Conference terri::cars_uk

yes
you go to swansea, find someone that works for the dvlc, pay them money (bribe)
and they'll tell you!


the only other way to find out is if the vehicle with the numberplate you want
crashes into you then the police will tell you.


the dvlc have cracked down quite heavily on letting out addresses because of
the value of cherished numbers- even ones that seem quite standard

the police have to have a legitimate reason to trace a number these days


...art

Arrange a visit to the local police station for some school kids.  To
demonstrate their lightning efficiency, the policeperson escorting the kids will
ask them their parents' car numbers, then proceed to tell them what the cars
are, where they live, etc.  All you have to do is get one of the kids to ask
about the number you are interested in.

Scott ;-)

    Also, if you know someone who works for the AA who has access to
    these things, the AA is permitted to request this information from
    the DVLC.  I know that Legal Services can do it, possibly Insurance
    too.  They have to fill in special enquiry forms and the turn-around
    is about four weeks, dependent upon the efficiency of the DVLC.
    

    I've heard in passing that one is able to choose the numbers and
    letters that constitute the new H'reg plate.  Is this true - if so how
    does one go about it ?
    
    Dave.

All I know is that your local friendly dealer will let you choose a plate from
his "advance allocation", as has always been the case.  The letters denote in
which area the car was registered, and I think the numbers are allocated
sequentially.  So I doubt if this rumoured free-for-all is true...

Scott

    I chose my number plate last week from a BMW dealer.
    All the number plates were Hxxx FLA, where xxx ranged from 300 to 700.
    I was one of first 'lucky ones' and ended up with H432 FLA !
    
    Not exactly exciting eh !
    
    I was informed that DVLC had taken out most of the good numbers like
    318, 320, 535, etc cos they can sell them for more. The good ones that
    they did allow, were picked and reserved for the demo cars !
    
    Talk about putting the customer first, I suppose having a suitable
    number plate on the demo cars helps to sell them later.
    
    Raj
    
    

    I'm an American who is facing a possible temporary assignment to the UK
    for several months. DEC policies entitle me to take my family. DEC will
    put us up in a furnished house and provide us with 1 car.
    
    I would like for my spouse to have a car while there, so I was thinking
    of buying a "cheap" used car and then selling it when we leave. Even if
    I took a considerable loss on the car it would still be cheaper than a
    hire car.
    
    I checked this notes file to scope out the used car situation and I was
    immediately struck with two observations. The first one is that cars
    are not cheap in the UK! The second realization is that I have no idea
    what the registration system is all about. What is this business about
    "H" registrations and "Y" registrations, etc... Am I to understand that
    the plates stay with the car when it is sold? Who cares what the numer
    is? Why is it mentioned in the adverts? Could someone give me a quick
    explanation of the registration process, or give me an address to write
    to to get a brochure or something?
    
    My next question does not relate to this note, but... what should I
    expect to pay for a car with around 60K + miles on it, say post 1985,
    basic transportation. I don't know what is considered basic
    trasnportation over there. Any reccomendations? A Mini?
    
    Any insights would be most appreciated.
    
    floyd.

A cars registration letter 'H' or 'Y' refers to the year of registration.  A car
that has a 'Y' as its last letter was registered between August 81 - Aungust 82 
So its ten years old (or so)  A 'H' registered car 'H' as its first letter was
registered between August 90 - August 91.  (New cars now have 'J' resistration).
A cars registration stays with it for life.  Hope this clears thing up a bit,
and as for the position of the letter last or first, we changed the format of 
registration plates in August 82 so the year letter is now the first letter on
the registration.



				Mike 

>    My next question does not relate to this note, but... what should I
>    expect to pay for a car with around 60K + miles on it, say post 1985,
>    basic transportation. I don't know what is considered basic
>    trasnportation over there. Any reccomendations? A Mini?
    
"Basic" in the UK is probably more basic than you'd mean in the US, at
least in terms of engine size. A basic car in the UK would probably have an
engine size of 1.0 - 1.4 litres, rather than the more standard (for the US) 
1.8 - 2.0 litre engine for cars in this category.  To qualify this a bit 
though, a smaller-engined car usually has better fuel consumption (at $3+/
gallon this is important), and also, as the vast majority of cars in the UK 
have a manual gearbox, power isn't sapped the way it is in cars with automatic 
transmissions. If your wife wants to drive an automatic, especially one in 
the small runabout category, she could find them extremely thin on the ground
in Britain. 

Expect to pay about double US prices for a car in the UK. Japanese cars are 
noticeably more expensive, thanks to EC import restrictions that are heavily
supported by French and German auto manufacturers.

John

    
    The current price of 4 star petrol(gas) actually equates to $3.84 per
    imperial gallon, I think the US gallon is about 10% smaller than the
    imperial gallon. (Assuming $1.68 to the UK pound).
    
    Many 5 or 6 year old cars cannot use unleaded which is a bit cheaper.
                                    
    Jeff K.

    
    I would think that what you are thinking of in terms of basic runabout
    is a Ford Escort (Its pretty BASIC in the states)
    
    I just helped a friend of mine pay for a 4 year old car with approx 30K
    miles on the clock, and he paid 3000 pounds for it, though it was in
    Very good condition.
    
    Mind you, the European Escort, is a bit more comfortable than the
    states version, and wth only a 1.4 engine is still far for performant
    than the US version.
    
    Just a help,
    
    Steve

Having just gone the other way (last year), I can certainly attest to prices in
the UK being higher than the US!  However, if you shop around you can still find
bargains, especially if they're more than 5/6 years old.  Watch out for rust
though!  

To clear up a few other points ....

Regsitration plates don't *have* to stay with the car in the UK, but they
usually do.

The US gallon is 20% less than the UK gallon, 128 fl oz vs 160. (Our Festiva
does 52 mpg US, which is about 65 mpg UK, for example.  It also only cost
us $5310 *NEW*. Try getting a Fiesta for that!)

Wait for the pollution!  Catalytic convertors and other emissions stuff are not
yet prevalent in Europe.  It is VERY noticeable, even when coming from such a
polluted environment as DC.

Buying a car in the UK is SO simple compared with here, but that's another 
story ....

Brian

	To rat-hole only slightly, I'm interested that you mentioned the
	pollution.  When I went to LA, I was astonished at the pollution;
	horrified that you couldn't see the mountains for yellow fug.  So,
	Reading seemed fairly civilised.  However, during last summer there
	was tobbacco coloured haze dancing around the M4 most of the time.
	Outside of London and the South East, I've not noticed car pollution.
	Nor in New England, for that matter...

	Dave

    Hi Floyd,
    
    Dont forget about insurance if you buy a car. In the UK you get LARGE
    discounts if you dont make claims (increasing each year). A newcomer to
    insurance usually wont get the maximum discount, but you may be able to
    get a bigger discount if you can get a letter from your US insurance
    company saying that you have not had any claims for x years.
    
    Also you should get an International Driving licence - that will allow
    you to drive in this country for up to a year without having to get a
    UK licence (although you should at least get a copy of the 'Highway
    Code' - a book which lists the main rules for driving in the UK).
    
    Andrew

How easy is it to get an International Drivers License?

Re: .15

> The US gallon is 20% less than the UK gallon, 128 fl oz vs 160. (Our Festiva

The US gallon is exactly 5/6 of the Imperial (UK) gallon.  US fluid ounces
are bigger then UK fluid ounces.

Re: .17

I believe that you can use your foreign licence for a year.  An International
Driving Licence is not necessary in the UK.

jb

    
    
    The AA will make you an international driving licence on production
    of your UK licence, a picture and some dosh. Takes about 5 mins.
    
    R.

I get a good driver discount here, as well.  All I had to do was bring over 
a letter from my UK insurers to show I'd had at least 5 years of claim free
driving , and Bob's your uncle.  Probably works the other way, too?

FWIW, I'm paying $500 a year for the Alfa, $610 for the Audi and $660 for the
Ford.  The Ford does include full business cover though!  Not bad for 3 cars
in the highest rated area of the US (next to New York).

Brian

    I'm curious about this international drivers licence. I've hired cars
    in several countries including the UK, and I've always used my good old
    "Live Free Or Die" New Hampshire driver's licence. It's good enough for
    Avis, although I've never been done for speeding.
    
    Just how long can you live and drive in the UK with a New Hampshire
    driver's licence?
    
    P.S. thanks for all the good advice.
    
    floyd.

I was told, when I attended college in Britain for a term, that my New Hampshire
license would be good enough for the same length as my Visa (6 months)

I was urged, however, to keep my passport with me when driving with under the
New Hampshire License.

-Al

    I think a foreign licence is good for 30 days in Massachusetts (used to
    be longer but now reduced). The rules seem fairly arbitrary. When I was
    in the US I got a US driving licence (necessary to write checks, buy
    liquor etc). They did not take my UK one, but I had to take a driving
    test (I think they would exchange another states licence for a Mass
    licence without the test). I think the UK also make you take a driving
    test (unless you have a licence from some other EC country).
    
    Andrew

    
    In the UK, after been registered to drive a car for a year (i.e.
    insured) then you must get a British Licence, by taking the test.
    
    Steve

>>One year then take the test
         
Wrong!

You must obtain UK driving licence within 6 months of your arrival.  However,
you *might* be able to claim date of arrival as the last date you entered the
country and got your passport stamped.  Bit dodgy, though, as immigration have
a record of your physical date of entry for residence purposes, and their 
records are linked to the police system for alien tracking purposes.

In the US, most states are pretty much the same - you have to exchange you old
state licence for the new one within 30 days of settling in the new state.  You
must also re-register your car(s) in the same time limit.  Lots of people
don't do so, though, especially if (like in MD) it means you have to pay the
registration tax ......  Interesting that you can't buy and register a car in
most states without having a drivers licence, and you can't get a drivers 
licence without a social security number, and you can't get one of those without
a green card, or similar, and .......  *EXCEPT* in goold old "live free or die"
state, who really do mean *free* much more than any other I've come across.

BTW, in order to keep a Swiss licence, couldn't you just tell the DVLC that you
"lost" it and need a replacement?  Naughty!

brian

>>BTW, in order to keep a Swiss licence, couldn't you just tell the DVLC that you
>>"lost" it and need a replacement?  Naughty!

Ouch! Naughty Brian! As long as the DVLC don't check your address, then I don't
see why not - I'll let you know if ever I need it...

Steve 

	Talking of naughties ! Here's one !

	When I knew that I was going to be done for various violations,
	I sent off to the DVLC to say that my licence was lost, although
	it wasn't. They sent me a duplicate which I duly handed in at court.
	This duplicate was then re-issued with the various naughty things 
	detailed on it.

	I meanwhile went to work overseas, and the authorities there only
	issued driving licences on 'clean' British licences. Lucky I had 
	my supposedly lost one.

	Alex

	PS This happened way back in '78 so I don't know if it would work now.

    
    Re -.1
    
    Yeah, then they find out, and you get done for all kinds of things,
    especially if you're a foreigner (look what's happened to Gachot in
    F1), like: "falsifying an official record", "presenting a false identity
    card" (if the country you were in uses driving licences for that
    purpose), "obtaining a driving licence (in the new country) by
    deception, etc. etc. [someone like Jeremy Barker will be able to give
    me the proper charges, but you get the idea....]
    
    You'd probably have been imprisoned/deported at the least, and even if
    you got off that, they would never let you in the country again,
    especially if that country was the US of A.
    
    Oh, and you probably weren't insured while driving for the duration of
    your stay, either....
    
    
    Stephen D.
                                                

    Re -.1
    
>    Yeah, then they find out, and you get done for all kinds of things,

	How on earth are they going to find out ?
	I worked in 'third world' countries, so I don't suppose they
	are linked by computer etc to the UK. 

	Mind you I don't know if DVLC etc are linked even to the rest of
	Europe, or are they ?

	Alex

>>	How on earth are they going to find out ?


*They* probably won't, but your conscience should have been enough to prevent
you from participating in such (illegal?) deception.

Obtaining a duplicate licence when another authority holds your original, such
as Switzerland or Germany, is one thing, but deliberate deception is quite
another.

There is one good thing about being overseas though, the points on my UK licence 
will have "timed out" before I get beck, so I can get it cleaned up when I
establish my new address there :-)  (I got 3 points for doing 40 in a 30 limit)

Brian

While in the UK the last two weeks, I drove 4 (well 5 actually but I don't
suppose you'll be looking at a '53 Sunbeam Alpine) cars. A Sierra 2.0, a
Fiesta 1.3, a Metro 1.0 and a Toyota Tercel 1.4.

The Sierra was the best, by far, and had automatic transmission. The Tercel
also had automatic and was ok but lacked power in the 40-60mph range, kicking
down got results but with lots of noise. Also the car needed power steering
as it was very heavy feeling and my hands actually got sore. On the plus side
it was very solid feeling and handled fine. The Fiesta was very peppy, more 
so than the Toyota, but not as plush nor as well made. Fun car though, with a
nice manual transmission. The Metro was pretty basic, manual transmission with
manual choke as well. Gearbox was vague, engine noisy, lacked power. It is
my sister-in-laws kid fetcher/grocery getter and I guess ok for that but 
marginal on the open road.

    Does anyone know if you can register a car in joint names
    (ie Husband & Wife) ????
    
    Roy

	Yes you can.  The car gets registered with joint owners.
	The Marlin is registered as owned by me and my wife.  
	However, the insurance is in one name.

	Dave

    Thanks Dave for your reply.
    
    How did you fill in the form as it only has one field for "mr/mrs" &
    "full name" ?
    
    Roy

	I can't remember, but I think that it's something like

	"Mr D A Rusling and Ms G M Clough"

	Unfortunately, I'm in the States and cannot check my
	documents.  If you can wait 4 weeks, I'll check when	
	I get back.

	Dave

    A vehicle registration document is not a statement of ownership.  The
    document only identifies the registered keeper who can be different
    from the owner.
    
    Nev

While this is being discussed, how is it that people who have lease cars
get away with not being the registered keeper?

jb

    I guess PHH/Hertz is the owner, and Digital is the keeper. Your
    agreement to use the car is with Digital - not PHH/Hertz.
    
    Steve
    

    Hello,
    
    Can you please let know how/where I can get my french car registered in
    the UK and what costs are associated with this.
    
    It's a 1000cc Polo 1988
    
    Kind regards, Patrick

    I'm certain this has been thoroughly discussed in EURO_MOTORING...
    
    Anyway, if I recall correctly, on import at port-of-entry, one
    presents oneself and one's car to the customs officers on duty. They
    will then assess what duty is liable, if any, and said duty must be
    paid immediately (it used to be cash only, but they take credit cards
    now). There is no appeal, and the sum liable is entirely at
    the hands of the individual one speaks to. On payment of duty, one
    takes the paperwork to one's nearest LVLO, then if it's required,
    scuttles off the obtain an MOT. If it's not required, and if the
    appropriate insurance has been arranged (I'm fairly sure this is a
    requirement of import), the LVLO will issue a tax disk. Next stop, the
    new plates.
    
    I'm pretty sure that since 1994, if VAT has already been paid somewhere
    in the EU, then that's that; import duty is no longer applicable to EU
    registered cars. So, a kosher French-registered car should not have any
    duty liable on it.
    
    I suggest you 'phone HM C&E somewhere in Britain, and a) check the
    above is still true, and b) ask for notice 3A which (well, it did
    anyway!) covers the import of a personal motor vehicle.
    
    Cheers, Laurie.

    Laurie,
    
    Thanks for the information. I now need to find out a bit more from the
    import VAT side.
    
    Kind regards,Patrick

    How can you find out who owns a particular number plate and whether it
    is for sale?
    
    I would like to buy a personalised plate for my parents 40th
    Anniversary.....
    
    Ideally A15 TAN.... 
    
    Xtine