.
    It appears to be the general consensus that the Umbrella has the
    sweetest disposition. Do you agree with this??
    
    BTW Al, Yes, John sent me an E-mail..Probably a year ago I guess.
    Something like ...You still got a job !$@#%@%@. He's a card. 
    
    Henry. 
    

    
    FWIW, I have to agree with Doug, and I OWN cockatoos.  I was a
    relatively experienced bird owner and I STILL didn't know what I was
    getting into when I got my citron and my umbrella (I've had them for
    going on 6 years now).  I had the idea that two would keep each other
    company and would be less demanding, and to SOME extent that is true. 
    However, at this point, all my personal possessions are covered in
    white dust all the time, I am going deaf, and, having reached sexual
    maturity, the umbrella feather-plucks, and the citron screams
    constantly.  This is in SPITE of having cockatoo companionship, humans
    available at home all day, tons of attention, a superior (and
    expensive!) diet, and extensive (and expensive!) vet care.  I adore
    them, they are sweet, cuddly, affectionate, and they are NOT good pets.
    I am considering (with a great deal of angst, since I do love them, and
    I DID make a lifetime commitment to them) put them in a breeding
    situation so that they can be happier.  I bred small birds for a while,
    and found that 25 pairs of breeding finches and 15 pairs of breeding
    budgies were less trouble to care for than 2 cockatoos.  And this from
    a dedicated bird owner - my little amazon, for all his gnarly attitude
    is with me for life, and I'd jump at a chance to own a timneh grey or a
    good blue and gold macaw again!
    
    Now, while I wouldn't recommend a cockatoo, I will say that if you are
    interested in birds, you might give thought to some other kinds.  Given
    the age of your children, I would say that a handfed cockatiel would
    make a wonderful pet and be a real joy to own.  A dove might also be
    nice for you.  Both of these birds will get fairly cuddly like a
    cockatoo, and are really pleasant keepers (although doves do coo
    continuously, and are none too intellectual).  If you prefer some thing
    that talks and clowns, consider a budgie, a small amazon, or an african
    gery, being aware that none of these birds will really want a great
    deal of physical contact - they are not very cuddly - and both the
    amazon and the grey will most likely bite you regularly and HARD even
    when handraised and quite tame.  (I have had and loved both amazons and
    greys, and I have the scars to prove it :-)
    
    Now, if you decide that you still want a cockatoo, I will say that
    goffins are pretty high strung.  If you would like a smallish cockatoo,
    a bare eye would be (generally - birds ARE individuals) a more stable
    choice.  They are perhaps not as pretty as their showier cousins, but
    seem to have a calmer disposition and are a little quieter (for a
    cockatoo).
    
    
    					/Rita
    

    Hi Henry,
    
    I don't have personal experience with Goffins, but from research I did
    prior to purchasing a bird found they may be less demanding than a
    large Too. I am glad to see you are doing research and are not going to
    jump right into buying a bird. Too many people do that and end up with
    lots of birds trying to find the bird that is right for them. I have to
    seen this lead to Bird burnout, and the inflicted people getting rid of
    all their birds. I beleive its in everyones(people/bird) best interest
    for the potential bird owner to be well informed. I am glad to see you
    reposted and I did not Scare you off, and hope to see you in notes more
    either with questions about buying a bird or post  purchase questions.
    
    Al,
    
    I never try to scare any one off, but if you re-read the base note and
    forget your personal Knowledge of Henry, you will see that it appears
    he has not done his homework. As far as creating note to point people
    to , you don't have to be a moderator to do, feel free to go ahead. 
    
    
    Rita, 
    Thanks for you support.

    Rita,
    
    Thanks for your imput.  This is the kind of info that I need to hear,
    good or bad.  Its really hard to know exactly what you're getting into
    when all you first see is this wonderful sweet cuddly bird in a pet
    shop enviroment and spend 30-40 minutes with it and it shows you only
    its good side. Having never owned a large bird or known anyone that
    did, we needed more than a sales pitch to find out the true nature of
    these birds.  I believe we'll keep on researching and perhaps shop for
    a smaller bird.  Someone had mentioned a caiques (sp?) as a
    possibility, has anyone had experience with this breed? Sorry to keep
    asking questions, but I'm a novice. We're open to any suggestions.
    
    Henry
    

    
    Hi Henry!
    
    Glad to see we didn't scare you off :-)
    
    I've only known one person who had a caique (pronounced "kike", more or
    less).  It was a beautiful bird, and, as a baby it was sweet as could
    be.  As soon as it hit breeding age, it became the Bird From Hell -
    mean and aggressive, pulling out its feathers, etc.  This is a sample
    of precisely one, so your milage may vary.
    
    Some other medium size parrots that friends of mine have had good luck
    with include pionus, ringneck parrakeets, and male eclectus parrots
    (the females, though lovely, tend to be nippy).
    
    Another thought for you:  handfed babies of most any breed tend to be
    sweet, wonderful, and not much trouble *when they are still young*. 
    Most larger birds don't hit sexual maturity until 3-7 years old,
    depending on the breed.  And when they mature, those wonderful, cuddly
    baby personalities can REALLY change.  One way around this for a
    first-time bird owner might be to work with a local bird breeder or a
    quality pet shop to find a bird that is already tame and a bit older -
    say 5-15 years old.  (Remember that they can live 50-100 years!)  While
    it may not tug your heartstrings like the darling little babies, you
    will at least KNOW what its personality will be like after it matures.
    
    
    Keep asking questions!  No need to apologise for trying to learn all
    you can and make an informed choice.
    
    
    
    						/Rita
    

    Henry,
    
    I heard the Pionus are really nice too.
    
    Did you receive my message?
    
    Renee

    Al,
    	Go ahead and change the title to a generic topic. It sounds like 
    a good idea and should be a good pointer.
    
    Henry.

Hello, 
    I thought I'd get involved in this discussion.  We have 2 hand fed 
cockatiels, and 1 hand fed green cheek conure.  We bought them when they were
babies, so they're very tame, love and demand a lot of attention, and are
generally a pleasure to own.  If I had it to do over again, we would have only
purchased 1 cockatiel.  The two together are incredibly noisy, messy, and give 
off a fair amount of powder.  That's the stuff that, if you are prone to
alergies, you'll be alergic to.  Anyway, a sinlge bird would be more connected
to our kids, than they are to each other, and they would'nt make such a racket
when they are apart.  
	The green cheek conure is a delight!  They are a very quiet bird. He
very rarely screams as some other breeds of conure do, and he seems to be
trying to talk.  He is a little smaller than a cockatiel, and requires about
the same size cage.  He loves to play with toys, take baths, and hang upside
down.  He's the small parrot with a big parrot personalilty.  In all, I'd 
recommend them as a first bird. They're not too big, they're
quiet, have the capacity to talk, and while they cost more than a cockatiel,
their cage requiremenst are the same.
	We've also explored the range of cockatoos but the combination of the
noise, powder, wood chewing, and the transformation in their personalities with
sexual maturity was off putting.  We're now researching African Greys, and
Pionus.  While these aren't as cuddley as the Toos, they seem more in keeping
with our life style.  So we'd love to hear from anyone that has knowledge of
those birds.
	And if you haven't been to Boston Exotics on 2A in Acton, you're really
missing out.  This is the cleanest, largest parrot specialty shop in the area.
They have an incredible assortment of toys, cages, and foods.  In addition, the
carry an irrestible line of hand fed babies (weaned on the premises).  They
have many different breeds, including Caiques, Pionus, Macaws, Conures,
Senagals and so on. Also, on Saturday they clip flight feathers, and nails free
of charge.  They are also knowlegeable, and friendly!  Worth the trip!

	Thanks...Paul and Kathryn

    Anyone out there know anything about an "Alexandrian" (sp)?  I'm doing
    some research before I decide to purchase.  I currently have a Mullocan
    and a Blue Crown Conure and I LOVE THIS PART OF MY LIFE.  I've
    researched on the internet and in encyclopedias and have even gone to
    the library (there's not much around here in the way of experienced
    breeders that can provide information other than "it's a nice bird",
    etc. etc.)
    
    This parrot looks to be a little larger than Chubakka (my 1 yr old blue 
    crown) and is 3 months old.  It's green with a light colored crown (sort of
    speckled, with brightly colored shoulders (I dont' know what the
    "real" name is for that part of their body).  I've been told that his
    tail feathers will grow as long as a green wings.  It coo's almost like
    a pidgeon, while cuddling, and the breeder that weaned it says it
    should be a pretty good talker.
    
    If anyone can add any additional information, I sure would appreciate
    it.
    
    Thanks.....JPs

    Well.....
    
    Since no-one answered my last question, I've decided to buy a
    Padegonian Conure.    Anyone got any insights?  Any personal
    experience they would like to share?
    
    Thanks.....JPs