Conference nyoss1::market_investing

    Concord Cooperative Bank (main office in Acton, Mass) has a 
    15-year loan with no point and no closing costs.  I don't
    know their current rate.
    
    		-John Bishop

    
    

	As of Monday 9/21, the Concord Cooperative Bank rates for 15 year
fixed are:

	7.375%	2 pts
	7.625%	1 pt
	7.875	0 pts
	8.375	0 pts  $0 closing costs

	$500 application fee refundable at closing.



	Anybody see any lower rates on the 0 pts, $0 closing around Mass?

	Gary

    
    These look good. I just finished a 0 point 0 closing cost with
    Old Colony at 8.625 and a $295 application fee.
    
    mike
    

    Associated Mortgage is offering a 0 pts. 0 closing costs 30-yr. mtge.
    at a fixed rate of 8.375%.  Call Joe Macarelli at (800) 698-6999.

    re .0
    
    Could you share the name of the mortgage company with us?
    
    Thanks

       Re:  .5
    
        Mortgage Trust Group, Nashua NH.    (603) 889-4644   Maurine(?)
        First Eastern Mortgage, Nashua      (603) 889-7788   Tom Lantry
    
    	It seems the Rate has gone up a bit after we talked to Maurine
    last week.  Now it is 7.65% with NO point and about $1K in closing 
    cost.  I don't know the First Eastern rate this week. 
    
        Good Luck...
    
    /Jay 

    I signed up for a First Eastern refi three years ago.  Weeks before
    closing, I walked in to lock the rate.  Even though their agreement
    gave me that right, they refused to take a lock.
    
    Naturally, I exercised my right of recision at the closing.  They then
    refused to issue me a full refund.  But after The Boston Sunday Globe
    highlighted my story, they sent me a check for the balance on Monday.   

    If anyone has had success refinancing a non-owner occupied property,
    please contact me directly.
    
    I own a duplex that I rent out and have been trying, unsuccessfully,
    to arrange refinancing.  
    
    Thanks
    Ernie
    royalt::mondou

        	
        Atlast, I have found a good deal to re-finance my house.
        
    	7.375% fixed for 15 years with Closing Cost but NO POINT.   
    
    	Please send me a mail if there is any interest. Jointly,
        we may be able to make a better bargain on closing cost.
            
    	(Moderator, if there is a problem with the last statement.
         You may delete it or let me know.  Thanks.)
    

I'm looking for recent info on refinancing and interest 
rates.  I'm looking for zero points/zero.zero closing
costs.  Anyone have a reference?
Thanks...

    I'm refinancing today with no pts/closing cost at 8.0%.
    
    Dave Gibbs  at Mortgage Master - 617-255-0099
    

    
    
    I just called those folks in .-1 and they have a good rate with
    a 1 year adjustable ...
    
    No points, no closing   2 points cap per year, 6 points max.
    6 1/4 to start for 1st year.
    No pre-payment penalty, no payoff loan penalty
    
    Anything else I should ask ???  I got a appointment for Monday AM to ask
    questions, etc ?? 
    
    Seems too good to be true and people say it probably is ... What do you
    think the catch is ?  I couldn't think of any other questions to ask
    at that time.
    
    Questions to ask ??

    
    
    What is their reference or target rate and initial discount for the
    rate?
    
    Kaizad

    
    
    re .-1
    
    Thanks for you suggestion, but can somebody explain to me what
    .-1 was saying regarding reference or target rate and initial discount
    for the rate ?  In simple english ?   Thanks!!

    Many mortgage lenders offer a "discounted" first year rate on ARMs to
    make the rate 
    	a.  attractive to borrower
    	b.  help new buyers qualify
    
    It is important to know if the first year is discounted.  If it is, you
    want to know how much, since even if the reference rate (more in a
    minute) stays the same, your interest rate will go up by the discounted
    amount at the first adjustment.
    
    Most ARMs are tied to a reference rate -- typical reference for 1-yr
    ARMS is the 1yr Tbill rate.  This changes weekly.  1-yr ARMS based on
    the 1-yr Tbill rate typically add about 2.5 points onto the rate.
    
    So if tbills are at 5.5% (hypothetical number), and the adder is 2.5,
    then the interest rate would be 8.00%.  If you get a lower rate, then
    you're most likely getting a discounted rate in the first year.
    
    Hope this helps.
    
    /steve

re                      <<< Note 280.12 by CSCMA::BALICH >>>
                        -< Sounds too good to be true! >-

>    No points, no closing   2 points cap per year, 6 points max.
>    6 1/4 to start for 1st year.
>    No pre-payment penalty, no payoff loan penalty
 

i'd shop around more.
i'm in a 4 7/8 1 pt cap /yr, 6 pt max loan that i got last year.
excellent program.
ok, a year ago... but i cannot imagine things changing _that_ much.

    re .14
    
The adjustable rate is based on something like the prime rate
+ a certain amount.  The first year is then offered at a
discount to this target rate.  An example:

	Prime Rate = 8%
	Delta      = 3%
	Adj. rate  = 11%

	Initial Rate = 6%

The discount for the initial rate is then 5%.

Come next year, say the prime drops to 7%, the Adj. rate drops
to a target of 10%.  Therefore your rate will increase by the
2% cap. limit to 8% even though the prime rate dropped.  This is
true of most adjustable rate mortgages.  In the example I gave, the prime
would have to drop by 5 points to get the interest rate in
the initial year.  What can vary from one adjustable policy to
the other is the rate "premium" over the prime rate, and hence
the initial year discount.

    While real estate is often an investment (intentional or otherwise)
    it is probably best to discuss such topics in the TALLIS::REAL_ESTATE
    conference, where a wider array of ideas will be found.
    
      John (moderator)

Re: .12

>     Seems too good to be true and people say it probably is ... What do you
>     think the catch is ?  I couldn't think of any other questions to ask
>     at that time.
>     
>     Questions to ask ??

Money is the purest form of commodity and indeed the rates appear 
to be very good.  Too good in fact; they must be making it up
on escrow, insurance and other facets. The questions to ask are:

1.  are escrow for taxes and insurance required? My bet is that
    they want a substantial prepayment.

2.  though no prepayment penalty is involved, how long does it take
    to get the escrow back should the mortgage be paid off?

3.  when does payoff for the first mortgage occur and what is 
    the EXACT process.  Depending on the closing, you may have
    two mortgages on the property.  Here's how:

	- you sign the mortgage required for refinancing;  at
	  this point, there are two mortgages on the house.
	- the mortgage company cuts a check to pay off the first
          mortgage company.
	- Only when the check has cleared will your mortgage
	  with the old mortgage be discharge.

    When Abbey Mortgage company when under, there were a number
    of customers that ended up with two mortgages on the same
    property. It turned out that the check to the first mortgage
    company bounced or was never sent. 

    Look at note 2387.28 (attached) which details a horror story.

For this reason, I have always dealt with a real Bank or Credit
Union.  Of course, the mortgage company could be a very good one.
When rates are substantial better, the reasons are:
	- they have found lenders to don't mind getting low
	  returns or 
	- they have cut corners/expesnes.

Gim



             <<< TALLIS::SYS3$:[NOTES$LIBRARY]REAL_ESTATE.NOTE;1 >>>
                       -< REAL_ESTATE - put ads in #19 >-
================================================================================
Note 2387.28              Abbey Financial Corporation?                  28 of 31
TOOK::FRAMPTON "Carol Frampton, DECnet/OSI for OSF"  36 lines   5-APR-1994 12:58
                              -< the Abbey mess >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    No, I think the fees/deposit are lost.
    
    My mother closed on a refinance the Wednesday before Abbey went bust. 
    The 3-day right of rescission ended on the Monday Abbey went under. 
    Even though the checks were cut to pay back her old mortgage and her
    real estate taxes which are currently due, both checks bounced.  Abbey
    stopped payment on the checks.
    
    The closing lawyer told her he would most likely be able to get back
    the escrow/etc she paid at closing.  The $850 that Abbey was holding
    probably is lost.
    
    She called number for the State which was in the paper.  As of
    yesterday the State is confused and doesn't even know the laws.  They
    are not sure if she has to go thru with a closing with Citzen's, the
    bank which took over Abbey's loans.  They were suppose to get back to
    her.
    
    Citzen's got a ton of paperwork from Abbey and hasn't gone thru any of
    it yet.  As of yesterday they also could not tell her anything.
    
    I'm not sure what she is going to do about her April 1st mortgage
    payment which she now has to pay since Abbey didn't complete the
    closing or the real estate taxes which are due even though she's
    already paid for them once.
    
    It does not seem fair that you have to show up at a closing with a bank
    check which you can't stop yet the mortgage company seems to be able to
    do just that.
    
    I feel pretty terrible about all this.  We closed with Abbey 3 times
    last year and didn't have any problems (except the last closing did
    take many more months that the 1st two).  Because of our basically good
    experience I reccomended Abbey to her.
    
    Carol

    I'll try to address this from an "investing" standpoint: in this case,
    trying to get a good return with minimum risk.
    
    > No points, no closing   2 points cap per year, 6 points max.
    > 6 1/4 to start for 1st year.
    
    Add this up and you would have to ask yourself, could you afford this
    in a worst case scenario? Let me know if I'm misreading this, but it
    seems that you could easily end up with a 12.25% mortgage in three
    years. On the kind of money that goes into a house, that is more risk
    than I'd like to take. You're betting that interest rates will stay
    low; so did LA county :-o!
    
    Give me a good fixed rate mortgage; this gives you a clear image of
    your expected expenses, which seems appropriate for a such a
    conservative investment as a house.
    			Jim