| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 2738.1 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Mon Mar 21 1994 17:07 | 3 |
| Gag on your steel Abie baby!
You had to have know that one wouldn't get a free pass!!! :-)
|
| 2738.2 | | MTVIEW::ALVIDREZ | state of the artie | Mon Mar 21 1994 18:08 | 5 |
|
Abe speaks the truth...
AAA
|
| 2738.3 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Tue Mar 22 1994 09:12 | 11 |
| Abe defies the law of physics. I'm not going to defend a position
that training (and the motor) are the single most important variables
regardless of the sport.
But clearly no one would argue the fact that if we took Andy Hampsten
back to the Alp D'Huez, could duplicate the precise conditions twice.
The first using his stage winning effort, the second strapping 10lbs.
to his back. Could we expect the same results (not effort or stage
win, but results)?
Maybe on Saturn...
|
| 2738.4 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Tue Mar 22 1994 09:13 | 20 |
| Oh, I almost forgot. On the steel thing...
:-pppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp's
Bwhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
|
| 2738.5 | | PAKORA::GGOODMAN | Loonatic | Tue Mar 22 1994 12:59 | 10 |
|
You can always rely on Chip to come up with an argument based on
mature thinking.... :*)
Re. Campy v Shimano
In the UK, Shimano is now suddenly finding the 105 groupset equally
priced with far higher quality Campag stuff...
Graham.
|
| 2738.6 | Sticker Shock in Boston | GNPIKE::JOHNSON | Matt Johnson | Tue Mar 22 1994 13:24 | 19 |
| I went out shopping with a friend this weekend. While he tried out
MTBs, I poked around looking at road bikes.
Shock #1: Road bikes are hard to find in Boston shops these days!
Shock #2: The prices are UP! (Who said inflation is 2%?????)
I'm so glad I got my road bikes 5-8 years ago. The pace of innovation
has slowed since then (I have Dura Ace click-shift and 8-speed; all I
lack is STI/Ergo-style shifters), but the prices have skyrocketed. I
simply couldn't afford Dura Ace at today's prices. Now I wonder whether
I'll even be able to afford a spare Dura Ace chainring!
With the lira at 1700/$ these days, there's also no justification for
bloated Basso, Campy, and Bianchi prices. I bet that someone
travelling in Italy could do MUCH better.
At least there are a few nice new toys, like Mavic's electronic
shifters. I'd be worried about dropping the bike, though; the rear
derailleur juts out about 3 inches to the right of the bike.
|
| 2738.7 | Campy is making a BIG mistake | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Tue Mar 22 1994 15:51 | 11 |
| To .6
As far as pricing is concerned the Shimano company seems to be
dealing with valid currency conversion disadvantages which are showing up
in it's prices, Campy seems to be taking advantage of the situation by
raising it's prices. Campy should be focused on taking market share
while it can. What goes around comes around, Campy will pay more than
it already has for it's current mistake.
Abe;
|
| 2738.8 | Challenge Accepted | BOOKIE::J_CROCKER | | Tue Mar 22 1994 16:44 | 8 |
| RE: .0
Abe,
Don't have a Merlin, but do have titanium. When can we meet in the
Wachussett parking lot?
Justin ;-)
|
| 2738.9 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Tue Mar 22 1994 17:19 | 3 |
| I WANNA SEE THIS!!!!! Make sure I get the date and time!!!!!
:-)
|
| 2738.10 | The challenge is set | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Tue Mar 22 1994 18:12 | 10 |
| Justin,
Saturday, the 16th of April looks good. I will send you a message
as the day approaches to set the time that we can meet. If this date
is ok with you then most of the challenge is set.
Abe;
P.S. to make things fair I will bring my "puppy" steel bike :-)
|
| 2738.11 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Wed Mar 23 1994 09:14 | 6 |
| Okay... I'm setting odds and taking bets... I will also attend this
"Duel in the Sun" to insure all rules and agreements are enforced.
Gentlemen, good luck to the both of you!
Chip
|
| 2738.12 | Expense vs. utility | USOPS::CLELAND | Centerline violation... | Wed Mar 23 1994 11:30 | 16 |
| The challenge is ill-founded.
The argument is Titanium vs. Steel. This argument cannot be solved
by pitting two different people on two different bikes.
The race can only be man against man, not machine against machine.
A much more unbiased test would need to be devised to test the
advantages of weight. No one would argue that lighter can be
faster, but Chip's claim of "10 lbs." is a bit absurd.
Titanium bikes are not 10 lbs. lighter than steel bikes. And the
current price of titanium frames places them in the hands of only
the financially elite.
No offense intended Chip, titanium is just too expensive...
|
| 2738.13 | Frame Test: No; Fun Ride: Yes | LHOTSE::DAHL | | Wed Mar 23 1994 11:58 | 9 |
| RE: <<< Note 2738.12 by USOPS::CLELAND "Centerline violation..." >>>
I was going to put in a reply to the same effect: what's the point of the hill-
climb test? Certainly no conclusions as to the effect of the bike frame's
material will be able to be drawn from the results, no matter whan the results
are.
That notwithstanding, I hope you both have an enjoyable ride.
-- Tom
|
| 2738.14 | Right .12 and .13 | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Wed Mar 23 1994 14:16 | 9 |
| The hillclimb is about ego at this point. .12 and .13 are right,
the only thing that is going to happen is that one person is going to
leave the hill with his tail between his legs. The larger point of
steel versus titanium will remain unexplored ( the only thing that is
certain is that Ti is a little lighter and far more expensive and
unrepairable ).
Abe;
|
| 2738.15 | No betting of course | STRATA::HUI | | Wed Mar 23 1994 14:31 | 18 |
|
What are the odds for this race? I want part of the action. Is it handicap
by age like NASTAR ski racing? Could this turn out to be the a new method of
uphill time trialing (letting 2 rider go at the same time)? This could be a
weekend ritual.
Go Abe! I meant Go Justin!
Can not be bias:-)
Good Luck to booth,
Dave
|
| 2738.16 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Wed Mar 23 1994 14:45 | 21 |
| Re; .12 No kidding? It won't decide the Ti steel debate?
10lb example absurd?
Ti frames are not 10lbs lighter than steel?
Ti is too expensive?
Take no offense, but you certainly have a propensity for the
obvious, so please...
Re; .12 & .13 (Tom) Lighten up a little, will ya?
There used to be an annual Mt. Wachusett TT (they called it a TT) in
October. The last one (I believe) was in '89. It evolved from a mass
start race to a timed rider release to nothing... Too bad, it was fun.
If there is interest in "organizing" something on a regular basis that
could be fun. I'd get involved...
Chip
|
| 2738.17 | Count me in! | USCTR1::VINCENT | | Wed Mar 23 1994 16:04 | 3 |
| I WANT IN!!!!! I'll be representing the carbon fiber crowd.......
Pete
|
| 2738.18 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Wed Mar 23 1994 16:19 | 8 |
| Well, any wise cracks about the plastic bikes out there?
Ha, I thought so... :-)
Chip
P.S. Welcome back! When were you let back in the country? :-)
|
| 2738.19 | | NOVA::FISHER | Tay-unned, rey-usted, rey-ady | Thu Mar 24 1994 07:24 | 6 |
| since this is going down a royal rathole anyway, Wachusett started
as a timed rider release TT its first two years (84/5) then went to
a mass start by groups in 86. I don't know what it did after that
before it died.
ed
|
| 2738.20 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Thu Mar 24 1994 08:56 | 8 |
| The last year is was timed release (minute intervals) by rider
category. They gave out money and prizes to the winners.
Fastest time was a 16:something by a Cat 3 rider (Andre Goguen).
Paul Butler took 2nd Sr. I took 3rd ($15.00 my first money ever).
USCF ran the show but I can't remeber who sponsored it. It's in here
somewhere...
|
| 2738.21 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Thu Mar 24 1994 08:58 | 3 |
| BTW, I put the Ti retro-kit on my new Campy dual pivit brakes.
No one's gonna tell me I ain't got the fastest brakes in town!!! :-)
|
| 2738.22 | | PAKORA::GGOODMAN | Loonatic | Thu Mar 24 1994 14:55 | 4 |
|
The fastest stolen, maybe... :*)
Graham.
|
| 2738.23 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Thu Mar 24 1994 14:59 | 1 |
| Bite your tongue! :-)
|
| 2738.24 | All our questions answered in one race! :-) | SWAM2::SEYMOUR_DO | You got a pool over there? | Thu Mar 24 1994 16:03 | 18 |
| While we're at it why don't we settle the Campy vs. Shimano question at
the same time. We all know that Abe's steel machine says "Made in
Japan" all over it. If Justin's Ti steed is Campy equiped, and it
should be if it's a Basso, we could kill two birds with one stone.
Chip, maybe you could lend Justin some Italian exotica to settle the
issue once and for all. Then we won't have to read any more notes
about Campy vs. Shimano. :-)
But then if the steel beats the Ti, was it really the steel or was it
the Shimano stuff. Or if the Campy beats the Shimano was it the really
the Campy or was it the Ti. I'm getting so confused. :-)
If Justin's running Shimano he'll have to race Chip I guess to settle
this. :-)
Still waiting for the details on how to place my bet!
Don
|
| 2738.25 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Thu Mar 24 1994 16:21 | 5 |
| You're right Don... I'm joining the ranks of the confused myself.
We never even considered their ages either! And yet another variable!
What about toothpaste? Sheesh, I give up! :-)
|
| 2738.26 | Time for Hillclimb | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Fri Mar 25 1994 14:15 | 8 |
| Justin,
I will meet you at the visitor center parking lot on April 16 at
10 am. If you want we can start the race from the entrance to the
ski lodge.
Abe;
|
| 2738.27 | Do All of Mile Hill Road | LHOTSE::DAHL | | Fri Mar 25 1994 14:58 | 5 |
| RE: <<< Note 2738.26 by LUDWIG::ASMITH >>>
If you want to maximize the test, start at the bottom of Mile Hill Road (a ways
below the entrance to the ski area). That's a grind!
-- Tom
|
| 2738.28 | April 16 | BOOKIE::J_CROCKER | | Fri Mar 25 1994 18:51 | 15 |
| Good suggestion, Tom (otherwise Mile Hill won't be a mile). With all
this snow, we probably won't be able to go to the top.
BTW, Chip and I did race each other last summer, to a virtual
standstill (track stand?) out on 140. Chip had Campy, I had Shimano
(does this mean they're equal?).
Abe, I've been looking forward to meeting you, especially after hearing
we were in the same race at Killington last year 8-).
Chip, could I borrow your bike? I mean I've got a Ti frame, but, well,
I've got a lotta pretty standard hardware. In fact, I bought Ti 'cause
it doesn't rust ;-), not because it's light ;-)
Justin
|
| 2738.29 | Count me in if road open | LASSIE::ZIELONKO | | Sun Mar 27 1994 19:05 | 9 |
| If the road is clear to the top by then count me in.
Should definately start at the bottom.
One more course suggestion. The route should be the "long way". That is the way
where you actually go on that little downhill.
PS. My bike is a steel Nivacrom. The gruppo on my bike is
MaviSachSuntouShimanolo.
|
| 2738.30 | | NOVA::FISHER | Tay-unned, rey-usted, rey-ady | Mon Mar 28 1994 10:13 | 5 |
| get any more folks in this and you'll need marshalls.
what about ducking the bar across the road?
ed
|
| 2738.31 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Mon Mar 28 1994 10:27 | 11 |
| Maybe April 16th is little too soon... Good points made about the
the gate still being closed and the road plowed. For the life of me,
I can't remember when the gate was opened or the plow went through
last year...
Maybe I'll call the visitor's center. They do plow before they open
the gate for the season.
By all means, you must go in the designated direction (long way).
Chip
|
| 2738.32 | Could be a dirty, slippery road this spring. | NOTAPC::BURGESS | | Mon Mar 28 1994 18:08 | 57 |
| re Racing up Wa_chu_chu
I did it somewhen around '85 - I placed fourth in what we then
referred to as "Senior Citz" in something under 19 minutes (from the
lodge, using the auto route, I guess that is the "long way").
I remember passing George Gamache who had started 3 or 4 minutes ahead
of me.
Anyhow, I've been watching that hill quite a bit this winter,
mostly from the chair lifts and slopes - I've also been in some
conversations about the hill, the lifts, the road, etc. Here's what I
understand to be going on, mostly hearsay....
i) They have to open the road April 15th. This is sorta
absolute, that is - no more snow making or snow grooming across the
roads, though if the skies dump loads of natural snow, say on the
night of 14th, they don't have to clear it - they'd probably just
close the road again.
ii) There's a new "high speed quad" lift to replace the Summit
lift, supposedly the contractor arrives April 10th to start...
probably with the tear down of the existing equipment.
iii) More trails are to be cut - supposedly between the head of the
Nor'Easter lift and the head of the Summit lift. The triple chairs
from the existing Summit lift will probably go over there.
iv) The ski lifts will close early if they run out of snow - or if
people just stop showing up to ski on slush, wet grass, stumps, rocks, etc.
v) There is some talk about the Mountain store staying open after
the lifts are closed, supposedly to sell "Mountain Bike stuff".
The person that told me this didn't know if there was any kind of a plan
to use the mountain as a Mtn bike recreational area - I *_DID_* ask (-:
From the above I'd guess;
There may be heavy construction equipment on the mountain road
for quite some time, maybe logging trucks too. There could be delays
if they're stringing lift cables across the road. Almost ANY logging
will lead to significant MUD slicks. Mtn Bike play trails might
appear this year.
I don't think I'd want to race up there until the road is open
and fairly CLEAN, as I remember it the downhill stretch can be quite
fast and leads into a curve that requires good traction. They put a
lot of water (artificial snow) on that hill this winter, together with
the natural stuff it will be a while before its all run off.
Reg
PS Skiing along the sections that I know to be road that I've ridden
was a bit weird at first. It might have inspired me to start riding
again..... might... maybe... (-:
|
| 2738.33 | Oh comeon, let's have it, PLEASE :-) | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Mon Mar 28 1994 21:36 | 5 |
| O.K. , then we're just have a cyclo-cross that's run on pavement,
log trucks and all. Trying to climb on slippery pavement should
be fun, and a true test of equipment and strength.
|
| 2738.34 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Tue Mar 29 1994 10:33 | 11 |
| Run-off has never been a problem in early spring. Generally, the
road is a little "dirty", e.g. twigs and branches, but they get
at it quickly.
My guess is that, while I agree construction will dirty-up the road,
that it won't interfere with the use of that mountain. Remember, the
road needs to stay open. The Mountain is not owned by the Crowleys. My
guess is that if there are plans to mess around up there the state
will insure that public access is not interefered with (I hope).
|
| 2738.35 | follow my tracks | MSBCS::BROWN_L | | Mon Apr 04 1994 02:16 | 7 |
| re .32
The road up the south side of the mountain is doable with a mtn
bike and a good rear tire. Some sections are already melted down
to pavement, and on the rest there's at most 3 inches of old
corn snow. I was able to come down the whole way without getting
off the bike (ok, crashed once, but I coulda done it).
Kratz
|
| 2738.36 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Mon Apr 04 1994 09:06 | 2 |
| I think they're closing the mountain on 4/10 which means they should
have the road bulldozed by the following weekend!
|
| 2738.37 | Some snow but not much it looks like. | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Mon Apr 04 1994 10:54 | 5 |
| I did some reconnaissance up at the mountain this Saturday gone.
Does not look like there is much snow on the mountai itself but the
entrance gate area is a mess. The pavement seems to have come through
the winter well.
|
| 2738.38 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Mon Apr 04 1994 15:33 | 6 |
| Just heard that Crowley is trying to get another week extension
(to the 17th of April)...
I'll keep you posted.
Chip
|
| 2738.39 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Tue Apr 12 1994 11:08 | 9 |
| The ski area is closed. They're supposed to plow through the trails
(crosses the road) this week. My guess is you may have to reschedule
the duel. Even if they plow, there will probably be ice/snow film
where the trails cross.
I know a guy who works at the Mt. Wach lounge and he's gonna get
more info for me...
Chip
|
| 2738.40 | open from the south | MSBCS::BROWN_L | | Tue Apr 12 1994 15:02 | 12 |
| The road up the sunnier south side of the mountain (Admin Road) was
clear this last weekend. It really took a beating over the winter;
barely doable now with a road bike. The ranger's pickup made some
serious divits in the pavement not too recently.
Directions: [Princeton's] Westminster Rd is about 1 mile south of the
ranger's hq on Mountain Rd. Take Westminster for 1 mile til it makes
a hard left; but you go straight (around the gate) and follow the road
to the top. If you come up from the southeast, climb 62 into Princeton
"center", then right (on Mountain Rd, or what becomes Mountain), and
it's about 1/2 mile to Westminster Rd.
Kratz
|
| 2738.41 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Fri Apr 15 1994 10:01 | 3 |
| So you guys duelin' Saturday morning or what?!
Chip
|
| 2738.42 | If it's rain then it's off | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Fri Apr 15 1994 15:34 | 10 |
| If it is raining ( or looks definite ) at 8 am then I don't plan
to show up. In the case of a rain cancellation, Justin can set another
date and I can check my plans to see whether it fits in.
So, if there is no rain and it looks like there will be none at 10
am then the race is on ( sorry about the rain issue, but I am a weenie
when it comes to riding in the rain, mostly for physical reason which I
would rather no go into here ).
Abe;
|
| 2738.43 | Rain or shine | LASSIE::ZIELONKO | | Fri Apr 15 1994 16:43 | 2 |
| As I will be doing this for training I plan on going rain or shine.
Is anyone else going?
|
| 2738.44 | A wild guess, I know | JURA::MACFADYEN | In need of some retail therapy | Sun Apr 17 1994 19:27 | 8 |
| > ( sorry about the rain issue, but I am a weenie
> when it comes to riding in the rain, mostly for physical reason which I
> would rather no go into here ).
Umm, it's because you get cold and wet?
Rod
|
| 2738.45 | Default | BOOKIE::J_CROCKER | | Mon Apr 18 1994 17:51 | 7 |
| Sorry to disappoint, but when I wheeled the bike out the door 8:30
Saturday AM, it started to to pour, so I bagged it.
Abe, we can meet at another time. Karol, I hope you had a fun ride
to the top. How's the road?
Justin
|
| 2738.46 | Justin, I bagged it at 8:15, I win!!! | LUDWIG::ASMITH | | Tue Apr 19 1994 16:59 | 17 |
| Rod,
The reason I don't like to ride in the rain is that my skin
becomes soft when wet and breaks open sort of easily. Whenever
I ride in the rain I get little skin breaks all over my bottom,
this is very painful and causes my not to enjoy the ride and not
to ride for several days afterwards. Vaseline helps but is not
fully effective.
Justin,
I can race you this staurday coming or May 7, 15 or 21. You may
be racing on these dates, if some other time is best for you then let
me know.
Abe;
|
| 2738.47 | Winner in a field of one | LASSIE::ZIELONKO | | Thu Apr 21 1994 19:20 | 17 |
| > -< Justin, I bagged it at 8:15, I win!!! >-
Sorry Abe ;^)
I didn't bag it. Rode it twice. Was gonna go a third time but flatted at the
bottom and *then* i bagged it. times were 21:47 and 23:20. not good but not bad
either for first hard ride of year.
The descent had two extend patches of ice that required walking. The ascent was
fine.
I suggest we move further discussion to the old note where we post our times
up Col de Wachusett. (note # 2284)
It's that time of year again!
Karol
|
| 2738.48 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Fri Apr 22 1994 09:45 | 3 |
| Congratulations! I think I'll check it out personally next week!
Chip
|
| 2738.49 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Tue Apr 26 1994 16:00 | 4 |
| Hey Abe and Justin... You guys gettin' cold feet? Come on now, lets
start working another date...
Chip
|
| 2738.50 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Thu Aug 25 1994 11:00 | 12 |
| Okay, it's been April since anyone's written here and most people
have probably forgotten the challenge, but not meeeeeee...
So, not to be tooooooo obnoxious about this, when are you guys gonna
play? I'm feeling cheated. I want to see this happen. I'm sure the
rest of the noters are also feeling this way, right folks???!!!
So come on, let's give Abe and Justin a little motivation, some
support and inspiration. Fall is coming, beautiful weather, and
the season is beginning to close quickly.
We're waiting.................................
|
| 2738.51 | Let's go... | HYLNDR::OUELLETTE | Buddy Ouellette | Thu Aug 25 1994 17:11 | 5 |
| Yup, I've been waiting for the results, too.
C'mon, guys. Show us which bike (yeah, right ;-) ) is faster.
-Buddy
|
| 2738.52 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Fri Aug 26 1994 11:32 | 5 |
| Quiet, too quiet... Almost eerie... Spooky... Morbidly so...
Could it be... Hmmmm, what could it be?
Chip
|
| 2738.53 | Okay, how 'bout this? | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Mon Aug 29 1994 15:46 | 12 |
| Well, it's getting close to September and I'm still feeling very
empty and unsatisfied... :-)
There seems to a very definite evaporation of interest on both
the participant's part and the audience (save one).
Maybe we should organize a BICYCLE NOTE mass sprint up the hill
some Saturday morning when the traffic is light.
Anyone interested? We could also meet some noters face to face...
Chip
|
| 2738.54 | On a plastic bike... | USCTR1::VINCENT | | Wed Sep 07 1994 20:48 | 1 |
| I'm in. Name the date/time.
|
| 2738.55 | | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Thu Sep 08 1994 09:58 | 7 |
| Okay... We have two people (Pete & me). Anyone else out there
want to join in? Meet some noters and maybe hit the Mt. Wacusett
Lodge for a beer or a little eats afterwards.
I would've at least expected Justin and Abe! :-)
Chip
|
| 2738.56 | Maybe | SOLVIT::ALLEN_R | | Thu Sep 08 1994 13:58 | 12 |
| If I can make it I'll come. But that is a big IF. I don't know how it
would be driving that far and then climbing and then driving back.
Although now that I think of it I did go from Gardner to the mountain
and back then drove home, in August. So maybe if I have the Saturday
clear I'd show up. At least I'd drive to the climb this time, not bike
to it.
Would like to do the climb again with my new gearing and meet you
people.
Maybe this time I won't leave my helmet on the mountain.
rich
|
| 2738.57 | ANOTHER OPTION | WMOIS::GIROUARD_C | | Mon Sep 12 1994 11:23 | 9 |
| A bunch of guys on the FCC Team are talking about organizing a
an (informal) TT up the Mt. sometime this month (or the first
week of October at the latest).
I'll post anything that we decide here...
Regards,
Chip
|