Conference noted::sf

    
    What about her Cheysuli Chronicles?  Any word on the publication
    of _Daughter of the Lion_?  I've been enjoying the series so far,
    although some of the more recent volumes are clearly a bridge to
    the final fulfillment of the prophecy...
    
    Willie

    I haven't gotten ahold of those yet.  What are they about?  How
    are they?  Will I like them?
    
    	Merryl
    

       More spoiler type discussion on "Sword Singer"

       
    
<    So now they're going to be together forever, and the Sandtiger can
<    go off and get the baddies that Del was after, and someday we'll
<    find out where all the wolves are coming from.  _I_ think it was
<    a *good* ending (albeit painful).
    

       Well, I might argue that "being together" as a sword and sword
       dancer is a special relationship but not nearly the equivalent of
       having another human by your side. I agree the characters were
       painting themselves into a corner. The need for hate and revenge
       had all but destroyed Del already. My problem is that I wanted
       her and Tiger to overcome that and it seemed for a while it would
       happen. That made it all the more awful when it didn't. liesl

    The Cheysuli are one of the two races descended from the race known
    as the First Born (the other race, the Ihlini, are their mortal
    enemies).  They have limited magical powers, the chief of which
    is they can assume the form of their animal _lir_ (a familiar).
    
    There are a total of *eight* books in the series, of which three
    haven't been published yet.  I have enjoyed the books so far,
    especially the first few, although they have all been good.  The
    first book is called _Shapechangers_.  
    
    Jennifer Roberson does a really good job of showing the cultural
    interactions between they Cheysuli, and the "normal" people who
    live in the same land.  Lots of foreign language content, etc. 
    Very similiar to Katherine Kurtz's Chronicles of the Dernyi, in
    terms of underlying cultural problems...
    
    I'm starting to ramble, if you'd like more details, let me know
    and I'll post them with spoiler warnings, or whatever
    
    Willie
    

    re -1:
    	Thanks.  I don't know about anyone else out there, but _I'm_
    intregued.  Next time I get a free moment (ha!) I'll borrow them
    from the MITSFS or buy them or something. 
    
    re -2:
    	Yet more spoilers for Sword-Singer:
    
    I was thinking along those lines as well, trying to write Del out
    of that corner (since I really thought it was *her* who was changing
    the rules in mid-play, so to speak) when I came up against that
    ending.  Like a crash-dummy hitting the dashboard, I came up against
    that ending.  I think I *respect* it more than any "happy" ending
    she could tack onto it.

    
    Swordsinger must hold the record for Paperback Volume Most Often Hurled
    Against A Wall Because the Ending Gets to People. 
    
    I can see their point.  It didn't move me that way, but I'm a cold,
    cyncial sort.
                                                     
    DFW

    And that's pretty amazing, considering it hasn't been out very long!
    
    Personally, I've thrown Heinlein's _The_Moon_is_a_Harsh_Mistress_
    against the wall *much* more often, because of the way he portrays
    females.  Then again, TMIAHM is my favorite Heinlein.
    
    What does that say?  People only throw *good* books against the
    wall?
    
    	Merryl-who-abuses-her-books-but-loves-them-anyway

    Hi there! I'm new here and would like to add to the Sword-Dancer/Sword
    -Singer conversation but haven't a clue as to how to add the *spoiler
    note*.  HELP!!
    
    I became involved with Jennifer Roberson quite by accident.  The
    "old" cover of Shape_Changers intrigued me in a used bookstore.
    At the time it was the only book written and I'm not sure if it
    was originally intended to be 8 volumes long (no mention of ANY
    sequels in the front).  While patiently waiting for the next
    installation, I found Sword_Dancer. Interesting.  Then I grabbed
    Sword_Singer the first time I saw it.  I want to say more but I
    can't *hide* it. UUUGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!  I do have to agree with the
    *throw the book against the wall comments*.  Does anyone know WHEN
    the next one comes out?
    
    Roslyn

    You hide things by using a Control L sequence at the point you wish
    to begin hiding things.. like this
    
    see?
    Control L appears as two little F's, usually.

If you have "EVE", it's a control_v, then a control_l.

Mike_L

    Interesting.
          
    So I do <CTRL L>...
    
                                                                     
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    ...and my termy says "Key CTRL_L_KEY currently has no definition"
    
    So when I want a <FF> in a reply I write my reply (REPLY.) in VMS 
    and then go into NOTES, find the topic, and do REPLY REPLY.  
    
    I'm sure a serious termy whiz knows a way to define a key while
    in NOTES....
    
    							Don
                            

    If you're using EVE/TPU as the editor, do a ^V^L; if you're using
    EDT, just ^L will do.
    
    --- jerry

    So I do <CTRL L>...
    
 
    And it works!!!  What'll they think of next!
    
    							Don
                            

    Back to the original topic...
    
    Sword-Maker came out a few months ago and lo and behold! Del wasn't
    dead after all.  I hated the ending of Sword-Singer but couldn't see 
    any way of avoiding it with all that had gone before.  Sword-Maker
    takes them back to the South and gets them into more trouble, ties
    up a few loose ends from Sword-Dancer and has an ending that implies
    future adventures.
    
    LN  

    Well, -.1, you should have probably used a spoiler warning. I'm glad I
    started the book before I read your note. It took me 6 months after
    buying Sword-Maker to forgive Roberson enough to read it. Sword-Singer
    crushed me with the ending. I was sure the only way Del would live on
    was in Tiger's sword. I am now happy again. I started reading late in the
    evening and couldn't put it down till I'd finished Part 1 at 3 am.

    Tiger and Del are my favorite fantasy characters. They are *so* human.
    They make mistakes, they let pride get in the way, they desparately
    avoid the L word and they grow and change and learn to share themselves
    with each other. I *care* about these people which is my mark of a
    great book.

    JR never cops out with Del either. She doesn't "fall in love" and
    change into the happy housewife. She remains her own person and always
    Tiger's equal, not his shadow. She is his strength, a reason to care
    about tomorrow. He is her humanity, a reason to live beside revenge.
    And they both fumble and have trouble talking about how they feel and
    say the wrong things at the wrong times, just like real people.

    Oh yeah, before I forget, there is also, blood, battles, adventure and
    magic. liesl

I notice in the latest Cheysuli book an announcement to look forward to

*Sword Breaker* - I can't wait and keep looking.

I also went crazy a few months ago at a sale and bought all 7 Cheysuli books.
I've read all but the last now and thought they were pretty good. I find I like
Roberson best when she writes in first person. The books seem to flow better.

As for her technique in general, I have a few nits. It seems she always has more
plot than she has time for and numerous characters get dropped by the wayside. 
It just leaves me with a feeling of incompleteness. Something I expect in the
real world but wish didn't happen in novels. The Cheysuli books are full the
*disappearing* character. People I would have expected to still be around but
aren't. Even ones who appear on the House of Hommana geneology. I know you can
only keep track of so many but...

My only other complaint is that sometimes the deaths of characters, villains
especially, seem almost anti-climatic and too easy. On the other hand, the heros
are certainly not safe in her books. Disfigurement and dismemberment are pretty
common. Being a regular on the bridge of the Enterprise wouldn't save you in one
of Roberson's books. :*) (of course, it didn't save Tasha either). 

Now if I can just recover my sleep from staying up and reading straight through
"A Pride of Princes" and "Daughter of the Lion" over the weekend. Guess that
means I really like her writing casue I couldn't put them down. Of course, I was
also trying to avoid studying for my French test. :*) liesl 

    Hi People,
    
    	If you are looking for the list of other books by J. Robertson
    check out Note 943 of this conference or Note 1321 in the Books
    conference.
    
    	Also if you enjoy her books there are a list of other female
    authors in these notes.
    
    Terry

    
    	I  found out that Jennifer Robinson also writes under the name of
    Jennifer O'Green and she, for those out there, also romance novels.
    
    	She has also written various short stories for Marion Zimmer
    Bradley;s "SWORD AND SORCERSS" volumnes.
    
    	Also she has produced the fourth book of "Tiger and Del" saga
    called "SWORD-BREAKER".  The intro for this book is as follows:
    
                          PURSUED AND POSSESSED BY EVIL
    
    	Accused of murdering a man the Southron tibes believe to be their
    messiah, but who is actually the slayer of Del;s family, Tiger and Del
    flee across the deadly Punja desert, hunted by religious zealots and
    sword-dacer assassins.  But evading death by assassins' blades is only
    one of the challenges they face.  For Tiger's sword, Samiel, has been
    possessed by the spirit of the deadly sorcerer, Chosa Dei-a wizard out
    of legend with the power to unmake the entire world, a master of evil
    who seeks to mold Tiger into his ultimate weapon of destruction.
    
    	Tiger and Del have only one hope left- to find and gain the help of
    Chosa Dei's equally powerful counterpart and sworn enemy, Shaka Obre. 
    But Shaka Obre has not been seen in the world for hundreds of years,
    and it may be beyond even the combined magical abilities of Tiger and
    Del to find this wizard who is their only chance for salvation....
    
    	By the way it looks like she is going to do another Tiger and Del
    book after this one.  It look like they are going to find out where,
    and who Tiger real is.
    
    Terry

Terry, I figured I'd bring the discussion back to the right topic. I've already 
read Sword-Breaker. It's been out quite a while now. 

Yes, Tiger is the thinker. I appreciate him from a feminist stand point. Here is
a man who lived in slavery, the same life (only differing in degree) that the
women of the Southron tribes lived. He broke free and became a total macho man.
Then he met Del who just refused to live by the limitations of this society. She
had mega problems but her rebellion let Tiger see the sameness that a woman's
life had with a slave's life. He reacted and changed over the course of the
novels to become a much different person. 

Del was stuck in revenge mode and had little growth until she was able to
redefine what was important in her life. She was obsessed and forgot how to live.

But beyond all that, these are just good action/adventure stories. A good read
will win me quicker than a good morality play. liesl

    
    Hello,
    
    	Has anyone heard of when her next book will be out for either Del
    and Tiger or the Shapecharger series.
    
    Regards,
    Terry Hollister