Conference noted::bicycle

    	Tom,
    
    	I don't shave my face either. I agree, what a bother.
    
    	I always assumed that racers shaved their legs for basically
    	two reasons:
    
    	(1) If you hit the deck, it's easier to clean and bandage a
    	    smooth leg.
    
    	(2) If you have something rubbed onto your legs, like some of
    	    the pros, to warm them up, it's much easier if the leg is
    	    smooth.
    
    	I'm sure there are numerous other reasons, like keeping Gilette,
    	Bic, etc., in business. 8-)>
    
    	Scott
            

    YES I DO!!!!!
    
    Our race team has a person that goes to the races and massages are
    legs before the race. You wouldn't believe the difference it makes
    as far as warm ups are concerned.Massages after racing is also
    important as far as aiding in quick recovery. That is why the pros
    shave there legs and I believe most of the amateurs do it to
    emulate them. It has nothing to do with aerodynamics. It's no fun
    getting hairy legs massaged with tiger balm and peanut oil!!!

Yes, I think the massage is the main reason to shave legs but there are more I
can think of.

>    It has nothing to do with aerodynamics. 

I'm sure it does.  I've heard Fignon ( Did I spell correct ? ) said on TV that
he shaves his legs for aerodynamics.  Since legs are moving FAST during races,
I believe shaved legs make a big difference in fast criterium. 

I also believe that lots of amatures shave their legs not because of massage,
but they ( we ? ) want show off more muscle definition and blood vessels.

Well, I used to shave legs everyday because shaved legs give me the feeling
that I look like an European pro ( as long as I am not racing ).  I personally
think shaved legs look better on a bike than hairly ones.

Tak  

    I used to swim competitively (in my "much younger" years) in high
    school and AAU after h/s. Body hair, on a swimmer, can have the
    effect of carrying up to 5 additional lbs. moving through the water.
    
    Now, I have no idea about the resistance of air and hair. I do have
    hairy legs. I'd feel weird shaving 'em especially if someone said,
    "hey, you shaved your legs". I have to admit that I've thought of
    it and wonder what they'd look like.
    
    Fairly hairy but not primatal
    
    Chip

    Fuzz on a tennis ball makes it go faster.
    
    A former NASA engineer repositioned the dimples on a golf ball
    to make it fly further.
    
    Smoother is not always better.
    
    ed

Bicycling mag did a piece on aerodynamics a while back, using wind tunnel 
tests on a variety of components, AND shaved vs. unshaved legs.  Shaving saved 
about 6 seconds over either 25 or 100m.  I don't remember which.  Either way,
its not worth it, to me.

Kevin

    re: .6: It was probably 6 seconds on 25 mi at 25mph.  At my speed
    a stop watch could not detect the difference on 200 mi.
    
    ed

    There's one more advantage to shaved legs nobody else has mentioned:
    your legs are cooler. In addition to two+ water bottles, shaved legs
    are just about mandatory for riding long distances in Texas.
    
    GS

    Epilady sounds like a great gift idea. Not becuase I want to go
    hairless, I like the pain!
    
    Chip

    RE: .7, don't feel bad. At least they use a stopwatch to time you.
    They use a CALENDAR to time me!
    
    						:^)
    

    re .4
    
    I also used to swim in my younger years. The major reason for shaving
    was (for short distances) the change in the "feeling" that shaved
    legs has when moving in the water.  Practice with hair, shave the
    nite prior to the BIG race, dive in, and guess what?  You can't
    feel your legs moving in the water.  This does cause the swimmer
    to kick faster (KPM) in an attempt to to gain the same leg stimula
    (sp).  This is pretty much a one shot deal, and only has this effect
    for a short time.
    
    As said in .5 the resistance is less, and does help in distance.
    
    
    John_who_still_does_not_know_where_the_rainbows_around_the_lights_come_from

>             <<< Note 1156.5 by NOVA::FISHER "Rdb/VMS Dinosaur" >>>
>                        -< Forget not the tennis ball! >-
>
>    Fuzz on a tennis ball makes it go faster.
>    
>    A former NASA engineer repositioned the dimples on a golf ball
>    to make it fly further.
    
    Both the fuzz and the dimples increase the drag of a ball, but when
    that's combined with backspin, they fly further because the spin
    creates a high pressure zone underneath the ball that keeps it in the
    air longer.
    
    So it's not really applicable to cycling - but maybe if we continually
    backpedal...
    
    
    Rod

    "Both the fuzz and the dimples increase the drag of a ball, ..."
    
    I've often thought I was just spinning my wheels anyway.
    
    ed

>    "Both the fuzz and the dimples increase the drag of a ball, ..."
    
Fudge. I grew my beard to hide my dimples, and now I find out I get drag 
either way. Just can't win.... time for an aero seatpost, I guess :-).

                                    ken

>    Both the fuzz and the dimples increase the drag of a ball...

I thought that it tripped the laminar flow into turbulent flow, thus
reducing the drag.

Is there an Aerodynamicist in the house?

-Jeff

    I shave my legs before races for mostly the reason's already cited:
    -- look cool
    -- legs run cooler
    -- easier to massage
    -- `road rash' heals better
    
    The major reason is because its a good way to get yourself psyched
    up for a race! You aren't gonna win if you aren't pysched!!
    
    Robb

                            -< Shaved Time or Legs >-

Bicyclists (male) shave their legs for the same reason that you find chrome on 
some engines.....it looks good (and fast).  All I know, is "Bat" Buchanan sure
looks better now that he shaved his legs.   When he crashed at lunch today, 
all the riders were commenting on his nice legs.  But how can you keep shaving 
with all that road rash.

    	So, what caused the crash?
    
    	Scott

RE-1
	Sounds like a reply for note 1047 in the making ;-)

TD

  <<< Note 1156.18 by CUPCSG::CRITZ "Greg LeMond wins: 2nd TdF, 2nd Worlds" >>>

    	>So, what caused the crash?
    	>
    	>Scott


Rapidly rotating pace line, 26 mph into a headwind, some cat II on steroids, 
severe oxygen debt, and the fact that he forgot to shave his legs this 
morning.....he caught a wheel.

    Unfortunately I didn't shave the top of my hip, my shoulder or my
    elbow.  The only scrapes on my legs are pretty minor.  Crack in the
    Giro front to back though.  

    I stopped over at my doctors to have it checked.  He said he rides to
    work but never wears a helmet.  Seemed kink of backwards me giving him
    a lecture on safety.

    I stopped wearing gloves a while ago and always worried that the first
    crash would take the whole palm of my hand out.  But I was still
    holding on the bars, so only one knuckle got it.

    Why did that pace line slow down so quick?  Must have been Gary's turn
    at the front.

              re:    <<< Note 1156.21 by VERVE::BUCHANAN "Bat" >>>
                   -< Should have shaved more than the legs >-

    >Why did that pace line slow down so quick?  Must have been Gary's turn
    >at the front.

Bat.....you must have hit your head pretty hard...I think you're 
hallucinating!

    	No hallucination, Gary.  Weren't you calling the sprint on Sunday
    instead of participating in it?  That was you standing there smirking
    as the steroid-crazed cat II roadie and the trackies smoked me, right?
    Hardly a heroic leadout - I'm inclined to believe that your tremendous
    decelerative powers took Mike down.
           
    					John
    
    (If this ration of merde doesn't get you into the weight room, nothing
     will.)

                     <<< Note 1156.23 by WLDWST::POLLARD >>>
                    -< A vote for the Batman's version... >-

John, have you been smokin' dope again?  Anyone who won't ride Mission at 
lunch because of a dumb 1:00 staff meeting, shouldn't be allowed in this notes 
file.  

O.K......Thursday morning at Gunn.  I'll work on my domestique-type lead outs. 

By the way, what does this have to do with shaved legs?

    No riding outside for me yesterday here in New England...  it was
    freezing out there!  (and windy too)

    - Jim

Since I'm starting to contemplate shaving my legs, I guess it's time to revive
this note.

Why am I thinking of shaving my legs?  I'm not sure; I can't recall any of the
guys in my club (Seven Hills Wheelmen) having shaved legs, so it isn't peer
pressure.  I've never had a crash, and since I don't race I don't expect my
luck to run out anytime soon (though I do wear a helmet).  I am planning on
participating (as a leader) in ride later this year that is advertised to have
end of the day massages;  Comments that shaved legs are easier to massage
probably has an encouraging effect.

My legs don't have a lot of hair on them, but they aren't hairless either.  I
presently shave my face every other day, and I don't believe that I would have
to shave my legs that often, so it wouldn't be too much of a hassel.

As you can see, I'm sitting firmly on the fence.  Does anybody have any new
arguments either for or against?

Rich

    
    	re: Does anyone have any arguments for or against
    
    For:      It will help to create the illusion that you look *fast*
    
    Against:  Those nubs are itchy growing back in and you may
    	      dread having to shave something besides your face
    	      every morning 
    
    		_Jerry_fence_sitting_since_he_had_to_shave_one_leg_for_surgery

I have to admit it. I shaved mine this year. Still have the beard though...

It started when I came home from work one night and found my route that I
commute on was sanded and oiled. YECH! Oilly sand was stuck to my legs and I
couldn't get it out of the hair on my legs. I was thinking of shaving them before
this anyways just for grins, but this was the push I needed to give it a try.
Out came the beard trimmer and off came the first layer of hair. Boy, what a
mess.  After the trim job I was chickening out. What did I get myself into I
thought as I looked at my two WHITE legs. These things stick out like new
sneakers, everyone is going to stare and point. Next came the shave. It took
forever. Now the regrets came fast and furious. When I was done I felt dumb for
even thinking about doing this. When I went out that night for fish and chips I
wore my cycling cap, just to make sure no one got the wrong impression.Sleeping
that night was tough. I could feel the sheets sticking to my legs like they
were wet. Putting on long pants the next morning felt totally wierd. But on the
first ride I felt great. My legs felt like they were cooler, washing the grime
off is easier and my wife don't mind giving me a massage like she did before.
Plus she would pull my hair on my legs before. OUCH!  I have now grown to like
having my legs shaved but hate it when the hair grows back and gets itchy. I
still hate shaving, but hate the itchy hair more. I have to shave them about
once every 6 days or so, or else.  

I wonder how the pros keep the hair off their legs during a long Tour???

Tom

    Some of the guys at the local racing club have started using those
    electric depilating machines.  They work with a flexible steel coil
    which rotates at high speed.  As it turns the coil opens on one side
    and closes on the other, thus grabbing and pulling out hairs by the
    roots.  They sting a bit for the first few times, but the advantage is
    that your legs stay hairless for longer, and when the hairs do grow
    back, it's not a stubble and it doesn't itch.  No razor nicks either.
    
    Richard

                        -< to shave or not to shave... >-


>As you can see, I'm sitting firmly on the fence.  Does anybody have any new
>arguments either for or against?

>Rich

For:
	They look good
	They feel great under suit pants
	They are conversation pieces at formal dinner parties
	They clean up nicely after a day of riding, sweating and getting 
	grubby
	Road rash is much easier to clean up (this one is important)
	They are cooler
	They keep my in-laws away
	They prevent cancer, heart attacks and in-grown toe nails
	Sex is nice (especially with someone else particiting)
	Less wind resistance
	When putting on sew ups the glue is easier to get off my legs

Against:
	The blood stains are hard to get off the tub (reminds me of a scene 
	from Psycho) 
	I have to shave every other day
	My socks fall down easier
	
Summary:  Bikers shave their legs for the same reason sports cars have chrome 
on the engine.....it looks good.  

>    Some of the guys at the local racing club have started using those
>    electric depilating machines.  They work with a flexible steel coil
>    which rotates at high speed.  As it turns the coil opens on one side

Do be careful if you try one o' these. My dad reported having seen an 
article about these which suggested that they could have unpleasant 
dermatological effects in some folks due to problems with 
regrowth/infection of the pulled-out hairs. Some women apparently have 
required treatments including plastic surgery to recover from the 
effects. I've noted a similar effect using a standard facial electric 
razor on me - my facial hair is really tough and tends to pull out 
rather than cut nicely. One trip over my face with an electric leaves my 
face looking like a road pizza for about 10 days; I'd imagine the 
depilating machines would have a similar effect on some folks. If you're 
tempted to try 'em, go for a small area at first until you're sure they 
work safely for you....
                             ken

    As one who has considered the pros and cons of shaving, my combination
    of dense, thick leg hair, very sensitive skin, and the tendancy to have
    ingrown type hair after close shaves on my face -- coupled with the
    complete absence of massage routine (I prefer stretching) and the
    social akwardness I would feel walking around with naked legs -- put me
    firmly on the side of no shaving.  Plus I would have to clean our
    shower drain.  But I sure don't look cool in the Cat IV peloton!
    
    
    
    
    
    

Shave at work and plug up DEC's drains!

I only massage my legs after very hard workouts.  I use the 10 second method
where you bend down and rub your legs while chanting the magical words, "God
damn my legs are sore"!

    Well, I did end up shaving my legs a couple of weeks ago.  I've found
    that I have to do it twice a week in order to keep them looking good.
    I've experienced some of the pros and some of the cons mentioned in .30
    since then.
    
    Rich