| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 298.1 | three possible choices... any more? | CRVAX1::LAMPSON | Mike @DDO - Central Area SWS | Thu Aug 28 1986 19:08 | 12 |
| Since you want something to run in the "background" (subprocess,
I assume), you could write some program/procedure to wait a
specified amount of time and do a WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "^G^G{message}"
(assuming SYS$OUTPUT is still defined as TT:).
...Or, if it will work for a non-ANSI SYS$INPUT, you could
hack the hack which hacks the PHONE protocol. ;^)
...Or, you could write a program which uses the $BRKTHRU system
service.
-&Mike
|
| 298.2 | Try this out | BARAKA::LASTOVICA | Norm Lastovica | Thu Aug 28 1986 21:56 | 14 |
| 100 !
! This small BASIC program will wait 30 minutes and then send "HELLO"
! to your terminal. Execute it with:
!
! SPAWN/NOWAIT/IN=NLA0: RUN HELLO
!
external long function sys$brdcst
sleep 30%*60%
stat% = sys$brdcst("Hello","sys$output")
32767 end
|
| 298.3 | Let the system do the work | REGENT::MINOW | Martin Minow -- DECtalk Engineering | Fri Aug 29 1986 02:22 | 6 |
| Why not send yourself mail? Or better yet, check if the
reply failed (because you weren't logged in or don't have
privileges) and *then* send yourself mail?
Martin.
|
| 298.4 | SYS$MANAGER Adjustment | CLOSET::DYER | Define `Quality' | Fri Aug 29 1986 19:42 | 11 |
| [RE .0]: Actually, the problem seems to be that REPLY is
*not* installed with OPER privs; therefore one needs OPER privs
to run it. Ask the system manager to install it with OPER privs
and to put a command to install it with OPER privs in the system
startup file.
I don't see why anyone would object: it filters out nasty
escape sequences, so it's no security problem.
<_Jym_>
P.S.: If your system manager declines to do this, you can al-
ways hack the PHONE protocol, which *does* allow you to send
nasty escape sequences.
|
| 298.5 | | PASTIS::MONAHAN | | Mon Sep 01 1986 09:26 | 8 |
| Installing REPLY with OPER privilege is a security problem,
since it allows a hacker to cover his traces (to cover his tracks
with the command
$REPLY /NOLOG
Dave
|
| 298.6 | Silly Program | VAXUUM::DYER | Define `Quality' | Mon Sep 01 1986 16:13 | 7 |
| You're right, I forgot about that.
There should be some way to send broadcast messages without
needing OPER privs. The SYS$BRKTHRU routine will generously
send messages to your own process without the priv.
Perhaps the REPLY utility should be broken into two images:
one that an OPERATOR would use, and one that anybody could use.
<_Jym_>
|
| 298.7 | Hope this helps some... | WORM::MCCLURE | The Kwisatz Haderach | Tue Sep 02 1986 13:25 | 57 |
| Although not completely secure, this suggestion may help you and your system
manager may go for it...
Have system manager copy SYS$SYSTEM:REPLY.EXE to SYS$SYSTEM:BROADCAST.EXE,
install it with OPER privilege, then allow limited use of the image with
the following BROADCAST.CLD file (place SET COMMAND disk:BROADCAST.CLD into
SYS$MANAGER:SYSLOGIN.COM file):
define verb BROADCAST
image BROADCAST
disallow ALL or NODE or SHUTDOWN
parameter P1, prompt="Text"
qualifier ALL
qualifier BELL, default
qualifier NODE, value(list)
qualifier NOTIFY, default
qualifier SHUTDOWN
qualifier TERMINAL, value(required,list)
qualifier URGENT
qualifier USERNAME, value(required,list)
qualifier WAIT
Above file is a subset of the REPLY verb and only allows broadcasts. I include
the following info on my system for help...
1 BROADCAST
Broadcasts a message to a terminal or terminals. This is a subset of the
reply command, allowing users basic one-line ability to broadcast to others.
Format
BROADCAST qualifiers "message-text"
2 Parameters
message-text
Text of the message. The text must be 1 through 128 characters.
Enclose the text in quotation marks if it contains spaces, special
characters, or lowercase characters.
2 Qualifiers
/BELL (default)
Rings a bell at the terminal receiving a message when issued with the
/TERMINAL, or /USER qualifiers; two bells when issued with /URGENT.
/NOTIFY (default)
/NONOTIFY
Sends a message describing success back to the originating terminal.
/TERMINAL=(terminal-name,...)
Broadcasts the message to specified terminals, where terminal-name is
the device name of the terminal. Incompatible with /USERNAME.
/URGENT
Sends a message beginning "URGENT..."; if used with the /BELL qualifier,
rings two bells at terminal(s) receiving the message.
/USERNAME=(username,...)
Broadcasts a message to the terminals of the specified users. Overrides
any NOBROADCAST settings at users' terminals.
/WAIT
Sends message synchronously and waits.
Greg.
|
| 298.8 | There's Also SEND >-< Told 'Em To Fix REPLY | CLOSET::DYER | Define `Quality' | Tue Sep 02 1986 18:02 | 4 |
| There's also a SEND utility in the ToolShed.
I've made a suggestion to VMS Development that they break
REPLY up into two images.
<_Jym_>
|
| 298.9 | | ULTRA::PRIBORSKY | Tony Priborsky | Wed Sep 03 1986 12:17 | 14 |
| Re: .7:
$ DEFINE REPLY SYS$SYSTEM:BROADCAST.EXE
Then, REPLY/SHUTDOWN or REPLY/DISABLE...
This is using the normal command language definition against your
supposedly "secure" *INSTALLED* image. There are other ways to
get around this too...
There's no less or more security in doing it your way - only a feeling
of false security because some hacker hasn't figured out how to
get around it.
|
| 298.10 | OOPS... | WORM::MCCLURE | The Kwisatz Haderach | Wed Sep 03 1986 18:02 | 13 |
| RE .9:
That simple to hack huh ? Humm, just going to have to write a
program to do what I really want. I usually don't make that
bad of an error, must be losing my touch...
RE .8:
I agree strongly with the suggestion that REPLY be split into two
utilities. I always wondered why the VMS equal of RSX BROADCAST
didn't exist already.
Greg.
|
| 298.11 | I think you need SYSNAM | 3784::GRIER | Hacking Central | Sun Sep 07 1986 23:56 | 9 |
| Re: .9:
Won't the REPLY logical name require an EXEC-mode logical (aka
"trusted" logical) name? If so, it requires SYSNAM privilege, which
you don't give to someone unless you trust them not to muck things
up.
-mjg
|
| 298.12 | | THEBAY::MTHOMAS | The Mad Hacker | Mon Sep 08 1986 04:52 | 2 |
| What does DCL care? It just uses the logical name to find out what
image to activate.
|
| 298.13 | | RANI::LEICHTERJ | Jerry Leichter | Sun Sep 14 1986 20:42 | 22 |
| re: .11, .12
No, any kind of logical will do for this purpose - it doesn't have to be
"trusted".
For a simple-minded generic "broadcast to a terminal" program, pick up my
ALARM2 program from the Toolshed; the program NOTIFY that's part of it does
what you want.
-- Jerry
A bit of history: In V2, REPLY did not allow you to send to your own terminal.
In V3, it did. In V4, it again did not. I complained about this as just about
the first (unofficial) SPR against the terminal driver/REPLY. It turned out
that V4.0 had a much more serious problem: The broadcast logic more or less
inverted the privilege test, and let through only those who normally would
not have had access (because they couldn't access the terminal itself). REPLY
did it's own check, and ran with OPER, so this wasn't noticed....
Anyway, the $BRKTHRU bug was fixed in 4.1, and the eventual response to my
complaint about REPLY was "well, yes, it probably should let you REPLY to
your own terminal, but the documentation SAYS you need privs, so it's kind of
hard to say this is a BUG".... -- J
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