Conference noted::bicycle

An excellant rim in that price range would be a MAVIC 217.  217's are very
strong rims.  The difference between straight gauge and double butted spokes is
weight.  They're both equally as strong.  I run double butted on my mountain
bike and can attest to their strength.  

						Shawn

    Look up one of the many mail order places and see what you can do on a
    set of prebuilt wheels.  I saw a set of 95' XTR hubs with Mavic rims
    for $180.00 +/-.  XT hubs with Ritchey rims were about $140.00.  The
    place in question is Bikeworld in Texas, http://Bikeworld.com.  I was
    quoted well over $300.00 for similar from a local shop.  
    
    Brian

    Some comments:
    
    	You don't really say why you want a new wheel set, other then the
        bearings are rougher then Campy Record.  Of course Record hubs cost
        more then Dur-Ace which are the road going equivalent of XTR.  So
        in all likely hood droping down two steps from there is not going
        to give you something in the Record class.
    
    Now given that there are a few reasons that you might want a new wheel
    set.
    
    	1. Lighter weight
    	2. Better Durability
    	3. Just plain fun buying new stuff (Usually my real reason)
    
    I have both XT and XTR hubs on bikes at home.  The XTR has much better 
    seals in it.  The XT needs to be rebuilt more often.  Once a month
    would be good in the case of the XT hubs, but is has been a really wet
    year and alot of racing.  LX is likely to be very similar to XT is this
    respect.  All of the Shimano hubs have replacable ball bearings and can
    fairly easy to rebuild, but do it often enough the races cannot be
    replaced and if they get pitted then its time for a new hub.  Go
    someplace where you can put your hands on the hubs and see how the
    different hubs feel to you.
    
    As someone else stated its hard to beat the Mavic 217 rim.  I would
    give some serious consideration to the Sun Cr17a because you can buy
    them at such a reasonable price.  Forget fancy coatings and the like in
    general they don't add much and can contribute to other bad
    characteristics.  Just be aware that rims are wear items, that is they
    wear out and need to be replaced.  In bad conditions its not unusual
    for a rim to wear out in less then one year.
    
    Spokes - 14/15/14 spokes are lighter and will build a stronger wheel
    than straight 14 guage spokes.  Read "The Bicycle Wheel" by Jobst
    Brandt if you want to know why this is true.  If you want a light wheel
    then use alloy spoke nipples but be prepared to replace broken ones
    from time to time as they will not last like brass nipples.
    
    If you think that you want to go to 8 speed some time then put on an 8
    speed now.  You don't have to use all of the cogs and the spacing will
    be the same 135mm.  It will shift 7 of the 8 speeds just the same and 
    you likely have a 12-28 7 speed if you go with a 11-28 8 speed then you 
    just skip the 11 and you have the same 12-28 that you are used to.
    
    One thing you don't say is how/where you plan on having them built.  If
    you plan on doing it yourself, buy and read the above mentioned book. 
    If your going somewhere check around for their reputation on wheel
    building.  The most important part is the building, everything you have
    mentioned here will make a good wheel if it is properly built and a
    lousy one if its not.  The best of parts will not make up for a poorly
    built wheel.
    
    The wheel set that I want is "Chris King Hubs" (of course the rear hub
    is not quite out yet) 32 DT 14/15/14 spokes, DT Alloy nipples, Sun
    CR17a rims, and Salsa steel flip off skewers.  But now we're talking
    about $400.00 for a set of wheels that don't really do much more then
    the $140.00 XT/MAVIC 231/ 14/15/14 DT spoked wheels that I have
    already.  By the way I suspect that you would be hard pressed to
    measure any real power lost in the "rough" hubs.  But like I said I
    just like to buy new and nifty stuff.
    
    Anyway thats my ramblins on the issue.
    
    Scott

Wow, that's a lot of good advice in the last few messages.  Thanks.  

My reason for wanting better hubs is because I rode for over 10 years on 
no-name hubs on the Fuji. Then I picked up a pair of Campy Record hubs at
a discount sale and immediately noticed a big difference in the rolling
resistance of the bike.  I expect to see a similar gain on the mountain
bike.  I'm getting older and don't want to work so hard to get exercise.

I pulled up the Cannondale Web page and looked for wheel components.

Model      Front Hub     Rear Hub      Rims       Spokes
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
M200 SE    Sovos         Sovos         Sun L21    DT Swiss Stainless
M300       Sovos         Sovos         Sun L21    DT Swiss Stainless, 15 gauge
M400       Acera X       Acera X       Sun TL18   DT Swiss Stainless, 15 gauge
M500       Acera X       Acera X       Sun TL18   DT Swiss Stainless, 15 gauge
M800       Acera X       Acera X       Sun TL18   DT Swiss Stainless, 15 gauge
M900       CODA 700M     Shimano LX    Mavic 220  DT Swiss Stainless, 15 gauge
F1000      CODA A900M    Shimano LX    Mavic 220  DT Swiss Stainless, 15 gauge


I believe I will try to find some LX hubs on sale, look closely at the Mavic
rims, and go with double-butted spokes.  If I can find some wheels that are
already built for a good price, I'll go with those.  Thanks for the advice so 
far.  BTW, I worked in a bike shop in the late 70's and built wheels.

Jim

    hi Jim, from .0
    >I repacked the bearing [on your mtn bike] and it is still much
    >rougher than the... road bike.
    
    I don't think I've ever repacked a wheel bearing [that didn't have
    pitted races] and had that happen.  Are you sure you weren't just an
    fraction of a turn too tight with the inner axle nut?
    
    My experience is that even the crappiest wheel bearing can be made to
    spin like silk with no play... how long it stays that way is another
    topic.
    Kratz
    
    
    

    In case you're open to buying still....
    
    I purchased some road wheels at Colorado Cyclist and have been VERY
    pleased with them - three years and only minor adjusting to the rear
    twice. And the price was right.  Their wheels have been rated highest
    of the mail order firms in the past.  I would recommend looking into
    them for the Mtn bike wheels too.  The LX/Sun CR17 is $136, pplus about
    $12 for DB spokes.  XT is $174.  Prices with Mavic appear to be about
    $25 more.  
    
    They did a better job than the bike stores around here when it comes to
    wheels staying true.  I have been
    happy with LX hubs, but they have never been wet, so I can't wouch for
    the seals (desert riding only).   
    
    
    Always fun to buy new toys :)

>>    I don't think I've ever repacked a wheel bearing [that didn't have
>>    pitted races] and had that happen.  Are you sure you weren't just an
>>    fraction of a turn too tight with the inner axle nut?

I believe I set them up properly.  They are tightened just to the point where
there is no axial slop in the system.  I kept on redoing it until I had it
just right.  The bearings were tight before I repacked them so I may have
some minor pitting on the races.

Jim

If you don't mind spending some extran money check out White Industries hubs. 
They use a sealed cartrige bearing.  The hub can be disasembled using an allen
wrench.  I'm using them right now and they're really light and smooth.  Another
hub worth looking into is the HOPE hub.  My wife is using these laced with Ti
spokes and 217 rims.  This is an incredibly light wheel.  You could get a set of
White wheels built with double butted, alloy nipples, and 217's for around $400.
 Both of the aformentioned wheelsets are mountain wheels and they really take a
pounding.  I've never needed to true either one and they're still as smooth as
the day they came out of the box.

						Shawn

    Don't worry about the 7 speed cogset: Grip Shift makes a 7 speed model
    (SRT-600) - Mark