Conference noted::equitation

    Whatever you do, make sure that you write the agreement down so
    that everyone knows what is expected of the other.  This is especially
    true when there are special arrangements like this.  The cost of
    hay varies by location and time of year.  You should expect to pay
    from $100 to $170 per ton for hay depending on whats in it and how
    you buy it.  Our horses eat about 1 1/2 to 2 tons each per year.
    
    Bob
    

    I'm not sure what area you are in, but in the eastern MA area, I
    think that is a decent deal even at $75.00 per month. At one time
    I was looking at leasing 2 stalls with 2 pastures in Concord, MA.
    To do all the work myself and buy feed, hay, shavings, etc. (plus.
    no outside water) would have been $100.00 per month per stall. I
    know that Concord is expensive but I ended up boarding the 2 critters
    out for just a little more...
    
    Essentially she is paying you $75.00 per month to feed her horse
    and do her stall for $75.00 for about 22 days per month. That amounts
    to a less than minimum wage payback, if you look at it as getting
    paid for your labor :^)
    
    Good luck in your decision,
    
    Linda

    I have to agree with Linda. It is very reasonable for you to up
    your fee to $75.00. If per chance this boarder decides to move on,
    I would study what you offer carefully. A typical rough board
    arrangement would have the person paying a fee for the stall and
    pasture, and be required to provide all supplies and maintenance
    themselves. Your service of feeding twice a day and stallwork is
    a very attractive benefit that most people might be willing to pay
    a bit more for...even splitting the work a bit. When I had rough
    boarders I charged $60 a month for the use of stall and pasture,
    morning feeding and turnout only. The owner provided all supplies
    and other services, very much  including vet and farrier visits.
    
    Good luck!!
    Marianne
    

    I live in Franklin, 2 miles off of 495, if that makes a difference.
    

    
    
    I think $75.00 is very reasonable.  I'm going to start rough boarding
    in Salem NH and board there is $85.00 monthly and that includes feeding
    in the morning and turn out everyday (only if you need so, otherwise
    you are responsible).  Also the owner sets up a time
    and date for a clinic for shots but you could use your own vet if
    you prefer.  I have to provide for grain,hay,sawdust, and of course
    cleaning and feeding at night.  I will be the one to set up any
    dates for the farrier or vet if needed.  ( And of course be there )
    The stables are very neat and the owner is very personable and gentle
    with each horse.  There is a track and lunging area and also a ring
    with jumps.  
    
    	Hope this helps!
    
    
    Zina
    
    I prefer rough boarding because I rather be the one to mainly handle
    my horse.  Most prices in this area run from $60.00 to $95.00 for
    rough boarding.  

    I think that $50 is a bargain for what you provide. In PA that is
    the going rate for do-it-your-self with nothing but stall and paddock
    included. NO feeding NO stall cleaning. Full board runs $150-$250
    in the same area. I would rethink this whole setup if I were you.
    
    My 2 cents,
    Sandy
    

                         Too good a deal!
    
    I live in Medway about 1 mile from 495. So your just down the road
    from me. I rough board 3 horses for $40 dollars a stall. Thats only
    because I have 3, If I was only boarding 1 It would have been $50
    a stall. And thats still cheaper than anybody else I know thats
    rough boarding in our area! I do all the work my self and supply
    everything. I know of a rough board barn in Millis that three people
    are boarding at. Everybody does 1/3 of the feedings, even the owner
    and she have 2 horses everybody else one. She charges $65 a stall
    and each person is respondable for there own supplys and cleanings.
     Most people who rough board are paying for the stall only. And
    $50 is a good price for that. I think your giving her much too good
    of a deal. even if you do raise the price. She should relize that
    she's not going to get a deal like that anywhere in the area. Three
    horses is a lot of work (I know!) I would make some changes if I
    were you. If she dosn't want to pay the extra $$ than at least 
    insist that she does more feedings. At least It would free up some
    of your time. 
    
                                        Gina
    

    I think you're giving her a deal.  I always thought the difference
    between rough board and full board was rough board they rent the
    stall/pasture and provide everything else (food and labor), full
    board you provide the labor, and food.
    
    Sounds like you're giving her almost full board at rough board prices
    and allowing her to pay for her own food.

    
    We boarded for a year and we charged $90.00 for rough, that includes
    nothing. You clean and supply shavings, you feed and supply hay
    and grain. You turn out and exercise. We provided and home, like
    an apartment. That's it...
    

Thanks for the advice.  I am definitely going to raise it to $75.00.  I will 
give her a couple months notice though.  I know before she came to my place she 
boarded her horse at her fathers' and he charged her $75.00 with the same work 
arrangement that we have.

I would really like to get her to do more work too, like do her own stall.  But 
she is a nurse on a rotating schedule.  She works a 32 hour work week but it is 
two-12 hour days and one-8 hour day a week and has the rest of the week off.  
So it would be impossible for her to commit to doing it everyday.  On the other 
hand, I work a 50 hour work week (the 2nd job pays for the barn loan) plus I 
take a night course. So with getting up at 5:30 every morning to do stalls I'm 
really getting run down.

Oh well, we learn by our mistakes.

Thanks again for the advice!

Sue

    per you .9 reply. You have a busy schedule...she should be responsible
    for more of the work. Being a horse owner means be responsible for
    your own horse, your boarder should learn to work around her schedule,
    not have you work around yours. I don't buy her not wanting to be
    tied down, by definition owning a horse is being tied down. If she
    wants total freedom, she should offer to pay you for full board. 
    
      

    In Maryland, near D.C., I charge $100 for partial board.  That means,
    I buy the hay and grain, make arrangements for farrier, vet, do
    the worming, bring the horses in 2x/day for feeding and general
    checking.  I have 30 acres, plus access to 25 miles of trails. 
    The owner does not have to do stalls.  She comes to groom her horse
    and to ride.
    
    This arrangement works well because I swapped board for one guy
    who feeds in the morning and for one girl who feeds/mucks in the
    evening.  The guy also does general farm work whenever I need it,
    since he has a second horse at the farm, for which he pays cost.
    
    Horses on partial board don't have stalls.  The owners don't want
    stalls, either.  IN bad weather, I bring the horses in under shelter,
    either stalls or in paddocks with run-ins.  I don't have a run-in
    in the main pasture (yet).
    
    My favorite boarder seems to like this arrangement.  She knows her
    horse will be well taken care of -- enough that she can go to Germany
    for three weeks and write me a note that she knows Rocky will have
    good care.  I just bill her for the farrier and wormer/vet services.
    She always pays her board bill on time or early!
    
    Good luck,
    Merrie
    
    
    Incidentally, pasture board (without feeding hay or grain) runs
    $100 or more in this area.

    WELL SUE....
    
    I HAVE TO AGREE WITH EVERYONE ELSE....
    
    FULL BOARD IN THE SOUTHBORO,DOVER, SHERBORN, FRANKLIN AREA AS I
    HAVE BEEN TOLD IS RUNNING THE CHEAPEST $300.00 (IF YOU ARE LUCKY
    ENOUGH TO FIND A PLACE...OTHER THEN THAT, FULL BOARD IS GOING UP
    TO AS MUCH AS $500.00 PER MONTH. I DO NOT KNOW HOW THESE FOLKS DO
    IT. THEY MUST HAVE GREAT PAYING JOBS, FOR THAT IS MORE THEN MY MORTAGE.
    
    I HAVE ALSO BEEN TOLD THAT JUST RENTING THE STALLS RUNS $75.00 TO
    $150.00 PER MONTH. THIS IS FOR THE STALL ONLY! NO WORK AND A LITTLE
    AREA FOR STORAGE OF SUPPLIES. THESE FOLKS LIKE ONE OF THE REPLIES
    SAID ARE JUST RENTING AN APPARTMENT (STALL) FROM YOU. 
    
    IF IT WAS MY BARN, I WOULD CHARGE ABOUT $100.00 A MONTH. I WOULD
    ALSO SPLIT THE DAYS WITH HER EVENLY... SAY YOU ON THE EVEN DAYS
    AND THE BOARDER ON THE ODD DAYS. YOU EACH HAVE ONE HORSE AND YOU
    ARE PROBLEY FEEDING EVERY DAY IN THE MORNINGS SO I WOULD REALLY
    THINK ABOUT HOW YOU WANT TO DO THIS, HOW MUCH WORK YOU ARE DOING
    AND MAKE SURE THAT YOU SPLIT IT WITH THE BOARDER. OR THE OTHER OPTION
    IS TO GO TO FULL BOARD. YOU RIGHT NOW ARE DOING ALMOST EVERY THING
    AS IF IT WAS FULL BOARD SO CHARGE THEM FOR IT. THIS WAY TOO, THINGS
    WILL BE DONE THE WAYS YOU WANT AND IF THEY ARE NOT GOOD STALL MUCKERS
    THE STALLS WILL BE CLEANED THE WAY YOU WANT.
    
    WELL GOOD LUCK,
    
    TERRY
    
    PS...NOW YOU KNOW WHY I SAID TO YOU BEFORE I REALLY DIDN'T WANT
    ANY BOARDERS.........

    
    
    I believe $75.00 per stall is the going rate at this time.  There
    are a few places for $50.00 but that is usually further out west,
    toward Gardner, Mass.  Even at $75.00, not many people are willing
    to turn out and feed.  That's just the stall and pasture.  The
    fact the you are doing stable work for the horse and only charging
    $50.00 is VERY cheap.  The fact that she refused to feed one more
    day is foolish, considering what she is getting for what she is
    paying.  Unless she doesn't realise the good deal she has.  
    
    I ran into a similar situation.  I took in someone who needed a
    stall fast, full board for $100.00 during the summer, with intent
    to increase to $125.00 once the cold weather came and I would have
    to clean stalls.  Unfortunately, the mare didn't get along with
    my horses so had to be stalled all day, so I ended up lugging
    water (I have a running brook), cleaning stalls etc.  I burnt
    myself out and didn't make any money doing it because the board
    also included feed, shavings etc.  I finally faced the reality
    that I was spending precious time taking care of someone else's
    horse, time taken away from my own, and told her I could no
    longer do it and that if she'd like to stay $50.00 month rough
    board with morning feed and turnout period.  
    
    If I were you I'd up the rough board and cut out caring for her
    horse unless she is willing to do HALF of the chores between
    yours and hers.
    
    Hope it works out.  P.S.  If she decides to leave to spite you,
    I don't think you'd have much problem renting to someone else.
    
    

    
    Some don't realize a good deal when the get one. Others know it's
    a steal and take advantage of it...like mentioned earlier in this
    note, she should understand the committment one has when owning
    a horse. This is why we gave up on boarders.
    
    With our last boarder (rough), $90.00 a month was agreed upon
    including morning feeding. He tried to get afternoons out of us,but
    we refused. Then he wanted stall cleaning. WHAT NEXT.
    What he was trying for was, full board at a rough board price.
    When he realized he was not going to get his way, he moved 
    and is now paying for it! $250.00 full board eslewhere. Now all
    he has to do is show up and ride.
    
    Our stall was back in use a week later. This person asked for nothing
    more. We came to a initial agreement from the start, and that's
    the way it remained. He was asked to leave when his horse became
    totaly unmanageable for anyone including us!

    I would love to have this deal. I would not mind doing the work,
    but it does not pay the mortgage. I am boarding a 17.1 hand horse
    in New Hampshire in a hunter stable. I pay for rough board, (includes
    turn-out for two hours only) $400 a month. He is well taken care
    of and seems to be a happy horse now. My daughter and I go to the
    barn and groom him every day and my daughter rides him every day.
    If I could afford my own barn, I would build one tomorrow. I love
    the four legged children, eventhough they are big. They are a lot
    of work and believe me $50 is nothing.
    You deserve what you put into it.
    Ruth
    

Well I *finally* brought up the subject with my boarder this Saturday (I will 
do anything to avoid conflict).

The final straw was when a couple of weeks ago I came down with bronchitis & 
strep throat at the same time. She knew how sick I was & never even offered to 
help.  I was so sick, and everyday I was cleaning her stall & lugging water.
I had also figured out that I spent about 15 hours a month labor on her horse 
alone which came to less than minimum wage.

I explained to her the problem and gave her these options:

1.  $50  - Total Rough - a)we each take care of our own horses or
                         b)we split all work 50/50

2.  $75  - Keep same feeding arrangement we have now (I feed 12 times a week 
           & she feeds 2 times a week). But split cleaning stalls evenly. 
	   1st week I clean them 3 times, she 4.  2nd week she cleans 3 times 
           and I 4 and so on.

3.  $85 - Keep same situation we have now. 

I didn't offer her full board because I really need the help.  But was willing 
to be real flexible on the above arrangements.

She was fine with the whole situation and chose no. 2.  She said she would 
double check with her husband.  She called me later on Saturday and said that 
he said it was fair and that would be fine.  I felt like so much weight had 
been taken off my shoulders.

Well, I got to work this Monday and she called to say that she didn't think it 
was fair that I was increasing the work and the money.  Her biggest concern was
that she had just joined nautilus and now she won't have enough time to workout.

I told her we should sit down go over our schedules try to work something out 
that we both could live with and if we couldn't come up with something and she 
feels her nautilus is more important than taking care of her horse than maybe 
she should find a full board barn where somebody else could take care of her 
horse for her.

She said she didn't have time to meet me until Feb 23. I kind of thought 
that was wierd unless she wants time to look for another place.  Meanwhile, I 
am still doing most of the work.  I just called her to move the date up and 
she said the soonest she could see me is this Monday.  So I hope this will be 
resolved then.

Sorry, to bother you all with this soap opera.  I am just so fustrated and it's 
hard to talk to non-horsey people that don't understand the work that is 
involved in taking care of horses properly.

Thanks for all your help and advice.  It has given me a lot more confidence to 
stand my ground.

Susan

                

    
    This sounds strange enough I would be tempted to give her one week's
    notice to move her horse.  No exceptions.  No discussion.  (This
    is your property after all.)
    
    Since she is being this irresponsible and thinks you are the bad
    guy for wanting more money and help, I have doubts whether the
    situation can be rectified to everyone's satisfaction.  
    
    In addition, if she feels this way, I don't know that she could be
    trusted to take care of her chores. (I sure wouldn't want this person
    even on my property much less possibly touching my horse.) 
    
    If you need help, then let her go.  Then find someone who would
    be glad to board their horse at your place and who would be happy
    with your arrangement.  I'm sure there are many who would gladly
    keep their horse with you for the prices you are offering.

    Mary Jo (who is very intolerant of people trying to turn me into
    a slave)

    
    Mary Jo you said a mouthful.  I was reading Susans note and 
    everything you replied with I agreed with whole heartedly. 
    I would definately think twice about this person being in my
    barn, as with Mary Jo, it would be all I could do to 
    give this person a weeks notice... 
    
    Marianne
    

                I am usually *read* only but I can't get over the
    attitude of the boarder! Sounds like she has her priorities
    alittle mixed up. If doing Nautilas is more important then
    taking care of her horse then she shouldn't own it. Horses
    need alot of attention and good ole TLC! I don't believe that
    they can be a part-time venture. This may be off track but the
    attitudes of some so-called 'horse owners' really gets me mad!
    I agree with the past couple replies and would find someone else
    that truly enjoys horses. It would certainly be easier for you.
               Sorry for rambling.....
    
                      Bob_who_loves_our_horse_even_though_my
    wife_does_MOST_of_the_work     
    

    Sue,
    	What was the outcome of your last meeting with your 
    boarder?  I am hoping that you stood your ground (maybe
    even print a few of the replies and rates others charge)
    and showed her what a great deal she was getting.
    
    Let us know how everything went.
    
    -Marti Davis (borrowing Diane Dillon's account to write this)
    

Things really didn't change too much.  I raised her board to $75.00 and she did 
the stalls one more time a week but that lasted for about a month and she kept 
forgetting to do the stalls and forgetting to feed.  I was a wreck because I 
always had to check up on her to make sure the horses were being taken care of.

In August my husband and I decided to take a vacation for a week and I had 
asked her several months in advance to feed and she said it was fine.  The day 
before we were leaving she told me that her and her husband decided to go away 
also and she couldn't feed.  At this point, I already had our reservations made 
and a lot of money spent so I had to ask a few friends to take turns feeding 
the horses.   

This past October my husband and I decided to go away for a weekend and I asked 
her to feed again and she said okay.  Two days before, she backed out and said 
she decided to go away also.  This time I held my ground and said she had to be 
more responsible that this was like a job and I was sick of being taken 
advantage of.  She stayed home and fed.

In November she told me she was leaving to a place down the street from her.  
(She lives in my town).  She was going to do rough board were she was going.  
(That's what I wanted all along!)  My heart went out for her horse.  

The last couple weeks she was at my house she proved my concerns correct.
Normally, I ordered all the shavings, hay and grain and she would reimburse 
me.  She told me not to order anything for her since she was leaving, that she 
would take care of it.  I agreed that it would make things easier.  Well, she 
didn't come out the last week and a half her horse was at my barn.  Her horse 
had no shavings in his stall.  I kept calling her and left messages on 
her answering machine but she never did anything about it.  So I decided to 
put my shavings in the stall because I didn't think it was fair for the horse 
to suffer.  She never offered to pay me back and at this point I really didn't 
care.

You're probably wondering why I put up with so much.  Lisa may have been really 
irresponsible but I thought she was a nice person.  We had a lot of fun when we 
went riding together.  I also loved her horse and I knew I was giving him a 
good home.

I don't have a boarder now.  But am looking for one.  I am not out to make a 
lot money.  I just want someone to share in the work (I'm still working the 2 
jobs and going to school nights).  It would also be fun to have someone to 
ride with.  

My barn is advertised in note 824.17.  Both the price and arrangement are 
negotiable.  We will be starting the riding ring in the Spring.  If you know 
of anyone looking, please refer them to me. 

Regards,

Susan

               

    HI, there.  Are you still boarding?  I am having a heck of a time
    finding suitable living arrangements for my animals.  I know this note
    is old, but I thought I'd take a chance and reply anyway.  Let me know
    if you want to/can accomodate 2 goats and one gelding.  
    
    Thanks!  Laurel.

    re.last
    Laurel...
    
    the way the economy is , I wouldnt pay lat years board prices or the
    year before either...
    
    People are now willing the talk board price with you, and get it in 
    writing and make sure it can be locked in for a year or so..
    
    
    	wendy o'