T.R | Title | User | Personal Name | Date | Lines |
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2568.1 | | KAOT01::M_MORIN | Le diable est aux vaches! | Mon Jul 05 1993 14:17 | 19 |
|
We have heard about the brand campaign through the grapevine; VOGON news, NOTES
conferences, etc... I don't remember it being directly communicated to us
from our direct line of management.
I really don't see how we can effectively and consistently communicate our
views on Digital - resulting in the enhancement of our image - if we're not
given some *guidelines* and official information from above.
I can suggest what *I think* can help, i.e. post *customer focused* posters
and banner messages around *everywhere*, but that doesn't mean it will get
done in every Digital office worldwide. Also it's one thing to post such
messages around, it's another thing to change employees' opinions on that
particular subject matter so that we can at least relay the same messages to
our customers.
Every little bit helps
/Mario
|
2568.2 | Respect the confidentiality of Digital conferences | STAR::BECK | Paul Beck | Mon Jul 05 1993 14:55 | 5 |
| Keep in mind that anything you read in Digital notes conferences is to
be considered company confidential information, and is not to be
considered public information. As such (this is a personal, not a legal
opinion), it should not be used or referenced in an outside publication
such as a dissertation.
|
2568.3 | RE: confidentiality | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Mon Jul 05 1993 15:43 | 7 |
| In relation to company confidentiality, I will have any information I
wish to include checked before it is used in my dissertation. At
present I am just collecting general feedback to help me get a feel of
what people are thinking. I do not intend to quote people or use
internal confidential information. I am currently discussing the
matter of what I can and can't use with a member of Internal
Communications, so I do not think there will be a problem.
|
2568.4 | Are we prepared?? | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Mon Jul 05 1993 15:47 | 7 |
| Do I get the impression it that there is a general lack of information
amongst employees in relation to the branding policy? As Digital have
started advertising in papers, I take it they have begun their campaign.
Therefore I would have thought that we should all be communicating
their ideas in any work we do. Is that not the case across all the
locations? Within my department, I certainly feel that many people are
not as aware as they should be of the transition.
|
2568.5 | Please explain it to me | SMAUG::GARROD | From VMS -> NT, Unix a future page from history | Mon Jul 05 1993 16:14 | 46 |
| Well here's my view.
It's a total waste of money. I've read several of the articles on this
new branding campaign in the various "happy news" internal rags and
still have absolutely NO idea why we're doing it and what it will
achieve.
How the hell can you build up a brand identity around the most generic
adjective ("digital") in the computer industry? Surely the people who
invented this idiocy aren't vain enough to believe that when people
think of digital computer they'd think of Digital Equipment
Corporation. And anyway the adjective "digital" is more associated with
watches than computers.
Name one other company that has successfully taken a common old
adjective from the language and turned it into a brand name. Yes I
agree the opposite has been done eg with Kleenex as adjective to tissue
and Xerox as adjective to copier. and Kodak as adjective to film. But
as far as I'm aware no existing adjectival words have become well known
brand names.
So since you seem to understand why and how this branding campaign is
going to be so successful please enlighten the rest of us.
And oh yes when I see the "I"magine adverts I immediately think of AT&T
who seems to have been far more successful in exploiting the "I" than
Difital has.
In my view we'd have been far more successful in trying to build a
brand name around "DEC" by taken the current "digital" logo and
integrated "DEC" into it. Maybe by highlighting DEC as the first letter
of the words and keeping the "digital" logo as part of it.
I'd love to support this "branding" campaign but first I need to
understand:
1, Why we're doing it
2, Why it is going to be successful
3, How we expect to get the adjective "digital" associated with our
company
4, How the acronymn "DEC" plays into this
The happy horseshit I've seen so far explaining the campaign doesn't
hack it.
Dave
|
2568.6 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Mon Jul 05 1993 18:43 | 10 |
| Dave Garrod says it for me. Cracking note. The "branding" is a POS, in
my opinion, and a criminal waste of money. I'd far rather it were spent
on something useful..
Oh, and congratulations Mr. Newberry, you're the first student I've
seen noting in this company who's literate. Don't leave; I was
beginning to despair of the English education system I escaped from so
long ago.
Laurie.
|
2568.7 | | HAAG::HAAG | Rode hard. Put up wet. | Mon Jul 05 1993 21:12 | 2 |
| while we may have had our differences in the past, mr. garrod is
definitely right on this one. when will we ever learn?
|
2568.8 | re. 2568.4 | HAM03::VEEH | It's... | Tue Jul 06 1993 05:31 | 7 |
2568.9 | Miss not Mr. Newberry!!! | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Tue Jul 06 1993 09:23 | 13 |
| In reply to .6, I am very pleased that you consider me literate. I
hope I have fully restored your faith in the education system.
However, I would just like to inform you that I am female - whoops. OK no
offence taken.
In relation to informing you all of the reasoning and so on behind the new
branding policy, I will construct a note shortly. I will base it on all I
have picked up on so far and hope it will help those of you who still
feel that there has been a lack of communication.
Regards,
Miss Hannah Newberry!!
|
2568.10 | Seen locally | 16BITS::DELBALSO | I (spade) my (dog face) | Tue Jul 06 1993 12:41 | 10 |
| The recent "good news rag" on branding which was sent to all employees was
quite timely and useful. In our group, which was pretty well decimated
by an eleventh hour budgetary decision on June 21st, one departing
individual took the "centerfold" - the picture of the shell crew which
was recommended to be posted in an effort to promote school spirit or
some such - and posted it outside his office with little pieces of
yellow sticky (contraband, no doubt) next to each rower. The pieces of
yellow sticky paper said "TFSO'ed".
-Jack
|
2568.11 | | GWYNED::PCOTE | Turn it on first, then try | Tue Jul 06 1993 12:56 | 13 |
|
> How the hell can you build up a brand identity around the most generic
> adjective ("digital") in the computer industry?
Who really cares about the name ? I never thought the most
generic noun "Apple" could be synonymous with a personal
computer. I think the point about this branding campaign is to
establish identity outside the computer business so we have a
shot in the commodity market.
|
2568.12 | change is change | ANARKY::BREWER | nevermind.... | Tue Jul 06 1993 13:12 | 4 |
| ...all I remember about this campaign is that the dot over
the "i" is round, not square. That in itself ought to sell
several thousand workstations.
/john
|
2568.13 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Tue Jul 06 1993 13:53 | 36 |
2568.14 | To understand "Digital" you must understand our market | TLE::TOKLAS::FELDMAN | Opportunities are our Future | Tue Jul 06 1993 14:04 | 21 |
| I'll bite.
> How many other companies competing with Digital have the word
> "digital" in their name?
None. Our competitors are IBM, HP, Sun, Andersen, EDS, Dell, Compaq, SGI,
Gateway, Seagate, Quantuum, Conner, Epson, Intel, Motorola, MIPS, and
probably a few others.
> How many competitive (to Digital) products incorporate the
> word "digital" in their name?
None.
> How many electronic products not produced by or complementing Digital,
> incorporate the word "digital" in their name?
A fair number, but what's the relevance? We're not in the electronic
products market.
Gary
|
2568.15 | Putting the cart before the horse.... | SPECXN::KANNAN | | Tue Jul 06 1993 14:11 | 31 |
|
Saying that lots of people bought Apple computers because of the
name "Apple" is like saying that everytime I eat a banana it rains. I may
have observed it a couple of times, may be even a hundred times, but
still it doesn't make for cause and effect. People bought lots of Apple
computers because it was cheap and easy to use at that time. The brand
name promotion reinforced their opinion of the company. Not the other
way around. When they see that the advantages they saw in Apple being
no longer distinguishing ones, they are flocking to PC clones and Apple
is worried about their revenues. That's why even their current "Easy-to-use"
campaign is not working well enough since people don't see much more than a
little humor there.
Brand names have their place when competitors have nothingelse to distinguish
themselves from the others. Like Coke and Pepsi. They're in the market to
sell "lifestyles" and that's the reason why you see all kinds of evocative
promotion. Brand names serve a big purpose when there is not enough
distinction between products; like Reebok and Nike.
Technical selling has always been and will always be based on real and
perceived value to the customer. Sustained perception of good value will
then establish the name as a brand to be trusted; like IBM. This worked
when customers weren't technically savvy. IBM's brand name isn't helping them
anymore.
If I am a customer, tell me what is it that you have that's head and shoulders
above your competitors. I'll worry about your brand name later on.
Fundamentals are always a good bet. Madison Avenue can come later on.
Nari
|
2568.16 | | GWYNED::PCOTE | Turn it on first, then try | Tue Jul 06 1993 14:36 | 19 |
|
REP .14
You obviously have a much stronger opinion concerning this branding
campaign then myself. It's my understanding that this company is not
well received or well recognized outside our immediate mainstream
business.
If we intend to succeed, especially in the commodity market, then
we'll have to change some outdated mindsets (i.e. many people equate
us as a proprietary mini-computer company)
My only concern is the future of this company. It's my opinion that
we have great products but don't know how to market them. Perhaps
this branding campaign is a small step in a bolder marketing
strategy. I hope so. Maybe the branding campaign is a POS. But at
least we're making an effort.
|
2568.17 | | SDSVAX::SWEENEY | You are what you retrieve | Tue Jul 06 1993 14:53 | 16 |
| It also seems odd that the company that wants "brand" "Digital" is not
involved in the development and marketing of technologies that
constitutes the digital revolution that has been discussed in the PC
press, the business press, and the general media.
This is not to say that because "Digital" isn't the first name that
comes to mind in virtual reality products, that Digital must enter the
VR market.
"Digital" once referring a type of clock or watch now refers to digital
encoding of audio, video, and text, or as Business Week describes it
"Digital Interactive Multimedia".
No, I think it's more realistic to look for a name other than "Digital"
or "DEC". Apple has a lot more at stake in "digital" technologies than
Digital itself does.
|
2568.18 | What's wrong with setting expectations? | PLOUGH::OLSEN | | Tue Jul 06 1993 17:01 | 16 |
| re .15ff
A technical sell, I guess, is when the customer is talking with you.
As someone once pointed out, marketing is getting the customer to talk
to you.
I don't think we can win, with only a technical sell, to the vast
majority of people, (i.e. those we are not now talking to, and those who
feel threatened by anyone talking technical). Hence a brand-image sell.
Of course, you have to deliver good product, helping the customer
succeed. But with a brand-image, or other marketing success, customers
link your name with one or more of their perceived needs. I'd sure
expect increased sales if 90+% of the market related to Digital in that
way.
|
2568.19 | Branding - my understanding | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Tue Jul 06 1993 17:21 | 57 |
|
I get the feeling from all the comments coming in on this conference
that there are many people who do not understand/do not agree with the
new branding policy. Let me try to explain in the most successful way I can.
Years ago, it was enough to have a logo. Then, as more companies started
selling the same types of products, there was a need for something more to
make a company stand out. At this point companies adopted a corporate
identity. This was basically a style that was introduced throughout a
company that everyone adhered to. Be it the way the logo was reproduced to
the typeface people used in documentation, a consistent pattern was
being established.
People would feel comfortable and familiar with the style of a company,
it would reflect quality and consistency. Gradually all the major
companies, such as IBM, ICL, and so on, started to sell products that
were fundamentally the same. A customer would be faced with a barrage
of machines, all of a high quality, all doing the same types of things.
So how could they be helped in their decisions?
Something more was need to differentiate one company from the other.
Yes you have guessed it, a brand identity. The concept of branding is
relatively new, many companies adopted one quickly, others have been slower
on the uptake.
Digital face the problem that they are not a well known company in
terms of the general public. So, they have to tackle this before it is
too late. The angle they have chosen to adopt is of a customer focused
company that turn the ideas of people into products.
When someone is considering which company to bring in, Digital want to
be considered AND chosen. They want to promote a friendly and helpful
workforce, so that people will want to come and use them again.
I could go on for a lot longer, but I think the main points have been
mentioned. In relation to the logo and it's lack of changes. The
apparent reasoning behind that was the need for a subtle change. However,
if Digital chose a totally new logo, they would loose the positive
characteristics that were associated with the 'blue' Digital. So, by
changing the colour and the lettering, they were acheiving both aims.
These aims were to keep old customers and attract the new. People
familiar with the logo would not be confused and potential customers
would be attracted by a more striking logo and brand image.
OK enough of my sales pitch. I have to say that with the understanding
I have developed, I can agree with Digital's motives. I must say that
their timing leaves a little to be desired - I've yet to obtain
reasoning behind that!
Just because I've given you some reasoning doesn't mean you should stop
commenting. I want your comments on the reasoning I have given and
also comments on how successfully you think the new brand is going to
be communicated both to employees and customers (potential or current).
Hannah
|
2568.20 | The new paint won't cover in one coat | CSOA1::GOBEY | | Tue Jul 06 1993 18:29 | 23 |
| I find it absolutely incredible that after more than 3 decades in
business, we as a corporation, feel that Digital doesn't have an
identity in the marketplace. The fact is that we do, indeed, have an
identity and that's what's causing the problem. As my business mentor
Arthur Fonzarelli (aka The Fonz) once said, "If you make your bed
crummy, you'll wake up with wrinkles."
The fact is that I really couldn't tell you what the logo looks like
for Tiffany and Company. However, what they sell and how they sell it is
crystal clear in my mind and in the minds of millions of people. I'm
also old enough to remember the Edsel. The car had one of the most
distinctive automotives features ever designed.....a really ugly
grille. To this day, people still talk about the grille of this
miserably failed product.
The marketplace clearly knows what we're about. Unless we change how we
sell, how we market, how we support and how we educate and bolster our
own work force, circles or squares, burgundies or blues won't mean
thing to our acceptance or bottom line.
Changing a logo and launching a brand identity campaign only makes
sense if you scrap what you currently do and build (re-engineer) a
new company.
|
2568.22 | | TOPDOC::AHERN | Dennis the Menace | Tue Jul 06 1993 20:37 | 10 |
| RE: .20 by CSOA1::GOBEY
>I find it absolutely incredible that after more than 3 decades in
>business, we as a corporation, feel that Digital doesn't have an
>identity in the marketplace. The fact is that we do, indeed, have an
>identity and that's what's causing the problem.
Maybe we're having an identity crisis. Yes, that's it, an identity
crisis. Time now for some identity crisis management.
|
2568.23 | | METSYS::THOMPSON | | Tue Jul 06 1993 21:31 | 24 |
|
When IBM was hot, a few years back, people (in this thread) would
proclaim how good their marketing was and how poor Digital's fared in
comparison. IBM always had good branding and got high marks from
contributors to this conference.
How come when Digital tries to do it it is suddenly perceived
as badness?
I too don't have high expectations of success, but let's at least give it
a try!
I also noticed how attention grabbing "digital" is becoming. It's the
hot new technology as far as the media are concerned. So we don't
participate in this wave, but do people really know that? I think
the next few years will be a good time for anyone that can get
a positive association with that concept. In fact Digital technology
needs the sort of high performance we have with Alpha. Surely
we'll be playing in that area soon?
Mark
|
2568.24 | | SDSVAX::SWEENEY | You are what you retrieve | Tue Jul 06 1993 22:17 | 33 |
| IBM has and had many problems, but name recognition, and internal and
external awareness of precisely what businesses they are in is not one
of them.
There's no evaluation of Digital's "badness" (ah... Digital jargon),
a direct comparison to IBM along these lines is absurd.
The attitude of "let's give it a try" is, in my opinion, a foolish one,
because it gives the impression that the inputs are insignificant and
the downside risks are inconsequential. Advertising on the scale
discussed is a significant expense and the money shouldn't be spent if
the returns are not going to be there. The downside risk of course is
embarrassment, humiliation, and ruin.
The new small "d" digital technologies are championed by other
companies with a huge appetite for risk and a strong interest in the
consumer market. Neither of which have ever fit Digital. The
"positive association" that concept brings is lost if Digital isn't in
the business of digital interactive media.
It's an exaggeration but consider a company called "Music Supply". You
call them and find out they make _wire_ of all kinds including the kind
used in pianos. That's the position that Digital Equipment will be in
if the trend to identify "digital" with "digital media" continues.
As for Alpha, the technology is there on the shelf, next to Intel's,
and, in the future, PowerPC. It is companies other-than-Digital who
will apply high performance microprocessor technology to take the risks
and bear the profits and losses of the next generation of
communications.
The bottom line is that Digital merely wants Intel's role here, not the
role that Sculley described for Apple or Gates for Microsoft.
|
2568.25 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Wed Jul 07 1993 11:01 | 44 |
| RE: .19
Hannah,
I think it's clear, although many don't see it, that the criticisers of
the branding campaign (including myself) are actually aware of (and
support) most of the motives, the rationale, and the desirability of
"branding" (as we understand that term). Where the difficulties start
are in the specifics.
For instance, you will surely have picked up by now that there are many
criticisms of the choice of the word "digital". As one of those voicing
such criticism, I find it amazing that there are some who cannot see
what seems to me, the crystal clear logic in that criticism. Still,
that's life, and thank goodness we aren't all the same.
The word "branding" is far too woolly. As I've said in the past,
branding is a clear attempt to have one's own name thought of as a
generic word for a product. Good examples of this are Kleenex, Hoover,
Xerox and the like. Sometimes, as in Hoover, the name becomes a generic
term for (in this case) vacuum cleaner by virtue of the fact that it
was the first one to be marketed widely. In the case of others, surely
the smaller number, the creation of a brand name has been a difficult
and expensive deliberate process. Now, just what exactly is Digital's
"branding" campaign trying to acheive in this respect? Or, as I
suspect, is the term "branding" as used in this campaign, a terrible
and misleading misnomer?
If I'm wrong, and Digital's branding campaign is trying to achieve
the above, then the choice of the word "digital" is clearly ludicrous.
However, given the fluffy, touchy-feely campaign slogan, one so awful I
can't even remember it properly, I doubt that branding, as I understand
it, is Digital's aim.
So, your earlier reply notwithstanding, please define "branding", and
please define what Digital expects to gain from this "branding", *in
the context of that definition*. I would also be extremely interested
in knowing why "digital" was chosen rather than "DEC", the latter
being, in my opinion, a ready-made and extant brand name, requiring
little more than polishing up in the eyes of "the market".
When I understand those, I'm sure I'll have further questions.
Cheers, Laurie.
|
2568.26 | | JUPITR::HILDEBRANT | I'm the NRA | Wed Jul 07 1993 12:17 | 6 |
| RE: .24
Good analysis Pat.
Marc H.
|
2568.27 | "branding" is distinction, not commoditization | REGENT::POWERS | | Wed Jul 07 1993 13:00 | 24 |
| re: .25
> As I've said in the past,
> branding is a clear attempt to have one's own name thought of as a
> generic word for a product.
This is exactly NOT what branding is!
Branding is to DISTINGUISH your product from others of its type,
to highlight (or at least suggest) its (presumably advantageous) differences.
"Coke" and "Pepsi" are two brands of cola drinks, each fiercely identified
as unique and NOT to be confused with the other, or ANY other cola drink.
"Digital" branding should be to identy our products as unique.
This is made difficult because of the generic and ubiquitous nature
of the adjective "digital."
I wish we had chosen to focus on the longer name "Digital Equipment"
as our branding identity. Build confidence and exposure for the (rather
mundane) name, and use the distinctive logo to build visual association.
General Electric and General Motors have similarly mundane names,
but have managed to build recognition as GE and GM, based in part on their
logotypes.
- tom]
|
2568.28 | Give some credit | SULACO::JUDICE | Everything must go. | Wed Jul 07 1993 13:46 | 31 |
|
I would have loved to see the image consultant's reports on Digital...
Here's a company, who's products are very well known and respected by
it's customers as "DEC". Yet these same loyal customers know Digital
as merely the nameplate on most of these "DEC" products. Then there are
the non-customers, who think of "DEC" as some hardware company, and
"Digital" as another company that advertises very little, but when they
do, it's hard to figure out exactly what business they're in.
Do you trash "Digital", an ambiguous, somewhat tongue-twisting English
word, but one with logo-recognition? Or "DEC" which almost everyone who
knows the company already calls it?
Clearly this was a tough job, and although I don't agree with the
results, you have to respect the mess these people had to work through.
Personally, I've been calling us Digital for years (ever since the time
around '88 when we de-emphasised DEC). But it certainly hasn't been
catching on among customers and employees, and the vague new
advertising is unlikely to change things.
There was some mention of IBM... See IBM's new "enterprise" oriented
advertising? "There's never been a better time to do busines with IBM."
Digital's "Putting imagination to work" would seem more fitting for
Industrial Light and Magic...
/ljj
|
2568.29 | A brand by any other name... | CHEFS::STAALH | To boldly go where I've been before | Wed Jul 07 1993 13:49 | 52 |
| Re: 125
What "branding" is attempting to achieve is different from what Laurie
has described.
His examples are clear cases of where companies have been sloppy
in enforcing their trade marks. The words that used to describe a
single product or company have now been absorbed in "every day
popular" English. You're best off contacting your local legal
representative for an insight into how enforcable claims are against
infringement of copyright/trade marks in instances such as these.
For example one can now "hoover" with a Philips vacuum cleaner, "xerox"
on a Canon photocopier etc. As far as I know other companies can now use
these words to promote their own competitive products. Hence the
importance that is attached to the correct use of trade marks.
The "branding" idea revolves around the concept of extending traditional
advantages of a strong brand image to a corporate identity. This is
currently the fashionable thing to do for major multinational
corporations. Hence (in the UK, apologies to our non-UK noters) companies
such as Volkswagen promote their reliability, Microsoft their ease-of-use
etc. The objective being that these corporate attributes should then
transfer to all the individual products/offerings of that company.
Compare this with traditional brands/products eg. Mars bars - the brand
- that helps you work, rest and play which applies to all the products in
that brand; be it a funsize Mars bar, extra large Mars bar or Mars ice
cream.
Digital is trying to create the image of being THE company that puts
imagination to work. This will hopefully transfer to all our products.
system integration services, hardware, software etc. etc.
The objectives are clear. Whether the implementation is successful only
time will tell. But it is very clear that every individual within
Digital does have a strong opinion on whether or not
a) the new image we are projecting is the right one
b) the name we should be using is Digital
c) the new logo will assist in developing the corporate image we are
trying to project.
d) they themselves fully understand the objectives of the branding
exercise
On this last point the communication that has been widely available has
been limited to announcements heralding the start of the branding
campaign. Unfortunately there have been very few (if any) detailing the
reasoning behind this particular approach and the specific results that
we hope to achieve.
Hans
|
2568.30 | | TLE::TOKLAS::FELDMAN | Opportunities are our Future | Wed Jul 07 1993 13:55 | 19 |
| re: .25
The reason "Digital" was chosen over "DEC" was explained fairly clearly in
a sidebar on page 4 of the recent Digital World issue, which every employee
should have received.
The research they did showed:
Worldwide awareness was higher for Digital than for DEC
(employee intuition and anecdotal evidence not
withstanding, and with Japan being a regional exception)
DEC was associated with "old" and "hardware company"
Digital was associated with "breadth of offering"
I agree with Pat's implication that the company is, in many ways,
acting more like a chip vendor than an innovative systems and information
technology company, but it's clear that the people who made the branding
decision want us to be the latter.
Gary
|
2568.31 | | QUARK::LIONEL | Free advice is worth every cent | Wed Jul 07 1993 14:34 | 28 |
| Re: .29
> For example one can now "hoover" with a Philips vacuum cleaner, "xerox"
> on a Canon photocopier etc. As far as I know other companies can now use
> these words to promote their own competitive products. Hence the
> importance that is attached to the correct use of trade marks.
This is not true in the US; I can't speak to other countries. Xerox vigorously
defends its trademark here. As for Hoover, it's not a common usage as a
generic in the US, certainly not to the extent of Xerox for "photocopy".
One well-known US company-name trademark which HAS become generic in the US
is "Thermos". Also, "Aspirin" started out as a trademark, but has become
generic in the US. In Canada, though, it's still a trademark of Bayer.
The Corporate Identity Manual has a lot of informative and useful text on
how trademarks should and should not be used.
However, given that "Digital" is not our trademark (nor anyone else's), it's
rather moot as to whether or not anyone uses the company name as generic.
I see the branding campaign as an attempt to make Digital Equipment
Corporation more widely known among potential purchasers of our products.
In some markets, we're well known, in others, unknown. (Just last month
I spoke with a PC-knowledgable user who had heard that Digital "used to make
PCs", and was astonished to hear that we're "Number 11 with a bullet" in
the industry.)
Steve
|
2568.32 | Digital please! | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Wed Jul 07 1993 14:36 | 34 |
| As stated in .30, there was strong evidence obtained to justify
sticking with Digital rather than DEC. The name Digital is much more
associated with the impression we are trying to portray of the company.
To adopt the name DEC would be like starting over again, with full
employee knowledge of the name and about 40% external knowledge. I for
one do not think that would stand us in a good position considering
the economic climate.
As an example, I was told about a magazine article from a few months
back. Apparently, it stated something like:
Four companies were bidding for the contract: IBM, SUN, ICL and a
company called DEC.
I think that in itself is evidence of why Digital is trying to be
reinforced as our name. I think that a concerted effort should be made
by all, especially employees to refer to the company as Digital. If we
could all manage it, then the company may be seen in a more consistant
and together light.
I don't think Digital have any desire to adopt the name DEC and have it
end up as a way people refer to various pieces of equipment. If that
was to happen, I think any identity would be lost rather than
reinforced. People easily forget, and I would question whether it
would make people want to by our products.
What Digital want to do, is become associated with various positive
features, such as being helpful, prepared to listen to the customer,
willing to be creative, quality products and so on. What we don't want
is our name being used to describe an IBM machine.
Hannah
|
2568.33 | Consistency?? Where? | SUBWAY::CATANIA | | Wed Jul 07 1993 14:52 | 7 |
| RE .-1
I hate to say this but I have seen very little consistency at Digital
or DEC for that matter. Everyone does there own little thing an there
lies the problem!
- Mike
|
2568.34 | That is my point | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Wed Jul 07 1993 15:38 | 1 |
| Exactly! That is why they are trying to create some consistency.
|
2568.35 | The "generic" rathole | LEVERS::PLOUFF | Stars reel in a rollicking crew | Wed Jul 07 1993 18:21 | 12 |
| re: .29, .31 trademarks like "xerox" becoming generic
Why does this always come up? Most U.S. readers (and most others?) can
readily describe "a xerox," or "a thermos" or "an aspirin." The
argument for the word "Digital" passing from trademark to generic
description makes sense only if someone can clearly describe what
"a digital" is, what it looks like, weighs, sounds like, etc. Anyone
care to take up this challenge?
.29's other points were well taken.
Wes
|
2568.36 | I don't tell anyone where I work anymore, anyway | 16BITS::DELBALSO | I (spade) my (dog face) | Wed Jul 07 1993 20:36 | 7 |
| If part of the point of this whole exercise is to get employees to
use/employ/be_comfortable_with/etc. "Digital" rather than "DEC", I can't
wait to see the next revision to PP&P which suggests that the useage
of the term "DEC" is grounds for commencement of a corrective action
plan and written warning.
-Jack
|
2568.37 | | CHEFS::STAALH | To boldly go where I've been before | Thu Jul 08 1993 08:28 | 47 |
| I agree with .31 that the examples I mentioned in .29
could have been better chosen. Aspirin is a good example
of a trade mark that has become a generic term for a
category of product. Although xerox, hoover etc. are words
that have slipped into everyday English/American they are
still covered by trade mark legislation and not open to
use by other companies.
re: .34 My intention in citing these examples was certainly
not a rathole. A previous noter had muddled the branding
concept with trade mark protection (if not in words then in
concept) and my illustrations were meant to clarify.
I agree that a "Digital" is a pretty nebulus concept and not
really the issue here (although "doing a Digital" may well
become accepted terminology in Marketing Case Studies at the
current rate).
The focus of this string of notes (in my mind) is really
enquiring into the (non)acceptance and understanding (or
lack of) of Digital employees of the current branding
strategy. The branding of corporate images is certainly
not a new concept but currently very fashionable. The
FMCG (fast moving consumer goods) sector is full of
examples of very strong brands and the images/life styles
that are associated with these brands (and hence the individual
products that make up that brand). These strong brands are
definitely an asset to the companies that own them. So now
companies are trying to turn their corporate image into a
"brand" so that the notions that the public associate with
a company can then apply to all that company's products.
The main focus of branding a corporate image is a battle for
the public mindshare. Successful "company brands" have
managed to get the public to associate a single word or notion
with their company name (and hence all its products). Examples
are Volkswagen and reliability, Volvo and safety, Microsoft
and ease-of-use etc. (Digital and imagination/creativity ??).
Unfortunately only one company can occupy a each notion in the
public minds and I'm not sure that imagination/creativity
doesn't already belong to Apple (or someone else - Next ??).
Hans
PS. Hannah, I would be extremely interested in reading your
dissertation once you've completed it.
|
2568.38 | Wanna buy an expensive watch? | RDGENG::OBRIENS | | Thu Jul 08 1993 09:29 | 9 |
| Everybody says it without a thought....
Hoover is a brand name and is accepted as such. I'm
interested in where the word -DIGITAL- actually came from. Why was this
company named after an LED watch ? Actually was digital technology
around in 1956 (I think that's when we were founded).
Any answers??
|
2568.39 | | SDSVAX::SWEENEY | You are what you retrieve | Thu Jul 08 1993 11:29 | 1 |
| The question posed in 2568.38 is answered in 2568.17
|
2568.40 | | POWDML::MACINTYRE | | Thu Jul 08 1993 12:47 | 16 |
| Last week in the Boston Globe a sidebar article contained a short note
that said (to paraphrase):
> "Digital Equipment Corporation has made it clear that it wishes to be
> known as "Digital" and not "DEC". As always, compliance will depend on
> space considerations."
I guess the press has received the message but is not too interested in
complying. Perhaps "they" do not agree that "Digital" is better known
to their readers as "DEC" is.
Marv
|
2568.41 | | MU::PORTER | another fine mess | Thu Jul 08 1993 13:17 | 14 |
| Of course digital technology was around in 1956! "Digital" doesn't
even imply that electronics is involved, although there were certainly
electronic digitial computers before 1956.
Heavens, we've had Fortran compilers since 1956 (although they
might not have been called "compilers" back then).
"Digital Equipment Company" was a pretty reasonable term for the
company back then, given that it was considered a Bad Idea to
use the word "computer" when talking to venture capitalists.
The early Digital Equipment Company made equipment which was
digital. Sure, the name's sort of vague, but they went in
for vagueness in those days. "International Business Machines".
"English Electric".
|
2568.42 | | NOVA::SWONGER | Rdb Software Quality Engineering | Thu Jul 08 1993 15:23 | 9 |
| > I guess the press has received the message but is not too interested in
> complying. Perhaps "they" do not agree that "Digital" is better known
> to their readers as "DEC" is.
The press is more concerned with making things fit into the space of
a headline. That's why you see things like "DEMS DECRY HUB COPS", or
some such.
Roy
|
2568.43 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Thu Jul 08 1993 15:35 | 6 |
| <<< Note 2568.29 by CHEFS::STAALH "To boldly go where I've been before" >>>
-< A brand by any other name... >-
Hans, thank you. that's much clearer.
Laurie.
|
2568.44 | time will tell | AMCUCS::YOUNG | I'd like to be...under the sea... | Thu Jul 08 1993 18:15 | 7 |
| After reading countless replies about the goodness or badness of
branding and then exploring those bottomless ratholes to nauseum I'll
add that I'm heartened to see marketing doing SOMETHING for the public
awareness. Good or bad they're actually doing something! Only history
will have the correct answer.
cw
|
2568.45 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Fri Jul 09 1993 09:35 | 41 |
2568.46 | in this survey, who recognized what? | MARX::GRIER | mjg's holistic computing agency | Sat Jul 10 1993 17:33 | 23 |
| Re: research: (these points have been nagging me for a while)
I'm curious about the details of the research. Was the gist of the
questioning something like "Have you heard of the company Digital?"
If so, they could be answering for any of a number of "Digital
<mumble>" companies.
The evidence I see clearly indicates that our customers call us DEC,
and that we try to call ourselves Digital, confusing everyone in the
process. (I've been here for quite a while, but I have to admit that
when I bought a disk controller card for my PC from Western Digital, I
did some checking to see if they were involved with us.)
Additionally, who was questioned? I'm really searching my memory of
ever dealing with someone outside Digital who buys our equipment who
referred to us as Digital instead of DEC. I can't recall any.
However, I also tend to deal with a more technically oriented crowd,
rather than corporate purchasing agents, etc., so I wonder if this data
is based on what CEOs recognize, as opposed to the people who really
have to use the stuff and recommend it to be purchased.
-mjg
|
2568.47 | Anecdotes VS. Analysis | ESGWST::HALEY | become a wasp and hornet | Sun Jul 11 1993 01:09 | 22 |
| I fear we are making decisions based on anecdote more than on research. I
have met customers who thought DEC went out of business a couple years ago,
and a lot who have never heard of VMS. This does not mean that Digital or
DEC is gone, simply that we are using self-selecting samples. My job was
to call on people who had little or no Digital gear or software.
Obviously, my customers have no positive association with DEC. So what!
When I worked in Massachuesetts I thought everybody knew about DEC,
Digital, Vaxes ( I know we aren't supposed to call them that, but we all
did) and VMS. A lot of people knew about PDPs. Now I talk to people who
ask me if the new Alpha workstations have Pentium chips in them! It is
very easy to laugh, but the perception is not consistant.
I have no ability to deteremine if Digital is the right name. I like it
better than DEC, but that is ONLY MY PERSONAL PREFERENCE.
To paraphrase from an article in Car and Driver this month: "Our marketing
efforts are about as successful as those of the Flat Earth Society and the
Charles Manson Flan Club." Luckily, on a positive note, any recognition of
our company on the left coast will be easily measurable.
Matt
|
2568.48 | | POWDML::MACINTYRE | | Mon Jul 12 1993 13:01 | 10 |
| The Help Wanted section of last Sunday had numerous job openings listed
asking for "DEC programmers", "DEC communications specialists"... all
of which were seeking people versed in Digital Equipment Corp's
products such as VMS and DECnet.
DEC lives on in the minds of our (local to MA) customers while it dies
at Digital.
Marv
|
2568.49 | Digital vs. DEC | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Mon Jul 12 1993 13:42 | 21 |
| It is obviously not going to be an overnight transformation from DEC to
Digital. A decision has been made (whether right or wrong) to keep the
name as Digital. A branding campaign has been introduced in the hope
to establish our identity and name.
I would think that gradually we will start to be accepted as Digital.
It is early days yet. What is needed is guidelines to the use of
Digital and DEC, this needs to be distributed within the company. Only
then would we be able to see whether the wrong decision had been made.
Also, established or current customers will obviously know the link
between DEC and Digital. It is the new customers and the rest of the
industry that are the targets.
I can agree that there is a large inconsistency problem at this stage.
But I would not feel in a position to comment yet because the new
campaign has not been going long. What I would suggest Digital do is
launch an advertising campaign drawing attention to Digital and DEC,
linking them together but emphasising that Digital is what we want to
be called.
Hannah
|
2568.50 | Datsun -> Nissan | GRANMA::FDEADY | it's hard to get release | Mon Jul 12 1993 15:07 | 7 |
|
Does anyone remember Japan's Datsun? They have been successful in
changing their "branding", to Nissan. How did they accomplish the
name recognition? Wasn't it through HEAVY television advertising?
Just wondering.
fred deady
|
2568.51 | | MIMS::PARISE_M | Contemplating mid-life cruises... | Mon Jul 12 1993 15:21 | 3 |
|
Or...ESSO to EXXON....and you can be sure is was megabucks.
|
2568.52 | | MARX::GRIER | mjg's holistic computing agency | Mon Jul 12 1993 15:58 | 31 |
| Re: .50:
Yeah, but they wouldn't have been successful at changing their brand
name to "Automotive", even if their new full name was "Automotive
Quality Dealers".
Re: anecdotes vs. research:
Well, I for one question the validity of the research. I haven't
seen their methodology used in generating this data, and as we all
know, you can make statistics say pretty much anything you want them to
say.
Using the example from my first paragraph, I imagine that if Datsun
had tried to change their name to "Automotive Quality Dealers", they
would have been able to demonstrate research showing a very high level
of recognitiion to the term "Automotive" -- but did it mean their
corporation?
-mjg
p.s.
Like other noters here, I do follow the guidelines and refer to the
company as either "Digital" or "Digital Equipment" to people outside
DEC ;-), but their usual response is something like "Well, I hear that
DEC has...". I truly believe that the research has hit upon the truth:
our corporation, which most people refer to as DEC, is seen as rather
staid in the industry. Changing the name to protect the guilty is
precisely like our internal corporate style, my only complaint is that
Digital is a poor choice for a new brand image.
|
2568.53 | Datsun 280z and Nissan 280z are different cars! | NEWVAX::MZARUDZKI | I AXPed it, and it is thinking... | Mon Jul 12 1993 19:19 | 9 |
|
re .50 Datsun -> Nissan
I just sold my Datzun 280z, 1978 model. It was never called a Nissan
280z, that my friend is a totally different car, and company. My point
is sometimes legacy prevents you from calling something new, different,
or something old, something new.
-Mike Z.
|
2568.54 | | POWDML::MACINTYRE | | Mon Jul 12 1993 19:28 | 9 |
| The Datsun "Z" car is the ancestor of the Nissan "Z" cars.
It started as a 240Z then 260Z and on to 280Z.
It is the same car in the same way that the Lincoln Mark IV has evolved
into the Mark VIII nowadays.
Marv
|
2568.55 | Same company, different model years. | STAR::BECK | Paul Beck | Mon Jul 12 1993 21:02 | 15 |
| > I just sold my Datzun 280z, 1978 model. It was never called a Nissan
> 280z, that my friend is a totally different car, and company.
***********?
Where do you get this "information"? The company's always been Nissan.
Datsun was the name of the cars they sold (at least overseas) until a
few years ago, and the name change coincided with a yearly model change,
but it's been the same company, continuously, throughout. (I've owned a
Datsun 510, Datsun 610, Datsun 280ZX, Nissan 300ZX turbo, and the
redesigned Nissan 300ZX. Plus an Audi and Peugeot sprinkled in the
middle; these were the only cars not made by Nissan...)
(The turbo *may* have been labeled "Datsun" - I don't actually recall
which name they were using that year. Which says something for the
continuity...)
|
2568.56 | | NEWPRT::NEWELL_JO | Don't wind your toys too tight | Mon Jul 12 1993 22:32 | 14 |
| Actually the way these high visiblity companies like Datsun/Nissan
make a name change and new name recognition is quite simple. They
produce a car the first year of the name change with both names on
the car. Both names (Datsun and Nissan) are of equal value (ie. size).
As the years go on, the older name becomes small in comparison to
the new name until the new name only is represents that car model.
Several years ago Forest E. Olson a large real estate company was
bought out by Coldwell Banker. The next year the signs read both names.
Each year the Coldwell became larger while the F.E.O. decreased in
size. It took several years (maybe 3-5) for a complete name change
and recognition.
Jodi-
|
2568.57 | | ZPOVC::HWCHOY | Mostly on FIRE! | Tue Jul 13 1993 00:06 | 3 |
| re.55
Yes the Nissan name has been around for a long time. Roughly it means
"Made/Produced in Japan".
|
2568.58 | hey, that's our abbreviation.. | MU::PORTER | the past sure is tense | Tue Jul 13 1993 00:46 | 5 |
| I read an article in the Christian Science Monitor which mentioned
"DEC".
They were talking about the "Dialogue for Economic Co-operation",
which is what they're calling the current US-Korea talks.
|
2568.59 | :-) | SUBURB::THOMASH | The Devon Dumpling | Tue Jul 13 1993 08:14 | 10 |
|
> Or...ESSO to EXXON....and you can be sure is was megabucks.
It's still ESSO here.........maybe we'll remain DEC here?
Heather
|
2568.60 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Tue Jul 13 1993 10:38 | 3 |
| It's ESSO all across Europe, Heather.
Laurie in Belgium.
|
2568.61 | | VAXCAT::RKE | Pawky Pussycat | Tue Jul 13 1993 11:32 | 9 |
|
Geoff Singles, The UK's old CEO, told the whole world back in
1986 or 87 that DEC UK would from then on be called Digital Equipment
Company Ltd. We still have folks internal calling us DEC.
If we can't change our name, how on earth do we expect the rest of
the world to?
Richard.
|
2568.62 | name changes are difficult to implement.. | TEKVAX::KOPEC | Free Stupidity Screening $5 | Tue Jul 13 1993 12:03 | 12 |
| Note that the Datsun/Nissan changeover didn't go exactly smoothly. My
'83 pickup truck is labeled, in various places, either 'Datsun',
'Nissan', or 'Datsun by Nissan'. This all on one vehicle.
This actually worked to my advantage; when I went to register the truck
(bought used at a good price) and pay the sales tax, the computer
didn't list a 1983 Datsun 720 truck; it only listed the 1983 as a
Nissan 720.. so they RMV clerk said "Well, we don't have a book value
for that truck, so I guess we'll have to accept the sale price for tax
purposes".. That saved me about a hundred bucks..
...tom
|
2568.63 | why we should stick to one name for good business sense | STAR::ABBASI | | Tue Jul 13 1993 12:58 | 14 |
| i think that we should just pick one name and just stick to it!, name
recognitions is very important in the eye of the customer, keep
changing our names is not a good idea, just pick a good sounding
name and dont change it for crying out loud, if we ourselves are
confused what our name now is, how out our customers and
the people outside?
i have never been more confused befor in my whole wide life about a
name than this one.
i say, enough is enough, one name, one company must be our new motto from
now on.
\nasser
|
2568.64 | | SUBURB::THOMASH | The Devon Dumpling | Tue Jul 13 1993 13:05 | 15 |
|
When I joined in 84, I was told that we should say Digital Equipment ltd
when picking up the 'phone, and never use DEC.
Every year since I have been told we are no longer DEC, and are
now Digital.
I wouldn't never have thought of calling us DEC......until I heard
all these messages, year after year, saying we weren't.
I wonder if all this publicity is working against it's desired effect?
And I wonder if we were ever officially DEC
Heather
|
2568.65 | | TLE::TOKLAS::FELDMAN | Opportunities are our Future | Tue Jul 13 1993 14:59 | 11 |
| There's a secondary factor influencing car names. Ironically, Nissan is
once again this year's example. The Nissan Altima has a small sticker or
nameplate somewhere, technically naming it the Stanza Altima. The reason
is that Federal regulations make it very expensive to introduce a new
line, but cheaper to give new subdesignations for existing lines
(regardless of how much engineering they have in common). So, for this
year, the Altima is a type of Stanza. These rules probably influenced the
"Datsun by Nissan" transition (and I think the Corolla Tercel -> Tercel
evolution).
Gary
|
2568.66 | What about old product names? | BULEAN::ABERDALE | | Tue Jul 13 1993 17:09 | 22 |
| Is it any wonder that so many are confused about our Company name? It
seems that our product names themselves encourage the confusion.
Many of our products are named DECfoo (DECserver, DECmcc, DECwindows to
name a few) while others are not. Are there plans in the works to
rename DECproducts to alleviate confusion? I know that sounds like
a costly proposal. However, I wonder if whoever chose Digital over DEC
ever considered the mixed message we still give our customers if we
continue to sell DECproducts.
Certainly other companies such as McDonald's have been successful at
distinguishing many of their products with company name prefixes.
Sure, it's a great idea _if_ it doesn't lead to confusion. Imagine
what you'd think if you purchased MECfries made by McDonald's Eatery
Corporation (I know that's not McDonald's real name, but please bear
with me for demonstration purposes). Wouldn't you wonder if MEC and
McDonald's were the same company?
Personally, I would prefer the name DEC, but I'll use Digital since
I'm not qualified to make those DECisions ;-)
- LL
|
2568.67 | | AIMHI::BOWLES | | Tue Jul 13 1993 17:37 | 14 |
| I don't think this point has been made before (at least in this
iteration of the discussion of names)........
I know there are exceptions, but don't most companies with initials for
names pronounce all the letters? For example, IBM, HP, GM, NEC, etc.
You don't say Ibum, or Hup, or Gum or Neck, do you?
However, for some reason, we are referred to as DEC (as in Deck), not
D. E. C.
Of course, we *could* have changed our official name to DEC (as in
D. E. C.), but that would have been too easy.
Chet
|
2568.68 | Well... | WHO301::BOWERS | Dave Bowers @WHO | Tue Jul 13 1993 18:39 | 5 |
| Actually, quite a few folks of my acquaintance pronounce NEC as "neck".
The "ibum" pronunciation for IBM has also been heard here in IBM's back
yard (WHO is only a few miles from IBM headquarters in Armonk).
\dave
|
2568.69 | | WREATH::DEVLIN | It's just time to say hor d'oevre... | Tue Jul 13 1993 19:20 | 5 |
| When I was at IBM, I never heard anyone say IBUM....
Now, I did hear "Itsy Bitsy Machines.."
JD
|
2568.71 | It is a pleasure to waste time on this frivolous sbject. | BONNET::WLODEK | Network pathologist. | Wed Jul 14 1993 07:13 | 10 |
|
Well, reading the Digital World ( former DEC World ) you can find a
quote saying "improve name recognition for Digital and DEC ".
So, the company focuses on Digital while DEC is still and will be also
company name for years.
If a name like DEC can't be eradicated by an ukaz in 5 minutes maybe
this name has some value the new one does not .
|
2568.72 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Wed Jul 14 1993 08:09 | 11 |
| I was giving this some thought yesterday. There are some clever,
observant and articulate people still left in this company. How is it
that by the time they get to offer an opinion, the irreversible
decision has already been made? Anyway, that's by-the-by, the point is:
I wonder how many of the "pro-Digital" camp would be able to resist
scathing comments and ridicule if IBM suddenly decided to call
themselves "International", because it's exactly the same thing as us
calling ourselves "Digital". and wrong for all the same reasons.
Laurie.
|
2568.73 | Displacing digital in the mind | SDSVAX::SWEENEY | You are what you retrieve | Wed Jul 14 1993 12:00 | 25 |
| "International" was in fact the nickname for "International Harvester"
once upon a time a company substantially larger than IBM.
"International" became "Navistar".
"Digital" is a poor name because it needs not only to establish the
name identity of the company but also to _displace_ what people already
believe "Digital" to mean in their lives.
Previous examples of Exxon, Nissan, and even Navistar above did not
need to displace a word with a meaning that was understood.
"Digital" to the people who don't consider themselves to be high-tech
is assocated with clocks, watches, etc. because that's where they have
seen this unfamiliar word used in advertising: a display in digits
rather than position.
"Digital" in its new high-tech usage refers to digital recording of
audio, video, and text. This is an area where the company has a
minuscule impact on consumers relative to the efforts of Apple,
Microsoft, and others to start a digital media revolution.
"Digital Equipment" was a clever play to the mindset of investment
bankers of 36 years ago. Today, it's a name that not only says nothing
to consumers. It's a name that contradicts what people, low-tech and
high-tech believe "digital" to mean.
|
2568.74 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Wed Jul 14 1993 12:48 | 8 |
| RE: .73
Wot 'e said.
I'm still waiting for answers to the questions I asked that touched
upon all that...
Laurie.
|
2568.75 | | SUBURB::THOMASH | The Devon Dumpling | Thu Jul 15 1993 10:18 | 20 |
| Well, someone's noticed we've changed our name!!!!!
VAX AT YOUR FINGERTIPS IN THE DIGITAL BRITISH LIBRARY
Digital, or DEC as the rest of the world insists on saying, are
sponsoring the new British Library, Bull's Eye Column makes the humble
suggestion that a program could be inserted to alter the DEC to Digital
wherever it occurs. Giving Digitalade rather than Decade, and
replacing obsolete words like "product" and "box" with the more snappy
"solution" (eg. Daddy went to the toy shop and bought a
Jack-In-The-Solution which an on site support team will seamlessly
integrate into my open play environment). The dry and dusty reference
library could make way for the sparkling new slogan "Digital: Vax at
your Vingertips".
Banking Technology, London. July/August 1993.
Heather
|
2568.76 | | WREATH::DEVLIN | It's just time to say hor d'oevre... | Thu Jul 15 1993 13:39 | 17 |
| Again - everysingle piece of official Digital correspondence or literature I
have ever seen or received has DIGITAL - and not DEC.
I really don't see what is so hard about it. Digital is the name. Digital
has, as far as I have known - never been known officially as DEC. I don't
recall any adverstitsing as "DEC". IBM has always (well, since they
changed from the Computation Tabulatin Company or whatever..) been IBM -
I worked there, and there was never any confusion.
The equipment in my office says "Digital" = not DEC.
My Business Cards say "Digital" not DEC.
DEC is an acronym, and acronyms are convenient ways to lessen speach - they are
also overused. My pay stub says DIGITAL, not DEC.
JD
|
2568.77 | Even if we get it right, what about customers and the press? | VMSMKT::KENAH | Escapes,Lies,Truth,Passion,Miracles | Thu Jul 15 1993 13:54 | 9 |
| >I really don't see what is so hard about it. Digital is the name. Digital
>has, as far as I have known - never been known officially as DEC.
You continue to confuse official policy with reality.
Many of our customers and the press call us DEC. A major industry
journal is called DEC Professional. We use DEC in hundreds of our
product names. This is reality.
|
2568.78 | | CVG::THOMPSON | Radical Centralist | Thu Jul 15 1993 14:06 | 10 |
| > You continue to confuse official policy with reality.
>
> Many of our customers and the press call us DEC. A major industry
> journal is called DEC Professional. We use DEC in hundreds of our
> product names. This is reality.
Some people have their minds made up already. You do no favor by trying
to confuse the issue with facts. :-)
Alfred
|
2568.79 | | WREATH::DEVLIN | It's just time to say hor d'oevre... | Thu Jul 15 1993 14:18 | 9 |
| I've used Digital with all customers I've dealt with - including all my stints
on location at customer sites (for up to 1.5 years...) There was NO confusion
about Digital being Digital Equipment Corporation, or DEC being an acronym
for the company name.
Perhaps I've been blessed with working with customers that have some ability
to think.
JD
|
2568.80 | | SPECXN::WITHERS | Bob Withers | Thu Jul 15 1993 16:35 | 16 |
| But, you may be using DECNotes on a terminal connected to a DECServer or using
DECWindows on your workstation. Your labour reporting system may be using
DECForms, or you may use DECcalc or DECwrite. (I hope I got all the
casification correct :-)
cheers,
BobW
>================================================================================
>Note 2568.76 Digital's new brand image 76 of 79
>WREATH::DEVLIN "It's just time to say hor d'oevre..." 17 lines 15-JUL-1993 09:39
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Again - everysingle piece of official Digital correspondence or literature I
>have ever seen or received has DIGITAL - and not DEC.
>
>JD
|
2568.81 | | SPECXN::WITHERS | Bob Withers | Thu Jul 15 1993 16:49 | 12 |
| I couldn't decide whether to put this here, or in the "Digital isn't what we
do" note, or one of the related theme notes, but I was pondering name
recognition as I shopped for a disk drive. The names I though of were:
Conner (someone's name)
Storage Tech (meaningful and descriptive)
Quantum (a unit of measurement or capacity)
MAXTOR (a play on MAXimum STORage)
and the one that struck me was that "Digital" evoke *no* mental image.
BobW
|
2568.82 | | TOPDOC::AHERN | Dennis the Menace | Thu Jul 15 1993 17:16 | 6 |
| RE: .80 by SPECXN::WITHERS
>But, you may be using DECNotes on a terminal connected to a DECServer or using
What's DECNotes? Is that anything like VAXnotes?
|
2568.83 | Digital the oposite of Analog | MIMS::STILL_G | | Thu Jul 15 1993 17:19 | 11 |
| .81
Digital does provide a mental Image as it did when the company started.
Digital as opposed to Analog electronic circuits; the basic electronic
circuit of todays computer!
Also the only way Digital will become a house hold name is to Advertise
to the common house hold via what common house hold watchs on TV.
Sports and sitcoms! But is that what we want
|
2568.84 | Look at Intel | MIMS::STILL_G | | Thu Jul 15 1993 17:28 | 5 |
|
As a after thought! Look at Intel! The average person did not
understand the 286 processor and who made it until the "Intel inside"
TV ad and they did not even Have a ad on PBS! Where did we go wrong.
|
2568.85 | running old software are you? :-) | CVG::THOMPSON | Radical Centralist | Thu Jul 15 1993 17:29 | 7 |
| > What's DECNotes? Is that anything like VAXnotes?
Yes, version V2.4 and later calls itself DEC Notes. All products that
run on platforms other than VAX, such as AXP etc, are going to this I
hear.
Alfred
|
2568.86 | | TOPDOC::AHERN | Dennis the Menace | Thu Jul 15 1993 19:10 | 9 |
| RE: .85 by CVG::THOMPSON
>> What's DECNotes? Is that anything like VAXnotes?
>Yes, version V2.4 and later calls itself DEC Notes. All products that
>run on platforms other than VAX, such as AXP etc, are going to this I hear.
Gee, maybe we shoulda called it just "Notes". Too late, huh?
|
2568.87 | DGTL | SMURF::SHIDERLY | | Thu Jul 15 1993 21:23 | 5 |
| Isn't a major historical reason why we are known as DEC that DEC is our
stock symbol?
Why don't we change the stock symbol to something like DGTL or DTL or
DGL?
|
2568.88 | "Digital" .. D in Lit | PLOUGH::OLSEN | | Thu Jul 15 1993 21:32 | 23 |
| FWIW, I had an enlightening experience this last week on vacation.
Being on vacation, I pointedly ignored tracking the news, especially
business news. Returning to the airport, after a week out-of-touch,
we passed a building (US WEST) carrying the message "Now we're
digital".
The thought just popped into my head...who's gonna pay my salary next
week, if they're digital?
I understand WHAT we're trying to communicate, particularly by linking
"Digital" to the COMPANY of putting innovative people to solving
customer problems. But I don't like the way we're DOING the
communication. If you were a teacher of language, and one student
adopted a stylistic device "Digital", awkwardly, what grade would
you be likly to give?
Frankly, I don't have to be a week away from news. Any morning, on
the way in to work, any news containing the word "digital" gets my
attention.
Rich
|
2568.89 | | NETRIX::thomas | The Code Warrior | Thu Jul 15 1993 21:47 | 4 |
| I have to wonder why our name is a adjective instead of a noun.
Even in our name we use Digital as an adjective (Digital Equipment).
But we use a noun (DEC or 'deck') as an adjective (DECnet, DECnotes,
DECsystem). The illiteracy of it all.
|
2568.90 | | SDSVAX::SWEENEY | You are what you retrieve | Thu Jul 15 1993 22:11 | 11 |
| (1) The company was known as "DEC" before Digital was a stock.
(2) The historical reason why the company was called "Digital
Equipment" ought to be known by every employee. Investment bankers
were reluctant to fund "computer" companies in 1957 out of fear of the
giants Univac and IBM. "DEC" is the obvious abbreviation and was used
by the company for its products very early.
(3) "DGL" is too close to "DGN" for Data General. NYSE stocks have 3
letter symbols. "DTL" could be used, but it's unlikely that would be
changed.
|
2568.91 | I always introduce myself as from "Digital Equipment" | ZPOVC::HWCHOY | Mostly on FIRE! | Fri Jul 16 1993 00:11 | 15 |
2568.92 | small nits on "digital" being not a noun | STAR::ABBASI | | Fri Jul 16 1993 07:44 | 6 |
| .89
i dont think "digital" is an adjectives, it is a noun. as in
i work for "digital", it must be a noun!
\nasser
|
2568.93 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Fri Jul 16 1993 12:47 | 9 |
| Nasser,
In DECspeak, "digital" is a noun. Out there in the real world, it's an
adjective. Now all we have to do is firstly to convince everyone that
"digital" is a noun, and secondly, to undo the fact that there are so
many instances where the word "digital" is used as an adjective. That
should be pretty cheap, and very good value for money.
Helpfully, Laurie.
|
2568.94 | | WREATH::DEVLIN | It's just time to say hor d'oevre... | Fri Jul 16 1993 14:06 | 14 |
| re ,91
So, who cares if logic modules from the 60's had DEC on them? Ancient, insignificant
doesn't matter.
As for the trademark issue - look at what you wrote "...DEC....is a trademark
of Digital Equipment Corporation..."
It doesn't say "DEC is a trademark of DEC" Isn't DEC too much like NEC - it
might get confused....using the logic of many in here...isn't DEC too much
like DECK - folks might think we build decks for houses....perhaps its
too close to DUCK - folks might think we are daffy...
JD
|
2568.95 | | MARX::GRIER | mjg's holistic computing agency | Fri Jul 16 1993 14:31 | 10 |
| Re: .94:
The point about the Flip Chips etc. having "d e c" on them was that
someone in a previous reply claimed that there was never any official
Digital communications referring to the corporation by its TLA. The
point was to demonstrate that to be true, and as I recall, the three
letters were in lower case, which means that it wasn't an acronym.
Probably a mistake at the time, but it doesn't alter the reality.
-mjg
|
2568.96 | another net about the sound of our company | STAR::ABBASI | | Fri Jul 16 1993 14:35 | 7 |
| .94
JD, i dont think "DEC" sounds close to "DUCK", with DUCK you pull you lips
up, with DEC they go downwords, at least with me they do.
\nasser
|
2568.97 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Fri Jul 16 1993 14:53 | 5 |
| Perhaps we should be "Digital Equipment" or "Dee Eee" for short. No
silly trademark problems there, and "Digital Equipment" is a proper
name. Even IBM (sorry: International) drop the "Corporation" from theirs.
Laurie.
|
2568.98 | if this energy could be channeled to real problems | LGP30::FLEISCHER | without vision the people perish (381-0899 ZKO2-2/T63) | Fri Jul 16 1993 15:20 | 15 |
| re Note 2568.97 by PLAYER::BROWNL:
> Perhaps we should be "Digital Equipment" or "Dee Eee" for short. No
> silly trademark problems there, and "Digital Equipment" is a proper
> name. Even IBM (sorry: International) drop the "Corporation" from theirs.
I almost always say "Digital Equipment" because "Digital"
alone is often misunderstood, ""Digital Equipment
Corporation" is too long, and "DEC" goes against policy.
Of course, as reported by many others, usually when I say
"Digital Equipment" the person to whom I am speaking says
something to the effect "Oh, you work for DEC..."
Bob
|
2568.99 | And away-y-y-y we go-o-o-o-o! | AMCUCS::YOUNG | I'd like to be...under the sea... | Fri Jul 16 1993 21:24 | 255 |
| Posted following extraction from e-mail
From: DECPA::"""v.p.,u.s.area""@a1.sales.mro.MTS.dec.com" "Russ Gullotti @MRO" 16-JUL-1993 13:48:49.40
To: distribution:; (see end of body)
CC:
Subj: Registering of word, "Digital" -- attention required 1
[This message is converted from WPS-PLUS to ASCII]
Letter from Russ Gullotti:
Our "digital" logo has always been registered as our trademark. We also
want to register the word, "Digital." However, the trademark examiner is
contending that the word "Digital" is a descriptive term. So, to obtain
registration, we must convince the Trademark Trial and Appeal Board in
Washington that the term "Digital" has acquired "distinctiveness" or
"secondary meaning" denoting Digital Equipment Corporation.
Our lawyers have requested that we provide them with 250 declarations from
our customers -- preferably the heads of Purchasing Departments -- confirming
that when they hear the word "Digital," it means hardware and software that
has been manufactured or licensed by Digital Equipment Corporation. When
our customers are resellers, we need them to affirm that when their clients
say "Digital," they mean one of our products.
The only way we can gather these declarations is through personal contact
with customers by our Sales Reps and Account Managers.
Unfortunately, we must have the 250 declarations in hand by July 30, 1993
if we are to make a timely filing with the Trademark Trial and Appeal
Board. I am requesting that you obtain signed declarations from your customers
and that you send them by Federal Express to:
Digital Law Department
ATTN: Todd Hammond
111 Powdermill Road
Maynard, MA 01754
to be received by July 30.
Attached is a one page guideline for the information that must be included
in the declaration. Two sample declarations are also attached to show you
how an end user or reseller could prepare them, although it will be more
effective if they are not all worded exactly the same. Should you need
further advice, please contact one of the members of the Digital Law
Department listed below.
Getting registered trademark protection for the word "Digital" may seem
like a small detail, but it is a very important aspect of our branding
initiative. I urge all of you to cooperate fully with this effort by
carrying out the actions outlined.
Law department contacts:
Regional Law Offices:
Alpharetta, GA John Henderson (404) 772-2517 @ALF
Dallas, TX Jeff Smith (214) 702-4210 @SCA
Elk Grove, IL Norma Sutton (708) 806-2530 @ACI
Irvine, CA Jan Sukrau (714) 261-4147 @IVO
Greenbelt, MD Kevin Harley (301) 918-5160 @COP
Landover, MD Jeff Schneider (301) 306-2437 @DCO
New York, NY Stephana Colbert (212) 856-2894 @NYO
Maynard Law Department is @MSO:
Angie Busby (508) 493-2778
Todd Hammond (508) 493-5072
Jan LaRue (508) 493-8943
Sylvia Reul (508) 493-5468
Dick Smith (508) 493-8266
Guidelines for Information to be included in customer declaration for
registering the word "Digital" as a trademark
Please make sure that the DECLARATION is written on the company's
letterhead and includes the following three parts:
Part 1 describes the person who signs the declaration:
- full name followed by "declare as follows:";
- current position and title;
- company name;
- time in present position;
- prior positions and/or employers (if relevant;
- explanation how he/she is familiar with the use of the term
"Digital" as it relates to computer products (e.g. he/she is
responsible for an annual budget of X $ for information technology;
he/she has been selling computer products for X years, etc.).
Part 2 makes a distinction between end users and resellers. Each must
contain variations of the following two themes:
- When he/she hears of "Digital" computer products, such as "Digital"
computers, hardware, software or peripherals, he/she assumes that
Digital Equipment Corporation has manufactured or endorsed the
product.
- To him/her, "Digital" signifies a brand of computer hardware,
software and peripherals manufactured by or affiliated with Digital
Equipment Corporation, rather than a type of computer hardware,
software or peripheral available from any number of companies.
The reseller should in addition include language to the effect that:
- It is his/her experience that when customers request a "Digital"
computer, "Digital" hardware, "Digital" software or "Digital"
computer peripherals, they are asking for a product manufactured or
licensed by Digital Equipment Corporation, and not for a type of
computer hardware, software or peripheral available from any source.
Part 3 - The last sentence should read:
"I declare under penalty of perjury that all of the foregoing is true
and correct pursuant to 28 U.S.C. Section 1746.
Dated: _____________________ Signature: __________________________"
For your information: Pursuant to the 28 U.S.C. Section 1746 "under
penalty of perjury" language, a person who knowingly makes a false
material declaration can theoretically be prosecuted for criminal
perjury and if convicted can be fined up to $ 10,000, imprisoned for
up to five years, or both (18 U.S.C Sections 1621 - 1623).
Attached please find a sample with different wording examples.
Sample End User Declaration
DECLARATION
I, John X. Smith, declare as follows:
I have been managing the Purchasing Department of XYZ Corporation
since June, 1986; in my capacity as Purchasing Manager I am
responsible for an annual budget of approx. $ 4 million for information
technology. Prior to joining XYZ I spent 10 years in the purchasing
department of RST Company where my responsibility included hardware
and software acquisition. I have been purchasing computer products
for the past 17 years.
Language alternatives:
1. When I hear of, ...
2. To me, the terms...; In my view, the terms...; In my opinion, the
terms ...
3. I understand ..
... "Digital" computers, "Digital" hardware, "Digital" software or
"Digital" computer peripherals, ...
1. ... I assume ...
2. ... mean, indicate, stand for the fact, show ...
3. ... to mean ...
... that Digital Equipment Corporation has manufactured or endorsed
the product.
To me, ...; In my view, ... In my opinion; "Digital" signifies a
brand of computer hardware, software and peripherals manufactured by
or affiliated with Digital Equipment Corporation, rather than a type
of computer hardware, software or peripherals available from any
number of companies.
I declare under penalty of perjury that all of the foregoing is true
and correct pursuant to 28 U.S.C. Section 1746.
Dated: _____________________ Signature: __________________________"
Sample Reseller Declaration
DECLARATION
I, John X. Smith, declare as follows:
I have been managing the Sales Department of XYZ Company since June,
1986; in my capacity as Sales Manager I am responsible for annual
revenues of approx. $ 42 million. Prior to joining XYZ I spent 10 years
selling RST Company computers. I have been selling computer products
for the past 17 years.
Language Alternatives:
1. When I hear of, ...
2. To me, the terms...; In my view, the terms...; In my opinion, the
terms ...
3. I understand ..
... "Digital" computers, "Digital" hardware, "Digital" software or
"Digital" computer peripherals, ...
1. ... I assume ...
2. ... mean, indicate, stand for the fact, show ...
3. ... to mean ...
... that Digital Equipment Corporation has manufactured or endorsed
the product.
To me, ...; In my view, ... In my opinion; "Digital" signifies a
brand of computer hardware, software and peripherals manufactured by
or affiliated with Digital Equipment Corporation, rather than a type
of computer hardware, software or peripherals available from any
number of companies.
It is my experience...; I have experienced ...; My experience
shows...;
... that when customers request a "Digital" computer, a "Digital"
computer program or a "Digital" computer peripheral, they are asking
for a product manufactured or licensed by Digital Equipment
Corporation, and not a type of computer, computer peripheral or
software available from any source.
I declare under penalty of perjury that all of the foregoing is true
and correct pursuant to 28 U.S.C. Section 1746.
Dated: _____________________ Signature: __________________________"
%%% overflow headers %%%
<removed>
%%% end overflow headers %%%
% ====== Internet headers and postmarks (see DECWRL::GATEWAY.DOC) ======
% Received: by mts-gw.pa.dec.com; id AA24528; Fri, 16 Jul 93 13:42:27 -0700
% Received: from umc by mts-gw.pa.dec.com via MR/WRLMTS with conversational-MRIF; Fri, 16 Jul 93 13:42:27 -070
% Posted: Fri, 16 Jul 93 20:35:01 -0700
% Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 20:14:01 -0700
% Sender: "v.p.,u.s.area"@a1.sales.mromts.MTS.dec.com
% From: "Russ Gullotti @MRO" <"v.p.,u.s.area"@a1.sales.mro.MTS.dec.com>
% Message-Id: <40830261703991/673929@SALES>
% To: distribution:; (see end of body)
% Subject: Registering of word, "Digital" -- attention required 1
% Msg-Class: !AS
|
2568.100 | Isn't it marvelous. | A1VAX::GUNN | I couldn't possibly comment | Fri Jul 16 1993 22:19 | 9 |
| re: .99
If some other manufacturer presented a similar request to Digital folk
our lawyers would tell us the nobody should sign a letter like that.
The rationale would be that signature commits Digital to something
obscure obligation, requires nineteen levels of approval, a six month
task force and a three inch thick procedures manual and, in the end,
only a corporate officer can sign it. Digital might even appoint
another VP specially to sign it :-) !
|
2568.101 | Good Grief! | MIMS::PARISE_M | Contemplating mid-life cruises... | Sat Jul 17 1993 02:57 | 7 |
|
Re: .99
If this memo is not a hoax, I'm not saying anything.
The tone of immediacy and desperation is a little discomforting.
|
2568.102 | Oh dear | SMAUG::GARROD | From VMS -> NT, Unix a future page from history | Sat Jul 17 1993 13:41 | 25 |
| At first I thought this was a hoax. But I don't think so given all the
real people listed in it.
Unfortunately I think this will make us the laughing stock of our
customers and resellers. The idiots responsible for picking the word
"Digital" for our branding campaign rather than the acronymn "DEC" and
a logo that kept the old "digital" blocks and somehow added the letters
"DEC" to them will now find out that very very few people think of the
company "Digital Equipment Corporation" when the adjective "Digital"
is spoken or written in its non trademarked farm. Sure the logo has
some recognition but not the word.
I think the trasdemark examiner is dead right. I can't believe the
arrogance of a company that wants to trademark an extremely generic
adjective.
So are any of you who are in contact with customers going to risk your
own credibility by making the request in .99 to them?
Please tell me this is a hoax. Better still please tell me it's a hoax
that Digital Equipment Corporation is running our brand identity around
the word Digital. Running it around the current logo (be it with round
or square dots) is only slightly more credible.
Dave
|
2568.103 | Time to keep an eye on Matco's column | SMAUG::GARROD | From VMS -> NT, Unix a future page from history | Sat Jul 17 1993 13:45 | 4 |
| Any guesses what Charlie Matco's next column is going to be about? No
I'm not sending it to him but I bet someone does.
Dave
|
2568.104 | No wonder there are so many lawyer jokes | FUNYET::ANDERSON | OpenVMS Forever! | Sat Jul 17 1993 15:35 | 3 |
| I can't wait to show this to one of my customers.
Paul
|
2568.105 | Just got back from the movies, and at the entrance: | RDVAX::KALIKOW | Partially sage, & rarely on time | Sat Jul 17 1993 18:29 | 13 |
|
there was a sign...
+---------------+
| Jurassic Park |
| digital |
+---------------+
P.S.-- the sound system WAS awesome.
:-)
P.P.S.-- :-(
|
2568.106 | What did DEC have to do with making of Jurassic Park | SMAUG::GARROD | From VMS -> NT, Unix a future page from history | Sat Jul 17 1993 19:43 | 7 |
| Did DEC have something to do with the movie? I too saw the word
"digital" that DEC are so desperately trying to make their own on the
signs for Jurassic park. Let's hope that Digital Equipment Corporation
doesn't get association in the public mind with dinosaurs. Although
reading the USENET that appears to be happening to some extent.
Dave
|
2568.107 | | MIMS::PARISE_M | Contemplating mid-life cruises... | Sat Jul 17 1993 20:10 | 5 |
|
.....and "Introducing DIGITAL MUSIC EXPRESS!"...
Damn, is that annoying.
|
2568.108 | Re .106/.105, sorry for the lack of :-) Dave... | RDVAX::KALIKOW | Partially sage, & rarely on time | Sun Jul 18 1993 00:18 | 14 |
| ... but .105 was meant to be wry. I didn't expect any affiliation of
Digital Equipment Corporation with the technologies used in Jurassic
Park (though for sure an Alpha AXP(tm) system would not have been out
of place for some of the computer graphics (if the necessary app were
ported in time)). Nor did I see any mention of Digital Equipment
Corporation in the extensive credits. Rather, I believe, the prominent
mention of "digital" on the internal marquee referred to some nifty
sort of digital sound system, whose brand name I have conveniently
forgotten.
:-}
Dan
|
2568.109 | DTS == Digital Theater Sound | ALAMOS::ADAMS | Visualize Whirled Peas! | Sun Jul 18 1993 05:51 | 4 |
| DEC, oops, I mean Digital Theater Sound. Sure made the movie more
enjoyable.
--- Gavin
|
2568.110 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Mon Jul 19 1993 11:16 | 12 |
| RE: .99
You'd think, wouldn't you, that they'd have sorted a teensy little
detail like that out, BEFORE spending time, effort and money on a
"branding" campaign.
I agree, the trademark people are quite correct, and only pointing out
what we've been saying for ages.
I'm still awaiting answers to my questions...
Laurie.
|
2568.111 | 250 customers who think we're digital? uh-hun | DNEAST::BEICHMAN_JOH | | Mon Jul 19 1993 12:50 | 15 |
| Correct me if I'm wrong (always an unnecessary line in this notes
file), but wasn't there quite alot of discussion about one reason we
(DEC/Digital) embarked on this branding campaign is that many of our
customers were confused about DEC/Digital? To the point they thought
DEC & Digital are two different companies? And now we need 250 of
these confused customers to sign a legal document stating they always
think of our computers/networks/(and IBM-clone PCs) when they see
digital?
Un-effing-believable.
I'm gonna put my face back on the grindstone now -- the pain distracts
me -- and wait to see if TSFO jr (in Q2) drops to 2 weeks + 1wk/yr.
johnb
|
2568.113 | Affords very little protection even if we get it... | SPECXN::KANNAN | | Mon Jul 19 1993 14:11 | 10 |
|
...The Trademark laws in the U.S are designed in such a way that the more
obscure the word is, the more protection the law provides you. The trademark
examiner might even award the trademark to us, but anyone can use the
word with impunity since it's closer to English than most words in the
technical realm.
Nari
|
2568.114 | computer credits | LGP30::FLEISCHER | without vision the people perish (381-0899 ZKO2-2/T63) | Mon Jul 19 1993 14:46 | 14 |
| re Note 2568.108 by RDVAX::KALIKOW:
> Nor did I see any mention of Digital Equipment
> Corporation in the extensive credits.
A number of computer companies were mentioned in the credits.
The most prominent reference seemed to be to Thinking
Machines (whose logo was used in the credits and which was
referred to by name in the credits).
Bob
P.S. Every time I see a re-run of "Ghostbusters" it gives me
a thrill just to see the Rainbow on the desk. :-}
|
2568.115 | My hands are "digital" | CORPRL::RALTO | It's all part of the show! | Mon Jul 19 1993 16:27 | 15 |
| I just bought a telephone whose product name is:
Digital Answering System
Interesting that it wasn't a description of the product, or even
the name of a feature of the product, it was the actual product
name for the entire unit.
Now, it was made (or at least distributed) by some outfit calling
themselves "General Electric". Darn good thing they didn't try
calling it a General telephone.
Or, even worse, a General Digital Answering System!
Chris
|
2568.116 | | SEND::KILGORE | Adiposilly challenged | Tue Jul 20 1993 13:28 | 15 |
|
Re: "Jurassic Park" replies
Heard on the net...
What's the difference between "Jurassic Park" and Digital Equipment
Corp?
One is a high-tech amusement park with a bunch of old dinosaurs running
around...
...and the other is a movie.
|
2568.117 | Digital on the west coast? | 2679::UNCAGD::CLARK | TBD | Tue Jul 20 1993 13:55 | 4 |
| Mentioned in this week's Computer World:
Advanced Digital Information Corp.
in Redmond, WA
|
2568.118 | Accountability? | ODIXIE::SILVERS | Dave, have POQET will travel | Tue Jul 20 1993 15:00 | 5 |
| I'd suspect that even with 250 letters (that stuff about 'under penalty
of perjury' will keep ALOT of reps from even showing this to customers
...), we'll have a hard time trademarking 'digital'. Wanna bet that
noone will be held 'accountable' for not doing this BEFORE spending all
those ad $$$?
|
2568.119 | What should we know?? | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Tue Jul 20 1993 16:19 | 23 |
| Has the name 'Digital' not been trademarked already? How come, seeing
as they are advertising, telling us it is Digital and so on. Do we
really need 250 people's signatures to get anything done?
Also, I was just re-reading Digital World - the issue about the new
branding campaign. It stated that many employees were asked about the
new branding campaign and able to give their opinions etc. Who are
they - are there any of you out there, if so please tell me what they
told and asked you? Also, can anyone else tell me the types of
information they received/are receiving about the new branding policy
and how employees should be reflecting it. I have not seen anything,
but am hoping I am an isolated case.
Also, Laurie - in relation to note .110, I have lost track of what your
questions were. If you still want them answered, please repeat them
and I will if I or anyone else has the answers.
I hope that I am not the only person getting more and more confused
about the branding policy!!
Hannah
|
2568.120 | | MU::PORTER | none of the above | Tue Jul 20 1993 17:07 | 16 |
| Employee 'branding' questionnaire:
Your Name _______________________
Your Resource ID ________________
(formerly known as Badge Number)
Q1. Do you want to keep your job? yes[ ] no[ ]
Q2. Do you agree that "digital" is
a really nifty idea, and is the
right name for this company? yes[ ] no[ ]
|
2568.121 | :-) | XLIB::SCHAFER | Mark Schafer, Development Assistance | Tue Jul 20 1993 21:04 | 1 |
| where do they put the Employee brand? Does it hurt?
|
2568.122 | DEC MKO1 Hedges Its Bets On New Company Name | NRSTA2::KALIKOW | Partially sage, & rarely on time | Tue Jul 20 1993 21:52 | 29 |
| MERRIMACK, NH (A_P_not), 20 July 1993: This reporter visited the
Merrimack campus of Digital Equipment Corporation(tm) today, and
reports to his UTTER confusion that there is a large ornamental topiary
hedge just outside the MKO1 Lobby entrance. Contrary to his
expectation (having just been asked by his friendly (but unaccountably
blushing?) Digital Equipment Corporation Sales Representative to sign a
fairly involved and intimidating legal representation concerning the
meaning, to him, of the generic adjective "DIGITAL" -- (FYI, you may be
amused and/or relieved to hear that (under penalty of perjury, mind
you) I asserted that DIGITAL denotes to me "DIGITAL EQUIPMENT
CORPORATION")) -- that the topiary hedge would have 7 letters in it, I
was Shocked, SHOCKED I say, to find that while the old familiar "D" was
first in the set of three letters cut into the hedge, that there were
two other upstart letters following it, neither of which is to be found
in "IGITAL."
As I left, I further observed that MKO staff were being exhorted to Do
The Right Thing with shears kindly being provided by the Legal staff.
One hopes that the proper order of things was restored.
PS -- Truth to tell, my primary association of "DIGITAL" with "DIGITAL
EQUIPMENT CORPORATION" stems from the fact that I am, in fact, not an
employee of A_P_not, but of DEC *whoops* DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORPORATION.
PPS -- major :-)
Dan
|
2568.123 | it's something in the water | XLIB::SCHAFER | Mark Schafer, Development Assistance | Wed Jul 21 1993 17:16 | 2 |
| Gee, I thought the hedges grew like that naturally in New Hampshire.
:-)
|
2568.124 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The match has gone out | Thu Jul 22 1993 15:30 | 6 |
| RE: .119
Hannah, my questions were posed in .25, in the last two paragraphs. In
a way, they've been overtaken by events, but still remain unanswered..
Laurie.
|
2568.125 | "Please make the pain go away, Doctor." | MBALDY::LANGSTON | The secret is strong ears. | Fri Jul 23 1993 07:39 | 13 |
| The interesting thing to me about this is that, as a field (formerly
associated with sales, as Sales Support and now associated with Digital
Consulting, though still as Sales Support - Damn! This computer
business is complicated!) person, and, until very recently, an
extremely indirect (there must be at least 10 layers of management, 11
of which are veepees) report of Russ's, I didn't receive the memo
referenced in .99!
What's even more interesting (sick, you might say) is that I'm staring
into this liquid crystal diode, communicating and ruminating about it
at 12:35 in the morning!
Bruce
|
2568.126 | LCD=Liquid Crystal Display | POLAR::SAVOV | | Fri Jul 23 1993 22:22 | 10 |
| Re: .125
Maybe you mean a liquid crystal display (LCD)? :-). I can tell it
must be late at night (or early in the morning) for you.
I couldn't resist it.
Cheers,
Emil
|
2568.127 | Some answers | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Tue Jul 27 1993 10:40 | 55 |
| This note is in relation to Laurie's questions posed in .25 which
haven't really been answered. I am going to try to answer them
and hopefully provoke some more noting as this conference has come to a
gradual halt. The three points I gathered that Laurie was trying to
raise were:
~ a definition of branding
~ what Digital expects to gain from branding
~ why Digital was chosen over DEC
Ok. With the help of various books I have looked at, I'll try to
provide an insight into branding.
When a consumer chooses brand A rather than brand B, he or she is
identifying with that image, joining a club. The image is not a single
entity and it is difficult to make tangible. It is an impression which
to consumer perceives of the brand, a systhesis of many impressions as
a direct or indirect result of a variety of signals transmitted by the
brand (and perhaps the company) of which advertising is one. The
advertisement is part of the product which is to say thst the image is
part of the product. (Company Image and Reality - David Bernstein)
To me, this helps explain that Digital were/are trying to create some
form of consistency of image. Therefore advertising new messages to
bring together all impressions of Digital into one general idea, eg
imagination. The advertising campaign is not our actual brand, it is
just trying to establish the brand by the imagination idea, next time
it may be something else. The brand is Digital - not DEC, not
imagination, not anything but Digital.
I mailed Peter Phillips and in his mail back to me he helped explain
the Digital/DEC debate. DEC is actually a brand name of Digital;
Digital being the top level brand. DEC has the same brand theory as
does VAX, PDP and so on. DEC describes non-VMS operating systems just
as VMS describes a non-DEC operating system. The fact that DEC was
taken on board as a widely used name should indeed have been stopped
before it went as far as it has. But the fact remains that Digital in
some shape or form has always been the top level name.
Digital expects to gain a consistent and positive image through
branding. It is making an attempt (a bit late), to tighten the belt
and try to communicate the same message rather than a set of
conflicting messages. It is trying to establish one company, one name,
one set of pre-conceptions and one set of goals. Whether it succeeds
is the next question, but that remains to be seen.
I personally think that all of this could have been done in a much
different way, as can many other people. But the fact remains that it
has been done in this way, and we all just have to stick to it. How we
can when no one tells us anything I don't know, but I think that they
think that we know what we should be doing to reflect the campaign!
I hope this has helped answer some more questions and maybe helped in a
last ditch attempt to keep this conference going. Everyone - you can
all have your say here so go for it!
|
2568.128 | | PAOIS::HILL | An immigrant in Paris | Tue Jul 27 1993 11:26 | 10 |
| One of the things I heard was that we are known by a very large
proportion of the population.
Unfortunately, the way in which we are known is not consistent. One
sector knows us as Digital, another as DEC, another as PDP, another as
VAX, another as VMS and another as DECsomething.
The sum total is that we have an image problem.
Nick
|
2568.129 | Exactly! | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Tue Jul 27 1993 13:18 | 2 |
| Exactly, that is why all this effort is going on internally and
externally to create some form of consistency.
|
2568.130 | on utilizing media to improve name recognition | STAR::ABBASI | play chess, its good 4 u | Tue Jul 27 1993 13:46 | 13 |
| i still dont get it why we dont have Alpha chips advertisement blasted
all over on TV like Intel have all the time, especially the one in
conjecture with the amdex (?) stock exchange where they talk about the
chip in a nice commercial with lots of lights and colors and all, why
can't we too have commercials like that about Alpha on TV so people
can start catching the name of it?
i strongly believe that TV is the number one media to pollster any
name recognition, yet, over an over, we seem not to utilize it,
any one knows why we ignore the power of TV media in our advertisement
efforts?
\nasser
|
2568.131 | | QBUS::M_PARISE | Southern, but no comfort | Tue Jul 27 1993 15:03 | 17 |
| Hannah,
Your notes and enthusiasm are refreshing, but I can't help feeling that
Digital's branding campaign is a bit like trying to effect one's grade
point average mid-way through one's senior year.
You asked earlier how employees were exposed to the branding campaign.
I was only exposed to the notion of the branding campaign via NOTES and
the April publication of Digital World.
Notesfiles is virtually my primary information conduit regarding company
matters. (Excluding the SOP mail memos.)
Also, Re: .119, and the "suggestion" to 250 customers, etc.
Am I the only one who detected a thinly disguised solicitation to commit
perjury? Doesn't that at least border on questionable ethics and honesty?
Mike
|
2568.132 | | NRSTA2::KALIKOW | Partially sage, & rarely on time | Tue Jul 27 1993 15:14 | 7 |
| Mike, re your "thinly disguised solicitation..." phrase: that's why
the fictional salesperson in my .122 was blushing... that, and the
rather preposterous (imho) notion that any member of the Sales force
would VOLUNTARILY put one of their customers through that ordeal. I
should think it would take quite a bit of coercion on the part of their
management to induce them to broach such a form with a paying customer.
|
2568.133 | Digital the halls with boughs of holly.... | SWAM1::STERN_TO | Tom Stern -- Have TK, will travel! | Tue Jul 27 1993 22:40 | 5 |
| I don't know about the rest of you, but I have trouble thinking of
myself as a "Digitaly" instead of a "DECy". Makes me sound like a
brand of heart medicine.
tom
|
2568.134 | Digital - we rent backhoes, see your paychek... | ODIXIE::SILVERS | Dave, have POQET will travel | Tue Jul 27 1993 23:34 | 1 |
| (that's pronounced dig-it-all)
|
2568.135 | | TALLIS::PARADIS | There's a feature in my soup! | Wed Jul 28 1993 18:37 | 16 |
| Just another data point in this "brand recognition" debate:
Yesterday I got the latest "Popular Science" in the mail (this is a
mass-market gee-whiz science magazine published in U.S.). The cover
story was on the next generation of microprocessors.
Our company, of course, rated a mention. When we were introduced,
the writer referred to "Digital Equipment Corporation (DEC)", and
thereafter referred to us as "DEC" for the rest of the article.
Seems as though at least *some* segment of the population knows us
by our nickname, no?
Oh, and they also referred to our CPU offering as "Alpha"; no "AXP"
or anything like that...
|
2568.136 | | GRANMA::MWANNEMACHER | Neck, red as Alabama clay | Wed Jul 28 1993 20:44 | 9 |
|
Well there are a fairly large number of folks out there who do know us
as DEC. I think we should modify the logo and include DEC in the logo
(HPesque). Isn't DEC copyrighted by Digital?
Mike
|
2568.137 | Old gas and tin-can cars | TNPUBS::JONG | Steve Jong/T and N Publications | Fri Jul 30 1993 02:53 | 15 |
| Two points about trademarks. One is an old New Yorker cartoon I
clipped, showing a couple driving in the country. They knew they were
REALLY out in the sticks when they came to an Esso station.
The other point is about the Three Diamonds brand. When I was growing
up, in the sixties, there were TV commercials for Three Diamonds tuna
(I can still recall the jingle -- "Three Diamond brand, fan-cy tu -
na"). I was surprised when I started seeing the logo on automobiles,
which I guess I unconsciously associated with tin cans for many years.
Finally the company with the three-diamond logo revealed itself as
Mitsubishi, as in Mitsubishi Heavy Industries. They had to establish
their presence in the US market very slowly; had they walked in the
front door as Mitsubishi, a whole generation of World War II veterans
would have associated them with the fighter planes they manufactured
and never bought the stuff.
|
2568.138 | | WELCLU::ADAMS | | Fri Jul 30 1993 12:50 | 74 |
| As has previously been said, branding is all about conveying recognition,
identification, meaning and image in order to get "mindshare" and hence market
share.
To be successful this has to be meaningful to the prospective audience.
"Digital" is not meaningful in any way. "Digital" means nothing.
"Putting imagination to work" is not a bad slogan, but it is rather spoiled by
being associated with a name that exhibits no imagination whatsoever.
Psychologically this ruins the message.
Some comments on what has gone before:
Re .37 >Digital is a nebulous concept
- this is *precisely* the issue.
Re .50
What a great name (no offence intended) - now that could be the basis of a
great branding campaign!
Re .81 >evokes no mental image
Therein lies the problem with the name
Re .99
One of the best things that could happen to Digital is that the name is refused
a trademark (which is virtually certain) and that we dropped the name
altogether. What a shame that such a lot of effort was spent in trying to get
people to persuade the courts to use a name when this is the last thing we
should be doing.
Re .116 Luv it!!!
Re .120 Great stuff!
Re .127
Trying to establish 1 company, 1 name, 1 set of goals etc. is self-defeating
when the company is in the inexorable process of breaking itself up.
Other comments:
The last thing alpha new business marketing needs is to be associated with is
"Digital". It would be more appropriate to market it via a separate company,
"Alpha Microtech" or somesuch.
A message such as "alpha - the new beginning for computing" would then be
powerful.
Digital is going through such major change that a far more radical change
in image would have been appropriate. I do not see this as risky, but a
necessity.
Digital is a conservative company with an overemphasis on protection
of existing business. This is something which will inevitably distort alpha
marketing efforts.
Alpha will not be the saviour of the Digital that currently exists. It will
probably catalyse the formation of a new much smaller organisation.
Regards,
Peter
|
2568.139 | The customers will decide our fate today! | JACOBI::JACOBI | Paul A. Jacobi - OpenVMS AXP Development | Fri Jul 30 1993 14:01 | 6 |
|
Any bets on whether we will receive 250 declarations as .99 requested by today's
deadline?
-Paul
|
2568.140 | | HLFS00::CHARLES | The wizzard from Oss | Fri Jul 30 1993 14:02 | 9 |
| In the mean time we do everything to confuse our prospective customers.
Digital in Holland is one of the sponsors of a major tennis tourniment.
On the posters our old blue logo is printed. Our logo at the
tenniscourt is grass green lettering on a white background.
And to make sure we mess up big time we tell customers in a brochure on
Alpha AXP that it's so good because it's designed by Digital Equipment
Company.
Charles
|
2568.141 | | CHEFS::STAALH | To boldly go where I've been before | Fri Jul 30 1993 15:29 | 51 |
| re: .138
I agree with all the previous notes regarding the adoption
of Digital as the corporate name. My reference (in .37) to
a "Digital" being a nebulous concept and not really the issue
was in reply to a previous noter's concerns regarding violations
of trade marks and generic use of the name cf. Hoover and Aspirin.
The name Digital is unfortunate not because it doesn't mean
anything but because it does mean something. It has a distinct
meaning in the English language, especially in the industry in
which we operate. To now try to persuade people to think of an
IT vendor when they hear the word digital is a bit of a lost
cause - although Sun and Apple have had some success. What will
Digital Consulting mean - consulting by a company called Digital
or consulting related to digital technology ? Therefore
I personally will be very suprised if the trademark application
were to succeed (on a slight tangent how can 250 people be
representative of the whole of the USA ??).
Hannah summed up very eloquently (.127) the motivations for trying
to (belatedly) re-establish this company's top-level brand. The
slight change of logo to new friendly letters (any similarity
to the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy is purely coincidental) is
only in line with current corporate fashions (BT, BP etc.) as indeed
is the corporate branding campaign.
The choice of Digital over DEC, we are told, is due to greater
recognition of the name Digital. I would be very interested in
the composition of the sample that was used for the market
research that resulted in this discovery. What was the mix in
terms of:
-current clients vs users of other manufacturers kit/services
-geographical distribution (current markets vs future markets)
-IT professionals vs other corporate functionaries
-general public (with the move to commodity products the scope
for the general public to become exposed to IT will greatly increase
- again a future market).
-decision makers (and any trends in the decision makers ie. move
down the managerial hierarchy, more end user based vs IT function
based)
-the people exposed to our different product offerings (HW,SW,
consultancy etc).
In other words how forward looking have we been in establishing
the corporate identity ?
To finish on a positive note, I really like the imagination tag.
Hans
|
2568.142 | | TOOK::MORRISON | Bob M. LKG1-3/A11 226-7570 | Fri Jul 30 1993 21:06 | 10 |
| If "Digital" becomes a registered trademark, does that mean people will no
longer be able to say "digital computer" in the sense of non-analog computer?
Note that if "Digital" is the first word in the sentence or the entire text is
uppercase, the distinction between "Digital" and "digital" is hidden.
I recall that there is a precedent for converting a stand-alone common word
to a trademark, but I don't recall what it is at the moment. In almost all
cases, either the trademark is spelled differently (such as Fiberglas) than
the generic word or the generic word (such as aspirin) was created from the
brand name.
The deadline is now; did we get our 250 statements in time?
|
2568.143 | The Ads | RDGENG::NEWBERRYH | | Wed Aug 04 1993 14:44 | 23 |
| On a slightly different note, does anyone have anything to say about
the media ads that have been running. I have seen a few (something
about an operation, one with people running, one with a woman on a
diving board and one with the two old ladies) and wondered what the
general response was/is. I think it would be interesting to know if
they were eye-catching to the non-employee. Obviously I take notice of
them because they are done by Digital, but does anyone else?
I have been reading up on corporate advertising recently and one
argument is that companies try to cover up their problems by good
advertising and publicity while the problem still bubbles away. On the
other hand, some companies properly put together all their ideals and
thoughts that they wish to put across and come up with an effective
marketing strategy. I couldn't say what I think Digital has done, I
hope it is the latter, bu sometimes my loyalty is questioned.
I personally think that the ad with the two women is very amusing and
clever, the others are more of a cliche to me, but that is a matter of
opinion. I actually think that despite being a cliche, they use
visuals and words (incorporating the imagination theory) very well, and
without saying it, they all relate to the industry.
Any thoughts???
|
2568.144 | | GRANMA::MWANNEMACHER | Neck, red as Alabama clay | Wed Aug 04 1993 15:19 | 16 |
|
I don't think they relate to the industry at all. Have you seen the
half apple half orange ad? To me this represents a tired, worn out
cliche that one resorts to when they have run out of substance to make
their point.
We need to define ourselves before we start these cutsey, irrelevant
commercials, assuming that people know who we are.
My $0.02 (less $0.01 for inflation)
Mike
|
2568.145 | Extension granted | AIMHI::BOWLES | | Mon Aug 09 1993 12:30 | 24 |
| Here's an excerpt from a Russ Gullotti memo which was on the wire this
morning. Looks like they didn't get the required number of customer
testimonials. Got an extension instead.....
Subject: Digital Trademark Declarations
You will remember that I asked you to help us obtain declarations from
your customers confirming that when they hear the word "Digital," it
means hardware and software manufactured or licensed by Digital
Equipment Corporation.
Unfortunately, even though some account representatives have sent as
many as three declarations from their customers, the Law Department has
received very few declarations to date. We're a long way from the
number we believe necessary to substantiate our registration petition.
We therefore had to apply for and fortunately were granted a final
extension of time by the Trademark Trial and Appeal Board to August 20.
In order to submit the declarations on time, the Law Department must
have them in hand by the end of business on Monday, August 16.
|
2568.146 | GO DIGITAL | GRANMA::FDEADY | definitely, definitely no logic | Mon Aug 09 1993 13:36 | 5 |
| I don't know if this was mentioned earlier, but I hope the Trademark
officials (U.S. Government) are not avid Compuserve users. Our PC
group, and Forum, is DECPCI. Maybe Digital should change it?
fred deady
|
2568.147 | GO DEC! 8-) | TALLIS::PARADIS | There's a feature in my soup! | Mon Aug 09 1993 18:25 | 8 |
| Hmmm... what will happen if we all scrounge up 250 articles that
refer to us as "DEC"? 8-) 8-) 8-)
[sheesh... why can't we just use *both* names as brand identifiers?
It works for Coca-Cola ("Coke"), among others...]
--jim
|
2568.148 | good example ! | CVG::THOMPSON | Radical Centralist | Mon Aug 09 1993 18:50 | 7 |
| > [sheesh... why can't we just use *both* names as brand identifiers?
> It works for Coca-Cola ("Coke"), among others...]
I read once that Coca Cola fought the use of "Coke" for some time.
Finally they gave up and made it official.
Alfred
|
2568.149 | IBM says they are Digital, too! | WRKSYS::SEILER | Larry Seiler | Mon Aug 09 1993 20:11 | 3 |
| Last week at SIGgraph (the premier academic computer graphics
conference and equipment expo) a lot of the IBMers had T shirts that
said on the back "Join the Digital Revolution", with the IBM logo.
|
2568.150 | | LGP30::FLEISCHER | without vision the people perish (Bob, DTN 223-8576, MSO2-2/A2, | Tue Aug 10 1993 14:57 | 11 |
| re Note 2568.145 by AIMHI::BOWLES:
> -< Extension granted >-
>
> Here's an excerpt from a Russ Gullotti memo which was on the wire this
> morning. Looks like they didn't get the required number of customer
> testimonials. Got an extension instead.....
You mean that this ISN'T a joke!?
Bob
|
2568.151 | | AIMHI::BOWLES | | Tue Aug 10 1993 17:16 | 9 |
| RE: .150
>>You mean that this ISN'T a joke!?
>> Bob
Nope.
Chet
|
2568.152 | | THEBAY::CHABANED | Spasticus Dyslexicus | Tue Aug 10 1993 17:48 | 10 |
|
Questions:
What if we miss the extension? Will any VPs become cannon-fodder?
Will we finally acknowledge that DEC is not such a bad name?
Doubtful.
-Ed
|
2568.153 | My predictions... | DECWET::FARLEE | Insufficient Virtual...um...er... | Tue Aug 10 1993 17:55 | 18 |
|
> Questions:
> What if we miss the extension? Will any VPs become cannon-fodder?
> Will we finally acknowledge that DEC is not such a bad name?
Predictions:
If we do manage to get the trademark, we will see a flurry of huge memos
about 1) how great it is that we succeeded in getting it, and 2) how
important it is for each of us to be vigilant in protecting that trademark.
If (as I personally expect, having nothing but a hunch to back it up) we fail
to get the trademark, we will hear...
NOTHING.
Nobody will be shot in public, and no announcements whatsoever will be made
officially. It would just be too embarassing. The Brand Campaign may or may not
fizzle out.
|
2568.154 | | PAMSRC::ALF::BARRETT | Robot Roll Call | Tue Aug 10 1993 20:33 | 6 |
| EVERYONE I know outside the company (that is into computers) does NOT think
of Digital Equipment when they hear "digital". However, when they hear "DEC",
they immediately do.
Says it all I think. Face reality.
|
2568.155 | | LGP30::FLEISCHER | without vision the people perish (Bob, DTN 223-8576, MSO2-2/A2, | Tue Aug 10 1993 22:09 | 11 |
| re Note 2568.154 by PAMSRC::ALF::BARRETT:
> EVERYONE I know outside the company (that is into computers) does NOT think
> of Digital Equipment when they hear "digital". However, when they hear "DEC",
> they immediately do.
Is it merely sufficient to get 250 customers that support
your position, even if one could have gotten ten times as
many to support a conflicting interpretation of "Digital"?
Bob
|
2568.156 | | WLDBIL::KILGORE | Adiposilly challenged | Wed Aug 11 1993 13:33 | 4 |
|
Gee, do you think if we could gather up 250 "DEC" customer declarations
by 16-Aug, someone upstairs would see the light?
|
2568.157 | (-: Sorry, couldn't resist :-) | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Wed Aug 11 1993 13:37 | 15 |
| @begin(-:Tongue_in_cheek:-)
QUESTION:
What is the name of the mentally paralyzing substance that
must be used to convert an old-line DECcie into The New
Corporate Style?
ANSWER:
DIGITALis the name.
@end(-:Tongue_in_cheek:-)
|
2568.158 | the original meaning of "digital" | KAOU30::JAMES | It's the MANAGEMENT stupid!!! | Wed Aug 11 1993 14:15 | 7 |
| In a recent show on "RoundHouse", a satiric show for teens on
Nickelodeon, the father suffered from a swelled thumb due to over-use
of his TV-remote.
He said, "don't think of me as handicapped, think of me as
digitally challenged".
|
2568.159 | | ICS::CROUCH | Subterranean Dharma Bum | Thu Aug 12 1993 11:20 | 14 |
| The branding campaign has yet to take hold here in Mass. This a.m.
there was a story on the local ABC station which mentioned the
problem that DEC was having with the State over our venture into
South Africa. Regardless of the story the newscaster never mentioned
us as digital but used DEC, deck, many times.
This campaign will take some time. I get many blank looks when I tell
people I work for digital. When I say DEC they know the company. Of
course our imagine stinks right now. Once they know who I work for they
usually say something that you'd expect to hear at a wake.
Jim C.
|
2568.160 | | DEMOAX::GINGER | Ron Ginger | Thu Aug 12 1993 15:22 | 4 |
| re: -2 "digitally impaired."
A recent rape conviction was for a digital rape.
|
2568.161 | A new venture? | DYPSS1::COGHILL | Steve Coghill, Luke 14:28 | Fri Aug 13 1993 13:13 | 8 |
| Of course the world thinks of Digital Equipment Corp. when the hear
the word "digital." Why just this morning I heard a commercial for
Crane air conditioners. They have some sort of promotion going where
a customer can get a digital calculator.
I feel really bad as an employee. I must spend too much time in
EINFs because I didn't even know we had branched out into
calculators.
|
2568.162 | Hmmm... | NODEX::ADEY | These ARE the good old days... | Fri Aug 13 1993 15:19 | 5 |
| I was just wondering...If MicroSoft was denied a trademark on
'Windows', what chance do we have of trademarking 'digital'?
Ken....
|
2568.163 | Give up "DEC" to gain "DIJ" ??? | ICS::MORRISEY | | Fri Aug 13 1993 15:49 | 12 |
|
An earlier note observed that if a 'name' is too long, people will
always find a shorter version...
Speaking with a doctor recently, I told him I worked at "Digital".
We were in Massachusetts, so the company is known to him.
Trying to be "familiar", he then replied, "So how are things going
at 'DIJ' ?"
Well, I guess I asked for it .... If I'd said I worked at DEC,
he'd have used "DEC" ...
|
2568.164 | | RAGMOP::LOWELL | Grim Grinning Ghosts... | Fri Aug 13 1993 16:41 | 21 |
| I found this while browsing through my Crutchfield Catalog Update,
Late Summer 1993. I guess we're building answering machines too.
NOT!
Feature Flash:
The Digital Difference
For hassle-free operation day-in and day-out, try a digital
answering machine. They're easier to use and more reliable
than cassette-based models, giving one-touch instant access
to your messages.
Digital answering machines record messages on a computer
memory chip instead of a cassette tape (but the sound
quality is as good or better than a tape).
.
.
.
*Our digital answering machines include the Sony TAM-1000
(left) and Panasonic XT-8000 on the next page.*
|
2568.165 | re .163: From my long-term storage, Psycholinguistics File: | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Fri Aug 13 1993 16:59 | 40 |
|
.163> An earlier note observed that if a 'name' is too long, people will
.163> always find a shorter version...
Quite right. Benjamin Lee Whorf, I believe, coined "Whorf's Law" by
which he demonstrated that the more frequently-mentioned a concept
becomes, the shorter becomes its spoken and written length. Hence,
"TV" and "telly" from "television," "'phone" and then "phone" from
"telephone," "Mac" from "Macintosh," and so on and on.
(-: Please, no ratholes on other Whorfish examples or detours into the
wonders of and needs for acronyms; take 'em to THEBAY::JOYOFLEX :-)
Please note that as WE are attempting to increase the frequency-of-
usage of DIGITAL, the popular culture is, also -- but in other, more
generic terms: "digital audio & video"; "the increasing digital
convergence"; "digital media"; and so on and on, to the detriment of
our minority interest in co-opting that word. We're a bit late to
claim it as our own, imho.
Part of the value (imho) of the "DEC" morpheme is that it uniquely
identifies "DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORPORATION," while "DIGITAL" is
(a)=> simultaneously harder to pronounce (multiple phonemes &
graphemes),
(b)=> reduces to a generic -- and increasingly popular! -- adjective
(which is imho worse than Microsoft WINDOWS, which reduces to a
generic noun) and
(c)=> is also subject to the sort of harmless japes as .163's "DIJ",
and the more sarcastic ones that Your Ob't Server has been
responsible for (e.g., "DIGITALis its name.") For which I
apologize... but not really. :-> The underlying point of the
sarcasm stands. And the constructive criticism, too, I hope.
I hasten to add that I would be remiss to make such a point in a
public (extra-DIGITAL) forum, of course; and that I never have or
would.
|
2568.166 | Getting another finger from DTI | NRSTA2::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Sat Aug 14 1993 20:12 | 19 |
| I was in my local Stop & Shop supermarket today and was walking by the
touch-screen store directory kiosk. I was struck by the screen (well
not literally) because instead of its normal option-button appearance,
it seemed to have been in maintenance mode. It contained the following
information, which I transcribed to my shopping-list and now to your
screen:
===== begin screen transcript =====
DIGITAL TECHNIQUES, INC. TOUCHCOM Version 5.53.001, 3-11-87
Terminal ID=999999 Mem Size 896 KB
Tests: 0000
PUC: 1601
Test Cycles 3482
Uptime: 10678 Hrs.
Test Passed Errors
===== end screen transcript =====
No mention was made of any trademark on the vendor name.
|
2568.167 | B. Breathed: OUTLAND comic strip, today, Boston Sunday GLOBE | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Sun Aug 15 1993 15:29 | 36 |
| (reproduced without permission)
Scene: Bathroom with toilet labeled R.I.P.
OPUS: We are gathered here to lay to rest yet another obsolete
way of life...
OLIVER: (takes camera out of shoebox)
OPUS: The camera has croaked. Photography has kicked the
bucket... pushed into an early grave by digital computer
imagery... joining its martyred brothers, the slide rule
and the vinyl record. Sniff. Do it. Quickly!
OLIVER: (drops camera into toilet with KERPLUNK!)
OPUS: OH, LITTLE NIKON, WE HARDLY KNEW YE!
OLIVER: (flushes)
OPUS: CURSE THE WRETCHED COLD HEART OF PROGRESS!
OLIVER: (honk)
OPUS: (sob)
RANDOM
COCKROACH: (sniff)
OPUS: Should we get a shot of this?
OLIVER: Naw. I'll make a digital composite of ourselves with an
enhanced background later.
COCKROACH: Leave out my zits.
|
2568.168 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | What a week that was! | Wed Aug 18 1993 16:27 | 8 |
| So, it's two days past the deadline. What happened? Or, as predicted,
will we hear no more?
The fact that we could have found thousands of "testamonials" to say of
"DEC", what they're asking of "digital", makes me chuckle. As someone
said earlier, face reality.
Laurie.
|
2568.169 | | SAHQ::LUBER | Fire Cox,Trade Justice,Bring up Lopez | Thu Aug 19 1993 12:46 | 7 |
| In the 80's, General Electric changed its name to GE for the purpose of
de-associating itself with businesses that were only related to the use
and generation of electricity. Over time, the term GE has lost its
association as "General Electric" just like IBM has lost its
association with "International Business Machines". Digital would haveDigital would hve
done better to become simply "DEC", without any reference to Digital
Equipment Corporation. What a foul up!
|
2568.170 | answer in 25 words or FEWER | LEDS::OLSEN | | Thu Aug 19 1993 17:05 | 12 |
| Please forgive me for not identifying myself to people as working for
"Digital"
In social settings, I always use "Digital Equipment" in introduction.
Once people get to know me, then "Digital" does work. But as an
introduction, "Digital" feels too ambiguous. Some friends you can
tease by giving them an ambiguous answer; it is unwise to do this
ambiguity stuff when making first impressions.
So, do any of you out there trust "Digital" in cold-call situations?
/rich
|
2568.171 | what? | LGP30::FLEISCHER | without vision the people perish (DTN 223-8576, MSO2-2/A2, IM&T) | Mon Aug 23 1993 03:17 | 11 |
| re Note 2568.169 by SAHQ::LUBER:
> In the 80's, General Electric changed its name to GE for the purpose of
> de-associating itself with businesses that were only related to the use
GE's own image ads include the name "General Electric"
somewhere in them. Also, the "GE" logo must be one of the
oldest industrial logos still in use. I think they use both,
as appropriate (as does General Motors, for example).
Bob
|
2568.172 | | SAHQ::LUBER | Fire Cox,Trade Justice,Bring up Lopez | Mon Aug 23 1993 16:03 | 7 |
| GE continues to display General Electric in their ads because they
don't want to lose the trademark. They refer to themselves, verbally,
and in their annual report, simply as GE. The General Electric is
downplayed for reasons I mentioned earlier.
Too bad we don't have as recognizable a DEC monogram as the GE
meatball.
|
2568.173 | | STAR::ABBASI | iam a good si'kick | Mon Aug 23 1993 17:48 | 7 |
| i think more people recognize the name "VAX" more than "DEC",
when i said "VAX" to some friends, some of them heared of it, but when
i said "DEC" more than not they did not know what iam talking about.
makes you wonder?
\nasser
|
2568.174 | | MILPND::J_TOMAO | | Tue Aug 24 1993 14:25 | 9 |
| The media Still refers to us as DEC. This morning while waiting for
the local weather...WXLO, based out of Fitchburg/Worcester Mass
annouced "DEC will be closer their Westminster building by January"
In the news report and the blurb before it we were refered to as
"Digital Equipment Corpration" once, "Digital" twice, and "DEC" 4
times.
Joyce
|
2568.175 | DECsystem, DECtalk, DECtp... | ASDG::SBILL | | Tue Aug 24 1993 16:09 | 6 |
|
If we are supposed to stop using DEC when describing Digital then I wonder
why we still insist on naming our products DECthis and DECthat. Talk
about a confusing message!
Steve B.
|
2568.176 | | AIMHI::TLAPOINTE | | Tue Aug 24 1993 16:23 | 5 |
| Maybe we should just move to Texas, rename ourselves the
"Lonestar Computer Co." and have a Star for our corporate insignia (;-)
We could put a "V" or the greek letter "A" within the star to denote
which product line(;-)
|
2568.177 | | ROBOAT::HEBERT | Captain Bligh | Tue Aug 24 1993 17:49 | 6 |
| I wonder if they've seen the hedges outside the front door of MKO1.
Big, big letters that spell out
D E C
|
2568.178 | Re .177 -- Been there, seen that, even got the DECt-Shirt... | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Tue Aug 24 1993 18:22 | 4 |
| ... see .122
:-)
|
2568.179 | From Computerworld... | TNKSYS::DBROWN | With magic, you have some control | Wed Aug 25 1993 02:19 | 19 |
|
From Computerworld dated August 23, 1993
The "Inside Lines" column ends with the following:
"Clear the DECs! It's Digital from now on. Marketers from the
Maynard, Mass.-based mini maker are on an intensive campaign to
expunge the "DEC" acronym from the industry's vernacular. They've
asked publications to refer to the company as "Digital" from now on.
We're happy to comply, but we're wondering what Digital is going to do
with it DECchip 21064, DECpc, DEC 3000 AXP, DECstations, DECsystems,
DECnet Phase IV, DECnet/OSI, DEChub 900, DECnis 500/600 routers,
DECconcentrators, DECbridges, DECservers, DEC/EDI, DECimage, DEC C,
DEC Pascal, DEC Fortran, DEC Ada, DEC Cobol, DEC C++, DECforms, DEC
Rdb, DEC DBMS, DEC PHIGS, DEC GKS, DECset, DEC DB Integrator, DEC DBA
Workcenter, DEC RAlly, and DECwindows Motif. We'll probably find out
at the next DECworld. ..."
|
2568.180 | | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Wed Aug 25 1993 02:46 | 8 |
| Well, should we complain? At least they spelled our name right...
Or was that nameS...
Yikes. I don't know about you, but *I* was embarrassed reading .179.
Doesn't look like the kind of press coverage we need.
|
2568.181 | | ICS::CROUCH | Subterranean Dharma Bum | Wed Aug 25 1993 11:31 | 9 |
| Dan, I'm way past the embarrassment stage. A fellow digit likes to
equate some of what is going on in the last year or two to a Three
Stooges Marathon weekend that never ends. You try to channel surf
and every station has Moe, Larry and Curly. When is Dana Kersey going
to interject with that deep voice of his 'Now wasn't that fun? On
the movie loft tonight we will be showing Apocalypse Now'.
Jim C.
|
2568.182 | | FINDER::COFFEYJ | The Uk CSC Unix Girlie. | Wed Aug 25 1993 12:41 | 10 |
| I thought everything that wasn't an oerating system or hardware was being renamed
to Polycenter something or other anyway, that'll avoid the dec...
-Hi I'm a Poly-person... :-)
Seriously though, I always have used digital more than dec - Iused to find a
lot more people knew it as the 2nd largest employer in Reading.... and still
now when I call out, ifI have to leave a message internally I'm from the
support centre, externally I'm Jo Coffey from Digital.
jo.
|
2568.183 | the magazine was only taking a sample | CARAFE::GOLDSTEIN | Global Village Idiot | Wed Aug 25 1993 21:13 | 3 |
| If you go into VTX Sales_Update_US, the Products and Services Index by
Name has 17 screens of products beginning with "DEC". Over 300
products. And none beginning with "Digital" within the trademark.
|
2568.184 | | RAGMOP::FARINA | | Thu Aug 26 1993 23:04 | 11 |
| After I'd been working here for a few years, my mother told me she ran
into an old schoolmate of ours. I said, "Oh, yeah. He works at
Digital." She said, "No he doesn't. He works at a place called Deck."
I know of someone else who excitedly told me she was working for
Digital, too! She said she was working at a Digital in some place
where DEC didn't have a building. Turns out she was working for a
cheapo watch maker! ;-)
Hey, maybe we have a corporate multiple personality. What do you
think?
|
2568.185 | Marketing? What's that? | ODIXIE::SILVERS | Dave, have POQET will travel | Fri Aug 27 1993 02:02 | 8 |
| I think we should use 'digital' watches as giveaways at tradeshows, and
that we should also capitalize on 'digital audio' by giving away CD's
of recordings of the Boston Pops (which we used to support financially,
don't know about now) included in every CONDIST and CONOLD
distribution.
Marketing, naah, we don't need no stinking marketing!
|
2568.186 | a possible solution to the DEC vs digital delima | STAR::ABBASI | iam a good si'kick | Fri Aug 27 1993 03:18 | 20 |
| ref. the confusion but people about "DEC" and "digital" being different
companies.
i might have a solution to help on this one, how about if we can some
how like combine both "DEC" and "digital" into like one syllabus name
and use that instead of just the one of them?
like may be we become "DECdigital" or "digitalDEC" or " digDECital" or
"DgitaldEC" or "dDigitDECal" or "digDECital" ..ectectera..
may be iam getting carried away, but you know what i mean, like combine
both names into one that is both pleasing to the eye and
makes a good sound and ring to it. people do remember names better
if it has a ring to it and rhymes well .
just an idea.
\nasser
|
2568.187 | or take a leaf from the former 'Prince' ... | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Fri Aug 27 1993 03:30 | 41 |
| Blend the two orthogonally, as he did with the superimposed male &
female symbols...
Digital
E
C
or, spelling it out further,
Digital
Equipment
Corporation
Hmmm. It even is an arithmetic progression when rendered in
fixed-font. Possibly even
Digital
Equipment
Corporation
or in "modern swoosh-style":
Digital
Equipment
Corporation
The point being, of course, to "permit" customers to choose the form
that is most meaningful for THEM within the pair of extant names, but
to inextricably link them in all copy, thus eliminating all possible
brand confusion.
\Nasser, I think it's time for us both to give up our day jobs.
You handle the basic ideas, the cookies, & the chess. I'll polish your
stuff up, we'll make a million bucks for Digital
Equipment
Corporation, and they'll
give us some more cookies & the chance to come up with more great ideas
like these.
Such a deal!!
|
2568.188 | | MU::PORTER | 550 user not local | Fri Aug 27 1993 12:03 | 8 |
| I just saw some comments from a VMS customer on DECnet-VAX, whoops
I mean an OpenVMS customer on DECnet/OSI.
We were asking about "product deficiencies".
One of his biggest complaints was that we kept changing
the $%^& names of everything.
|
2568.189 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | No... I've had my ears lowered | Fri Aug 27 1993 13:37 | 4 |
| Well, I asked in .168, on the 18th what the outcome of the "survey"
was. Will we ever know?
Laurie.
|
2568.190 | I'd work for a company owned by Dan & \nasser! | TOHOPE::REESE_K | Three Fries Short of a Happy Meal | Fri Aug 27 1993 13:41 | 7 |
| Re: 186
Psssst \nasser, better be careful; someone might read that note
and take it seriously :-)
Karen
|
2568.191 | re .190 -< I'd work for a company owned by Dan & \nasser! >- | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Fri Aug 27 1993 13:56 | 6 |
| Hate to be the first to say it, especially considering the compliment &
the source (Hi Karen!), but, umm, to paraphrase Groucho, I don't know
whether *I* would work for any company that would have me as its owner.
:-)
|
2568.192 | ... people outside the discipline have better insights ... | CPDW::CIUFFINI | God must be a Gemini... | Fri Aug 27 1993 17:35 | 21 |
|
The Beatles tackled this 'name' problem in the White Album when
in Rocky Racoon they sang ( and still do.. ) [ if my memory serves
correctly ]
$ start memory /out = note
... her name was Magill
but she called herself Lill
and everyone knew her as Nancy....
... she and her man, who called himself Dan .... ( Dan K? )
$ stop memory
The important thing here is that 'everyone knew her as Nancy'
... and more importantly, 'everyone'.
jc
p.s. How about D/igital
E/quipment
C/orporation
|
2568.193 | an appropiate quote about what our name should be | STAR::ABBASI | iam a good si'kick | Fri Aug 27 1993 18:05 | 9 |
|
i think at this occasion this quote is appropiate:
"a rose by any other name still will smell as sweat"
original author: william shaksksshspeer
\nasser
|
2568.194 | | MSBCS::BROWN_L | | Fri Aug 27 1993 19:01 | 5 |
| re .last
> a rose by any other name still will smell as sweat
I doubt Mr. Shakespear was suggesting that rose synonyms smell
like a locker room.
|
2568.195 | | ECADSR::SHERMAN | Steve ECADSR::Sherman DTN 223-3326 MLO5-2/26a | Fri Aug 27 1993 19:09 | 5 |
| re: .194
Could Mssr. Shakespear have been thinking of Rosie Grear (sp?)?
Steve ;^)
|
2568.196 | re .193 these misquotations & misspellings are driving me nuts! | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Supplely Chained | Fri Aug 27 1993 19:22 | 10 |
| It's *not*
.193> "a rose by any other name still will smell as sweat"
DAMMIT, get it right \nasser!!
"a rose by any other name still wilt smelt as sweat"
tyvm
|
2568.197 | Nasser? Kalikow? | ALAMOS::ADAMS | Visualize Whirled Peas! | Sat Aug 28 1993 05:28 | 4 |
| I think a couple of noters to need to inhale... O2.
--- Gavin :)
|
2568.198 | | LGP30::FLEISCHER | without vision the people perish (DTN 223-8576, MSO2-2/A2, IM&T) | Sat Aug 28 1993 05:46 | 12 |
| re Note 2568.187 by DRDAN::KALIKOW:
> or, spelling it out further,
>
> Digital
> Equipment
> Corporation
I noticed recently that our big trucks do indeed write it
this way (at least on the back).
Bob
|
2568.199 | | MARX::GRIER | mjg's holistic computing agency | Sat Aug 28 1993 15:58 | 11 |
| RE: .195:
> re: .194
>
> Could Mssr. Shakespear have been thinking of Rosie Grear (sp?)?
>
> Steve ;^)
Grier. No relation. ;-)
-mjg
|
2568.200 | Bravo! | ROYALT::PANDERSON | | Tue Aug 31 1993 03:30 | 10 |
| I heard about today's introduction of our new PCs on both radio (WBZ Boston
during their business news) and television (WLVI Cambridge channel 56 on the Ten
O'Clock News). Both reports mentioned that the new PCs were aimed at the mass
market and would be priced in the $1000-2000 range.
The coverage was very positive. The TV anchor said after the story, "While
things are looking up for Digital, another company..." All this left a very
favorable impression of Digital as a company and the new products.
Paul
|
2568.201 | | 4GL::SUTTON | So this is how it all begins... | Tue Aug 31 1993 11:12 | 6 |
| re .200:
I was half-paying attention (dozing off...) as that story was read,
and I'd swear the WLVI anchor referred to us as "Digital Corporation".
Howzat for name consistency? (-:
|
2568.202 | catalogs or on-line | XLIB::SCHAFER | Mark Schafer, Development Assistance | Tue Aug 31 1993 13:13 | 3 |
| where can we get information about the new systems?
Mark
|
2568.203 | PC info is on VTX | MSDOA::FLACK | Enter catchy name here | Tue Aug 31 1993 15:01 | 6 |
| Try VTX PRICE FR-7 will provide prices and part #'s.
VTX Sales Update. 23-Aug Edition.
You may also want to try VTX PRICE on the older LP series. Those prices
have come down also.
|
2568.204 | It's the thought that counts | FUNYET::ANDERSON | OpenVMS Forever! | Tue Aug 31 1993 19:17 | 9 |
2568.205 | I'm _still_ laughing | ATLANA::SHERMAN | Debt Free! | Wed Sep 01 1993 19:17 | 7 |
| RE: <<< Note 2568.193 by STAR::ABBASI "iam a good si'kick" >>>
Once again \nasser has hit the mark! In the context of this note
and its replies, his "appropriate quote" is really appropriate,
and accurate.
Ron
|
2568.206 | If we say it enough times, does that make it true? | QUARK::LIONEL | Free advice is worth every cent | Wed Oct 27 1993 17:55 | 89 |
| (I consider the attached message to have been intended for wide distribution,
thus I think it is appropriate to post it here. - Steve)
From: ASABET::ASABET::MRGATE::"A1::GIBSON.JEFFRY" 25-OCT-1993 13:14:27.57
To: @Distribution_List
Subj: IMPORTANT MESSAGE REGARDING "DIGITAL" AS A TRADEMARK 2
From: NAME: Jeffry Gibson
FUNC: Public Relations Mgmt.
TEL: 223-6865 <GIBSON.JEFFRY AT A1 at EMASA2 at MLO>
To: See Below
CC: See Below
Dear friends,
The Law Department has been taking some important steps regarding
"Digital" as a trademark of the company. As part of this activity,
Corporate Public Relations now will be including the following
statement on all our press releases, background papers, fact sheets,
and similar documents and materials:
Digital is a trademark of Digital Equipment Corporation.
As appropriate, please include it in your materials.
Attached is a copy of the memo received from the Law Department
related to this issue.
Regards,
Jef
I N T E R O F F I C E M E M O R A N D U M
Date: 22-Oct-1993 09:23am EDT
From: VMSMail User pawlina
pawlina@AM_GAVEL@NEMTS@MSO@MRGATE@NEMTS@NEMTS@MRGATE
Dept:
Tel No:
TO: LEVENSALER@POWDML@MRGATE
TO: J_GIBSON@ASABET@MRGATE
Subject: RE: Digital(TM) reference line
From: NAME: PAWLINA <pawlina@AM_GAVEL@NEMTS@MSO>
To: J_Gibson@Asabet@MRGATE
CC: Levensaler@Powdml@MRGATE,
Myria Pawlina@MSO
Hello Jeffry,
I am a Legal Assistant for the Trademark Law Group.
The proper reference line for our Digital(TM) trademark is:
Digital is a trademark of Digital Equipment Corporation.
We are claiming Digital as our trademark through common law usage of
five consecutive years or more and we have proven use of this
trademark for over 30 years as a Corporation. Additionally our
request to register this trademark is currently under appeal at the
Patent and Trademark Office.
Please do not change the reference line, it would create havoc
throughout the Corporation.
If I can be of further assistance regarding your trademark questions
please do not hesitate to contact me via my mail node:
GAVEL::PAWLINA or Myria Pawlina @MSO or call me at DTN: 223-8233.
Sincerely,
Myria Pawlina
Legal Assistant
DIGITAL INTERNAL USE ONLY Document
------- End of Forwarded Message
|
2568.207 | Can I do it too? 8-) | TALLIS::PARADIS | There's a feature in my soup! | Wed Oct 27 1993 17:59 | 7 |
| Very well: "Jim" is now a trademark of "Jim Paradis".
Anyone named "Jim" should either change his name immediately or send me
a royalty check 8-)
--Jim[tm]
|
2568.208 | | RLTIME::COOK | | Wed Oct 27 1993 18:13 | 13 |
|
>Additionally our
>request to register this trademark is currently under appeal at the
>Patent and Trademark Office.
We are appealing the original ruling. Does this answer the question as
to whether we got 250 customers to say that the word Digital(tm) made them
think of Digital Equipment Corporation?
Al
|
2568.209 | | ENABLE::glantz | Mike @TAY 227-4299 TP Eng Littleton | Wed Oct 27 1993 18:14 | 4 |
| I believe the approach advocated in the memo in .206 is called "proof
by vigorous assertion". It's not recognized as a valid form of proof in
mathematics or debate, but, as I'm not a lawyer, it could very well be
acceptable in the legal biz.
|
2568.210 | | NOTIME::SACKS | Gerald Sacks ZKO2-3/N30 DTN:381-2085 | Wed Oct 27 1993 18:21 | 6 |
| For my next trick, I will cause havoc throughout the corporation.
Digital is an adjective.
|
2568.211 | Re .210... | WLDBIL::KILGORE | Dysfunctional DCU relationship | Wed Oct 27 1993 20:08 | 5 |
|
Bravo!
Encore!
|
2568.212 | maybe I'm being paranoid but | CARAFE::GOLDSTEIN | Global Village Idiot | Wed Oct 27 1993 20:21 | 4 |
| re:.206
I wonder if it's significant that the vigorous assertion comes from a
Legal Assistant, not a member of the bar. Little details like this
sometimes hide things.
|
2568.213 | Watch it if you misuse my trademark... | SMAUG::GARROD | From VMS -> NT, Unix a future page from history | Wed Oct 27 1993 20:45 | 7 |
2568.214 | We are not making this up. | TEKVAX::KOPEC | persistent object | Thu Oct 28 1993 10:44 | 6 |
| seeing Dave(TM) in .-1 brought on the thought that this whole thread
reads like a Dave Barry story..
...tom(TM)
...tom and ...tek are trademarks of Tom Kopec.
|
2568.215 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | Good girls go to heaven... | Thu Oct 28 1993 12:10 | 7 |
| RE: .210
HAHAAHAHAAA!
Laurie(tm).
PS. Actually, this isn't even slightly funny...
|
2568.216 | | WLDBIL::KILGORE | WLDBIL(tm) | Thu Oct 28 1993 12:59 | 6 |
|
Would 250 people please send me mail stating that when you see
WLDBIL(tm) you think of me.
My attorney thanks you.
|
2568.217 | Sigh, everyone knows us as Digitial ? | STAR::PARKE | True Engineers Combat Obfuscation | Thu Oct 28 1993 13:28 | 16 |
| What is really sad,
Our DSP disk drives are starting to show up in the retail market, I
have seen adds for drivers in the last two months Computer Shopper.
Not the bigies (Hard Drives Intnl, etc) but the second line (MegaHaus)
are advertising:
DSPxxxx Digital(DEC) $xxxx.xx
Or
DEC Drives
DSPxxxx ......
William G.[TM]
|
2568.218 | jbeich(tm) is mine | DNEAST::BEICHMAN_JOH | | Thu Oct 28 1993 13:35 | 14 |
| Greetings:
since this is now the "official" trademark your name note:
jbeich(tm) is mine and YOU can't have it...
compare the efforts that this company is putting into this lunacy to
what the compensation package is doing to sales' morale in string 2728
-- 2728.58 is particularly poignant and effective -- and ask draw your
own conclusions about this "ship of fools".
regards,
jbeich(tm)
|
2568.219 | Bob(tm) ... before BP gets it | ROWLET::AINSLEY | Less than 150 kts. is TOO slow! | Thu Oct 28 1993 14:08 | 0 |
2568.220 | that's got him.. | SMURF::WALTERS | | Thu Oct 28 1993 14:54 | 1 |
| ...and British Petroleum already has BP.
|
2568.221 | perhaps I should register it | LGP30::FLEISCHER | without vision the people perish (DTN 223-8576, MSO2-2/A2, IM&T) | Thu Oct 28 1993 15:20 | 7 |
| re Note 2568.219 by ROWLET::AINSLEY:
> -< Bob(tm) ... before BP gets it >-
Sorry, 250 of my closest friends already call me that!
Bob
|
2568.222 | | WLDBIL::KILGORE | WLDBIL(tm) | Thu Oct 28 1993 15:21 | 5 |
|
Re .216:
1 down, 249 to go...
|
2568.223 | Be careful | HGOVC::JOELBERMAN | | Sun Oct 31 1993 11:01 | 16 |
| > <<< Note 2568.211 by WLDBIL::KILGORE "Dysfunctional DCU relationship" >>>
> -< Re .210... >-
>
>
> Bravo!
>
> Encore!
Did you have AST's permission to say Bravo! (shoudl I (tm) AST and Bravo)?
Did you obtain Encore's permission to say Encore?
/joel (who gets confused among copyright, trademark, service mark,
patent, trade-secret, and those little circles wiht the letter 'K' in
them.
|
2568.224 | | CVG::THOMPSON | Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest? | Sun Oct 31 1993 20:51 | 9 |
|
> /joel (who gets confused among copyright, trademark, service mark,
> patent, trade-secret, and those little circles wiht the letter 'K' in
> them.
The little circles with the letter 'K' in them indicate that the
product is Kosher and follows Jewish dietary laws for preperation.
Alfred
|
2568.225 | (-:nit:-) | DRDAN::KALIKOW | I CyberSurf the Web on NCSA Mosaic | Sun Oct 31 1993 20:55 | 1 |
| Isn't that more properly rendered as Kosher(tm)(K)?
|
2568.226 | leaving no mark unmarked | CVG::THOMPSON | Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest? | Sun Oct 31 1993 21:38 | 7 |
|
> Isn't that more properly rendered as Kosher(tm)(K)?
At the bottom of the page also include "Kosher and the circle K mark
are trademarks and service marks of God. God is a trademark of God."
Alfred
|
2568.227 | | CSOA1::BROWNE | | Sun Oct 31 1993 23:43 | 12 |
| RE: .206 & .207
After reading the above, I couldn't stop chuckling for several
minutes. Then, when the importance of the issue finally settled over
me, I realized that it wasn't really funny.
But, following a couple of seconds of thought, I further
realized that the whole issue is LAUGHABLE!...so I went back to
laughing.
P.S. However, to be frank; it hurts when I laugh.
|
2568.228 | | ZPOVC::HWCHOY | Simply Irresistible! | Sun Oct 31 1993 23:48 | 4 |
2568.229 | King Joel is now Royalty | HGOVC::JOELBERMAN | | Mon Nov 01 1993 01:30 | 9 |
| .1,
Yes, and if I change my name to King Joel (tm), I become royalty and
need to be paid.
I thought that was what the cirle k meant until I saw it on a can of
motor oil once.
j
|
2568.230 | trademark law protects kosher food | CARAFE::GOLDSTEIN | Global Village Idiot | Mon Nov 01 1993 03:35 | 19 |
| re:.-several
The circle-K is actually a trademark, as are the circle-U, the
half-circle-K, and several other symbols which all are used to indicate
that a given product is kosher. Since US law does not (thankfully)
allow the state to mediate what is and is not kosher (this was recently
fought in New Jersey), several private rabbinical organizations do this
instead. They have legal standing because their symbols (it's called a
hecksher) are trademarks, so anybody misusing them is violating
trademark law. To use them, you need the owner's approval, and that
means that you're kosher by that owner's standards. If something has a
simple letter "K" on it, then it is NOT certified kosher; you could put
this on a bucket of lard and defend it as "rendered at plant K".
Nobody who cares about kashrus (the state of being kosher) accepts an
assertion that lacks a rabbi's name or trademark.
I think "DEC" is a legal trademark, as is the Digital logo (blocks),
but of course a word meaning, "pertaining to fingers and toes" is just,
I suspect, an adjective.
|
2568.231 | | GRANMA::MWANNEMACHER | the ???'s kids ask | Mon Nov 01 1993 11:46 | 4 |
|
Saw a Digital kitchen timer over the weekend. Wonder how long we have
been making these......
|
2568.232 | digression | REGENT::LASKO | normal = ANSI, dim = ASCII | Mon Nov 01 1993 13:11 | 2 |
| Hmmm, I've seen the letter K rendered in a circle and within a
triangle. Are both of these the same mark?
|
2568.233 | Some lawyer is going to make a killing | DYPSS2::COGHILL | Steve Coghill, Luke 14:28 | Mon Nov 01 1993 13:14 | 3 |
| So, how much is the lawyer--who represents all the Digital xxx...
companies in the class action suit that's sure to come out of
this--going to make from it?
|
2568.234 | real trademarks and near-tradmarks | CARAFE::GOLDSTEIN | Global Village Idiot | Mon Nov 01 1993 13:18 | 12 |
| re:.232
Triangle-K and Circle-K are different heckshers. Each different group
who issues them has their own trademark. Not all have the "K" in them,
but the people who care about them recognize which is which. (And if
you don't recognize it, you probably don't accept it as kosher.) Thus
some marks are considered most "reliable".
All this trademark talk reminds me of a bottle of wine I saw selling
for $2.99 back in '72, called "Chateau Lafitte". Real French stuff
too. Just one letter away from the real thing, and a label design that
was eerily reminiscent. I suspect it didn't stay on the market very
long.
|
2568.235 | 5 sides to every story | DECC::AMARTIN | Alan H. Martin | Mon Nov 01 1993 22:08 | 5 |
| > Hmmm, I've seen the letter K rendered in a circle and within a
> triangle. Are both of these the same mark?
Yes, and they're both different from a K rendered within an apple.
/AHM
|
2568.236 | | RTL::LINDQUIST | | Mon Nov 01 1993 23:29 | 9 |
2568.237 | | WHOS01::BOWERS | Dave Bowers @WHO | Tue Nov 02 1993 13:55 | 8 |
2568.238 | Encore! Encore! | TALLIS::PARADIS | There's a feature in my soup! | Tue Nov 02 1993 14:08 | 17 |
| > Did you obtain Encore's permission to say Encore?
Actually... I used to work for Encore in a past life. One day I saw an
"Encore modem" in a computer store; this product was *not* produced by
Encore Computer. Next day I buttonholed our legal counsel at the
coffeepot and asked him if this wasn't a clearcut case of trademark
infringement. His answer: "No, because the word 'encore' is too
generic to be trademarkable. The only things we can trademark are our
logo and any unique product names (e.g. "Multimax")"
I figure the only reason DEC is even *THINKING* of going up against
the "generic name" issue is that we have enough lawyers to tie this
up for a good long time... Encore didn't...
--jim
|
2568.239 | | CSOADM::ROTH | Running Bear loved little White Dove | Tue Nov 02 1993 15:28 | 14 |
| Re: Trademarking common words
A few years ago an entrepreneur named Wayne Green saw the coming CD
revolution so he started a magazine called "Digital Audio". Another
magazine, "Audio", filed suit against Wayne Green claiming "Audio" was
their property and his usage constituted misuse of THEIR property.
I don't recall hearing the outcome (maybe it was all a ploy to sink him
with legal fees) but I still think there is a magazine called "Digital
Audio".
Anybody know the specifics of this case?
Lee
|
2568.240 | Green Publishing->McGraw-Hill | REGENT::BLOCHER | | Tue Nov 02 1993 17:34 | 7 |
| I don't know anything about that case, but McGraw-Hill bought Wayne's
publishing company a few years back and still publishes at least "Byte"
and "73" magazines. I'm sure McGraw-Hill has enough money/lawyers to
handle a suit like that, so if they wanted to publish Digital Audio,
then they probably do so.
Marie
|
2568.241 | Digital Audio changed its name | CARAFE::GOLDSTEIN | Global Village Idiot | Tue Nov 02 1993 17:57 | 16 |
| re:.239
Wayne didn't have the resources to fight "Audio" magazine (which I
think was published by CBS), even though it seemed an easy one, so he
changed the name of the magazine to "CD Review". For a transitional
period, it was "Digital Audio & CD Review" on the cover. A couple of
years ago he sold it, though he is still involved in the music and
publishing industries.
For the record, Wayne started Byte in 1975 but only controlled it for
three or four issues. It wasn't in his name and the nominal owner took
it, selling it later to McGraw-Hill for fair dinkum change. He started
"Kilobyte" (get it?) which became "Kilobaud" which became
"Microcomputing", plus several other computer magazines, which he sold
to CW Communications (Computerworld, IDG, etc.) in 1986. Digital Audio
was not part of that deal. He did sell "73" but took it back.
fred (who worked there in '75 when Virginia took Byte)
|
2568.242 | | PLAYER::BROWNL | The Becket Effect... yes... | Wed Nov 03 1993 10:19 | 7 |
| RE: .168,.189 (my own notes)
Any news then? Official word?
Don't be silly.
Laurie.
|
2568.243 | (-8 8-)'s | CSC32::D_ROYER | Chi beve birra campa cent'anni. | Tue Nov 09 1993 18:00 | 9 |
| Re.. .213 Dave...
If you are born prior to September 1940 I will allow you to use
the Trademark for the name, However if not, then I have the use
of the name by prior usage, and it is then public domain.
Dave...
|
2568.244 | | RUSURE::EDP | Always mount a scratch monkey. | Tue Jan 18 1994 14:15 | 50 |
| Article 534 of alt.humor.best-of-usenet:
From: dwing@uh01.Colorado.EDU
Newsgroups: alt.humor.best-of-usenet
Subject: [comp.sys.dec] Re: Dec's DIGITAL STORE now on the INTERNET
Organization: best of usenet humor
Lines: 41
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.dectei-l,comp.sys.dec
Subject: Re: Dec's DIGITAL STORE now on the INTERNET
From: john@iastate.edu (John Hascall)
In article <940110090542@cavedog.ftp.com> mamros@ftp.com writes:
}>More or less confirmed: "dec.com" is going away, and is being
}>replaced with "digital.com". Mostly marketing reasons, as dec
}>wants to known as "digital". [but they're still 'dec' to me. :-) ]
}
}Figures... Wonder how many millions of dollars DEC (oops, sorry, Digital)
}will be spending as thousands of system managers throughout the company
}have to change their systems? Talk about waste...
}
}Seems that Digital is trying to establish some sort of "brand image" with
}their name. Well, with moves like this the word "Digital" is indelibly
}linked in my mind with words like "wasteful" and "stupid". Way to go, Bob.
I dunno, the almost universally net.decried cheesy "Intel Inside"
campaign has apparently been a huge success....
I am imagining a new DEC :) campaign "Digital Downbelow" ...
[Commercial opens] standard swoop into a computer via the diskette
orifice. But this time, instead of a sea of chips, it really *is*
a *sea* of chips! "Dive Dive Dive" [we swoop below the surface]
and there, lurking sinister and just radiating power is the
AXP Boomer prowling. [inside now, to the torpedo room] the
crew is loading "killer apps" into the tubes. "Fire One" *swooosh*
[periscope view - it's an MVS mainframe battleship in the crosshairs]
*KaBoom* it breaks into little "rightsized :)" pieces and sinks
(where little shark-like AlphaPCs eat what's left).
John
--
Postings to alt.humor.best-of-usenet reflect what the submittor considers to be
the best of usenet humor. All submissions are the responsibility of the sub-
mittor. The moderator serves only to remove duplicates, copyrighted material,
and redirect followups, and does not drop articles due to content. See the
alt.humor.best-of-usenet charter for more information. Sigs may be truncated.
|
2568.245 | 3-D SIRD version of the DEC logo-Don't tell Corporate... | DPDMAI::WISNIEWSKI | ADEPT of the Virtual Space. | Tue Jan 18 1994 19:10 | 1002 |
| Organization: DECUS DFWLUG BBS *Dallas*TX*214-270-3313
Lines: 995
Xref: fallout alt.binaries.pictures.misc:1922 alt.3d:1059
Here is the 3-D SIRDS (Single Independent Random Dot Stereogram) version
of the NEW Digital Equipment Corporation (DEC) logo.
Extract, UUDECODE, and use your favorite GIF viewer...
Made it for some hand outs I was working on...
Be seeing you,
+-----------------+--------------------------------------------------------+
| John Wisniewski | Consultant/DFW DECUS LUG Counterpart |
| +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Voice: 214-404-6412 |
| |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| | UUCP: wisniewski@fallout.lonestar.org (DFWLUG BBS)|
| +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | At Work: wisniewski@dpdmai.enet.dec.com |
| Dallas, TX USA | |
+-----------------+--------------------------------------------------------+
You're in a Maze of Twisty Little Unix varients -- All different.
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#`#L*
`
end
|
2568.246 | Imagine a unique and differentiating ad campaign... | NOVA::SWONGER | DBS Software Quality Engineering | Wed Feb 16 1994 15:49 | 13 |
|
Did anybody else notice the 3M commercial during the Olymics
broadcast? Throughout the commercial it's
"Imagine a glue that..."
"Imagine a plastic so strong that..."
.
.
.
These things happen because 3M employees imagine.
Or something like that.
Roy
|
2568.247 | Hey, imagine THIS! | STAR::DIPIRRO | | Wed Feb 16 1994 16:05 | 6 |
| Which reminds me...Now that the new branding campaign has been in
place for some time, the dollars should really be rolling in. Anyone
know if we've recovered the $1M or so that it cost to change the shapes
on the dots on the Digital i's?
And I can't believe that 3M stole our marketing idea! I would never
have IMAGINEd that!
|
2568.248 | $1,000,000.00 to change the dot ??? | STAR::ABBASI | one of the 744 | Wed Feb 16 1994 16:42 | 14 |
| <<< Note 2568.247 by STAR::DIPIRRO >>>
>Anyone know if we've recovered the $1M or so that it cost to change the
>shapes on the dots on the Digital i's?
hi,
did we really spend one million bucks to change the dot from little
circle to little square (or is it the other way round (bardon the
buns) ?) on our i's ?
i find this amazing if we spend that much on this thing?
\bye
\nasser
|
2568.249 | :-) | XLIB::SCHAFER | Mark Schafer, Development Assistance | Wed Feb 16 1994 17:04 | 3 |
| >>> 3M stole our marketing idea
maybe that's why we retaliated and stopped buying Post-its
|
2568.250 | | VANGA::KERRELL | The first word in DECUS is Digital | Thu Feb 17 1994 06:31 | 10 |
2568.251 | the 'digital difference' | SWAMPD::ZIMMERMANN | I'm a DECer, not a DECie | Thu Feb 17 1994 23:50 | 8 |
| Has anyone heard about the adds boosting the 'digital difference'. I
haven't seen or heard about them, but I think it was AT&T playing up
this one.
I wonder if we (Digital) get royalties when other companies use our
slogans?
Mark
|
2568.252 | | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Info Highway Construction Crew | Fri Feb 18 1994 01:05 | 5 |
| While driving in Florida last weekend, I could SWEAR I saw an ad that
mentioned something how good digital technology was, and it did that
using the "Imagine" theme. And no, it wasn't our ad. Talk about
generic advertising -- Digital Has It Now!
|
2568.253 | Digtal PC ads in USA Today | TOOHOT::LEEDS | From VAXinated to Alphaholic | Fri Feb 18 1994 13:03 | 8 |
| In case no-one has seen it, the 2/17 USA Today (second page, 1st
section) has a 2/3 page Digital PC ad. The "slogan" at the bottom is
"Beyond the Box" and is labeled as a "service mark of Digital
Equipment Corporation".....
What the heck is a service mark ???
Arlan
|
2568.254 | | MUDHWK::LAWLER | MUDHWK(TM) | Fri Feb 18 1994 13:15 | 20 |
|
A Service mark is similar to a trade-mark, but applies to
a service, rather than a concrete product. (Presumably,
"Beyond the box" implies services that DEC provides, over and
above the product itself.)
For example, "Die-hard" is a trade mark of a battery.
"Roto-Rooter" is a a service mark.
I believe telephone services such as "Mobile-reach", "bay-state
dialing", "I plan", "the-most" etc. are all service marks,
rather than trade marks.
Usually they are denoted by a SM where the "TM" would normally
be expected...
|
2568.255 | | GRANMA::MWANNEMACHER | Is it spring yet? | Fri Feb 18 1994 13:34 | 8 |
|
RE: servicemark-It just makes me sit here and shake my head. Albeit
trivial, why not just use a term that people are familiar with
(trademark).
Mike
|
2568.256 | | QUARK::LIONEL | Free advice is worth every cent | Fri Feb 18 1994 13:57 | 4 |
| Because it's not a trademark. "Service mark" is widely used; look carefully
at just about ANY ad that has a tag-line.
Steve
|
2568.257 | Not again! | STAR::DIPIRRO | | Fri Feb 18 1994 16:41 | 5 |
| Roto-rooter left more than a "service" mark when they came out to
my house. Has anyone looked at the dots on the i's on the new Digital
logo under a magnifying glass or microscope? I realize I'm obsessing on
this, but I swear they look like little smiley faces! But it might also
be my pain medication!
|
2568.258 | Rubbish to me. | PFSVAX::MCELWEE | Opponent of Oppression | Sat Feb 19 1994 03:24 | 7 |
| So if Service Marks are so important, how are they administered?
Are there legal protections associated with them?
When did they become "real"? I recall noticing their presence in
advertising only a few years back.
Phil
|
2568.259 | | QUARK::LIONEL | Free advice is worth every cent | Sat Feb 19 1994 12:52 | 9 |
| They're not really "administered"; you claim protection to a service
mark just the way you do with a trade mark, by putting the SM (or TM)
after the mark in publications. The idea of the service mark is to
prevent a competitor from using the same (or too similar) tag line in
their own advertisements.
I agree that they seem to have become more prominent in recent years.
Steve
|
2568.260 | Imagine if DEC ever followed through on anything | SMAUG::GARROD | DCU Board of Director's Candidate | Sat Feb 19 1994 16:46 | 9 |
| re .-1
Digital seemed to really care about its "Imagine" campaign. But as
pointed out all sorts of other companies have "Imagine" campaigns too.
Who owns the concept? If not Digital why did people think it was such a
big deal? If Digital how come everybody else is allowed to do the same
thing.
Dave
|
2568.261 | Answer to Dave's question in .260 | DRDAN::KALIKOW | Info Highway Construction Crew | Sat Feb 19 1994 17:29 | 10 |
| .260> how come everybody else is allowed to do the same thing?
Simple -- we forgot to establish a Service Mark for Imagination!
"Imagine...
(Imagination is a Service Mark (SM) of Digital Equipment Corporation, 1994)"
(-: (Hint: Try to keep up, Dave!) :-)
|
2568.262 | | NACAD::SHERMAN | Steve NETCAD::Sherman DTN 226-6992, LKG2-A/R05 pole AA2 | Mon Feb 21 1994 15:42 | 4 |
| Our use of the "Imagine" concept is simply an extension of our push to
demonstrate our support for industry standards ... ;^)
Steve
|
2568.263 | | NOTIME::SACKS | Gerald Sacks ZKO2-3/N30 DTN:381-2085 | Mon Jun 20 1994 12:43 | 30 |
| Posted with permission:
<<< PEAR::DKB100:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SOAPBOX.NOTE;1 >>>
-< SOAPBOX. Just SOAPBOX. >-
================================================================================
Note 1591.0 We're here, we're queer, we have e-mail 42 replies
MSDOA::ZIMMERMAN 22 lines 15-JUN-1994 10:36
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As if we don't have enough brand identification problems. From
a June 14 Raleigh News & Observer article on gay and lesbian
support groups in North Carolina's high-tech Research Triangle
Park area:
"A small band of Silicon Valley techies founded Digital Queers
two years ago to serve as a networking resource for gays and
lesbians in the industry.
" "We're here, we're queer, we have e-mail" proclaims a popular
T-shirt sold by the organization, which has 500 dues-paying
members and a mailing list with more that 2,000 names, including
40 in North Carolina.
"Many RTPers still wouldn't feel comfortable wearing Digital
Queers shirts to an office pig-picking. ..."
The group can be contacted at digiqueers@aol.com.
- Z
|
2568.264 | Now were DE | TROOA::SOLEY | Pain in the butt Canadian | Mon Jun 20 1994 13:43 | 4 |
| On an entirely unrelated note I saw a new way of refering to us this
weekend, WiReD Magazine has a review of some animation software that
includes the info-bit that the software and one of DE's Alpha
Workstations can be had for about $33,000.
|
2568.265 | | VMSVTP::S_WATTUM | OSI Applications Engineering, West | Mon Jun 20 1994 13:47 | 11 |
| > DE's Alpha
> Workstations can be had for about $33,000.
That's ok then; the Borland C++ book I picked up the other day has the Alpha
as being a 32 bit processor. Obviously some company out there called DE
is making a 32 bit Alpha processor. We should go after them for trademark
infringment.
;-)
--Scott
|
2568.266 | | AKOCOA::BBARRY | If you can't keep up, take notes! | Mon Jun 20 1994 13:49 | 7 |
| > Note 2568.264 Digital's new brand image
> TROOA::SOLEY "Pain in the butt Canadian"
> -< Now were DE >-
At least we're only half-DEAD! :-)
--
|
2568.267 | Who makes that DECstuff anyway? | SPECXN::LEITZ | butch leitz | Mon Jun 27 1994 20:52 | 26 |
| I had to put this in here...
Over this past weekend I was at my wife's employer's regional meeting
& got to talking to another spouse who worked for HP. She had heard I
did something with computers & asked who I worked for, told her that I
worked for Digital, & we proceeded to discuss various facets of new
technologies, etc. At some point, after talking with her about 15 minutes,
I mentioned something about having been at DEC for 10 years & it went
something from there like this:
her: "DEC? I thought you said you worked for -Digital-???"
me: "They're the same thing. Digital Equipment Corporation. DEC."
her: "You're kidding? We have DEC stuff all over the place.
"I always hear about HP vs. DEC. Ohhh. You work for -DEC-.
"Ohhhh.
bystander: "DEC? Yah, we have their stuff all over our office along
"with a bunch of other junk. Digital, huh? Huh."
At any rate, she's a very intelligent person, currently does joint
work for several HP marketing types, & up until then hadn't even
begun to acquaint "DEC" with "Digital". They always refer to us
as DEC.
This cracks me up - this whole brand thing hasn't made ONE dent in
the world about identifying Digital with DECstuff.
|
2568.268 | | VANGA::KERRELL | Handle with care - aging fast | Tue Jun 28 1994 07:10 | 10 |
| re.267:
>This cracks me up - this whole brand thing hasn't made ONE dent in
>the world about identifying Digital with DECstuff.
I'm no statistician (I can't even say it!) but I think you need a larger sample
than one to draw that conclusion. Besides, the aim is to grow awareness of
"Digital" not associate it with "DECstuff"!
Dave.
|
2568.269 | Is there a difference? | NDLVAX::MTANNER | D'ye ken John plunk | Tue Jun 28 1994 08:30 | 19 |
|
RE -1
Dave,
> Besides, the aim is to grow awareness of
> "Digital" not associate it with "DECstuff"!
Isn't associating Digital with DECstuff part of that awareness
campaign?
The problem I see with that 'growing of awareness' is that by that the
time it has grown sufficiently, digital could have gone the way of the
dinosaur.
Cheers,
Mark.
|
2568.270 | | VANGA::KERRELL | Handle with care - aging fast | Tue Jun 28 1994 09:40 | 5 |
| re.269:
Sorry, I missed off the tongue-firmly-in-cheek symbol.
Dave :^Q
|
2568.271 | Food for thought... | CTOAVX::SMITHB | | Tue Jun 28 1994 10:52 | 6 |
| I read a buyers survey recently that concluded that people don't buy PC's
because they say 'Intel Inside'. All they care about is that it is
'PC' compatible.
Brad.
|
2568.272 | Another data point | NOTIME::SACKS | Gerald Sacks ZKO2-3/N30 DTN:381-2085 | Tue Jun 28 1994 12:48 | 6 |
| I was talking to a doctor friend who has an office in Concord MA. He's
mentioned in the past that a lot of his patients worked for DEC. I asked
him if many of his patients who work for Digital had been laid off. He
said, "Digital?" I said that he'd told me that a lot of his patients
worked for DEC. It turns out that he'd had never made the connection
between Digital and DEC.
|
2568.273 | multiple definitions | GRANMA::FDEADY | | Tue Jun 28 1994 12:52 | 5 |
| Maybe corporate should hold off a couple of months until they
know what to "brand" as "Digital." ;)
Fred Deady
|
2568.274 | FedEx's Solution | NWD002::THOMPSOKR | Kris with a K | Tue Jun 28 1994 18:23 | 12 |
| I saw a news item the other day that Federal Express, in response to
their customer's habits, changed their name and logo to FedEx. The new
logo incorporated both the full name and the slang term. The
announcement said something like, "In recognition of how are customers
refer to us.."
Made perfectly good sense to me; why are we so stubborn? Customers
call us DEC, analysts call us DEC, competitors call us DEC, dentists
call us DEC, the press calls us DEC, we call our products and programs
DECthis and DECthat, yet we want to be known as Digital Equipment?
(Is this stubborn or stupid?)
|
2568.275 | | NOTIME::SACKS | Gerald Sacks ZKO2-3/N30 DTN:381-2085 | Tue Jun 28 1994 18:52 | 2 |
| Coca Cola did something similar. When I was a kid, the bottles just said
"Coca Cola." Now they say "Coke" too.
|
2568.276 | | QUARK::LIONEL | Free advice is worth every cent | Tue Jun 28 1994 20:31 | 5 |
| Re: .274
It's both.
Steve
|
2568.277 | everything is "digital" today... | TOOHOT::LEEDS | From VAXinated to Alphaholic | Tue Jun 28 1994 21:31 | 6 |
| We went to a movie the other day - during the "intro", the words
"Digital Stereo" flashed on the screen.. my 7 year old said "Digital?
Did you help make this movie ?". Don't know if that's good or bad
brand recognition.
Arlan
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2568.278 | make it "DEC" | SWAM2::ROGERS_DA | feeling _so_ SCSI | Wed Jun 29 1994 00:43 | 10 |
| re: -.1
> ...Don't know if that's good or bad brand recognition.
It's a kiss of death.
Like "Thermos" or "Asprin", we are at risk of becoming so
generic that our brand identity will have virtually no
value.
[dale]
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2568.279 | | GUCCI::RWARRENFELTZ | Follow the Money! | Wed Jun 29 1994 10:41 | 4 |
| Got a junk mailer from a local computer discount outfit yesterday and
was surprised to see our printer, pix and stats, listed next to
"Complete communications center." Maybe we're following the HP lead
and hope our printers will give us that coveted name recognition.
|
2568.280 | Call SGI or AT&T to reach "Digital" | HPCGRP::BURTON | DIGITAL INTERNAL USE ONLY | Wed Jun 29 1994 12:01 | 146 |
| How about this for "Digital" brand confusion.
Jim
AT&T AND SGI WED, GIVE BIRTH TO MULTI-MEDIA VENTURE June 22
NEWS BRIEFS HPCwire
=============================================================================
Mountain View, Calif. -- AT&T and Silicon Graphics, Inc. (SGI) have
solemnized a formal marriage. They simultaneously produced a new 50-50 joint
venture baptised Interactive Digital Solutions (IDS).
Dan Stanzine of AT&T Switching Systems is to be the chairman of IDS, while
Jim Barton, former SGI vice president for interactive media, will be
president.
The new venture will be a separate company, located in Silicon Valley, with
post-natal lodgings on the SGI campus here. This site is saturated with
symbolism suitable for a venture in interactive multimedia.
It is within a few blocks of Mountain View's town dump (soon to be closed
forever) and an open amphitheater used mostly for rock concerts.
Despite protracted and at times skeptical questioning from reporters in New
York City, Washington, D.C., Denver and Mountain View, Stanzine, Barton, and
SGI chairman and CEO Ed McCracken revealed few corporate facts about IDS.
They talked only in the broadest terms about the capitalization and
anticipated size of IDS, although it was acknowledged that the efforts of
AT&T and SGI, plus IDS, would constitute the largest single enterprise in the
multimedia/interactive market.
IDS's timeline was also left vague, although it was said that a serious
impact on revenues would not be expected for a year or two.
NOBODY JILTED
This is to be a thoroughly modern marriage. They emphasized that the
joint venture format rather than yet another of the loose agreements and
partnerships that abound in the multimedia market is intended to convey a
sense of seriousness and commitment in the midst of "all the hype," as
McCracken put it.
Despite the exchange of wedding bands, however, AT&T and SGI will both be
free to continue other relationships each has already established in
multimedia, ranging in seriousness from transient handshakes to torrid
affairs.
This is not surprising, because many of these earlier flirtations are at
least in part the subject of contractual obligations. These cannot lightly
be ignored simply because AT&T and SGI have discovered that they are made for
each other.
MADE IN HEAVEN? PLAUSIBLE
The SGI and AT&T representatives did their best to make the case that this
is in fact a marriage made in heaven. Their arguments are plausible.
Marriages, whether corporate or between real humans, survive best if the
newlyweds are well-matched and the link serves enduring interests of both
parties.
Neither AT&T nor SGI is a small company, although no conceivable suitor
would equal AT&T in size.
Both are eager to see that relatively new hardware is widely adopted for
a future broadband network and for interactive multimedia. SGI is just
beginning to ship its Power Challenge XL symmetrical shared memory
multiprocessors, which it considers an excellent general-purpose platform
that could act as a media server for video on demand.
SGI's workstation technology and a wide range of microprocessors from its
subsidiary MIPS, including the powerful new R8000 microprocessor, could serve
in a variety of interactive devices, including set-top point-of-delivery
boxes that would manage the whole complex business for consumers.
AT&T is anxious to promote its ATM technology, including a new switch.
MOSTLY SOFTWARE
As described by the AT&T and SGI representatives, however, IDS sounded more
like a software-intensive enterprise. McCracken spoke convincingly of the
lessons learned during the past year or so. SGI has discovered that the
technical requirements of modern multi-media broadband communication are
"enormous," including complications that had not been anticipated.
A large part of the IDS effort will be devoted to the development of
systems management software and other tools that make it possible for
assorted hardware to work together at the elevated levels of precision
required for the synchronization and high resolution of multi-media.
This aspect of IDS is apparently to be based primarily on SGI experience,
including the 4000-home experiment in Orlando, Fla., being carried out in
conjunction with Time-Warner.
AT&T will, however, also share results obtained from home-delivery
experiments in California carried out with cableista Viacom and other
partners.
The kickoff of the Orlando project was delayed from this summer to the end
of 1994, primarily due to software shortcomings. Asked about reports that
point-of-delivery set-top video managers used in Orlando are priced at $5000
each, McCracken said that this simply implied that by the large-scale
rollout target date of 1996 or 1997, the advance of technology would permit
reduction of prices to the $300 level that is considered the margin of
customer tolerance.
When pressed for reasons why the SGI-AT&T nuptials are more significant
than the casual relationships prevalent in the multimedia set, Stanzine
noted that AT&T has historically developed all of its technology within the
company. A joint venture in which AT&T will be sharing on a basis of
equality technology developed in another company is an important new
departure, he said.
MARKETING
Both companies also bring marketing strengths to IDS. AT&T is a major
supplier to service providers (regional telephone companies, cable
companies, etc.) around the world.
SGI has an acknowledged world lead in visualization hardware and software.
In addition, the company has long supplied hardware and support to "content
providers" (interactivespeech for showbiz) for special effects and other
purposes.
Finally, while AT&T has traditionally developed its own software in-house,
SGI has extensive experience working with third-party applications
developers in many fields.
The two companies' representatives said that during its initial year, IDS
would concentrate primarily upon contacts with service providers as well as
discussions with developers of third-party content and applications. Thus,
initially, IDS's concentration would exploit the distinctive strengths of its
two parents.
Asked whether these efforts would be concentrated upon ports to SGI
platforms, McCracken noted that open standards do not yet exist in this
field. Work will begin with emphasis upon selected platforms and will then
be extended as much as possible as standards arise and open systems become
possible.
A tender AT&T button was pushed by one questioner, who asked why AT&T had
turned to an outside computer company rather than to NCR (now AT&T Global
Information Systems), which was acquired by AT&T at considerable cost and
trouble a few years ago.
Stanzine explained the AT&TGIS has fixed its sights on six clearly-defined
market concentrations and does not want to be distracted.
FAMILY VALUES
In discussing joint ventures of this kind (IBM's recent stormy
collaborations with Apple come to mind), financial analysts and other
fortune-tellers frequently raise the issue of presumably incompatible
corporate cultures.
The grounds for speculation about IDS are obvious. SGI, like its Silicon
Valley neighbors Apple and Tandem (but unlike Hewlett-Packard), has always
cultivated a cool, with-it image.
Like so many other Valley firms, SGI spun itself off from Stanford
University. Its model was, however, the notoriously iconoclastic Stanford
Band rather than the Stanford Business School.
AT&T has always maintained a two-faced image of technological innovation
combined with corporate caution and conservatism.
Despite its collegiate exterior, however, SGI has a long history of
delivering on tough, often risky technological and marketing commitments.
Every year or so, SGI seems to take on some new challenge (like absorbing
the MIPS microprocessor business), and observers predict confidently that
this time the company management has over-reached itself. Most of these
predictions have been proven wrong.
Both companies know a lot about two practical things: technology and money.
These shared family values could override any clash of corporate cultures.
Meanwhile, these two new partners might be able to jointly wield sufficient
influence to bring some order and direction to the confused world of
interactive multimedia.
|
2568.281 | | OTOOA::POND | | Wed Jun 29 1994 16:51 | 3 |
| Don't you think though that there are the same perception problems with
"HP" and "Hewlett-Packard"?
J
|
2568.282 | | BSS::C_BOUTCHER | | Wed Jun 29 1994 20:22 | 3 |
| NO ...
Chuck
|
2568.283 | Seiko Unit To Sell IBM PCs Made By Digital Equip Of Japan | SPECXN::WITHERS | Bob Withers | Wed Nov 09 1994 15:27 | 14 |
| I'd say our image campaign is being successful. Witness what DJNS reported
this morning:
Seiko - IBM PCs -2-: Might Be Blow To NEC Corp. >IBM D
DJ 11/9/94 6:50 AM
TOKYO -DJ- Seiko Epson Corp., a Japanese electronics maker known for
its printers, will market International Business Machines Corp. (IBM)
compatible personal computers made by Digital Equipment Corp. (DEC)
Japan under an original equipment manufacture arrangement.
There's more, but I thought the wording was interesting...
BobW
|