Conference noted::bicycle

> Why would I keep breaking rear spokes?  Was it lousy installation?

	If it breaks near the head, it is probably either a bad edge
	on the spoke hole or spokes inserted from the wrong side (on
	most hubs the direction doesn't matter).

	If it breaks near the middle, it might be too much tension.
    
> How do you insert the spoke in a rear wheel and maneuver it to correctly 
> position it?  It seems like it can't be done (although, I know is it 
> possible).  There must be a trick.  Can anyone shed any light on this?

	In many cases you must remove the freewheel.  In all cases
	you have to bend the spoke a little to get it woven in with
	the rest of the spokes.  If the spoke head is supposed to go on 
	the outside of the hub flange, you will have to bend the spoke
	quite a bit to get it through the flange and up BETWEEN the 
	other spokes.

	For a less strong repair, don't weave the new spoke in... just 
	insert it with the head on the inside of the hub flange and run 
	it straight to the rim hole.

	For the best results, take the wheel apart and rebuild it.  This
	might cure whatever was causing the breakages.

    For me, it was too much weight on a light gauge spoke set. I was
    breaking them on a regular basis until I had the wheel rebuilt with
    a heavier guage spoke. I don't remember the guage number; a good repair
    shop should be able to help there.
    
    Since the rebuild (last summer), I haven't broken any.
    
    Tom

    I used to break alot of spokes as well, and since then I go with
    14 gauge DT galvanized spokes only. [They are stronger than the
    stainless]
    
    A problem I had on one wheel was the holes were to big in the hub,
    causing the spokes to move alot, then break.  One of the holes was
    cracked through to the outside as well. 
    
    Robb

Going to heavy gauge spokes can actually WORSEN spoke breakage in some 
cases. I had some wheels long ago with some j.random hubs (don't recall) 
with rather small spoke holes in the flanges. 14 ga. straight spokes 
were poppin' like popcorn. 15/16 DB spokes stopped that right quick!

    OK, now what to do.
    
    I got it fixed again at Goodales.  But a couple of hundred miles
    later I popped another one.  Ron recommends a new wheel.  I don't
    know anything about wheels, except that a lot of people in this
    file build their own.  I don't want to do that.  So I need to bite
    the bullet and get a new wheel.
    
    Do I buy a pre-built wheel from Nashbar or Performance, or do I
    get one locally.  (I went down to Cat 1 at lunch and Paul is not
    taking any work for a few weeks, he's moving out of his store.)
    This is a rear wheel I'm talking about.
    
    I have a Wolber Type 58 now, recommended for heavy touring.  I
    think I would rather something built for training.  I never do any
    loaded touring and use the Cannondale ST500 for training and triathlons.

    Is it wise to get only one wheel?  Mail order seem to be sold only
    in sets.  Can I mix wheels?  How about different sizes.  (Wheels
    are 1 1/4 now, can I go to a 1 1/8 for a little more performance?)    
    
Any info would be appreciated.
    
    Bob
    

    re .6 - Anyone want to give me some wheel advice?
    
    Bob
    

    Cost, options, and quality are all reasons why people build their
    own wheels.  Consider your situation: 
    
    1. You really only need one wheel (shops and mailorder companies
       usually sell quality wheels in pairs, or if singles, usually FRONT
       wheels are what's left), or if two, you'd like different BACK
       wheels. 
    
    2. You have a good hub that you could reuse if you built your own (the
       price of new ones will be included in the built-up wheel cost) 
    
    3. You're insecure about the quality of a mass-produced wheel (if you
       built it yourself, you know what you have). 
    
    So you end up paying more, getting potentially lower quality, and
    getting some things that you don't need when you buy them pre-made. 
    
    On the plus side, of course, you save time and effort.  When I used to
    buy wheels pre-made, I got them from local shops.  I usually went in
    and asked if there were any leftovers from when people traded up on a
    new bike.  I got a $125 pair of GP4's from International Cycle that
    way, but it was the dead of winter, and a couple of years ago. Last
    year, I walked into Laughing Alley and spotted a pair of almost new
    used wheels for $100, including tires, hanging from the ceiling.  The
    rims weren't particularly strong, but they had Campy hubs.  In both
    cases, I did better than I would have through mail order -- but wait, I
    saw $80 pairs of wheels at the Nashbar outlet a few months ago.
    (They're gone now.) 
    
    In other words, you have to be prepared to scrounge.  If you buy
    used wheels, be VERY careful.  It's possible to make a wheel with
    a flat spot appear round until it's ridden, when it will revert
    to its permanently warped shape.
    
    As far as your requirements go, I don't have enough information to
    recommend something specific.  Yes, for sport riding, you can go to 1
    1/8, or even 1 inch wide wheels, but the choice of rim and spoke
    pattern will depend on your weight and riding style.  I'm heavy and I'm
    not gentle to the bike, so I need really strong wheels.  I've seen
    lighter, more adept riders go years on much more delicate/cheaper
    hardware.  Then there's the style factor -- since you're doing Tri's,
    you might want an aero rim.  Can you elaborate on your needs? 
    
    Hope this helps some,
    
    MATT

    Thanks for the input, and thanks to Ken McDonald for the phone call
    too.
    
    I'm 6'3", 215 lbs, and I'm not gentle on the bike.  I ride pretty
    hard and try to push a lot.  I got the touring Cannondale because
    of the heavy touring wheels, tires, and the very strong frame.
    
    I guess I need the lightest strongest wheel I can find.  Does this
    imply that I'm stuck with a touring wheel?
    
    Regarding strength.  What  is it about a wheel that makes it strong?
    Elsewhere they talk about heavier guage and/or more spokes don't
    necessarily make it stronger.  Is this correct?
    
    Bob
    

    The qualifications about number and size of spokes have to do with
    hub/wheel compatibility: if the hub wasn't designed for heavy spokes,
    it will break them.  Some people also claim that 32-spoke wheels are
    actually stronger than 36-spoke ones, because of the opposition of the
    spokes on the wheel.  (I tend to think that the greater distance
    between spokes along the rim increases the vulnerability when hitting
    something hard, making this a wash at best.)  Keeping these exceptions
    in mind, more spokes/ larger diameter/greater number of crosses is
    stronger.  That's why you see cross-4, 40-spoke, 14-gauge wheels on
    tandems.  The only place where you get equal strength for less weight
    is in choosing double-gauged spokes over single-gauged ones.

    The amount and strength of rim material is the other factor.  You're
    by no means restricted to touring wheels; racing wheels have to
    take punishment, too.  A fairly heavy, heat-treated rim like the
    Mavic MA40 is strong enough for most people.  Other people can give
    specific clincher recommendations.  My experience is mostly with
    tubulars.
    
    
    MATT

    What's a good touring rim? I've got Wolber 58s, but one's damaged
    and they're both worn, so I'm thinking of changing them.
    
    Suggestions very welcome.
    
    Rod