Conference 7.286::digital

    
    Or you could give them the number of a distributor.  The distributors
    do care about small orders.
    
    Or you could give them a DecDirect catalog.
    

The distributors sell other people's equipment as well
and are statistically likely to do so. 

People don't want to buy something they're already 
scared about buying from a catalog.


I've said it before and I'll say it again. Our presence
in the small business markets is non-existent but that
is what works there. You may have more misses and more
failures for more frustrating reasons but the contacts
you cultivate will pay off in the long run. 

                             > Buy Digital <
    
    I agree with the base noter.  I have a friend/business associate at a
    market research firm that just purchased an entire office set-up from
    Digital.  It took me over 20 phone calls to get him anything more than 
    a catalog.  I persisted until he received the personal service that he
    deserved.  He was already being courted by our competitors.  He wrote 
    a letter of appreciation to my supervisor.  It appears to me that some
    type of effort to capture the small businessman should be made.  I'd 
    go through all the trouble again even if it was for a small sale.
    
                                                                  Dan
                                              
    P.S. The office in question has 15 in house 
         employess and hundreds of field auditors.
         They process massive amounts of data 
         every day so it was decent size sale.

    I put another YES vote in for the idea presented in .0  Sure, there
    might be some specifics to "iron out", but I think overall the company
    would be better for it than not.
    
    I seriously think I could have sold a couple of PC's in '92, and 3 or 4
    last year!  All I could do was talk with the person, and give them a
    catalog (and of course help them with questions, etc.)  At least 2
    cases I know of were such that the potential customer chose non-Digital
    due to hassles they experienced trying to buy through Digital.
    
    	Jim

    I might add ... that IMHO, a commision of 5% would be too high, given
    that the "margin" on PCs and related products is so small.  I
    personally would settle for even 1% commision, if the overall result
    was a new customer, and new revenue . . .
    
    	Jim

    On Monday, shortly after the LA quake, I called a company called "The
    Software Labs", who had sent me a catalog here at WRO (victim of yet
    another mailing list bought from someone?) When I got through, I asked
    for some price information. I liked the prices, and asked if I could
    place an order. They apologized, and stated due to the quake, their
    systems were rendered inoperative. I asked them if there system was a
    DEC system (I did say Digital Equipment system, so don't sweat it 8^)
    They replied, "No." I then told him about DEC's Disaster Recovery
    Program, and if the had our computers, they'd probably still be
    running. And if not, we'd be there to back them up. The guy said he'd
    talk to his managers about this. Potential sale there for someone. Not
    to be an opportunist, but...I am what I am. So perhaps the sales folks
    can offer our DRP to the people of SoCal/NoCal/and anywhere else
    disasters may happen. Not like hovering vultures, but with a smile,
    offering a valuable service.
    
    Bob

    
    
    Ditto on all these notes. I've been saying this to a LOT of
    people. I've been at a few family functions, where I've run into family
    and friends I don't even know. Tell them I work for Digital. They ask me
    how the PC's are. I tell them what I know. I've even had 4-5 guys in my 
    neighborhood that work for LARGE companies in the Boston area ask
    me about Alpha Workstations, and Alpha PCs. I do best I can to get 
    them the info, and a contact.
    
      But what it all comes down to is that we're really all a sales force.
    I'm not saying that to make the sales people, or the DECdirect people 
    upset. But what I'm finding is that there are more and more people
    in my town that are out buying PCs. Also, with three children in Pre
    school thru 1st grade I run into more parents buying PCs for
    educational purposes, and then ask for advice. 
    
      What I really think we should be doing if we're not doing already
    is to get in with Microsoft with their Microsoft Home software series.
    From what I understand Microsoft is taking the "Tupperware " approach
    to selling their software. One of their employees takes some of
    their Microsoft Home software with them to a parents meeting at the
    local school or their house, and show off the software. Parents
    buy etc...etc.. and there you have it new customers, and future sales. 
    We should get in there with Microsoft and give them the PCs to demo the
    software to these people to, or do a similar kind of thing. Market to 
    the schools PTA groups, colleges, etc. 
    
     We also need to provide employees easier access to PC equipment. Right
    now it's not uncommon around here to hear someone say "I bought a
    PC" when you ask what they bought they say they bought a Gateway, or a
    DELL, etc.. etc. And site that they got a better deal. This is just 
    shooting ourselves in the foot. And causes us to loose the following
    benefits : 
    
       1st) We lost a sale. Why aren't the prices in EPP lower than what 
            someone can get from another company. Don't we want employees
            to buy Digital ? Maybe we need a program where an employee can
            only buy one PC every two years, or trade it in every year for
            a newer model. Get the equipment in the hands of all the
            employees. Its like this great network everyone in this company
            uses, we all use it, and we can tell that to our customers.
              
    
       2nd) Because that person doesn't have a Digital PC we lost that
           persons abaility to market a Digital PC, because now they have
           another companies PC or hardware. Now when the relatives or
           friends are over the house, or that person takes their portable
           non Digital PC somewhere people don't see a Digital PC. But
           think for a moment what this might mean to that person that
           might be looking to buy a PC. Here's a person working for
           Digital. He doesn't have a Digital PC, doesn't that send
           out the wrong message. 
      
       3rd) More equipment in the field means that more people get to see
            it. I've had numerous people ask me where they can see a Digital
            PC ? I don't know where they have them on display, and I don't
            know what stores to send them to. And I as as an employee don't
            have one so I can't show them also. People that I know won't buy
            an item over $1000.00 through a catalog. They want to see it
            first. Touch it, try the keyboard. Where do they go ? 
    
            
             I'm glad this note was started. This issue has really been
            bothering me. 
    

	When I first started reading this stream I was very pessimistic.
	Several years ago KO encouraged us all to participate in sales
	but the program was not really formal.

	After the "tuperware" example the light started to come on... I'll
	bet a lot of Decies moonlight at one time or another. Why not
	moonlight as a company rep? ( or act on the opportunity)

	What I have heard so far:

	1) We would have to have a way to order the machines at a reasonable
	   price. Some training may be in order.

	2) Machines could be delivered to our homes or where we work.

	 other problems to solve...

	3) We should attempt to sell service contracts as well as hardware.

	4) You would have to be prepared to take calls from anyone you
	    sell to at all times of the day and night.

	5) We could use a notesfile to discuss pre-sales questions and selling
	    techniques.

	6) You may be able to set this up with one sales rep in each area
	    being a "coach"/advisor. Maybe that rep gets the credit for
	    the sale (but you still get the 1%)

	PLEASE, someone take this and push it. I volunteer to help.

	Heck, I've got one neighbor alone that spends several k$ per year
	on hardware alone on his home business...

joe

    next time i'll go play in a chess tournment, i'll do my share of
    marketing , i'll want to put on my digital VMS t-shirt on, so that people 
    know that DEC have smart people in it.
    
    \nasser

    Another twist to the idea.
    
    Why don't we set-up a small outlet at the manufacturing plants.
    Where the 'new' employee-salespersons will call an 800 number to
    get their orders in.   Also the outlet will serve the area:
    (ie: Kanata - the Canadian Orders, NIO - New England, Colorado-
    Rockies, Albuquerque-Southwest).   The machines will be available
    at popular configurations with a 24 or 48 hour leadtime.   If the
    customer wants other options, then the leadtime will be a week or so.
    

    Be careful what you propose here!  If the powers that be find out
    you're trying to sell something, they're liable to cut your salary by
    20-40% and make you earn it back on 'commission'.
    
    ...only half in jest....

    
    Good Idea .0
    
    !!!
    

    Back in Rainbow days we did have an employee incentive program. You got
    points for referals, and a catlog of gifts to spend your points on.
    I still have a nice kitchen blender from the points.
    
    When I get to the office again Ill have to dig through my 'historic'
    file drawer, I may still have some of the promotional material.
    
    We also did a rather good employee purchase program. I bought a
    Rainbow. When It came time to buy a new PC I tried to buy through EPP,
    but it was so damned restricted and long lead times I bought a clone,
    on which I am now writing this note.

    My neighbors WOULD buy Digitial "equipment" if they could see it
    run the latest software.  
    	
    My non-dec friends, my church, my neighbors, my relatives,...
    
    If we could only bill for all the time we help our neighbors bump and
    grind their way through a few, guru, abort, retry, fail, system-bombs.
    
    With a VTX order entry system available, a few hundred thousand
    catalogs, and some compensation method (free equipment based on sales)
    THis is a good idea.
    
    The XL is currently on order, however our EPP system is NOT optimized
    for us to represent Digital in its best light.
    
    Mark

Re:0

>>	Here's how it would work. My plumber wants to buy a DECpc. I, being
>>	more informed than she is in this matter, can help her choose a model 
>>	that will fit her needs. I go into VTX EMPLOYEE_SALES, place an order, 
>>	and she gets her PC delivered in a few weeks. I can choose to help her 
>>	install it also, if I wish. I get 5% commission for my work and Digital
>>	gets more revenues, more customers, etc. without taking
>>	time from the busy sales reps, who wouldn't care too much about
>>	such small opportunities. 

I would suggest that 800-PC-BY-DEC is a much better vehicle for this.  They are
trained to configure the system correctly, have access to all the new info and
can sell the latest configs (which aren't available to employees).

If the sale is more complex, give it to a distributor. 

We have the right channels in place to resolve these customer horror stories.
Let's use tham before we create another administrative morass.

    re -1
    
    	Thats poppycock..  1800pcbydec have made mistakes ordering systems
    and we "the field" make up the difference once again.  (NT configs)
    
    	We are not trying to replace catalog sales, merely add to them.
    
    	Microsoft employees bleed software, and are great salespersons.
    	Because of the way they "prime" sames, with the promo stuff, repeat
    	sales are inevitable.  Everywhere around them, get it!!!
    
         

I'm in favor of the idea. But I think 5% is a bit much. And to be honest
where do we get the money from. They've done a similar idea in Holland
when they introduced Deccollect in the new form. The sales people would get
points for every service sold, and at the end of the year this could
be traded for equipment (kitchen, audio, video etc.) For those sales people
who done a very good job Digital Holland doubled the points.

It turned out to be that so much customers bought things, that the budget
reserved for this was far to small. I've to say, even the administrators
got presents, from the sales people not from Digital. 

Due to the fact there were people selling so much, they didn't gave the bonus,
the idea is great of letting everybody sell, but maybe we should also make
the people out there aware that Digital sells pc's. And if possible with a
delivery time of a week and not a delivery time of 6 weeks or more.

But the idea in .0 is great, it might work.

Ciao,

Michiel

I have always wondered why the idea in .0 hasn't been implemented already 
looonngg time ago. A lot of other companies (Microsoft, Apple etc.) have 
similar things in place. Why? Because they have realized that this is the
VERY best position to be in, when you want to sell something. People buy
from PEOPLE. I also had several occasions last year, where people came up
to me to ask me about our PC's, Alpha workstations etc. Why? Because they
KNOW me . They prefer to chat with me at the local bar with a beer, on what
kind of soundboard or new disk to buy. They prefer that largely over calling
a number that connects them with an unknown person , who is probably 
technically very competent, but who they don't KNOW. 
Remember how much money sales people are spending on just building up these
"relationships" with customers. And here you are: Friends, neighbours etc.
with whom you already have these relationships just walk up to YOU and start
you asking about our products! A more ideal and perfect "sales situation" is
hardly possible!

But this company just doesn't seem to get this. To make this work , a couple 
of things should change:

-There should be a reasonable benefit (=incentive) for the employees.
 This could be in money (personally I think 1% is too low. That's 30$ on a
 full blown 3000$ config!), or in goods, or some kind of point system, 
 whatever. But it should be an attractive incentive.

-It should be made EXTREMELY easy and cheap to get our own hardware and
 software. I have always said that Digital should give away their PC's to
 employees. The benefits of doing so LARGELY outway the costs. A lot of
 other companies are doing this already looonnngg time. For example, 
 an employee starting to work for Apple , automatically receives a (free)
 Macintosh on his first day. If you don't want the system , you just 
 don't get the job ! (Don't know if this is still the case).
 If I am going to show off at my home , how good Digital PC's are, I expect
 DEC to give me a "demo" model, like with other resellers.  

-As mentioned before , it should be made EXTREMELY simple for ANY employee
 to place an order, get details about the delivery time etc.

-And last but not least : We should have much more competitive prices .

To summarize: Yes, .0 is a good idea. So where do we go from here?

Timo 

    re .18
> This could be in money (personally I think 1% is too low. That's 30$ on a
> full blown 3000$ config!), or in goods, or some kind of point system, 
> whatever. But it should be an attractive incentive.
    
    I don't know what kind of profit Digital gets on a PC, but there was a
    quite long article in the Business section of the Houston Chronicle
    last year that covered the competition among the *many* small clone PC
    vendors in the Houston area. According to the article, there was only
    about a $50 profit on each PC sold! You have to sell a LOT of PC's to
    make a living at that rate.
    
    Giving an employee $30 of that $50 would bring margins down to very low
    returns. (Probably negative after all the over was deducted). :-(
    
    Harry
    

At first when I read this note I thought it was a great idea. Anything to
increase sales. Also, I think of PCs as a way to get in the door with larger
sales. But then as I saw lots of new processes added to my work, I had second
thoughts. Why add another new process when we don't need one.

I suggest instead that when someone asks about PCs, first give them the
DECdirect catalog. If they don't like to deal with an unknown person then
bring the catalog with you to the bar or whatever. Go through their options
with them and call up DECdirect for them. Then when the system shows up, help
them out to get it going.

As for the commision, I would think that a healthy company is more important
right now. That way more of us could keep our jobs. Plus once the company
starts doing great the raises will start pouring in (Hey, I can dream can't
I?).

So the bottom line is I don't think we need to add another channel as well as
another group of people to manage the new comission mechanism. Let's keep
things simple.

Richard

Customer Services now has a sales lead program in effect now, where 
when we fina a potental sale we provide a lead which gets summited to
the appropit sales Chanal. when the sale is made we get 1% Commision.
This program inculdes new contracts and sales of equipment other than
the PC family.

As for the PCs I carry PC by DEC catalogs and pass them out to anyone
who shows any intrest in buying a PC. I also usualy will hand the person
2 of the catalogs and ask them to pass it on to an aquantens that may be
intrested in PCs.

    re .21
    
         Are you serious?  Why didn't anyone contact me when I went through
    a great deal of effort that lead to a healthy sale?  Where's my 1%? =)
    
                                                               Dan
    Do you have a contact phone # for this?

Did we ever had a good look through the DEC-direct catalogue. At leas the one
we do in Holland doesn't make any sense to me. I needed a laptop. When I tried
to order it from the the guide, I couln'd find what I needed. At least not all,
I had to go to the people who check configurations before we process them as
an order.

I found out that somethings were not even in the catalogue. And the delivery
times are weird. Like weeks for a PC withouth terminal. Or weeks for a ribbon
or something small. If we wanna sells PC's I agree, the bar with a beer or 
something, like a party or birthday, that's easier. Of course the DECdirect
thing can be a usefull tool, but it's better to have one at home and show the
interested person. And I agree also that sales spends time, a lot of time
to get to know the customer, because that's easier for doin' business, so
why not use everybody in the company to sell the things.

But be aware that there need to be something in place, which works.

Ciao,

Michiel

How can I advice a customer/friend to buy a Digital PC when I myself bought
a noname product?

Presently during the period of closing KBO I think about a third of the fired
people are buying PC's and I know only one who sold a Digital PC. Why?

Because the company (we) especially in Germany are not able to sell PC to the
employees to a FAIR price. There is no EPP at all!. 
When I requested to establish an EPP in Germany I heard only a lot of excuses.

So let's continue with the procedure and finaly close the company!


Bernhard_still_about_150_days_with_digital   

About the "low margin". Which margin are we talking about? Now I am not in
marketing or sales, and what follows is based on what I learned from ecomics
lessons at university, so forgive me if this is completely wrong but..:

I thought, that when you manufacture I product, you first start adding up
all the costs  from start to finish. So:

raw materials,
manufacturing,
documentation,
transport,
admin,
SALES <<----
marketing,
etc. etc.

This gives you a price X. Than, on top of this price, you add your profit
margin of let's say 2%. If we assume that this model is correct, than your
commision should come out of what is reserved for SALES activities, and not
out of the margin. If the above model is not correct, and we are supposed to
finance the sales,marketing etc, activities out of the 1% margin, than I think
we should get asap out of this bussiness (or better, not trying to get in there).

Timo

>This gives you a price X. Than, on top of this price, you add your profit
>margin of let's say 2%. If we assume that this model is correct, ...

This was explained to me as COST-BASED_PRICING.

I'm told to survive we need to move towards PRICE-BASED_COSTING.

Doug.

    The cover article in the February 1994 issue of PC World is on
    high performance PCs. Of 80 they reviewed, the DECpc XL 466d2 (ISA)
    came in 6th in their list of "Power Desktops".  Unfortunately is was the
    most expensive PC in the entire list at $5397, $650 more than any other 
    486 (EISA), and equal in price to the most expensive Pentium (EISA) 
    system listed.  Most 486 (ISA) systems listed were in the range 
    $2400->$3500.
        
    DEC got high marks for performance and the size of its hard disk, but
    with that big a difference in price are folks really going to buy?
    

Re: .27

The DECpc XL line is PCI-based.  Were the others?

			Steve

    re .-1
    
    PCI-based...what's your point?
    
    If you want a PCI system you can go to Gateway and get a complete 60MHz
    Pentium system for $2495. A similar system from Micron is $2799. Don't
    like to buy off brands? OK, how about a complete Ambra (IBM) system for
    $2669?
    
    All are PCI-based. 
    
    tim m.

    I agree with the folks that think we need to do more than just talk the
    talk.  It should be SO INEXPENSIVE for an employee to get a piece of
    our equipment that noone would even THINK about going outside!  
    
    Unfortunately, even at the unbelievable, never-to-be-repeated,
    once-in-a-lifetime, holiday extravaganza prices I just carried the
    sheet into a local dealer, dropped it on the counter with the box I
    wanted circled, told them I wanted it in a tower instead of an LP, both
    5 1/4 & 3 1/2" floppies, and more memory - The salesperson looked at
    the sheet for about 10 seconds and said "No problem!"  And did.  The
    box now has a 3rd parth 17" monitor, 3rd party additional disk, 3rd
    party additional memory, etc - ALL because they were available at a
    better value elsewhere.
    
    When people are looking for computers, either PCs or something larger
    (but especially PCs) one of the first questions they ask is "What do
    you have."  Especially when they know where you work.  I can think of
    few statements that would be more likely to cause doubt in our products
    than to truthfully tell someone you invested your own money in a 3rd
    party system, no matter WHAT the reason.  'Cause no matter what you
    tell them after that the question in their mind will ALWAYS be - if
    you're company's stuff is so good how come YOU don't have one!

RE:             <<< Note 2866.16 by WETONE::LICATA "Mark @548-6455" >>>
                      -< This or a job at Computer City >-
>>    	Thats poppycock..  1800pcbydec have made mistakes ordering systems
>>      and we "the field" make up the difference once again.  (NT configs)
    
>>   	We are not trying to replace catalog sales, merely add to them.
  
If PC-BY-DEC has difficulty configuring PC's (not my experience, BTW, but your
mileage may vary), what makes you think 85000 DEC employees running around
selling PC's will do it right?  

I agree that we need to expand our market.  I just don't think this idea
would work.  Just my opinion.

 Desktop 
 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Refer a Friend Program                                 Date: 04-Mar-1994
 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Page   1 of 1  
 As we strive to attain our goal of being one of the major PC 
 Vendors, we must enlist as many Digital Employee's as possible
 to get the word out!! Being the fastest growing PC Company in 
 the world has required alot of work with lots more to do. We 
 would like to enlist each Employee of Digital to assist us. 
 Should you have a friend, relative or business acquaintance 
 sell them on a Digital PC and have them call us at 800-722-9332.
 Be sure to have them reference the "Refer a Friend" program when
 they call us. We have set up the "Refer a Friend" program to 
 provide your referral caller with some background information on 
 DECpc's as well as sending them the latest DESKTOP DIRECT catalog. 
 So, help us, help your friends, and most importantly help your 
 company..DIGITAL...the fastest growing PC Company in the world!!
 
 Thanks to each of you in advance for your assistance.

    	Now that there has been so many changes in the field lately I'd
    like to ask a similar question as in .0 again. How or who can I contact
    to identify potential customers. I ran into one manager of a software
    co. the other day and she said that she could sell a few DEC PC's daily.
    
    	Any help would be appreciated. I'd like to follow through and make
    sure that things work out well for both sides.
    
    thanx,
    	   bc

    Try Judy Trombino 617-273-6842.  I guess she is in Channels and
    recruits VARs.
    
    Mark

    If I could get 5% on a  PC sale, I'd quit everything and sell only
    them.  Yowzer.  Lets see, sell 100 a year at 3K a pop..... times
    5%...... mmmmmm....yeah, I can live on that.

    you either are a cheapy, or you have your mathematics incorrect
    I could'nt do it on 100 * 3000 * 5% = 15k$ a year, or 1250$ a month...