Conference misery::feline

    Oh Boy!  Do I have experience in this subject.
    
    1.  Is there another cat getting into the house.  There has to be a
        reason why your kittie has taken up spraying, and that may be it.
    
    2.  Make sure you wash thoroughly any area that has been sprayed with 
        one of the chemical altering substances sold for such purposes, like 
        Odormute, or Natures Miracle.  And the same if you find any spray 
        outside the house. This will discourage further spraying from
        either furry party.
     
    Kitty is marking his turf, probably because another cat has intruded on
    his patch and done the same.  
    
    I guess that until our kitties evolve unto CAT (see the PBS program Red 
    Dwarf note) and uses cologne spray to make things his, we are stuck with 
    this problem.
    
    
    The VERY best of luck.

    Have you had him checked by the vet? He could be having urinary tract
    problems. A few years ago one of my cats suddenly spraying and it 
    turned out to be cystitis. After treatment by the vet and a change 
    in diet, he hasn't done it since.
    
    Linda

    Has something in his life changed, like you are perhaps away
    more often?
    

    
    
    	Thanks for all the ideas...  I don't think that any other cats have
    gotten into the house.  I will definately take him to the vet as well
    as spraying the areas with the chemicals you recommend.  
    
    -becky-

    Is your cat an indoor/outdoor cat?  Many times a cat that is allowed
    outside learns to spray to make his territory known to other cats
    outside.  When that cat comes in the house, he doesn't understand that
    this instinctual behavior isn't appropriate indoors.  
    
    Jo

    Last night I let into the house the Little Grey Cat that I talked
    to Jan about on Sunday.  (He's my possibly about to be fourth cat,
    sigh.)  He tentaively stepped into the kitchen and checked it out;
    I had the other cats on the other side of the closed kitchen door.
    After he'd stolled around for a few minutes and sprayed (extremely tiny
    amount) in about 5 or 6 places, he wandered outside again (I
    probably upset him following him around with gobs of paper towels and
    Nature's miracle :-)
    
    I've never had a feral be quite so, how shall I saw this, generous in
    marking the house.  I'm wondering if there's any hope that this
    can be brought under control if he's altered.  He marks the outside of
    the house almost every night when I feed him.  The good news is he
    seems very healthy and does well outside.
    

    
>    I've never had a feral be quite so, how shall I saw this, generous in
>    marking the house.  I'm wondering if there's any hope that this
>    can be brought under control if he's altered.  He marks the outside of
>    the house almost every night when I feed him.  The good news is he
>    seems very healthy and does well outside.
    
my experience in this does not make promising news....I never could get
one male that I rescued and neutered to stop spraying.  I finally had to
place him with a family in a more rural area - as an outdoor-only cat.
He didn't live as long as I hoped, but it was all we could do.  I think
the factors that may help are:

	youth.  if he is young, he may not spray once he is neutered and
	kept away from challenges for female company.

	behavior of the other cats.  If the other cats spray, he will
	continue to spray.  If you can keep him in an environment where
	noone else sprays, then he may forget to spray.

The first priority is to get him neutered...FAST.  The longer you wait, the
less success you may have.

of course, then there's Van Gogh - he seems to be doing fine.

    Karen,
    
    Most of the FIRM are neutered adult feral males; just about all used to
    spray outside; the only one that didn't stop upon neutering was Spiro
    (and mild ovaban therapy for a short perios of time stopped that).
    
    Deb

    LGC would actually be my fourth feral (former) male, and the first one,
    Pussycat, was several years old when I acquired him;  so was Sweetie.
    I'm just amazed at this 6 times in 4 mins business.  Pussycat initially
    did it occasionally, and Sweetie and Little Bit have never done it, to the
    best of my recollection.  (It's my former female, Holly who zaps the
    house to tell me she wants to reign in solitary splendor.)  Well, it
    won't stop me from going forward;  I'm just surprised.
           

    That is typical of whole males (the six times in four minutes).  They
    use only a few drops each time, but make sure the place is well marked.
    My stud boys usually do this when I clean their cages too well (makes
    you feel like you shouldn't have bothered!), and when I first brought
    in Mush, he did this as soon as I let him loose in his new quarters.
    After that initial going over, Mushy didn't spray very much at all.
    
    Jo

    As D stated...I guess I have been luck with Van Gogh (the old man).  
    Right after he got fixed he continued to spray...and let me tell you
    it was not "tiny" amounts...I swear he emptied his bladder!!
    But as of the last few months he has stopped this nasty habit..
    atleast it gives me hope that he will become less aggresive too!
    
    My sister has two young neutered males...who continute to spray!
    (sigh).  One is so bad (Pacer) that his nickname is Pissy Pacer!!
    
    Sandy

    Unfortunately, I have a neutered male who wasn't feral, was
    neutered at the proper age (to the best of my knowledge - I didn't
    own him but was told he was neutered when I adopted him) and still
    sprays - not constantly but often enough that it is a problem.  We've
    tried everything with him.  Multiple litterboxes, reducing the number
    of felines in the house, giving him extra attention, rigorously
    cleaning up after him (some people vaccuum every week - I clean the
    carpet :-), hormone therapy (turned him into a big fat couch potatoe),
    everyone at the vet's office knows Misha!  I'm now trying to find him
    a home somewhere where he can "be a man" and it isn't much of a
    problem.  I hope I can.  I wish you luck with the little guy, give him
    a chance if you can, they all deserve that.
    
    Mary-Michael

    We had to use Hormone treatment as well; twice.  It turned Guido into a 
    german sausage shape rather than the lean bouncer he was before.  The 
    plus side has been that he has been the most loving of any cat I have 
    lived with and he doesn't spray inside anymore.
    
    

    
    	Well, Merlin and I went to the vet on Saturday.  He is now taking
    Valium to (hopefully) get him to stop spraying.  We started the
    treatment on Saturday, Sunday he was so stoned that he was falling all
    over the place but was still able to spray the speaker!  This is not
    fun!!

    Has the vet tried Ovaban on Merlin yet?  It is a hormone, and it won't
    make him stoned like the valium does.  If the valium doesn't work, it
    is worth a try.
    
    I have used it on my Winston from time to time.  He starts to spray
    when my Birman girls go into season.
    
    Jo

    Unfortunately, if it's not hormonal, Ovaban doesn't help too much.
    Misha is on Ovaban now, and it doesn't even seem to making a dent.
    Misha, on the other hand, is making a *big* dent in his food dish,
    and my already fluffy feline is up to 17 pounds after only two 
    weeks (he gained two pounds)!  
    
    If its behavorial, try to find anything that's changed in his
    environment that he might be upset with.  You may need to go
    back a ways.  For Misha, placing him in a home where he is the
    only cat will be the best for him.  
    
    I feel for you.  I'm going through this now with Misha, while
    trying to place him and hide him from the landlord, since he
    was supposed to be gone by now, and I don't have the heart to
    bring him to a shelter :-(
    
    Mary-Michael 

    I couldn't find a more sensible place for this  and it is related.
    
    I have 4 cats (3 male, 1 female) all of them altered.  My 10 year old
    male siamese is top cat, the two other males don't get on well
    together.  I think this is because the 8 year old foreign oriental black 
    (Havanna) has no brain, is afraid of everyghing and lets the 3 year old
    brown tabby moggy boss him around. The female (sister to the brown
    tabby moggy) ignores them all and is a law unto herself. Though, she
    does enjoy terrorising her brother now and then.
    
    The problem is that someone insiste on peeing/spraying on the kitchen
    cabinets by the microwave.  It stopped for a while after the vet put the 
    two younger males on Ovarid twice a week. I don't think it is the
    siamese that does this.  There has been pee on the cabinet every day
    this week (they are really clean now!) and I'm really fed up with it.
    We've had this problem for some time now.  
    
    The question is; is there any way of marking each cat's urine with a
    different colour so I know who is going where? Is there any sort of 
    harmless tablet that will colour their urine?  
    
    Disclaimer: This was my husband's idea. I think the answer will end up
    being "no" but I promised I'd ask anyway.
    
    LaDonna
                           

    
    
    	Merlin has been on the Valium for a week and a half now.  He seems
    to be a little less stoned than in the beginning, and certainly is not
    having any trouble spraying!!  I had washed all the walls and sprayed
    some stuff the vet gave me all over (it is supposed to get rid of the
    urine smell), only to have Merlin go absolutely haywire and spray ten
    times as much!!  I will be calling the vet by the weeks end if I don't
    see a difference.  I will ask him about the hormones when I call.  If
    you know of anyone who might be willing to give Merlin a chance if this
    doesn't work out please let me know!!!
    
    -becky-

    LaDonna, have you cleaned the sprayed area with one of those enzyme
    cleaners that neutralizes the smell of urine?  That's necessary since
    cats can smell what humans can't.
    

    In the case of my stud cats, removing the smell of their spray just
    causes them to replace it.  That may be what you are experiencing with
    Merlin.
    
    When I clean out the stud cages, I always expect that my males will
    want to immediately spray the cleaned cage, so I hang a hospital
    "chuck" in their favorite spot for them to spray on.  I leave it there
    and then replace it the next time.  The chuck absorbs the spray so that
    it doesn't pool in their pen and either erode the cage or get all over
    the place, but it does nothing for the smell.  In my case, being a
    breeder with whole males, I expect a certain amount of male urine odor,
    it comes with the territory.  
    
    You might try something like this yourself.  Try taping up a chuck or
    disposable diaper (no gathers) to the favorite spot and see if the cat
    isn't just content to spray that rather than ruining your house.  It
    might be the kind of compromise you both can live with.
    
    Jo

    
    Re: .19  enzyme scent removers
    
    Been there, done that.  I sometimes think I'm keeping the "Odour
    Eliminator" people in business by myself! At 5 pounds for half a liter
    it is quite pricy.
    
    LaDonna
    
    

    
    
    	I would be more than willing to put up a diaper for Merlin to spray
    on if there were only a few "favorite" areas.  The truth of the matter
    is that there are more like 100 favorite places that he chooses to
    claim as his own!!!  I also am keeping the odour eliminator folks in 
    business.  Spraying the entire house is now a part of my weekly
    cleaning routine!!  This is very frustrating!!!

    Pick a spot and try the diaper thing.  I have found with my stud males
    that they get into the habit of only spraying certain areas.  I am not
    sure if they learned to do it that way, or if that is just how stud
    males do things.  I do know that several breeder friends tell me that
    their males are the same way.  Just hang a diaper or two and maybe he
    will get the message.
    
    Jo

    
    Hi,

I need help!!  My housemate and I have four fixed cats, three males and one
female, and one of them is spraying (primarily by the front and back
doors).  Before we can try correcting the problem, we have to figure out
which one is doing it.  All four cats stay indoors and eat hard low ash
food. Here's a little background on each of them:

  Buddy is a 20 lb. 7 year old male.  He's very friendly and easy going.
  He has adjusted very well to new environments (when we moved) and new
  pets in the home.  He seems to have a "more-the-merrier" attitude.

  Dustin is a 14 lb. 3 year old male.  He's very affectionate with people,
  but can be very aggressive with the other animals.  I even suspect he has
  bitten and broken the skin on Buddy's back a couple of times.  Dustin has
  been treated in the past for a urinary tract infection. He also has a
  strange habit of dragging clothing, blankets, and towels around the house.
  We have seen him mount these items on occasion.

  Mork and Mindy are from the same litter.  They are about 1 1/2 years old.
  Mork is the most aloof of the four, but will lay in your lap on
  occassion.  Mork started spraying before he was neutered at 6 months.
  The spraying stopped after he was fixed.  He's our first guess, but we
  can't be certain it is him.

  Mindy is the female.  Although she is fixed, she has recently been going
  in heat.  Well, it sure seems like she's going in heat. For about a week
  she'll cry, roll around on the floor in front of the males, and so on.
  She always has to be on my lap or sleeping with me.  However, she is
  very skittish with company.  Actually, we don't even see her when there
  is company at the house.

We recently brought a couple of Yorkie pups home.  I'm sure that doesn't
help the situation.

Does anyone have any suggestions of which cat is spraying or how we might
go about figuring that out?

donna

                                                                        

    I've heard that there's some additive that you can get and add to a
    cat's food, and then their urine will show up colored or some such. 
    (I'm really hazy about this.)  You might ask your vet about it.  The
    idea is that you do this with each cat in turn until you find the one
    in need of help.

    Two different things may be happening...the female may be spraying
    while she is in heat.  Or the female being in heat could be upseting
    the males and causing them to spray.  Best way to fix the problem may
    be to spay the female and see if the spraying continues.
    
    Jo

but Jo, .24 says that all 4 cats have been spayed/neutered.

    But Romberg, it also says that even though the female has been spayed
    she has recently been going into season.  So I thought that maybe they
    didn't get everything during the spay.
    
    Jo

Gee, what can they leave behind that can cause "heat"?  Perhaps the vet can
suggest something hormonal to help her thru these trying times.....

Mar

    Sometimes just a little piece of tissue can be left behind which will
    stimulate the heat cycles.  Happened to a friend of mine's cat a few
    years ago.
    

    
    Sounds like the first thing I should do is have the female checked out.
    I'll also ask about the additive.  Thanks for your help.
    
    donna
    

    I could use some advice on a problem I'm having:
    
    I recently adopted two female kittens.  They are now about 4 1/2 
    months old.  My older cats at first were a little annoyed, but are 
    putting up with them.
    
    I had been fostering these kittens since they were 5 weeks old,
    and had them confined to one room with a litterbox.  They were always
    very good about using the litterbox and never missed.
    
    After I officially adopted them, I set them loose in my house.  My
    older cats' litterbox is down cellar, and there's a catdoor in the
    cellar door.  We figured they were too small to figure out how to
    go through it, so I put a small litterbox just for them in the
    bathroom.  Well, my 16 lb. cat, Pretzel, decided it was a neat idea
    and started using it (getting most of his pee outside the box), so
    I quickly trained the kittens how to go down cellar and got rid of
    the upstairs litterbox.  They got the hang of it and used the box 
    down cellar with no problems for about 2 weeks.
    
    Then all of a sudden, one of them peed on the bed two nights in a
    row (while we were in it!  don't you just love kittens sometimes...)  
    We're not sure which one it was, because both of them were in the 
    bed and the lights were out.  I figured it was because there weren't 
    enough litterboxes for 5 cats, so I added another one.  That seemed to
    cure the problem for another two weeks or so.
    
    Well, last night, I smelled dry urine on a blanket I had on my
    recliner, so someone is again peeing on the blankets.
    
    I realize it may be a urinary infection, but if it were, wouldn't
    the kitten be peeing outside the box every day?  Why just every two
    weeks?  And if it's a behavioral problem, would a 4 month old kitten
    already be acting that way?  I always thought kittens were a lot
    more adaptable than older cats, and wouldn't be that fussy about
    things.
    
    Would it be worth it to have both kittens checked out for urinary
    problems?  That would involve either me trying get urine samples
    from both of them (yah, right), or having them both stay overnight
    at the vets so that they can get the samples.
    
    Or does it sound like behavioral problems instead?
    
    thanks for listening.  I expected problems like this to come from
    my older cats - not the kittens!
    
    Pam

    Onyx did this shortly after I adopted him.  I'd have whoever is
    doing it checked just for good measure.  For me it finally took
    a major undertaking of being sure I had every little pee scent
    removed from the bed before he quit doing it.  I had to wash all
    bedding and I added Nature's Miracle to the wash water and I 
    doused the mattress with it.
    
    I wondered at times if he was having a problem with the color.
    The litter boxes are light blue-gray.  The comforter at the time
    was the exact same color.  Recently he has pee'd on one of those
    round cat toys with the ball inside that is the same exact color
    and on a light blue cat bed.  Seems like an odd theory I know but 
    it seems to fit his problem.
    
    If you can't break the kitten of the habit fairly quickly it might
    take some intense litterbox retraining (which to me means confining
    kitty in a small space with the litterbox so that they're forced to
    use it rather than pee in their living space).
    
    (your mileage may vary)
    
    Jan 
    

    Pam...my guess is they are just too young to have to hold their
    pee until they get ALLLLLL they way down cellar.   Kittens are
    sometimes over anxious (as you know now...) and don't have time
    to pee because they are having so much fun.   So...they wait until
    they really have to go...but by then it might be too late to run
    all the way downstairs.
    
    You might want to put the litterbox back in a conveneint spot 
    for them....(not you!!) until they get a little older!!!
    
    Kittenhood...don't you just love it!!!!  I still can't wait until
    the day they attack your beautiful dried flower arrangement!!!!
    (giggle giggle). 
    
    Sandy

    Sandy - you're a pain!  ;-)  Don't give Lily and April any ideas
    about my flowers - they're still looking good - don't need any
    kitty teeth chewing on them!! ;-0
    
    I think you might be right about them "holding it" - didn't we
    all do that as kids!!  I hope that's the problem.  I really hate
    putting another litterbox upstairs (especially when ALL the cats
    will want to use it!), but if it will break the habit it will
    be worth it.
    
    I'll give it a try before getting them tested.  I really don't
    think it's a urinary problem - I haven't seen blood in the urine
    and it's not a constant thing.
    
    thanks for the advice!
    Pam
    
    

    Giggle Giggle....Pam has the most best behaved adult cats I
    have ever seen....and then she adopted Lily and April who
    are full of vinegar...now the fun begins!!!!
    
    I'd also wash your bedspread/blankets with Natures Miracle too..
    just to make sure all the scent is gone.  You can buy a BIG bottle
    at Pet Supply for about $6.99!!!
    
    Sandy 

    Hmmm.....a behaviourist at Tufts told me that cats "break training"
    always for a reason.  Your mission is to figure out what that mission
    is!!!  Cats mark their territory by urinating on what they consider
    their own property.  Julie is a classic case of this.  I (and my
    bed...or is it HER bed) are hers.  She allows, upon occasion, others to
    sleep on HER bed.  When she gets fed up, she poops on the bed.  When
    she gets really mad, she pees.  Unfortunately, we're at the poop stage
    now, which means if I don't do something about renewing her Valium
    perscription soon, I'll be at the pee stage, which I find less than
    appealing.
    
    At 4 months, it's hard to tell why one of them is peeing.  I think it
    might be that they don't like the current litter box arrangement.  I
    dunno....heck, if I knew why, I'd have my own little problem solved!!
    Some day, I'll be able to figure Julie out and what a treat that will
    be!!
    
    Mary, who ought to own stock in Nature's Miracle...
    

    Well, I cleaned both litterboxes out last night, and there was
    no pee this morning (none that I found, anyway!).  Maybe they're
    just trying to tell me the litterboxes aren't clean enough!
    
    Hmm, I'll have to keep a better eye on them from now on.
    
    thanks for the advice!
    Pam

    
    
    
    I have had the same problem with my cats.  The reasons that I was able
    to conjur up were the following.  1.  They didn't like the litter
    (sometimes) so I changed it to a litter they liked (all the time).  2. 
    The litterboxes weren't clean enough.   3.  They were in heat at 5
    months.  The first two were easy enough to fix.  The last one had to
    wait until they got fixed....It was a loooooong month...
    
    michele (precious, princey, pookie, pickles and pepper)

    Well, so far so good.  I'm being extra careful and scooping out the
    boxes twice a day and so far no more pee in the bed or blankets
    (thanks goodness).
    
    I guess I just adopted two very fastidious kittens!
    
    Pam

We are having a problem with a neighbor's cat spraying our house. We have a
family room in our basement, with a slider that opens to our backyard. Up
until a couple months ago, our cats (indoor only) were allowed access to the
entire house, including the family room. Then we started noticing "the smell"
in the family room, and discovered that someone's cat had sprayed the
outside of the slider. Since the room smelled so bad, we blamed our cats too,
figuring that seeing the neighborhood cat caused one of ours to spray
(yes, ours are fixed/neutered). We cleaned the slider, got rid of most of
the odor, and now keep the door to the family room closed so that our cats
can't go in there. The problem is that the outdoor cat keeps spraying our
slider! Somehow the odor is penetrating into our family room. There are many
cats that roam our yard, so we don't know which one is the culprit.
Any ideas on how to get the cat to stop spraying our house? 

Thanks,

Lisa

    Hi Lisa...
    
    Tis the time of the year when all the strays are out marking
    their territory.  I watch all my strays eat on my porch...and
    then go spray every tire and bush in my yard!  I swear sometimes
    they are having a spraying contest amongst them!!!!  
    
    A few ways to try and stop them are:
      o squirt them with a water bottle and when your not home keep
        the squirt bottle in sight of where they spray.
      o completely wash the area that was sprayed with Natures Miracle
        to get the complete smell out so other strays won't spray the
        same area.
      o try spraying the area with a citrus spray.  I use a natural lime
        citrus spray that smells great...but the cats hate it!! Or other
        people have taken old nylons and put mothballs in them and hang
        it where they spray.
      o Or you could try that spray...I think it's called something like
        "NO" and it has a very bad smell cats hate.
      o Or...find the culprit and get him fixed!!
    
    Good luck....the toms in the neighborhood are starting to slow down
    now that spring is almost gone.   I go through this every darn year..
    and it's always worse at this time!!
    Sandy

Lisa,

I had also heard that moth balls help.  Try spreading some out around 
the area outside, the smell is suppose to be repulsive to cats... I know 
it works for me... I hate the smell myself.

R-

Valerie

    Be careful of mothballs they are poison to cats.
    
    Keep the area swabbed down with Odormute--a chemical that changes the
    components of cat spray and takes away the smell.  It's not harmfull to
    humans, pets or vegetation, doesn't stain or smell.  The crystals are 
    disolved in water and must be made up fresh each time.
    
    It won't stop the cats spraying but it will unmark the spots and stop the
    smell.  I haven't managed to find a way to stop spraying that dosen't
    harm the cat, but I keep trying.
      

    Can you put up some kind of barrier temporarily to prevent him from
    getting too close?  It won't stop the spraying (he'll just go
    elsewhere), but a barrier combined with an enzyme cleaner might change
    his behavior a bit and permit you to use that room.  
    Sarah
    

    You might also try getting some 'bulk' red pepper (the 'good stuff'
    might be too expensive) and lightly sprinkling the area around where
    the 'outsider' sprays. This assumes your cats are indoor cats, and that
    you don't have kids who will be playing in the area. This is what we
    finally had to do to discourage a stray tom from spraying our house,
    after the 'No' and other remidies failed. (Actually I have
    outdoor/indoor cats, but they didn't hang out where the overly
    agressive tom did). As cats do a good bit of navigation by smell, and
    the pepper is a strong irritant, they will most likely avoid the areas
    treated that way. (mixed with dilute lemon scented soap and sprayed on
    the area works too) And don't forget to wash your hands after with a
    good strong soap after handling the pepper. Don't do this in areas your
    own cats play in, or you will have some sneezy, runny eyed kitties to 
    worry over, and they most likely will not venture into those areas
    again for a while.
    
    John
    
    (And a P.S. Karen and Leigh said to say hi, next time I posted here!)
    

    Well, I toted 3/4 of my crew to the vet yesterday for a group 
    checkup; Carrie for her annual exam, Amelia for her ear recheck,
    and Onyx because he's turning my house into a haven for a spraying
    male cat.  
    
    On the way to the vet either Carrie or Onyx peed in the carrier
    (found this out as I attempted to put them into the car...ended
    up with a wet leg, sock and shoe...lovely). :^}  I had assumed
    it was Carrie but when we checked Onyx's bladder for urine (we
    needed a sample) it was pretty darned empty.  He's looking pretty
    guilty at this point.
    
    Carrie and Amelia were declared fit as fiddles and even weighed
    it at a reasonable weight.  Onyx was held over until a urine sample
    could be obtained.  $11.40 for fluids and $14.50 for urinalysis later
    Onyx is declared to be free of organic causes for spraying and declared
    to be extremely territorial.  (Gee, I tried to tell them this but, it's
    good to be sure of it.)  So, Onyx is now on drugs.  He's getting 1/4
    tablet of Valium twice daily.  The hope is that this will relax him 
    and he'll forget to spray when he sees those cats on the patio.  It
    may take several weeks (maybe up to 6).  If that doesn't work, the
    next treatment is Buspar (another tranquilizer).  Both Valium and
    Buspar of medical side-effect free.  Valium may cause some sleepiness
    and the urge to eat a bit more.  Last resort treatment is Ovaban.
    Ovaban has some side-effects associated with it so they use it as
    a last resort when all else has failed.
    
    I hated the thought of putting Onyx on Valium but when the treatment
    method and side-effects issues were explained to me.  And, when it
    was clarified that Buspar was not a hormone but another type of 
    tranquilizer, I felt a bit better about it.  I had thought Buspar
    was this wonderous new hormone that would cure the spraying.
    
    So, I'm wondering what the Valium will do to Onyx's personality.
    Anyone have experience with this?  I tried to watch him this morning
    after I gave it to him but he has it firmly in his mind that if I
    took him to the vet yesterday morning after I got dressed that I must
    be getting dressed to take him again.  He made himself pretty scarce.
    As I walked down the hallway he bolted for his favorite she-can't-
    possibily-find-me-in-here spot in the hall closet.  I'm hoping he's
    doing okay today.
    
    Jan 

    Jan,
    
    I had Taja on Buspar two years ago.  It didn't work for him.  It is an
    expensive drug too.  This was just my experience, but thought I'd share
    it.  I'd hate to see you waste money!
    

    Jan,
    
    Pip was on vallium when she stopped eating. A tiny dosage is often
    given to a cancer patient to stimulate the appitite. It caused her to
    regain her appitite; the doage was to small to have any other effects.
    
    Deb

    Thanks for the info on Buspar, Roberta.  I think I'm feeling better
    about the valium now (especially knowing that Buspar is expensive).
    
    Deb, I haven't noticed any real increase in his appetite yet but 
    then I'm not home to watch him eat except at night.  He does seem 
    mellower and more lovable though.  Interesting effect.  He was always 
    pretty lovable before but he's even more like that now.  I haven't 
    actually seen him spray anything yet (yes, he will actually walk right
    up in front of me and spray something).  Maybe the valium will be all 
    it takes.  I hope so.  My apartment is not smelling too fresh these days.
    
    Jan                                    

    We've had Peaches on valium for the past two weeks.  We're trying to
    combat two problems:  1) overgrooming - she's licked off almost half
    her fur; and 2) extreme aggression toward our youngest feline, Bandit.
    
    Peaches was on 1/2 tablet twice daily.  The vet warned us about an
    increase in appetite, but we didn't really notice much of a change -
    she was too busy sleeping or looking to us for affection.  There was no
    change in the overgrooming, but there was a marked improvement in the
    aggression.  So, the valium may be all that's needed in your case.
    
    I wish the valium had taken care of both problems, we may have to go
    the Ovaban route, which I'd rather not do.  
    
    Good luck, 
    Paula

    You will all have to let me know how things will or have worked out.
    My tubba has been spraying a bit (on the tv right in front of me!).
    He was given Buspar (@.75 -1.00 a pill)but it was making him really
    inactive.  I would like to cut the dosage in half and see how that
    works.  I also have valium but have not used it for this.  Another
    breeder recommended using Elavil.  It was given to her by her vet.
    
    It seems there could be several things to try before going to Ovaban.
    Karen

    I just made a call to my vet to ask how long Onyx needs to be on
    the Valium (1/4 tablet twice per day) before I start noticing any
    difference.  He's been on it a little over a week.  She says if I
    don't notice any difference in 2 weeks then it's time to try 
    something else.  This morning he just stood in front of me and
    sprayed the front door.  Last night he sprayed the couch and 
    either peed or sprayed the rug area right next to the couch (the
    couch is near the sliding glass door to the patio where all the 
    foster cats live).  I'm at my wits end with this.
    
    So far I haven't noticed any change in him that the doctor said I
    might.  He's not sleepier at all and I don't think he's eating more
    (if he is, it's not much more).  The thing I have noticed is that
    he's more demanding of attention.  Every time I turn around he's
    either leaping for my shoulder or begging for tummy rubs and the
    like.  He's certainly a lover boy while on this stuff.
    
    Jan

    
    I am a recent feline notes reader and have found a wealth of
    information. I have been a cat lover most of my life. I have 4
    kids right now Bonnie and Clyde (brother and sister), Mocha,
    and Scooter all black (3 males and 1 female). 
    
    Bonnie and Clyde are 7 years old both fixed.  All cats are fixed.  
    Bonnie and Clyde out door cats.  About 4 years ago Clyde decided to begin 
    spraying in the house.  At that time my son who is very found
    of cats moved back to the house.  May I add, I also had 2 other cats
    that lived in the house before I got Bonnie and Clyde. They have since
    passed on to the great beyond.  I have my daughter's cat and my son's cat.
    They have become part/full time residents. It's been a year for both.
    All cats are very fond of each other and live very harmously.  The 
    only thing that I can possibly make any sense out of the spraying is 
    that when my son was rooming at college, one of his roomates had a 
    dog and my son may have brought the doggy odor home on his things.  
    So much for that theory though because dear loveable Clyde is still 
    spraying occasionally on things.  He has been tested and put on
    hormones but I thought he has stopped and time passed and he is at it again 
    sometimes in front of me.  Also, it doesn't seem to matter whose things
    he chooses to spray could be my things, my husbands, a dresser or a
    bed. 
     
    I just wonder how long this continues for the rest of his natural life
    or does he get tried. It is rather disconcerning since you don't want
    your house to smell. I just wonder if it isn't just in the genes.
    He is the only cat in all my years of having cats as pets who has
    given me such a problem. Sorry for rambling on.........
    
    Any ideas are welcome.
    
    Thanks, Lee
    
    

    I don't have any answers...but my opinion is sometimes spraying
    is behavioural, territorial and other times it could be a medical problem.
    
    My sister has a cat, Pacer who has continued to spray for 2 years.
    Pacers problem is definitely behavioural because my sister has
    monitored him and found that when Pacer wants something (like to
    go outside) and if Donna doesn't move fast enough, Pacer will spray.
    So she has learned to "do" what Pacer wants and he won't spray.
    
    I also have a cat, Bogie who will spray outside, but I have never
    seen him spray in the house. (thank god)   I also know of cats at
    the shelter that were brought to us because they spray, but yet
    many of them will no longer spray once they find a new home!!! BUT
    yet some will always spray.  I just can't figure this one out.  
    
    I originally thought cats who were neutered later in life are the 
    ones that have the "habit" and continue to spray.  But I proved that 
    theory wrong when I rescued some of my cats.   I have some that were 
    neutered at age 10-12 and do not spray. 
    
    One suggestion is to make sure you use an enzyme cleaner where the
    cat sprays or he will continue to go back to the same spot!! Also
    try to keep your eye on Clyde to see if you can determine "when"
    he does spray.  Ie..when he wants out...when other cats are teasing
    him...when new cats show up in the neighborhood etc.
    
    Good luck....
    
    Sandy
    

    what kind of medical workup did they do? If it was just a urine test
    for FUS, you might want to have a complete blood panel work up done.
    I wish I'd have had that done when my Eirene started urinating
    indiscrimintly, as I know realize that she was probably trying to tell
    me something was wrong (she was probably begining kidney failure at the
    time.
    
    Deb

    Reponse,
    
    Thanks, for your thoughts.
    
    Sandy, you may have hit the nail on the head...he is a very loving animal. 
    Seventeen pounds of pay attention to me when he comes into the room,
    when someone comes to visit or just anytime. He thinks he is a dog.
    He is a very demanding animal when he wants out or to eat.  
    
    He has had a complete blood workup and had his bladder checked for
    possible infections, etc.  
    
    I think it may be just behavior, like you mention.
    
    I have another problem maybe someone has an answer to:
    
         As I said I have had Bonnie and Clyde and have since introduced
         two other cats both males (fixed) within the last year and a half. 
         Everyone had lived in relative harmony for almost a year then I
         noticed that Bonnie was hiding under the bed and was not joining in
         with the rest as she had been.  Reason being Scooter was chasing 
         her and upsetting her most of the time.  I spoke to my vet and we 
         found Bonnie had a slight urinary infection and then I  realized she
         had a case of roundworms she must have had for some time.  All 
         problems had been taken care of and she was still hiding so
         the vet suggested valium for a short time.  She did stop hiding for 
         a while but still not confortable with Scooter.  This lasted about 
         3 months. Well, he is back chasing her again and she is upset again 
         with him and runs.  
    
         Interestingly enough, he was mistreated as a kitten.  I have
         brought him around so that he is friendly but still skiddish to
         company and noise.  Very nice cat basically, but not lovable.
         He waits until others are finished eating before he will eat.
         Definitely not overly agressive with other cats. Just Bonnie.
    
         My question is: do you think she may have roundworms again and
         give off an odor that interests him.  She is a little huntress.
    
         Thanks for letting me ramble on, sorry it is so long.
    
    
    Lee
    
    

    I'm going through this right now with Onyx.  He's on Valium to
    relax him because his problem is his strong territorial mentality.
    He started this shortly after Mac moved into the house.  He sprayed
    occasionally then and it has increased recently since I started 
    fostering the 3 strays on my patio.  In fact, he sprayed right in
    front of me twice the other day.  Obviously, the valium treatments
    are not working.
    
    The next step was supposed to be Buspar (another tranquilizer) but
    when my vet called and left a message yesterday she mentioned we'd
    put him on Ovaban (hormones).  I have a call in to find out why
    she's decided to skip the 2nd step in the process she layed out.
    
    From what she tells me there is a slight risk of long term side effects 
    which may or may not occur with the hormone.  They are diabetes, cancer 
    of the mammary glands and adrenal depression (if I heard her right on
    the tape).  I believe she's decided to go for the more effective 
    hormonal treatment in spite of the risk of side effects because he's
    so persistent.  I'll know more when I go in on Saturday (foster cat
    vaccinations) and have a chance to talk to her.
    
    I'm hoping that after x amount of time on Ovaban, when the spraying
    stops (assuming it does) that we'll be able to wean him off the 
    Ovaban and he won't resume spraying.  I hope this turns out to be
    true since I'm probably going to move to a new apartment next month
    and sure don't want it smelling like the current one does.  Guess
    I'll borrow mom's carpet cleaning machine (again) or get a professional
    in to deal with it.
    
    Jan

    jan,
    
    Please let me know how the hormone treatment works.  I am curious,
    since I would be willing to try it again.  Maybe this time I would
    have some success.  Because I even got to the point I considered
    giving him anyway, but he is such a lovable animal.
    
    
    Good luck,
    
    Lee
    
    

    
    	I previously wrote about my two female(spayed) cats spraying on
    my kitchen counters, usually the coffee maker or the microwave.  I
    don't know which one is doing it.  I really can't afford a trip for
    two to the vets at this time.  Is there any inexpensive way to handle
    it for now?  I think it might be because now I have to travel to work
    and I'm gone at least 10 hrs. a day.(Thanks DEC)  Anyways, I need
    to stop this real soon before they become outdoor cats for good.
                                                Thanks Sue
    						WMOIS::FLECK_S
    						
    

    well, you could gather up the sample and have the vet do a litmus test
    or uninalysis for about $10-$20. This would point out if one of the
    cats has FUS, and if so, feed them something like Purena Special Care
    (available in the supermarket). 
    
    Of course, it may be behavioral; making a point to spend some time with
    the cats (maybe a half hour; just a good combing or letting kitty sit
    on your lap when you are relaxing) when you come home might fix the
    problem, too. 
    
    
    Good luck, this can be a very frustrating problem.
    
    Deb

    
    	Good morning, I tried to help my cat by spending quality time
    with her and yesterday I got home to a coffee maker full of YUK!
    I left her out last night and when she came in this morning she
    actually walked into the bedroom and right in front of me sprayed
    my clothes basket!!!!!  I sort of lost control, screamed at her
    and put her back outside.  She's never done this with me standing
    right next to her, thats why I wasn't positive which cat was doing
    this, now I'm positive.  I can not have this happening in my house.
    I guess I will have to call the vet today, thank god they take credit
    cards.  I'm still shaking my head at what she did RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME!
    Almost like "tough, I'll do as I please"  Any clues on how much this
    might end up costing me?				Sue & Pumpkin
    

    Sue..it also could be she did it in front of you because this
    is her way of saying...I need help!!!  It really could be a 
    medical problem..as a matter of fact my Rio is at the vet today
    having tests on his urine because he kept going back and forth
    to the box right in front of us!!  My guess is with Rio it is
    the beginning of FUS or possibly an infection!!
    
    I think it's best to rule out medical problem...and then if there
    are no medical problems you can start to change behaviour.  To do
    this...I would definitely cage her for awhile because they seldom
    will spray where they sleep.
    
    Good luck...and keep us posted.  Once I pick up Rio tonight I'll
    have a better idea of what the costs are.
       
    Sandy
    
    

    Just thought I'd let you know that my Rio was diagnosed with
    a Bladder Infection.   So he comes home tonight with antibiotics!!
    I'll let you know the cost of the urinalysis tomorrow!!!
    
    Sandy

    Just thought I'd let you know that Rio's entire bill was $76
    which included an office visit, overnight stay (he had to stay
    because they couldn't get him to pee), urine test, antibiotics, 
    and CD dry and wet.  The actual urine test was only $10.
    
    With Rio we are keeping him on antibiotics, feeding him CD for
    two weeks and then we will do another urine test to see how
    that one comes out!!!
    
    I'm not sure what vet you go to...but I'm sure the prices
    could be different.
    
    Sandy

    	I'm bringing her to the vet on Monday, and they already told me
    it would be $22 for the office visit, and $18 for the urinalisis(?).
    This might be alittle high but I trust them with my animals and 
    unfortunatly I've had some bad experiences with other inexpensive
    vets.  I'll let you know what comes of this.  Thanks    Sue